(L+CR) Nobunaga: The Fool

[RoboMambo]

The whole thing at the waterfall was too narmy. Nobunaga screaming while standing the strenght of the water, Jeanne crying at the pure manliness. This could have actually been a good scene, but the crying was too much, and O just dodn't feel Nobu's screaming, I don't know if it was the voice actor, or the rest of the scene pulling it down.

Now the love triangle is gone, Nobu get an opportunity to step up his game, and Jeanne learnt what it means to support your men. Himiko's death was to hamfisted, and it's intent so obvious.

To not say only bad things, the funeral was good. To me, it was maybe the only moment so far that Nobunaga truly shone. And the torrent of cherry petals was perfect.

Originally Posted by AntonKutovoi

And yes, this Nobunaga heavily lacks charisma. Compared to the last season's Nobunaga from Kanetsugu to Keiji or even to this season's Nobu from Nobunagun, this Nobunaga is completely unimpressive.

For real, I can't stop myself from comparing this show to Gifuu Doudou. If only it had more righteousness.

[Shikijin]

Another historical anecdote about Nobuhide's death:

"When his father lay mortally ill in Owari, Nobunaga asked the bonzes to pray for his life and asked them whether he would recover from his illness. They assured him that he would, but he died a few days later. Nobunaga then had the bonzes thrown into a temple with the doors locked from the outside; he told the bonzes that, as they had lied to him about the health of his father, they had better pray to their idols with greater devotion for their own lives. After surrounding them on the outside, he shot some of them to death with harquebuses."

I think this shows that he cared in his own way for his father.

By the way, Nobunaga's brother's name was Nobuyuki, but he was also known as Nobukatsu (at the time people had many names). It is confusing because Nobunaga had a son also called Nobukatsu. Anyway, Nobunaga's brother conspired against him, and Nobunaga had to kill him.

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by dniv

No, I agree with Nobunaga. You're all missing the point. Ever seen Silver-Spoon? The point is that first appearances don't mean much. If you don't deeper into what is actually going on, then you're just going to be like most people and miss something amazing.

Thing is, it's been 6 episodes already, we're pretty much over the "first impressions" stage. Plus, unlike in Silver Spoon we don't have a POV character here, so we're supposed to see the characters a lot more objectively. It's not that Nobunaga is a "fool" - duh, he's supposed to be one. The problem is that so far Nobunaga has done exactly nothing to show that despite being an eccentric and a controversial figure, he's worthy of the loyalty and trust his followers place in him, and that he's really just misunderstood.

Originally Posted by dniv

If you really think that there is no special reason for why he does why he does, why the hell would he be called the savior king and the show made about him?

Why indeed. Perhaps there's some character development down the road, or as I said earlier, it could be that the character is not working the way the writers expect him to, due to his lack of charisma and the general "if you don't think he's awesome you're just a hater" approach to him.

Originally Posted by kirasama

let me say something here :
I think he was trying to avoid a "civil war" in his clan. if he disputes the crown with his brother his clan would collapses from the inside.

doing what he did he could make his brother the new leader and avoid it.

for me, a smart move.

If that's what he was trying to do he wasn't doing a very good job. He already knew that many retainers don't want him to be the boss, why didn't he just resign and support his brother?

Originally Posted by zztop

Some of Nobunaga’s actions this ep are the exact same as his real-life counterpart’s actions, who also threw incense at his late father’s altar while dressed inapproproately.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oda_Nobuhide

Refer to the Succession Controversy part of the above link.

Yes, I know. Again, the problem is not that Nobunaga is an eccentric who does controversial things, he's Oda Nobunaga, that's what he's supposed to do. It's that so far there's nothing to show that there's more to him than that and that he's not just a self-centered ass/a "free spirit" who does whatever he wants and everyone can go to hell. This episode, and I think some previous ones as well, tried to show him in a better light but they were unconvincing to say the least.

[Rokumonsen]

Poor Nobukatsu. Although I thought he already knew Mitsu's plans and accepted it.

[ookamigirl]

Things are not looking good for Oda clan.
Nobunaga was grieving in his own unique way.
Always such a rebel...
If he continues like this he's gonna have an uprising on his hands.
He's going to push everyone away with his behavior.
Guess he's too macho to show his true feelings to anyone.
The ending of the episode was a shocker!
So much unnecessary loss..

[Death Usagi]

Seriously... if Himiko dies this early, it's going to be freaking disappointing...

And poor Nobukatsu... he was just naive. He didn't really do anything wrong D:

[Sinta]

Shiz just got real...Powerful episode, not perfect, but certainly good. The deaths were unexpected.

[GDiddy]

The brother's death didn't surprise me in the least....but why even bother with Himiko if all she was going to be was more of a supporting character who dies off considering that she's in the OP?

This show went from crazy and ridiculous to plain ridiculous. Goddamn I can't STAND Nobu or Jeanne. I know the real Nobu wasn't exactly the best person ever(wasn't he the japanese version of Vlad the Impaler?) but this show makes him the BESTEST PERSON EVAH AND YOU SUCK IF U HAET HIM. Christ, if I want to see a show about a Gary Stu, I'll stick to Shonen Jump's messes.

I'm done. Peace out.

[Nork22]

Originally Posted by Zero-2

2 character deaths in 1 episode? Are they pulling an Urobuchi here?

Urobuchi got nothing on the amount of times Kawamori kills his characters.

[kuromitsu]

You guys need to watch (or read) LoGH. "Oh, you like this character? Hold on a sec... *KILL KILL DESTROY* There."

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

You guys need to watch (or read) LoGH. "Oh, you like this character? Hold on a sec... *KILL KILL DESTROY* There."

What's LoGH?

[mnedel]

Maybe he means Legend of Galactic Heroes?
For me it is the best anime ever! It has everything, great plot, deep characters (who are adults), interesting world. It was very entertaining. After a few episodes I was completely addicted, finished the entire series in less than two weeks (it has over 100 episodes). It's a space opera with an accent on politics and huge fleet battles.
There were some memorable deaths.

[kuromitsu]

^Yep, it's Legend of Galactic Heroes, pretty much one of the best anime ever (the novel series it's based on is also damn good).

[Avaricia]

Originally Posted by Cloudedmind

What's LoGH?

Log Horizon

Spoiler for :heh::

...
^
^
^
What they said

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by mnedel

Maybe he means Legend of Galactic Heroes?
For me it is the best anime ever! It has everything, great plot, deep characters (who are adults), interesting world. It was very entertaining. After a few episodes I was completely addicted, finished the entire series in less than two weeks (it has over 100 episodes). It's a space opera with an accent on politics and huge fleet battles.
There were some memorable deaths.

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

^Yep, it's Legend of Galactic Heroes, pretty much one of the best anime ever (the novel series it's based on is also damn good).

Thanks, I'll look into it.

[Avrorrange]

Originally Posted by ookamigirl

Things are not looking good for Oda clan.
Nobunaga was grieving in his own unique way.
Always such a rebel...
If he continues like this he's gonna have an uprising on his hands.
He's going to push everyone away with his behavior.
Guess he's too macho to show his true feelings to anyone.
The ending of the episode was a shocker!
So much unnecessary loss..

Honnouji is INEVITABLE if Nobunaga continues his ways as he did.

[dniv]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

Thing is, it's been 6 episodes already, we're pretty much over the "first impressions" stage. Plus, unlike in Silver Spoon we don't have a POV character here, so we're supposed to see the characters a lot more objectively. It's not that Nobunaga is a "fool" - duh, he's supposed to be one. The problem is that so far Nobunaga has done exactly nothing to show that despite being an eccentric and a controversial figure, he's worthy of the loyalty and trust his followers place in him, and that he's really just misunderstood.


Why indeed. Perhaps there's some character development down the road, or as I said earlier, it could be that the character is not working the way the writers expect him to, due to his lack of charisma and the general "if you don't think he's awesome you're just a hater" approach to him.


If that's what he was trying to do he wasn't doing a very good job. He already knew that many retainers don't want him to be the boss, why didn't he just resign and support his brother?


Yes, I know. Again, the problem is not that Nobunaga is an eccentric who does controversial things, he's Oda Nobunaga, that's what he's supposed to do. It's that so far there's nothing to show that there's more to him than that and that he's not just a self-centered ass/a "free spirit" who does whatever he wants and everyone can go to hell. This episode, and I think some previous ones as well, tried to show him in a better light but they were unconvincing to say the least.

I mean you're having good points and you're right, but I'm hoping that a 2-cour show didn't mess up that badly, especially since if it didn't then it has pretty good potential of getting very interesting.

It's true that his being special isn't exactly coming off near as well as it could have i.e. I've seen much better renditions of that particular element in movies all of the time in English every second or third movie but... I'm still hoping it gets better because I'd rather it be good than bad.

I was just in a bad mood when I wrote that post... sorry if I was harsh.

[velvet nightmare]

common sense: if you are taking a shower with water that's too cold just step out... screaming about it won't make it better

if there was supposed to be any symbolism in that, i completely missed it because of how stupid it all played out.

[NoemiChan]

Seeing how Jeanne is feeling the hurt of Nobunaga's sadness is so dramatic.....

If the loli dies then it's solid Nobunaga x Jeane FTW!!!! ^^

[mikethepokemaster]

Originally Posted by velvet nightmare

common sense: if you are taking a shower with water that's too cold just step out... screaming about it won't make it better

if there was supposed to be any symbolism in that, i completely missed it because of how stupid it all played out.

I think it got to more with him feeling guilty and pain at his father death more or less \. Well to me at least anyway. I really don't get the Nobunaga hate but whatever. This is a two course show so wait and see what happens