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View Poll Results: Claymore - Chapter 107 rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 21 | 14.89% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 14 | 9.93% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 16 | 11.35% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 20 | 14.18% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 8 | 5.67% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 3 | 2.13% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 3 | 2.13% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 2 | 1.42% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 1 | 0.71% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 53 | 37.59% | |
Voters: 141. You may not vote on this poll |
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2010-09-03, 12:56 | Link #721 | ||||
Warden of the West
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Casterly Rock
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In the first two, she was trying to save her comrades from certain death. It migth not have been the most logical thing to do but yes, Miria is altruistic. No arguing there. In the last one, she is simply not saving her comrades from anything. She didn't even ask Tabitha if she wanted to figth. She made a decision for them, one that won't do anyone any good. This is not characteristic of her. Miria, in the North, let all of them decide for their own if they wanted to move South or not. And it didn't even made sense. If she is afraid of Tabitha killing claymores, then I assumed she was ready to kill them herself but apparently not. Quote:
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2010-09-03, 13:12 | Link #723 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
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Mr JB, since Miria's introduction what has her concern been for? Claymores, people, and more claymores. Her character never changed. Sparing her enemies is not stupidity, because those are exactly the people Miria is trying to save. Miria's cause has been to save all claymores, which is reflected in the Slaher's arc, the Piera arc, and the Riful/Rachel/Audrey rescue. Every claymore, whether friend or foe, Miria/ghosts have saved. This situation is no different. Why would Miria suddenly change to kill claymores? That in itself would be a sudden character change. Miria has always been so ideological that she is in fact an illogical person. Her saving grace is that she is a strategist, but on an object one.
The major difference with this case is not about killing claymores since that was never an option to Miria. The major difference is that humans/Mibs (not hybrid claymores) had to be killed. Remember Galatea's talk with Tabitha? The conclusion was that Tabitha would kill humans if it came to it. Miria did not want that by any means and so she is saving the other ghosts from having to make that decision. The ghosts want to topple the organization, but at the same time not degrade into killers(this cannot be underestimated). That in itself creates a problem. How to topple a human-led organization without killing humans? Easy, one person takes the hit(s). Miria never gave them the choice out of the need to protect them and their humanity. That is why she went alone. Miria is trying to free claymores. No matter what, this is a suicide mission for Miria. Why? Because she took it upon herself to kill humans and accept the punishment for killing humans. In conclusion, why would she kill the people she is trying to save? It is would be like trying to uplift a country by bombing the shit out of it. On top of the fact that Miria was always an idealist and altruistic character. Furthermore, the crisis of character is that she has to kill humans, but she does not want the others to make that type of sacrifice. Finally, and this where we disagree the most probably; Miria does not want any of the ghosts to degrade into killers. Miria nailed herself to a cross as strange as it sounds. Last edited by Nixl; 2010-09-03 at 13:27. |
2010-09-03, 13:26 | Link #724 | |
Thread Hijacker
Join Date: May 2009
Location: In a hole, I just need to dig myself out
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I can't think of a situation where this kind of warrior would be affective against the Ghosts.
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2010-09-03, 13:26 | Link #725 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
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I have absolutely no problem with the way Miria was trying to spare the claymore's that's in Miria's character, it's the oh look we have this claymore that no one has ever heard about with this random mindfuck ability that just happens to be the perfect weapon to take you down it's just plain bad writing it could be ripped straight out of bleach and I extect alot better from Claymore.
And there's no way she's been made to just fight the ghosts unless they can vat grow somebody and train them within a few months time span, only reason I can think she exists is because they expect rebellion. |
2010-09-03, 13:32 | Link #726 | |
Kana Hanazawa ♥
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 37
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WHAT?!
This chapter shocked me so much it motivated me to post in this section for once. I need to vent my frustration. How could Miria, one of the best character in this manga, die like this? It's not that she died that pissed me off so much, but the way it happened. Quote:
I MAD
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2010-09-03, 13:33 | Link #727 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
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Newhope that has happened since the beginning. Consider,
Yoma can shapeshift vs Claymores can sense Teresa's perception vs Priscilla's suppression. Dauf's strength vs Galatea's manipulation. Dauf's armor vs Jean's drill. Ophelia's ripple sword vs Irene's flash sword Isley vs Feeders Rigardo vs Claire Alicia/Beth Awakened Priscilla vs A destroyer that can drain energy. No character so far has been untouchable. The difference is that we have received virtually no character development from this one as of yet. The only one that really angered me was Claire's sudden inner-shounen hax against Rigardo. Personally, for me this is far less annoying since we may or may not get some character development. What would annoy is if she dies 5 chapters later and accomplishes nothing else in the story. |
2010-09-03, 13:36 | Link #728 | |
The One Eyed King
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Lurking Up Ahead
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Remember to vote for what you thought of the chapter hopefully Yagi will get the message.
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2010-09-03, 13:37 | Link #729 | |
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The town where Copernicus was born.
Age: 38
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All of this could only happen now that Alicia and Beth weren't present. If Miria and co. destroyed the Org I would say it was too convenient and MiBs were retards they let this happened. Everyone, please note that it was Yagi that gave ghosts such huge power up, MiB didn't know that! So from their point of view they really had a trump card. And it was them that used this term (Rubel to be specific). As we could see Miria exceeded their expectations completely but that's a given since they didn't know about partial awakening. In their eyes ghosts were trash, they knew their abilities before Pieta battles and they knew they could only be useful as cannon fodder. Some no names like #22 who could stretch her hands if she appeared they would laugh in her face. I would guess that to take Organization down force no less than Clare and Miria would be needed. Miria + Tabitha shouldn't be enough since Tabitha was many levels below Miria. She could also use her abilities only when she stayed focused and immobile (at least it looked that way when they were fighting Agatha). Even assuming she could do it during her fight, she wouldn't be able to keep up with Miria leading to Miria worrying about her and becoming a handicap to her. Do you think that Miria would be able to defend her against the twins while at the same time defending herself? Somehow I doubt it. Unless she killed the twins at the start it would end the same, only this time Tabitha would be also dead. Yagi could have killed Miria in many ways. Letting AFs defeat her, making twins more powerful or warriors #3-10 more powerful so that they wouldn't be incapacitated with one move effortlessly or he could come up with Abyssal abyssal, something stronger than Priscilla that from the start was defending MiB. Every option was worse than what he had chosen IMO. The option he chose made the biggest impact of all. Nixl, I will add some other examples in response to JB's post. When Miria was fighting Rigaldo she didn't know what to do. If not for Clare, Deneve and Helen she would be dead. Also it was Jean not Miria that noticed first that Rigaldo is going after captains and if she didn't shouted it and wasn't distracted she might have defended herself better. As I've written earlier, Alicia and Beth leaving HQ was the same as Priscilla showing in Clare's face. It was Miria's weak point, her hatred. Miria's Pieta plan wasn't perfect. She wouldn't succeed if not for suppressant pills which somehow she got. That was the best part of her plan. With suppressant pills anyone with average intelligence would use them. Before the battle Miria was talking gibberish in a cave instead of evacuating people (humans that were still in Pieta). All this meeting for half-awakends exclusively was only to let everyone know that they have 0 chances of survival which served no purpose at all. It could only break their morale. She was far from being perfect but then again there are no perfect characters in Claymore which is very good. It only made her more human. Many of you wanted her to be a cold, calculated person who she wasn't as we could see in her fight against Rigaldo. She was a great strategist if she could look at everything calmly, without rush but with Alicia gone she was in a rush. In this case Miria couldn't wait, she couldn't have known that Tabitha could help her (or not, we don't really know how useful she could be). Obviously she was expecting something like the twins not some turtle AB. And waiting on Clare, Helen and Deneve would take too much time (she could wait forever for all she had known). They were the only ones that could keep up with her (in fact only Clare could keep up with her but Helen and Deneve wouldn't be left so far behind as Tabitha). Last edited by Gooral; 2010-09-03 at 13:50. |
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2010-09-03, 13:40 | Link #730 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
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They came first for Isley,
and I didn't speak up because he is a cat-killer. Then they came for Riful, and I didn't speak up because she is no virgin. Then they came for the Twins, and I didn't speak up because they are with pimps. Then they came for Maria, and by that time there is hardly any cool character left. /someone should give it a better spin.
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2010-09-03, 13:44 | Link #731 | |
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The town where Copernicus was born.
Age: 38
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2010-09-03, 13:52 | Link #733 |
Angriest Angel
Join Date: Nov 2007
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The annoying thing is that if miria would have killed those soulless shrimp twins immediately she wouldn't have to release her yoki and would probably be still alive.
IN this fight she somewhere had to release yoki this went to her downfall.
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2010-09-03, 13:54 | Link #734 |
The One Eyed King
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Lurking Up Ahead
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Raft... ... more like life jacket What good is she against is actual warfare?
@Gooral we don't have a problem with Miria dying or this warrior. It was the poor way she [#10] was introduced and her power seemly the perfect counter only in this situation which Miria seemingly walked right into. Her number being 10 was out of the blue (it's like Yami (hope I got the name right) in Bleach being both #10 and #0 )... dump the number and have her rankless and/or make her a new warrior with a high number. So what if we never meet Clare's gen #10 there was no trend before hand showing there was never a known #10 throughout other generations and people could actually suspect something. This felt like watching the Star Wars prequels and just being told of past adventure of Obiwan and Anikin. Next off the way Miria was violated (hence us calling it mindfuck & rape) and it was just more horrific than anything in the story thus far... except maybe for Clare's time as a Yoma's play thing but that wasn't shown for a very good reason.
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2010-09-03, 14:20 | Link #735 | |
Former #9
Join Date: Jul 2010
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Raftela wasn't THAT strong making us to believe she was actually a trump card. She was just a barricade for defense against the those who rebelled the org. Truly, She wasn't useful against an AB or AO although she was a warrior vs warrior specialist. I don't see what's the brillant point Raftela making illusions or blublering the opponent's eyes to see a mirage. It's the same thing we say Clare's QS and WC were so AWESOME that could have killed even an AO easily. That makes no sense. I don't know what was the intention of Yagi killing Miria off but he made her look stupid taking this mission alone. We already saw Rubel's talking 'bout she would have gotten the revenge if she had come with other ghosts. The combination between the trump card and the shrimp twins was perfect to take down a single warrior; not a group of rebelling ghosts. For example, Miria could have taken the action bringing Miata and Tabitha at least. This was already predicted.... and seems the story's going so easy to predict IMO.
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2010-09-03, 14:21 | Link #736 |
True Believer
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Now that I have seen the actual chapter I can fully form a opinion. It was great. For a while now I was under impression that Yagi forgot that he is writing Claymore and that in Claymore sometimes good guys get killed in a very gruesome manner. Ever since Pieta it seemed like Ghosts have gotten themselves plot armor. Now I think that the reason other Ghosts kept surviving against crazy odds until now was to fool us into believing they are somehow safe and then we get a punch in our guts. (Make that a FALCON punch in our guts)
Miria's death wasn't entirely pointless. This way rest of the Ghosts will know that the Org has something up their sleeve, something that can kill Miria. At least one of the Ghosts should be smart enough to figure this out. It is possible that this was Miria's intention all along. She already knows the how strong no.3 and no.5 are so she attacks the org while Alicia and Beth are away and if she wins, she spares her friends from having to kill humans, if she dies she is sending her friends a message "The org has a way to defend themselves so don't %^&* around". The trump card has turned out to be a warrior specifically trained to counter other warriors. It makes sense. And she's no.10, one rank under a "single digit radar". The name kinda bothers me. I mean Rafut... um... Rafn... what? I think I'll just call her LSD. |
2010-09-03, 14:26 | Link #737 | |
nani ni tatoemu
Join Date: Sep 2006
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@Gooral: that last lots-of-bold one was a great post. If not for you being on the record calling me a fool, I'd be starting to like you @Nixl: some very good points in the last few posts. Last edited by yononaka; 2010-09-03 at 14:38. |
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2010-09-03, 14:30 | Link #738 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Damn! Felt so sad reading the chapter. What a pathetic way to get killed. It reminded me of the way Terressa died, why does all the strong warriors die so pathetically? With Miria gone, one of my most favourite characters in Claymore is dead and I was expecting her to die with abit more honour instead of on her knees with tears and under an illusion. I wish she died in a fair fight without being deluded into defeat.
Miria was way too kind and that was her biggest flaw. Her first mistake was to go there alone, and the second mistake was to show mercy to her opponents. I mean she could've cut off their heads anytime she wanted before that number 10 could interfere. R.I.P Phantom you will be missed. I wonder who will lead the 6 now? I wish Galatea would get back her eye-sight as she would've been the perfect leader IMO. Anyways does anyone remember who the "old numer 10" was? Has it ever been mentioned? I want to see Raki next.
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2010-09-03, 14:35 | Link #739 | |
The One Eyed King
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Lurking Up Ahead
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From what was shown, rather than the reader imagine (key difference there, it's how the Movie Dark Knight got a pg-13 rating and not an R even with the "torture" scene where the Joker "tortures" the fake batman), this was by far the worst violation of a human we've seen thus far in the manga. Even worse than Miria being stabbed in the gut with the tongue by far. --------------------- Anyways after rereading it few times I have slight issues with how Miria's yoki was released enough for this to take effect. We the readers didn't see it happen but just told of it later. Sure it was dramatic but far from respected the readers intelligence, yet them speculate on the meaning of her releasing her yoki then have #10s powers take effect. anyways gtg... back on later...
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2010-09-03, 14:41 | Link #740 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
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So it's now oh look she's released her yoki which we can't see so we can now mind-rape you then have you acting like your dead best friend is still alive, this chapter just gets better and better.
Last edited by Newhope; 2010-09-03 at 15:28. |
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claymore, manga |
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