2008-07-15, 11:40 | Link #5741 | |||||
RRR/Kotori/Tessa Servant
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Netherlands, Rotterdam
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No smilies today, it's cold here. Quote:
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The "bad" writing part, I mean, Kubo has put a lot of pressure on Orihime's love. If she has just said "I love ichigo", fine by me. If she doesn't end up with ichigo she can move on or end up with someone else. But saying that even if she has five lifetimes she would still fall in love with ichigo, puts more drama/effect in it. Kubo has made Orihime's love so deep, that her falling in love with someone else would need some major screen and story time.
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2008-07-15, 11:44 | Link #5742 | |||
Optimus Prime
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Japan/Canada
Age: 39
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Oh Searcher... I think you need to go read some more of the manga
To answer your question, Ichigo has a hollow side because Urahara cut his chain of fate. It was how he regained his shinigami powers following his first meeting with Byakuya. The powers he used to defeat the hollow part of himself were his own, not Rukia's borrowed ones. I believe that's covered in the anime and the manga but I could be wrong about the manga bit. Quote:
I don't think any Ishida lovers that I've seen on this board have suggested anything quite so ludicrous. Your point about Ishida's fighting style not being suited for close-range combat makes complete sense, but I can understand why readers are confused about his absence from the reunion chapter last week. Despite the back and forth, I think most people in that group would consider him 'nakama'. So where is he? It's not entirely impossible that he will help Ichigo take down Ulq. Perhaps he will be the one to get Inoue safely from the tower while Ichigo defeats Ulq (paralleling SS, when Renji removed Rukia from the execution grounds so she could be safe while Ichigo fought off Byakuya and the other captains). Quote:
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2008-07-15, 11:46 | Link #5743 |
Ishida Zealot
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Deep South among alligators
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Good morning and Happy Birthday Ichigo! I can't stay away from this site because I'm an obsessed fangirl!
IchiRuki isn't my OTP but I've been pretty staunch about defending the pairing as Kubo's OTP, much to the annoyance of many here. The fun outweighs the hate mail, though. I just wanted to drop by and point out an important parallel Kubo-sensei made between the SS arc and the HM arc in the last chapter of Bleach. I thought that this was IchiOri's last chance for romantic development. There was a decidedly romantic IchiRuki colorspread for chapter 85. Since then, no other girl has shared a colorspread alone with Ichigo, let alone one that shows this sort of obsession with her. Spoiler for chaper 85 IchiRuki colorspread:
This was the time for the IchiOri color spread. It didn't happen. This was the time for Ichigo to declare something SPECIFIC about Orihime, at least her NAME, in his speech bubbles or to have a flashback about her in his thoughts. He didn't. Before this chapter I was alert to shipping clues. Now, I ship what I want--RenIshi, IshiHime--regardless of whatever way the manga is going but I've got a fascination with canon and a challenge to myself to read the author's intentions correctly. This chapter defined the rescue from Inoue's point of view. She said that she would do the same for any of her nakama. The theme was hit over and over--nakama, nakama. It was in the side-text that Ichigo's blade swings FOR his nakama. In Soul Society, we also had a rescue defined from Inoue's point of view. Ishida was about to say that of course they all had gone this far for the sake of a friend but Orihime interrupted him to say that to Kurosaki-kun, Rukia was more than a nakama. Spoiler for More than a nakama:
I don't know what clearer parallel you can have than that. Game, set, match, IchiRuki. Just another parallel for the hellofit: when the great execution bird was about head for Rukia, we had Ichigo appear and Rukia and Ichigo's eyes met, words were exchanged, etc. When Ulquiorra's hand is at Orihime's chest and about to kill her (?), Ichigo appears and who exchanges a glance with him? We're not shown Orihime's face. The face we're shown is Ulquiorra's. The dynamic is not on the IchiOri romance at all. Next chapter Ichigo may ask Orihime if she's all right. If there's more, I'll be very surprised. I'm just waiting for the rest of the summer's story. I expect it will be fun. I want my Orihime development (and my Ishida appearance!). To those annoyed by the IshiHime pairing, alas, your frequent taunts of "Ishida is a fag" don't make me flinch at all and I'm in perfect agreement that Orihime makes almost no acknowledgement at this point of Ishida's y chromosome. Kubo-sensei would have to work to make this pairing canon, but I still love it--and yes, I do have hope for it. Ishida defied his father, told Urahara he'd rescue Inoue alone if he had to, and said to Renji in HM, "I'm here to save Inoue-san, not to fight Espada." I'd like to see his determination rewarded. More than acknowledgement from Hime, I'd like her to shoot Tsubaki and stand on her own two feet rather than fall into another man's arms and be whisked away a la Rukia via Renji in SS but knowing Kubo's love of parallels---hey, I'll just laugh and laugh if that happens. Over and out, and happy shipping!
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2008-07-15, 11:58 | Link #5744 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: at the IchiRuki FC :3
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2008-07-15, 12:28 | Link #5745 | ||||||
RRR/Kotori/Tessa Servant
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Netherlands, Rotterdam
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And if I were ishida I would still be between nemu's breast I don't think that Orihime will leave ichigo untill the fight is over, after all she can shield herself. Quote:
Kubo could do it for minor minor characters like the shinigamis. Without changing the dynamics of the major characters. But sofar nothing. Quote:
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Oh well, time to start reading the manga
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2008-07-15, 12:43 | Link #5746 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Between a rock and a hard place.
Age: 38
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Gee, let's see if I can figure this out.
more than nakama (so far) > regular nakama (so far). more than nakama = / = just a nakama, Therefore, can we deduce that they are more than friends, less than lovers? Of course, you're right, this doesn't mean they have a lover's connection. She just has a really close, friendly bond with Ichigo that is a bit stronger than his other nakama so far. |
2008-07-15, 12:45 | Link #5747 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
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What else is there besides nakama?
As far as my understanding of the definition goes, it is deep friendship accompanied by unfailing trust. After that it's family, which doesn't make sense in Ichigo and Rukia's situation because their interactions don't scream brother/sister etc. What's after that? Family pets? By the way, if you want to look at what Rukia thinks of everyone in her life, look at her thoughts in 269. Friends (Chad/Ishida), Family (Byakuya/Renji), then Ichigo with completely new panel art and then her best girl friend Inoue. If that doesn't somewhat dim the shipping wars, I don't know what will. |
2008-07-15, 12:48 | Link #5748 | |
カカシ
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In Rukia's flashback, we saw a tale of two "brothers"...or maybe I should say three brothers. Byakuya was her adoptive brother who didn't act like one. He was cold, distant and formal with her. Then she met Kaien who was warm, kind and informal with her just like a brother should be. Kaien was everything Byakuya was not. However, she lost Kaien when he died after he impaled himself on her sword (ironic that Rukia herself was later impaled by Aronillo/Kaien's Nejibana). It took Ichigo, another brother-like figure (he was kind and informal to Rukia, don't know about warm...) to show Byakuya how a big brother should act towards their little sister. Ichigo should know because he himself is a big brother to two little sisters. Is it any wonder then that Kubo has been showing how Rukia is like a sister to Ichigo (his sister's clothes fit her, Isshin put her bed in Ichigo's sisters' rooms)? Ichigo also had no problem letting Byakuya do the saving. That's why he asked Byakuya during their fight why he didn't want to save her when it's his job as brother to do so. In the end, Byakuya did learn from Ichigo how a brother should act. That's why I never saw the SS arc romantic except where Orihime was concerned. That was because Orihime was the only one in that arc that really showed any interest in Ichigo in a romantic sense. I mean, when Kubo wants to be obvious, he's going to be obvious. Orihime had a crush on Ichigo, by the end of that arc, that crush didn't die. It was still there and only grew to be full on love by chapter 237. Kubo is not going to waste all that ink to develop Orihime's love just for her to move on later. After all, we've covered the theme of family in SS arc, the theme of friendship in HM arc, and I wouldn't be surprised if we're going to see the theme of love in this arc. What an auspicious start we've had so far. We've got the proverbial knight (Ichigo) racing towards the tower to save the princess (Orihime) from the dragon (Ulquiorra). He gets attacked by castle guards only to have his comrades back him up so he can continue on to his goal. When Ichigo arrives he sees Ulquiorra's hand aimed right for Orihime's heart. It's as if Kubo was pointing out that this is where this arc is going to start, from Orihime's heart. And Ichigo, being the first one to arrive to see it, will be the one to claim Orihime's heart and keep it safe. But yes if nothing significant happens before the end, it's IchiRuki. Last edited by Kakashi; 2008-07-16 at 10:51. |
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2008-07-15, 12:52 | Link #5749 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Between a rock and a hard place.
Age: 38
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Well, it's pretty fair game right now, Notaron.
I mean, on the one hand, you have the girl that changed Ichigo's life/is his rotator/made the rain stop. On the other hand, you have a girl that will love him for five lifetimes. We need more from Ichigo's part before jumping to any given conclusions. |
2008-07-15, 12:53 | Link #5750 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
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Ruki (a male version of rukia)
imagine if rukia was a male instead of female in bleach..how would you evaluate her interaction with ichigo a worried ruki oh he seems very girly here he's struggling here to stop going to his ichigo XD Ruki is happy to see his ichigo again "I won't give up in ichigo" "ichigo don't told them I'm a gay" a gentle ruki he's happy when ichigo's happy <3 when ichigo thanked him gently, he didn't want to keep up the subject or else he'll be embarrassed he jumps to protect ichigo when he is in danger he surprised at ichigo's sudden hug "why did you leave me ruki, is it because your secret has been exposed "gay"" "ruki I came to take you home with me" "ichigo are you sure you okay with a gay like me" " and do I need to tell you again that I'm fine with it" Well it's easy to come up with ideas and a different understanding for their interaction.. but kubo wrote these scenes to observe it from one point of view.. If rukia were a guy, I'm sure ichiruki would be the most famous gay couple in anime world XD |
2008-07-15, 12:54 | Link #5751 | |
Insane Fangirl
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Home of the 2010 Olympics
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2008-07-15, 12:57 | Link #5752 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2008
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The HM arc isn't over yet. Back to the response however, I never saw a perfect reason for Inoue's crush to blossom into undying love. Where did she do/see anything that would cause for this to happen? I didn't see one scene in SS that she was in that would lead her to fall in love with Ichigo. In fact, did she actually say anything about her love for him before 237? Why do you get the feeling that this arc is going to be even remotely romantic either? The 'nakama' theme has been hammered home from the beginning, even Inoue in the last chapter mentions all of her nakama, not just Ichigo. Had Ichigo been the only one mentioned, then maybe this would have had some relevance. By the way, there hasn't been anything in this arc that rivals Ichigo's landing in front of Rukia on his knee during the bridge scene nor the Soukyoku scene yet. I'd also like to add that it is PERFECTLY plausible that Kubo is setting up Inoue to realize her one-sided feelings. Unrequited love is pretty common in manga/anime, and both Inoue and Renji are suffering from it. |
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2008-07-15, 12:59 | Link #5753 | |
Insane Fangirl
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Home of the 2010 Olympics
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2008-07-15, 13:16 | Link #5756 | ||
カカシ
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Spoiler for Gutter.:
There are plenty. Not that one. I'll PM you about this. Quote:
Got to watch E3 Sony Conference. Sorry couldn't answer you fully. |
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2008-07-15, 13:20 | Link #5759 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Rukia-land
Age: 28
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First of all,crying over his injures.Okay,why in hell would she freaking CRY?She is Rukia,keep in mind this is not Orihime crying over the injures of an enemy,she is Rukia,she doesn't cry over something simple,she isn't the type to reveal her emotions so easily and NOTHING insignificant makes her shed a tear.Just because there is no declaration "OMG I LOVA YA SOO MUCH ICHI-KUN" doesn't mean feelings aren't there. What do you need to see them anyways?Hands-holding and romantic five lifetimes speeches?Is it what you expect Rukia to do if she is in love?Do you expect the main pairing in a shounen like Bleach to be based on giggling and blushing at little body contact?Like I already mentioned,this is not the Rukia and Kubo I know,he is better than this. Then,the executioan stand.The panel with both Ichigo and Rukia when she said "Ichigo's strenght flaws endlessly into me" is romantic.(when he was carrying her).Did Rukia ever shared a panel like this one with Renji?I don't think so. "Just for Hime to move on"?What,isn't Orihime's developement important in Bleach? She is the second most important female in Bleach universe.Her developement is important and Kubo can make it just for her to grow up.Since obviously the love is not shared,what would be the purpose of it?If it's to be shared,it would have happened through Hueco Mundo right?Because they had big amount of time to interact but nothing romantic was implyed by Kubo and the arc is called Nakama arc. Orihime will learn from this love,getting over it will help her to mature,understanding it's not nessecary the guy you want to love you back and even without more than friendship,you can still be close with that guy,all these things matter.And since Ichigo shows no interest(if you don't believe that,I will be more than glad to hear why)in her,what else is that love for? Everything in Bleach has purpose,everything is done for the depths of a character or it's a plotkai.It's not like Kubo makes his characters interact and change with no reason. Because I would go the same way as you-"Why make Ichigo and Rukia interact when it is gonna be Orihime Ichigo chooses".This is a weak argument.Why do this and why that. Quote:
If it is in an order to repay a debt,why would he expect her to go back with him?If what you said was true,there would be no purpose in Ichigo being so sure even without asking Rukia is returning with him.If it is just a debt,he would save her and go home.However,he expected her to come. Why did he have flashback of a crying Rukia in chapter 181?He would havehad a panel of her saving him if it was the debt.The difference is it WAS NOT the debt,it wa sher happiness."If you actually wanna stay here,isn't that a good thing?".Because last time Byakuya and Renji captured her while she was crying and her eyes were fulled with tears and obviously she didn't want to go and wasn't happy at all.And he just wanted her mental well-being.If it was just for saving her from dying,he wouldn't care so much for her feelings. Hana-chan-IchigoxRuki for the win.This cracked me up Thousand of grammar mistakes but I write fast so bear with me.
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