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Old 2018-05-27, 03:17   Link #3301
Obelisk ze Tormentor
Black Steel Knight
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wissenschaft View Post
The only reason Seele seems more competent is because we learn next to nothing about them. One of the risks of actually answering questions is that the answers may not be as satisfying as the mystery. *shrugs
It's not about learning their background. It's due to their stupid action. You can go back several pages and check out my posts about them coz I'm not gonna repeat the same post again. Also, SEELE's plans actually worked in the end and they got what they wanted (human instrumentality), nobody was able to touch them, and none of them got killed outside of their planning. In comparison, two APE members already got killed pathetically for being stupid. Let's see if later on they got defeated and their plans ruined which will be the final nails in their coffins of incompetence.

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Originally Posted by wissenschaft View Post
As someone on reddit pointed out, this show is one big love letter to Eva. Its not at clone level like RahXephon but theres way too many similarities to be anything but an intentional homage. Which makes sense since this show is made by former Gainax employees.
This show doesn't get any points from me for imitating Eva when everything else in the show is pretty much mediocre (which is the antithesis of Eva when it came out). It's like watching kids trying too hard to be as cool as their cool dads. It's cute the first time around, but it gets old quickly.

That said, I already gave Franxx credits for other aspects like the decent-to-great execution of some parts in the past episodes. Ikuno's confession to Ichigo is one of them.
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Old 2018-05-27, 04:00   Link #3302
Solace
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wissenschaft View Post
As someone on reddit pointed out, this show is one big love letter to Eva.
It is? Because I'm not feeling a love letter. Has it really been that long since Eva that people have forgotten why it was such a big deal?
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Old 2018-05-27, 04:13   Link #3303
RDNexus
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And why was it such a big deal at the time?
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Old 2018-05-27, 04:18   Link #3304
Gan_HOPE326
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
Of course if immortally is ever achieved it will have its pros and cons. Problem is this show only sees the cons. It's a pretty reductive and misguided way to look at it.
It's not even that: the cons are conveniently manufactured plot devices. Be it the sterility, the loss of emotions (which isn't clear what comes from; even if it's just an effect of immortality, wouldn't that kind of total existential boredom take at least a couple centuries to kick in?), or the fact that immortality can only be obtained by using the same form of energy that now powers the world and that somehow also is defended by this ancient civilisation of biomechanical monsters, it's all plot setup. None of that is necessarily a logical consequence of immortality, it's all plot contrivances, like the Franxx requiring fertile people to pilot them. It doesn't make sense even in its own internal logic, it's just arbitrary bits of world building tacked on to make the story go where they wanted it to.
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Old 2018-05-27, 05:27   Link #3305
Solace
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Originally Posted by xrick View Post
And why was it such a big deal at the time?
Digibro made a good video about its influence:

YouTube
Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

I miss those crazy days.
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Old 2018-05-27, 08:43   Link #3306
Magewolf
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I think Hiro is actually doing some masterminding of his own. He arranges the marriage to see what the response would be. Then he eggs the team to all go and confront Papa with much shouting. After which he demands freedom following the next battle.

Now you might say that it does not seem very mastermindy to state you are rebelling before you are actually able to to the all powerful world goverment. However he had to get the whole squad ready to fight Papa fast and that was the fastest way to do it. But that opened them up to retribution so he gave his demand for freedom after the next battle, even though by this time I do not think he believes a word that Papa says. He knows that they need the squad and that they are confident that they can control the parasites. So with his demand he bought them some time and access to their Franxxs.
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Old 2018-05-27, 09:24   Link #3307
orion
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Originally Posted by mangamuscle View Post
The thing is, orangutans share 97% of their DNA in common with humans and surprise, surprise, they do not have "human rights". So chances are that if the difference between parasites and "adults" is also between 1%-5% it would be no surprise that they think them as labor animals.

My take on the latest episode is that the magma is a clear analogy to oil and the desertification for global warming.

Now, they are making the bold prediction that "immortality" (let's call it "the first treatment for the ages old disease known as aging) will be discovered in less than a decade. It will not make adults infertile, but with the increase in human population, many governments no doubt will control or outright outlaw human reproduction and this show is trying to say "hey, that will also have dire consequences".
Well that 3% was critical. It included the ability to have a larger brain capacity and be more resistant to bacterial infections. So it's prob more what is different than how much is different.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_...her_great_apes
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Old 2018-05-27, 09:52   Link #3308
kampfer91
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I can see Hiro gonna be kidnapped soon .
Because all Klaxxosaur is female , Hiro would be the 1st male Klaxxosaur hybrid .

The nine is not really Klaxxosaur hybrid , they are more human like , i doubt they have that blue heart and blue horn which Hiro is possessing .
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Old 2018-05-27, 10:01   Link #3309
DemonneoPT
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You have failed me Trigger. This recent episode was the most underwhelming backstory i ever seen. Literally, my only interest in the anime were the cool animated action scenes, the artstyle and the mistery behind that world. And the latter, turned out to be a huge disappointing mess so far

The poor way they dealt with the immortality theme was ridiculous. It's hard to believe people would lose interest in life or forgetting their "emotions" by being immortal for 50 years or so because they had pleasure machines at home..lol. The story would make sense if hundreds of years have passed. And what's up with the Franxx robot they created? So they create and design a machine to later "discover" it only works with the union of a female and a male pilot? What? If the technology belonged to some ancient civilization and they just reverse engineered it, it could make sense... i dont know, something linked to the klaxossaurs origins? Since the show inplies those creatures existed in the underground for quite some time and went berserk after humans messed up with their environment. It's like me developing a toaster and later "discover" it does not work with electricity..lol. Honestly everything was so rushed and poorly explained. And what was explained made no sense. I can only hope the next episodes can explore all these subjects a little bit more including the downfall of humanity. But i don't know, I think the producers main goal was just making a shipping love story with kids exploring their sexuality and fanservice. Everything else just had a lazy sci-fi background to bait people like me . I bet the Dino princess story will be shady and disappointing too. Trigger pls!!! Redeem yourselves in the following episodes... explore the world building and take a break with all the thots and shippings for the love of gawd
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Old 2018-05-27, 10:05   Link #3310
RDNexus
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Other than the Klaxx's background (which may be equally underwhelming), I'm not seeing Trigger or A-1 going deeper on what's been made known already.
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Old 2018-05-27, 10:13   Link #3311
Gan_HOPE326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DemonneoPT View Post
You have failed me Trigger. This recent episode was the most underwhelming backstory i ever seen. Literally, my only interest in the anime were the cool animated action scenes, the artstyle and the mistery behind that world. And the latter, turned out to be a huge disappointing mess so far

The poor way they dealt with the immortality theme was ridiculous. It's hard to believe people would lose interest in life or forgetting their "emotions" by being immortal for 50 years or so because they had pleasure machines at home..lol. The story would make sense if hundreds of years have passed. And what's up with the Franxx robot they created? So they create and design a machine to later "discover" it only works with the union of a female and a male pilot? What? If the technology belonged to some ancient civilization and they just reverse engineered it, it could make sense... i dont know, something linked to the klaxossaurs origins? Since the show inplies those creatures existed in the underground for quite some time and went berserk after humans messed up with their environment. It's like me developing a toaster and later "discover" it does not work with electricity..lol. Honestly everything was so rushed and poorly explained. And what was explained made no sense. I can only hope the next episodes can explore all these subjects a little bit more including the downfall of humanity. But i don't know, I think the producers main goal was just making a shipping love story with kids exploring their sexuality and fanservice. Everything else just had a lazy sci-fi background to bait people like me . I bet the Dino princess story will be shady and disappointing too. Trigger pls!!! Redeem yourselves in the following episodes... explore the world building and take a break with all the thots and shippings for the love of gawd
Not much point in blaming only Trigger IMHO, people keep considering this as a Trigger show, but it's a co-production. I guess that helped for me, as I started with lower expectations to begin with.

I'll just wait for the next Imaishi show, I guess.

But yeah, this falls proudly in line with a long tradition of mecha shows that try to rip off Evangelion and manage to have a world building that makes even less sense than that one's. At this point, I'll stick to the end in the hopes of a spectacular enough final battle, and that's it. They even deprived us of the joys of Zero Two by turning her into a Good Girl (TM) after episode 15, which was a terrible shame.
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Old 2018-05-27, 10:23   Link #3312
orion
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Originally Posted by wissenschaft View Post
@Guido One theory is that those parasites that fail to become pilots are instead used as breeding stock so more parasites can be produced. Without the stress of piloting the parasites will likely live longer. That said, Nana and Hachi could very well be given treatments that extend their lives.

Failed samples wouldn't be used as breeding sources. It wouldn't produce good pilots. They have to only place them in those vats to produce them. And they just need egg and sperm samples which they could have harvested from successful pilots or continue to use from the original population. They are using artificial uteri to mature the pilots. The birth memory is prob artificially implanted in all of them.

I also don't believe Papa with regards to Kokoro and Mitsuru's memories. Something is compelling them to keep their rings on. Maybe they are the next generation's Nana and Hachi.
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Old 2018-05-27, 10:34   Link #3313
Blueknight78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DemonneoPT View Post
The poor way they dealt with the immortality theme was ridiculous. It's hard to believe people would lose interest in life or forgetting their "emotions" by being immortal for 50 years or so because they had pleasure machines at home..lol.
because it's actually somehow is happenning in japan, the japan is noticing how fast japaneses are becoming less "sociable and more reliable on "machines" and it don't take hundred of years to happen, just some decaded and fast advance of technology and it's also happen all around the world, we humans with internet and tech are become less "friendly" and more bunch of selfishs and only care about "our opnions", technology is really chaning the mankind in a "fast pace".

Quote:
And what's up with the Franxx robot they created? So they create and design a machine to later "discover" it only works with the union of a female and a male pilot? What?
he don't say which it "only work that way, he told which they found which having a male and a female piloting was the "most effective way" they found to reduce/balance the side effect,
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Old 2018-05-27, 11:05   Link #3314
germanturkey
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Originally Posted by Botan_TM View Post
Cells have inbuilt limit how man times they can split Telomere. Death is not a bug, is a feature.

Off course there is enzyme, which can rebuilt those, it is active in reproductive cells, or in cancer cells. So I doubt this problem couldn't be fixed with so advanced cloning technology.
they said in the episode that Karina's work prior to meeting Franxx was on telomere regeneration. they very likely fixed the issue already.
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Old 2018-05-27, 11:06   Link #3315
kari-no-sugata II
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Originally Posted by Botan_TM View Post
Cells have inbuilt limit how man times they can split Telomere. Death is not a bug, is a feature.

Off course there is enzyme, which can rebuilt those, it is active in reproductive cells, or in cancer cells. So I doubt this problem couldn't be fixed with so advanced cloning technology.
I entirely agree that death is not a bug. However, I would not point the finger at telomeres - even the article you link to shows that telemeres are unlikely to be the ultimate problem for ageing as in some species the lengths actually increase over time or are very stable. From all I've read, ageing is a very very complex process and there's unlikely to be a simple solution. There's some things that might help slow down ageing but I wouldn't count on there being some kind of magic bullet to stop it entirely. I think a 3x slowdown in ageing might well be achievable - birds in general age very slowly. Actually, humans age more slowly than they "should" if we compare ourselves to similar mammals but birds are even more of an outlier.

Anyway...

I've been a bit disappointed about the lack of comment on the confrontation between Hiro and the 13ers and Papa and the APE council. It was unclear after the last episode just where the kids stood but now we can clearly say that mentally they are "done" with the adults. Unsurprisingly, Zorome was the last hold-out and since his hopes and dreams of becoming an adult are now over. The kids don't currently see the adults as "the enemy" but it's quite close.

I wonder if Papa and the APE council would genuinely let the kids go after the "final battle", if it turned out to be an option... or if they believe the kids will all conveniently die. I suspect the latter.
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Old 2018-05-27, 11:16   Link #3316
Kanon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solace View Post
It is? Because I'm not feeling a love letter. Has it really been that long since Eva that people have forgotten why it was such a big deal?
It's a love letter. A badly written one.
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Old 2018-05-27, 11:52   Link #3317
wissenschaft
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Originally Posted by Solace View Post
It is? Because I'm not feeling a love letter. Has it really been that long since Eva that people have forgotten why it was such a big deal?
Its been 23 years since Eva came out so, yeah, its been more than long enough to forget its impact.

Perhaps love letter is the wrong word because the plot of the show is very different. Perhaps its better to say its in part a homage to EVA. They keep putting in similar scenes so its impossible not to notice. Its not a retelling of EVA, more like filled with eater egg references to EVA.

I'm surprised you guys are so negative about the show. Ah well, if I want crazed enthusiasm I do have the DitF reddit.
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Old 2018-05-27, 12:18   Link #3318
Gan_HOPE326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
It's a love letter. A badly written one.
Dear EVA,

I thinks you iz awesome! Because you haz giant robots and hot girls and sexual symbolism and stuff. Please look at my waifu! She like Asuka but better. She haz hornz! Tee-hee I love you much XOXOXO <3

Darling in the FranXX
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Old 2018-05-27, 12:43   Link #3319
Botan_TM
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Everybody talks about EVA, but personally I see some similarities with Sidonia no Kishi.

Spoiler for Just in case:


Main difference is that in Sidonia all pieces seems to fall together like puzzles, making a coherent world, here it feels a bit opposite.

I mean, if that magical energy makes a post-scarcity world, why not just built one plantation for the most successful parasites? Also some parasites kamikaze'd with tanks full of it, so why not make some missiles with it? It just feels like some decided to make "castrated cold adult vs horny teens drama" and that's it. In the end, it all just comes to how big suspension of believe one can have.

From the other hand, "teen drama" part seems to work, Kiznaiver hasn't created such heated fanboys wars. And memes.
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Old 2018-05-27, 12:45   Link #3320
Kanon
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Originally Posted by wissenschaft View Post
I'm surprised you guys are so negative about the show. Ah well, if I want crazed enthusiasm I do have the DitF reddit.
I used to be positive about it, but its flaws have gotten way too big to ignore. It always had them, but they were less noticeable. I was first extremely disappointed by episode 14, which for a while seemed like an accident because the following episodes were really great. However, the past couple episodes have been really bad. Plot induced stupidity, a poorly written backstory, and the oversimplification of the show's themes like immortality being among said flaws.
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