Higurashi (1st Season) General Discussion

[Misuzu]

Not going to go too in-depth with the theories I have, because most of them are pretty close to stuff that's already been posted. Two things I've been wondering, though.

Spoiler for firstly:

I've seen a lot of people say that they think that some kind of hallucinogen, or other concious altering substance could be in the water.

Does anyone else think it could be in pollen? It would explain (to an extent) why things are happening at that specific time of year, and it would explain the picture of the flower in episode 4.

Spoiler for Secondly:

When Mion and Rena started mentioning "the director", I assumed they meant the ringleader of the dismemberment murder, the one who disapeared. Am I the only one who thinks this? Am I totally off base?

[HMMaster]

Originally Posted by kj1980

That is a QRcode. QRcodes are a popular 2-dimensional barcode used predominately in Japan so that people can use with their camera-phones to look up info from their internet capable mobile phones. What you do is take a picture of that barcode with your camera-phone, and the phone recognizes the info stored in that barcode and does its thing (access a website, etc. etc.) It surely beats the hell out of punching in website address on the dialpad. If it doesn't work for you, then it's probably because QRcodes are a feature that is only found in our phones and is only used in Japan (then again, I wouldn't know so can someone outside of Japan confirm?).

The QRcode that you used in your post is the one that will make your mobile phone access the mobile phone version of the oyashirosama.com website.

Another cool feature for QRcodes is that because it is a matrix code, it is able to store vast amounts of data. So if you get a business card with a QRcode on it and take a picture of that with your camera-phone, you can store the info on that business card into your mobile phone without the tedious task of typing it in and storing it. Or if you have a QRcode reader, you can store it in your PDA (if your PDA has a camera, even better!), your Outlook address book, etc. etc.

So if you happen to come across Japanese magazines with that kind of picture, it is a QRcode. If you want tickets to L'Arc~en~Ciel, you can take a picture of that if it is written on the poster and it will redirect your phone to access the website to buy the tickets. If you find a magazine with an interesting article and if there is a QRcode next to it, it will take you to a website with more info. If you need to send a letter, you can take a picture of that QRcode and print it out and use that as a shipping label. Etc, etc.

Obviously, you can find more info about QRcodes on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QR_Code

And if you are interested, you can create your own QRcode here! http://www.qrcodemake.com/bookmark.php
The English one doesn't seem to be working, but the Japanese page is made alongside with the English one so it's fairly simple to figure it out.

ic. thanks for the info!

[Cogwheim]

An inquiry with respect to the "Men in Green":

Spoiler:

Even though I've been lead to believe that many of the events in Onikakushi-hen that are recounted to us by the paranoid and disturbed K1 are unreliable do to his fractured cognitive state, I'll concede to the notion that many of the occurences within the chapter have, at the very least, some element of truth backing them. If I'm going to be specific, I'd say that any phenomena which occur when a character on screen has contorted eyes are probably exaggerations of what actually occured--likewise, when all characters on screen have normally rendered eyes, the phenomena which occur probably actually happend. By "normally rendered" I mean without any strain, without a look of disbelief, without a look of anger, and without bulging.

Everytime the Men in Green make an appearance, K1's eyes aren't normal. As I said, this probably means that the phenomena which occur regarding the Men in Green are exaggerated, not hallucinated. I wager that the Men in Green exist, but K1 was being overly paranoid in their presence. What does this mean? That the Men in Green didn't attempt a hit-and-run upon him, that they didn't knock him out with a block of wood, and that they weren't pursuing him with malicious intent as he fleed the scene of his homicide. That is not to say that the Men in Green weren't present in these cases--they were there, but they weren't acting belligerently or suspiciously.

Just who are the Men in Green, then? We know that the Doctor, or "Manager" rolled up with them in tow to K1's house. Why would the Men in Green travel via white van, and what connection do they have to The Manager?

In my mind, there are a handful or possibilities, and even combinations of these said possibilities. These are:

1) They're EMT's working for the Doctor's clinic. This could justify why they arrived alongside the Doctor who was to treat the ailing K1. [might the clinic be the pediatric clinic in Okinomiya? In the first TIP posted, this location is listed as being where the second school of Hinamizawa is...]

2) They're workers for the Forestry Preserve. This explains the green uniforms as well as why they were lurking around on the forest path. Doesn't really explain their presence at K1's house, though. [Once again, if the "Manager" leads these fellows, then could he possibly double as town Doctor and Manager of the Forestry Preservation? If such is the case, then he can effectively monitor both school houses of Hinamizawa at his discretion, since one is near his clinic and the other is actually situated within the Forestry Preserve building...]

3) They're Electric Company workers. This could explain their presence at K1's house--his power had went out the night before during the storm, and they were there checking up on things. Also, this could indicate their involvement with the Dam Construction Site incident, since the hydroelectric company was attempting to erect the dam. This could also make the "Manager" the manager of the dam construction, meaning the person who was supposedly dismembered...

4) They're Yakuza under the jurisdiction of the Sonozaki family. Once again, maybe the Doctor is one of Mion's numerous Uncles. This could indicate that they actually had an intention to murder K1, since he was beginning to "dig too deep," just like Satoshi.

Number 3 sort of conflicts with the other numbers--however, it's possible that any conjunction of numbers 1, 2, and 4 could be true.

I'd also like to point out that in Episode 2, when Tomitake and Takano are telling the story of the yearly Watanagashi murders to K1, it looks like the Men in Green are present in the picture depicting the deaths of Mr. and Mrs. Houjou, i.e., the one year anniversary's incident involving the supporter of the dam construction and his wife. (Satoko's parents). They're looking down at the waterfall, where the married couple supposedly fell...

[FubaredByAnime]

Originally Posted by Misuzu

Not going to go too in-depth with the theories I have, because most of them are pretty close to stuff that's already been posted. Two things I've been wondering, though.

Spoiler for firstly:

I've seen a lot of people say that they think that some kind of hallucinogen, or other concious altering substance could be in the water.

Does anyone else think it could be in pollen? It would explain (to an extent) why things are happening at that specific time of year, and it would explain the picture of the flower in episode 4.

Spoiler for Secondly:

When Mion and Rena started mentioning "the director", I assumed they meant the ringleader of the dismemberment murder, the one who disapeared. Am I the only one who thinks this? Am I totally off base?

Spoiler:

To your first comment:
If so, why only Keiichi and Tomitake (and Rena and Mion if you suspect they were affected as well)? Why not the whole town?

To your second comment:
KJ prefers the word "manager" to "director". Based on some other comments on the forum, we'll find out why it makes more sense. In terms of the manager being the ringleader, that yet has to be determined, but some like to believe so.

[Jellyfish Marine]

Well, about the weapon pics in the image thread...
In the bottom of every pic, there's a line written in japanese. Somebody has mentioned that they are big big spoilers. I wonder if anyone would kindly work on translating them OwO

[Freakman]

My question is : if they are spoiler, why would you want to be spoiled ?
Even if Higurashi being all about figuring out the truth is debatable, it's still not worth spoiling yourself.

[Jellyfish Marine]

Well, umm, I was thinking about the Marker/Syringe picture which made many people went "ah, so it was ________!!". Some of the weapon pics might be useful providing hints and I personally believe that our game moderators won't go as far as translating one with big spoilers.

But...yes, now that you've mentioned it, maybe it's better not to seek for anything other than TIPS; they are useful enough. Playing along with what we're given is more exciting, right? Thank you for reminding that ^-^

(One of my bad habits is asking around for spoilers, I'm terribly sorry if that ever happen to bug anyone before =w=o)

[Thewanderer]

Just watched ep6... and wow.

I made a lot of speculations before ep5, and ep6 don't seem to support any of them. I'm not dropping the possibilities just yet, but I'm keeping an open mind.

[Cogwheim]

Dude--
That was definetly Mion on the phone, and perhaps even Mion in the library--I think Shion has already been "taken away as a sacrifice for Oyashiro-sama" and Mion was just trying to confirm whether or not K1 needed to be sacrificed as well. And, well...now she's confirmed that K1 does need to be sacrificed.

All 3 families of Hinamizawa seem to have been against the Dam Construction, but the Furude family was attacked anyway--not only this, but the Sonozaki yakuza seem to have quite a bit of sway in this town. Mion seems to be directly linked to the murders in Watanagashi, yet only the Furude family supposedly has access to the shrine of Oyashiro-sama and the torture devices, which is peculiar.

[Shinndou]

Originally Posted by Cogwheim

Dude--
That was definetly Mion on the phone, and perhaps even Mion in the library--I think Shion has already been "taken away as a sacrifice for Oyashiro-sama" and Mion was just trying to confirm whether or not K1 needed to be sacrificed as well. And, well...now she's confirmed that K1 does need to be sacrificed.

It would be weird if it was Mion though, why would she need to wear Shion's clothes while talking at the phone?

[kj1980]

Helpful hint: My advice would be to jot down the clues of Takano Miyo-san's explanation of the Watanagashi Festival and reading the TIPS for what's coming in the next episode(s).

[Shinndou]

Originally Posted by kj1980

Helpful hint: My advice would be to jot down the clues of Takano Miyo-san's explanation of the Watanagashi Festival and reading the TIPS for what's coming in the next episode(s).

Hm, I was actually wondering if those scrapbook notes in the TIPS section were written by Takano Miyo-san.

[edit]

I just noticed this:

Spoiler for Taken from the TIPS regarding episode six:

Originally Posted by kj1980

Mion: "It's right after Watanagashi. If we still can't find him, we should notify the authorities in the morning. Whether we find him or not, it is best to do what we can do right now to avoid the pain in the gut."

A pain the gut? Is that a metaphor or is it referring to the way Tomitake (and Keiichi in Onikakushi-hen) committed suicide? Interesting...

[Vicke]

Originally Posted by Shinndou

Spoiler for Taken from the TIPS regarding episode six:

A pain the gut? Is that a metaphor or is it referring to the way Tomitake (and Keiichi in Onikakushi-hen) committed suicide? Interesting...

Or maybe she means it literally

[Cogwheim]

I envisioned rapid-fire speculation from opposing viewpoints in this thread. If you're reading this, and if something is on your mind or you disagree with another's musings, then type something up and fire away...

Anyway, if I'm going to take a vague stab at what's going to happen in the next two episodes...

Spoiler:

K1 is going to stumble across the fact that Shion is missing, and that Mion has been impersonating her since after the Watanagashi. Part of the reason why Mion offed Shion has to do with the fact that she was an accomplice to the festival-shed break-in, the other part being that she wanted to eliminate her sister as being the other potential heir to the head seat in the Sonozaki family. After this, K1 tries desperately to keep himself from falling victim to the Yakuza and Mion, since the Sonozaki family has always been the family to enforce the divine whims of "Oyashiro-sama." Of course, Oyashiro-sama's curse is probably just a political tool used to instill fear within the residents of Hinamizawa--or, in the case of the present, a means to disrupt plans for the Dam Construction as well a means of covering one's tracks concerning the murders.

Rika's going down, though. It's hard to say why--but she was stabbing away at her neck, right? Myabe it's similar to the way that K1 and Tomitake clawed at their necks. Perhaps it's true that her suicide has something to do with the mistake she made during the ritual, though.

[Sushi-Y]

Originally Posted by Shinndou

I just noticed this:

Spoiler for Taken from the TIPS regarding episode six:

A pain the gut? Is that a metaphor or is it referring to the way Tomitake (and Keiichi in Onikakushi-hen) committed suicide? Interesting...

Spoiler for that tip:

She said "痛くない腹を探られない方がいいでしょうから". Which literally means "it's better to not let an unhurt stomach be searched, after all".

痛くない腹を探られる ("an unhurt stomach searched") is an expression that means "to be doubted or second-guessed (by someone) even though nothing suspicious was done". So Mion was basically saying "whether we find him or not, it's better for us play things safe to avoid unwarranted suspicions".

I don't think the phrase was said with any direct connotations to Watanagashi.

[choia]

Originally Posted by Cogwheim

I envisioned rapid-fire speculation from opposing viewpoints in this thread. If you're reading this, and if something is on your mind or you disagree with another's musings, then type something up and fire away...

Anyway, if I'm going to take a vague stab at what's going to happen in the next two episodes...

Spoiler:

K1 is going to stumble across the fact that Shion is missing, and that Mion has been impersonating her since after the Watanagashi. Part of the reason why Mion offed Shion has to do with the fact that she was an accomplice to the festival-shed break-in, the other part being that she wanted to eliminate her sister as being the other potential heir to the head seat in the Sonozaki family. After this, K1 tries desperately to keep himself from falling victim to the Yakuza and Mion, since the Sonozaki family has always been the family to enforce the divine whims of "Oyashiro-sama." Of course, Oyashiro-sama's curse is probably just a political tool used to instill fear within the residents of Hinamizawa--or, in the case of the present, a means to disrupt plans for the Dam Construction as well a means of covering one's tracks concerning the murders.

Rika's going down, though. It's hard to say why--but she was stabbing away at her neck, right? Myabe it's similar to the way that K1 and Tomitake clawed at their necks. Perhaps it's true that her suicide has something to do with the mistake she made during the ritual, though.

Questions I would ask:

1. How did Mion find out? Tomitake was keeping an eye out, afterall.

2. If Mion really did get rid of Shion, why didn't she get rid of Keiichi at the same time, too?

3. If Mion is pretending to be Shion, then we know she'll switch back to Mion from time to time, since we see her at the school after the festival. So why is she still dressed up like Shion when she calls Keiichi?

Another question I have, based on the TIPS, is why the padlock on the storeroom was changed in the first place. Was it all a cunning trap to lure Tomitake and Takano?

[Cogwheim]

Originally Posted by choia

Questions I would ask:

1. How did Mion find out? Tomitake was keeping an eye out, afterall.

2. If Mion really did get rid of Shion, why didn't she get rid of Keiichi at the same time, too?

3. If Mion is pretending to be Shion, then we know she'll switch back to Mion from time to time, since we see her at the school after the festival. So why is she still dressed up like Shion when she calls Keiichi?

Another question I have, based on the TIPS, is why the padlock on the storeroom was changed in the first place. Was it all a cunning trap to lure Tomitake and Takano?

1. That's quite the question--I'd say that, simply, someone of the Sonozaki family was watching them go into the shed despite Tomitake's vigil. As you said, it might have all been a trap since the lock was changed. If you're implying that you believe it was Mion who took K1 into the shed, then I ask you this: Wouldn't she be commiting an offense against "Oyashiro-sama" as well? And, if she was the one with him, then why would she need to confirm that he was there?

2. She didn't get rid of K1 because the intel surrounding the break-in was ambiguous: or at least Mion wanted to believe it was. When she's on the phone with K1, she realizes that he was complicit in the break-in and reluctantly consigns herself to "sacrifice" him as well...

3. At school, Mion dresses noramally. Shion's disappearence in Okinomiya will have no bearing on their part of town the day after, anyway. When K1 is called to the library, it's Mion dressing as Shion--when Mion goes home later on and calls K1 from her bed, she's still wearing the clothers she disguised herslef with at the library.

[rocket]

Episode 6 (or 2.2 as I like to think of it now) answered a lot of questions! Sure it opened up a bunch of new possibilities (though I still don't go for the supernatural angle), but the things that happened were just as important as the things that were said.

Assumption time! Lets check my old ideas and throw in a few new ones. No closer to solid evidence on any solution (think it'll need to be 2.3 or 2,4 before there's anything like a pattern), but there are some boundaries and structure...

Spoiler:

1. Each chapter ends with (and probably starts with) a gruesome murder/suicide.
So far, this one looks like it's in the bag given the start of chapter 2. ^_^;; We'll see if it holds up, but I'd be willing to put money on it now!

2. The victims will be Keiichi or some/all of his friends.
And likewise...

3. There will be a death(s) mid chapter to heighten the tension and involve the police before the climactic ending we see at the beginning.
This held out for chapter 2, though I had no idea it would be the photographer again. Interestingly enough, his "girlfriend" died this time instead of disappearing. Undoubtedly this is "IMPORTANT"... but what it means we can't tell yet. It does seem to be evidence for the supernatural curse, but the murders could just be coverups for the cannibal cult and the disappearances are how they ...um... "restock the larder".

I'm tempted to refine my assumption and say that the same people will die every chapter, but I'm not convinced it's necessary. It *is* necessary for someone to die on the night of the festival though, and for that to start the events that freak out Keiichi and lead to some final horrible murder. So I'm going to stick to my assumption as it stands.

4. Each time the victims and perpetrators will be different, based on some subtle change in the timeline. That’s important because it means the story is not about Keiichi (who has a paranoid-schizo tendency) but about the setting and characters that in one scenario make Keiichi crazy, but in another might leave him perfectly sane. (I’m guessing he’ll only go crazy in one or two of the timelines at most).

Again, I think this one is being borne out - at least partially. The victims are different, and the immediate perp is different, although my theory is that they all have the same root cause. I was probably too hasty about Keiichi though.

Given how he reacted at the end of ep6 it occurred to me that Keiichi may have paranoid tendencies in all episodes - which is going to make unravelling the mystery harder!

Last time I said that the show is actually visual novel - not just in inspiration, but in structure. The original visual novel was based off the more traditional interactive type and may even have been conceived as such, but for whatever reason was released as a set of linear stories. Still, in the original game and in the anime now, each chapter plays out like different paths in a traditional game.

What's different? Thats supposed to be the key. Well now we've seen enough to hazard a few guesses.

Spoiler:

The obvious difference in chapter 2 is that Keiichi didn't goto the dump. We *know* this because he didn't meet the photographer until preparing for the festival. This certainly gives some support to the theories that the fall and discovery of the murder at the dump were *some* kind of trigger. But I find that less interesting than the question of *why* didn't Keiichi go?

Hehe... well, he wasn't flirting with Rena... so!

Assumption 5 - Like a visual novel, the key difference in each chapter is *which girl* is Keiichi is involved with!

Now before anybody accuses me of assuming that Keiichi's strike zone *is* that* low, I should say that it doesn't have to be a romantic involvement (or even interest on *his* part).

So, how many episodes are there anyhow... (>_>)

The other thing I noticed, which I don't think is conclusive enough to claim as an assumption, is that the problems for Keiichi begin when he starts to lie...

Now then, what else was worth noticing about the episode besides the obvious (Tanako works at the clinic, the festival *may* hide a cannibalistic cult behind the village)? One thing that stuck in my mind was that the village god had only 1 hand? Any meaning to it... I dunno?

Time to go read the TIPS before anymore theories!

[Jellyfish Marine]

Originally Posted by Cogwheim

Spoiler:

K1 is going to stumble across the fact that Shion is missing, and that Mion has been impersonating her since after the Watanagashi. Part of the reason why Mion offed Shion has to do with the fact that she was an accomplice to the festival-shed break-in, the other part being that she wanted to eliminate her sister as being the other potential heir to the head seat in the Sonozaki family.

Spoiler for Shion-Mion, from a different perspective...:

From Mion's reaction in the EP1, I would rather say that her hatred toward Shion is mainly from jealousy. Mion just want to spend her life like a normal girl but instead she's assigned to become a candidate for Sonozaki head. She is forced to act strong and tomboy-ish, and has to undergo several torment while Shion can enjoy life like a teenage girl.

Another assumption; Shion was Mion/Mion was Shion before the story takes place. The original Mion switched place with the original Shion; to avoid becoming a candidate.

[Matrim]

OK, I read some of the tips for episode six and I need to put forward my pet theories.

Spoiler:

What if the burned body is not that of Takano? We see in the tips that it was identified but the identity is not mentioned. I am pretty sure this theory will be shot down in the next episode but I had to mention it.
Takano just seemed too relaxed and happy for someone who has just broken into a forbidden warehouse, in a village where someone dies every year on this very day. I don't think the average archeologist who finds a human sacrifice tomb would tell its story so happily while inside the tomb but maybe Takano is just weird. Why did she and Tomitake allowed Shion and Keiichi to enter with them? Maybe Takano's role is to lure people into breaking the tabboo because someone wants the atmosphere of fear to continue in this village but is reluctant to kill people without the excuse that Oyashiro-sama is angry? And maybe this someone got really pissed off that not only Tomitake but also Shion (or Mion) and K1 got involved in the breaking in so he or she punished Takano?
If Takano is dead. is the person who called Keichi (Mion or Shion) sure of that? Or she just assumes that it has to be Takano?