Ore no Imouto (Season Two) - Episode 14-16 [Series End] Discussion / Poll

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Kanon

The only good scene was Manami punching Kirino. I'm not pro violence but I have to admit that was incredibly satisfying. The vindicative **** totally deserved it. This made suffering through these three episodes worth it. Kind of.

That's kind of a contradiction in itself. By stating it was a good scene, and she deserved it you are professing support for violence in this specific case.

But this smart-arsing aside, the anime would have needed more episodes to capture all those little details that give meaning to the ending and also do a better job describing the road to. Although I disagree the notion that "it never made sense". Kirino's feelings were clear from the first season on and Kyousuke on some occasions showed care that exceeded mere siblings' responsibility.

The hate Kirino gets is also kind of unfair. Just as Kuroneko supported Kirino, Kirino supported Kuroneko. She didn't object her confessing and she pushed Kyousuke into giving her serious consideration. Always kind of funny when in a show Person X is caring very much about Person Y, but fans of Person X absolutely detest Person Y.

EDIT: Suddenly I get the feeling this Manami punch into the gut was included for the satisfaction of all those who dislike Kirino.

[Wilshere]

Originally Posted by Kanon

That was awful. Absolutely awful. The writing for this series has never been very good in the first place but it reached a new low in these final episodes. If you want to make an incest ending despite it not making sense in the first place (at least in the context of the anime, I don't know and don't care about the light novels), do it. Don't cop out at the last minute. He rejected all those awesome girls for the chance to be with Kirino only for a few months? You have to be kidding me... that's just adding to the injury. I can't think of any way they could have made this ending worse.

The only good scene was Manami punching Kirino. I'm not pro violence but I have to admit that was incredibly satisfying. The vindicative **** totally deserved it. This made suffering through these three episodes worth it. Kind of.

In the end, Kuroneko remained the best girl in this show by far. She was able to remain friends with Kirino and support her even after all this. I hope she'll find somebody better than Kyousuke.

Here we go again with the ''Kuroneko deserves better'' excuses. If so, why did she fall in love with him? She always admits that he is useless and stuff but she likes him that way, add to that, that he always is there to help and is simply a very kind guy. Once again, the anime did not do a very good job in clearing the Manami/Kirino mess alongside the build-up which led him to fall for her. One more thing, its really sad seeing this Kirino hate where to the extent people rejoice in seeing her hurt.If anything, Kuroneko wanted this to happen and she admits that she always knew that from the get-go, not surprising for me(or whoever watched the series for the plot and not giving much unnecessary attention to the side characters), hence your disappointment. I said it many times, blame yourself if you expected any different ending than this. Most people nowadays watch anime not for the plot or build-up, but for their ''girls''. Harsh reality is bitter, but you must cope with it.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by Kanon

He rejected all those awesome girls for the chance to be with Kirino only for a few months? You have to be kidding me... that's just adding to the injury. I can't think of any way they could have made this ending worse.

That isn't all that resulted. Kirino was originally going to go off overseas but that got called off regardless of their "dating" arrangement. So he gets to continue to be with Kirino indefinitely going forward, even if they've "gone back to being normal siblings" (pending the results of the additional life counselling). In the end, you might argue that continuing to be together was more important for them than what exact form their relationship took.

(Not that I expect this to change your opinion.)

Originally Posted by viperdk1

The whole thing doesn't make any sense - this plot point of Kyousuke confessing and proposing to Kirino (and her ACCEPTING after yelling out how creepy it all is) is so hopelessly forced into the series that it feels less like shoehorning and more hammering the damn thing in.

Weren't Kirino's true feelings already betrayed in Episode 13 where we understood how much she loved Kyousuke? (Not to mention all the prior episodes about how she wanted to be number one in his life, didn't want him to date anyone else, was jealous when he was going out with Kuroneko, and on and on.) Given that she's been in love with him all this time, and yet still constantly going on about how creepy it is, it seems clear that she's both a) being dishonest about her feelings, and b) conflicted about the fact that her feelings aren't normal (as she was told by Manami). This was further reinforced in Episode 15.

As for Kyousuke and his timing, this too was foreshadowed in Episode 11 and 12: in 11 he told Kuroneko that he had to settle things with Kirino before he could give her an answer, and in 12 he rejected Ayase because he already had someone he loved. He also found out that Kirino was planning to leave to go overseas again. So there were lots of reasons why now was right time, and it wasn't forced into the narrative.

(Again, not that I expect this will change your opinion either.)

[GDiddy]

I knew they were going with the implied ending that's in the books.....but still.... goddamn.

Thanks show. This series is ruined completely ruined for me.

[Dr. Casey]

Just watched episode 14; I'm going to watch 15 after posting this, then I'll do 16 later tonight.

I have to say that I was really pleased with the way the scene with Kuroneko was handled. I was expecting the typical feel good, at times unrealistic anime fare where the rejected party wishes the other person well, tells them they 'always knew this would happen' with the greatest sense of of acceptance and enlightedness... but nope, Kuroneko is just hurt and angry and makes it clear that she hates the way things turned out. Very honest scene that avoided the pitfalls into blandness that I was afraid things might take the moment it started. If I was Kyosuke, once she started tearing the diary apart and ranting about how she was Yamineko, I might have had to go "Uh, wait. Is it too late to take all that back and date you again after all? You're pretty sexy when you're angry."

Whenever Saori and her sister pulled up, I thought that Saori was the driver and it was Ayase in the passenger's seat (forgetting, of course, that the front seats are reversed in Japan compared to what they are in the US). It's cool that the two sisters recovered from their falling out, though I was a little disappointed that Ayase-tan hadn't returned after all, since she's one of my favorite characters.

[sleepingleo]

One last time I pour my opinion (since this is a poll, any opinion is valid) : I hate the original ending, hate this ending and the author disgusts me. I won't elaborate on this, I already did in the novel thread a while ago and since that thread was most seized by Kirino shippers my opinions were not always welcome. So just, yeah, haters gonna hate. Since the ending came to light I became one. I'm sad one of my favorite series had to end like this. With a re-watching value of ZERO for me.

[Haruyasha]

Wait, why is it so satisfying that Kirino got punched? Sure, she got annoying there a bit.. But keeping in mind Kirino is a junior high school girl..

Tbh, I found this much more satisfying:

Spoiler:

She was asking for it. Always sticking her nose into places where it didn't belong. It was creepy how she always knew every factor of Kyousuke's life.

[Tenchi Ryu]

Manami definitely won that fight. I was like "DAAAYUUUMMMMM". And that was before the KO gut punch. Good to see Kirino get some form of ass whoopin, never thought it would happen on a show like this.

[psycho bolt]

finally got to see some cat fights

[kentasaiba]

everybody got what them deserve. Kyousuke Kirino and Manami a punch in her face.

[Sphire]

I think I'm hugely disappointed in the ending. Part of it is likely due to some things being rushed, but the other is massively due to the cop out.

Spoiler for 14-16 rant:

Starting with ep 14, to be honest, I was 50/50 on how I felt for Kuroneko. She gave her blessing to KyouxKiri, so no amount of tears will make me feel sorry for her. But she was rejected, and I can have some sympathy for those who are rejected. She broke up with Kyousuke though, and was more than willing to help him after the rejection too. So yea, not much from me. It was kinda quick too, like a random point to begin the final episodes.

To be fair, it all felt quick. Kyou falling for Kirino really kinda just happens in these episodes. Sure, there were feelings before, but here they become concrete. The part at school and with Kanako felt pointless too, in the face of rushing through things in this bunch of episodes and from the previous episodes in season 2. There was no need to go through all that with Kanako, but we did, and the series suffers for it.

Still, I'd have probably been fine with it had the ending actually been better. I don't require all endings to be finalized and can deal with open endings, but this feels like a massive cop out from going full incest route. I wouldn't have minded so much had it flowed well, but the faking between Kirino and Kyousuke from when they apparently decided to go back to being normal feels massively cheap. Why would Kyousuke be okay with that? Not after all he's said and done, it doesn't feel realistic. It massively cheapens the whole fight with Manami too, aside from Kirino getting her revenge.

Best part of the 14-16 eps: Kuroneko becoming Black Lotus
Worst part of 14-16 eps: Too many (Ayase MIA was a shame too)

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by SigUp

That's kind of a contradiction in itself. By stating it was a good scene, and she deserved it you are professing support for violence in this specific case.

Hence the "but". I know this is contradictory but I just can't help it. That's just how it made me feel and I'm not proud of it.

The hate Kirino gets is also kind of unfair. Just as Kuroneko supported Kirino, Kirino supported Kuroneko. She didn't object her confessing and she pushed Kyousuke into giving her serious consideration. Always kind of funny when in a show Person X is caring very much about Person Y, but fans of Person X absolutely detest Person Y.

That's true, but you also have to take into account what happened before and after she gave Kuroneko her approval. She pulled that stunt with the fake boyfriend to make it clear to Kyousuke that she didn't like him flirting with Kuroneko, and then after Kuroneko had her face her real feelings she had him promise he wouldn't go out with anybody. She's definitely not as selfless as Kuroneko is (she admits herself that she is very selfish).

Originally Posted by Wilshere

Here we go again with the ''Kuroneko deserves better'' excuses. If so, why did she fall in love with him? She always admits that he is useless and stuff but she likes him that way, add to that, that he always is there to help and is simply a very kind guy. Once again, the anime did not do a very good job in clearing the Manami/Kirino mess alongside the build-up which led him to fall for her. One more thing, its really sad seeing this Kirino hate where to the extent people rejoice in seeing her hurt.If anything, Kuroneko wanted this to happen and she admits that she always knew that from the get-go, not surprising for me(or whoever watched the series for the plot and not giving much unnecessary attention to the side characters), hence your disappointment. I said it many times, blame yourself if you expected any different ending than this. Most people nowadays watch anime not for the plot or build-up, but for their ''girls''. Harsh reality is bitter, but you must cope with it.

Calm down and read again. I didn't say she deserved better. I said I hope she'll find someone better. I'm not saying she deserves better than Kyousuke, I'm saying she deserves happiness.

It's perfectly fine to be disappointed over Kuroneko's loss. She received just as much romantic development if not more than Kirino in the anime. Why should I not care about her? She is in no way a side character we shouldn't give any unnecessary attention to, to quote your words. As a love interest, she was just as important as Kirino and her chances of winning were fair. Well, at least until she self-destructed in episode 8. After that it was obvious she wouldn't win but not all hope was lost yet.

By the way, this isn't reality. This is wish fulfillment fantasy for otaku.

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

That isn't all that resulted. Kirino was originally going to go off overseas but that got called off regardless of their "dating" arrangement. So he gets to continue to be with Kirino indefinitely going forward, even if they've "gone back to being normal siblings" (pending the results of the additional life counselling). In the end, you might argue that continuing to be together was more important for them than what exact form their relationship took.

(Not that I expect this to change your opinion.)

That's a good point. That's the one positive thing I can take away from this ending. I'm not sure this was the only way to accomplish this result, however. This remains a massive cop out.

[GDiddy]

It's a shame that it ended too like this, because other than the implied incestyay, it's a pretty fun look at being an otaku

Fucking hell.....no wonder people look down on anime sometimes for this shit.

In happier terms though; THANK YOU MANAMI. And someone seriously needs to give Kuroneko her own spinoff.

[ginger02]

Finished watching. Two parts confused me though:

1. Why did Kyousuke break up with everyone when he knew he and Kirino would go back to being normal siblings?

2. I never really got the feeling he really had feelings for Kirino, so his confession seemed a bit random to me.

Otherwise I loved it. Was a little rushed, and could have switched Kanako with Ayase to be better. The show kind of touches on the subject for those who do have incestuous feelings, which I like that it did. Also, the life of an otaku was great. The kiss on the cheek was the cutest moment though.

[VORTIA]

Originally Posted by GDiddy

And someone seriously needs to give Kuroneko her own spinoff.

She got a manga already!

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Kanon

That's true, but you also have to take into account what happened before and after she gave Kuroneko her approval. She pulled that stunt with the fake boyfriend to make it clear to Kyousuke that she didn't like him flirting with Kuroneko, and then after Kuroneko had her face her real feelings she had him promise he wouldn't go out with anybody. She's definitely not as selfless as Kuroneko is (she admits herself that she is very selfish).

I'm not saying she is quite as selfless as Kuroneko, but she I checked that scene again, and she never made Kyousuke promise that he won't go out with anybody. I quote that scene:

Spoiler for Episode 9:

Kirino: What were you planning to answer back then (when Kuroneko asked him what he would answer, now that he knows Kirino's true feelings)?

Kyou: [...] I can't get a girlfriend if you don't want me to. Not yet, at least.

Kirino: Not yet? Then, when?

Kyou: When you get a boyfriend, I guess?

Kirino: But you don't want me to get a boyfriend either, right?

Kyou: Yeah

Kirino: That's no good.

Kyou: No, it isn't.

And that thing with Mikagami, while immature, was understandable. Kyousuke was too dense to pick her emotions up and she also couldn't tell him straight (which Kyousuke would have found ridiculous by the way). Kyousuke flirts around not only with Kuroneko, but also with Ayase and Manami (she specifically mentioned Manami and Kuroneko). But when Mikagami came, Kyousuke made the hell of a ruckus and when Kirino compared that with him flirting he honestly didn't see the comparability of him flirting and her bringing a (fake) boyfriend. Kyousuke in this instance was not only dense, but also very inconsiderate.

Furthermore, I think her going abroad with the intention of confessing to Kyousuke before is a hint to interpreting what she intended to do. She planned to confess to him to get a close on this relationship (either positive, or what she feared negative). And if his response turned out negative she would leave abroad to enable them both a new beginning, relieving Kyousuke of the self-given responsibility of not getting a girlfriend because she doesn't like it. As I quoted above, she said it is no good if both of them tie their relationship fates together, so her solution is leaving. It may not be as selfless as Kuroneko, but she sure cares enough about him, not to give him hurdles if he turns her down.

By the way, a few pages ago somebody said Kyousuke looked like a retard with that screaming around, and I have to agree to a certain degree. Him going berserk during the confession, and to a degree with Manami was somewhat okay. But I think the staff really turned it into a running joke when he screamed around and bended backwards in that Kanako scene. I was surprised by this because this wasn't how I imagined it, having read the novel. I imagined him looking at Kanako and saying in a determined, but calm voice, that he can't date her. Here's the passage from the novel:

"With a dignified voice, I shouted my answer:

“I refuse! I can’t go out with you! ---- Because I already have a girlfriend that I love above everything else!” "

His answer in the anime was anything but dignified...

[taichi-kun]

Originally Posted by Kanon

If you want to make an incest ending despite it not making sense in the first place (at least in the context of the anime, I don't know and don't care about the light novels), do it. Don't cop out at the last minute. He rejected all those awesome girls for the chance to be with Kirino only for a few months? You have to be kidding me... that's just adding to the injury. I can't think of any way they could have made this ending worse.

I agree

he rejected ALL the girls just to be alone in the end..what an idiot... some people will say that their agreement made it more realistic,I found it cheap and a stupid thing to do.

Oh and that final kiss.. when I read the book I thought it was on the lips.. but it was a kiss on her cheek that makes the incest end less probable

the end is too open

[Sumeragi]

I'll be waiting for the Afterstory.

[Miraluka]

Originally Posted by Sumeragi

I'll be waiting for the Afterstory.

This.



Or one can stick to their... ff ends.

[Black Phoenix]

I've been reading this forum for too long and I created an account precisely because this topic.

I'm one of the only ones that are open minded and know how to separate the real world form the 2D world?

I think that this ending was the possible one, because of everything that was implied in the Manga / Anime / LN.

The topic in question is controversial and not well accepted by the society we live. At least was different from the normal not "blood related" siblings (PhotoKano is one of the most recent Animes I watched where that happened, for example). Of course being blood related siblings, this were the possible way of warping everything around.

The fight in question was good, I loved the sentiment that were show there, from both parties, and I'm with the MC. He had choose what he wanted, what was the best for him and is to him that he needs to give justifications, not to anyone.

I do not feel sorry for Manami, I never liked her. She always had the upper hand, knowing everything even without anyone telling her, sticking is nose in someone's business. She deserved to be happy in the end? Probably, but also Ayase, Ruri and Kanako deserved. But they were turned down by the MC. The ending in question, leaves a little fell that things will be not as were in the beginning, and the last life counselling after MC demanded his "trophy" for getting a A in the Mock Exam that we will never see implies that. The author left lots of flags that implies that!

In overall, I will miss this history, I enjoyed the story, the jokes on it and the turnarounds that were shown. Was a good show.