Code Geass (Generic discussion thread)

[Paranoia833]

Originally Posted by JediNight

Suzaku is a pragmatist (optimist?) I think is the correct term? He would like to see the system overthrown as well, but he doesn't believe in sacrificing anyone in order to do it. But then of course the question is would the system ever change then?

The correct term for Suzaku would be an idealist. Lulu would be the pragmatist of the pair, concerned purely with ends rather than means (hence admonishing the terrorists for attacking civilians not out of any sense of justice, but because it hasn't actually impeded Britannia in any way). I would hesitate to call Lulu a realist simply because the term comes with a lot of ideological baggage when used in a political context, that can't be easily applied to Lelouch without knowing more about his long term plans.

To be honest I'm a little disappointed. When it seemed like the show was going in a morally grey direction I was kind of hoping for a more in depth look at imperialism and the way of thinking that inspires it via mecha-anime. Instead they simply seem to have gone in the "this side is good, this side is bad but there are some idealists and assholes on both sides" approach, which has already been done to death in other mecha-anime IMHO.

Still I'll continue watching. The show may not be my ideal anime or bring much new to the table, but it could still be fun, and I'm still curious to see what they do with it.

Yeah I saw the ANN review and I instantly replied with a bash on the reviewer. In fact, most people who frequent the ANN forums and people who work there are ****ing western lay-fans who know NOTHING about Anime. God they piss me off.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. Just out of interest what, specifically about the preview of Code Geass do you disagree with? While I think the article made a few to many premature judgements based on seeing only the first episode and exaggerates more than I care for I can't find that much I genuinly disagree with. i mean parts of the subtext are blatent as hell even if some of it gets missed.

Edit: Removed the Nadesico reference. Now that I think about it several shows are more complex, though I still think it's telling how a show that mostly takes the piss out of mecha anime is more engaging than a good 90% of the serious shows in said genre.

[Nightengale]

The hell? Green eyes...orange hair...that emblem he's wearing....

Spoiler for some minor character in Episode 4:

Heine Westenfluss!?

[monstratboy]

Its real weird how they portray Suzaku. He won't fight against the opressive bloody-handed empire but he'll fight for them. Well I guess because the resistance were planning to murder innocents and he wanted to go look for Lulu we can say he fought for that reason in the beginning. It will be interesting to see if he feels different with Zero's change in tactics.
I already had his character pegged from the second episode but to hear him actually say his feelings in a serious context was still weird. Lulu should have used his eye beam power and:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Lulu:*Left eye beam attack* Stop being an idiot!

Suzaku: (under geass) Oh my God! Oh my God!! What nonsense have I been saying. They tried to kill me, TWICE! I bet it won't be the last time too. You're right Zero-san, to change the world Britannia must be des.....(geass wears off) huh, What was I saying?

Zero: Yes! Yes! Go ahead! You were saying Britannia needs to be ...

Suzaku: .... changed from within! With me protecting them with my stength and strong righteous emotions and self sacrifice I shall change the world the right way or die trying!

Zero: Ye...... What? Noooo! Die trying?! What again?!! What is wrong with you man!!

......... well I guess magic powers can't solve everything. It's obvious Lulu's part time role is to save Suzaku from his obvious death wish and not Suzaku to save Lulu from becomming corrupt. Fear not Suzaku, your crazy, gray moralled, two faced, cosplaying friend genious has your back....... as long as you prove to be useful. His sisters' got your back as well.

Don't get me wrong though. I still think Suzaku is a kick ass character. That spinning jump kick he uses in and out of Lancelot and his willingness to bow to superiors even though he knows he can kick their assess is cool. When he displays his skills it'll be great to see their faces.

[Omiane]

Well put monstratboy but I see alot of eye beaming in the future lol.

[W-General]

Originally Posted by Paranoia833

To be honest I'm a little disappointed. When it seemed like the show was going in a morally grey direction I was kind of hoping for a more in depth look at imperialism and the way of thinking that inspires it via mecha-anime. Instead they simply seem to have gone in the "this side is good, this side is bad but there are some idealists and assholes on both sides" approach, which has already been done to death in other mecha-anime IMHO.

You're taking anime too seriously.

Did anyone doubt Lord of the Rings was a good movie? It won Academy Awards, and if you really strip it down, it only boils down to two points:
1) Good vs Evil
2) The burden of power (the Ring)
And surely they've been done to death in the film industry's 90 years of history.
Well, it is based on the novels. But likewise, no one ever said the books were boring.

I treat Lelouch as entertainment. And pure entertainment. When I watch it, I never go "Oh yawn, boring." Instead, I find it very gripping, and there's always something going on, and I anticipate it every week the moment it gets aired.


But of course I'll just attribute that to personal preference. I prefer anime that doesn't try to make people think too much about things...but instead should bring about some sort of heightened emotions (moving people to tears or giving people adrenaline rush through excitement).

[Owaranai Destiny]

Thoughts on episode 4:

Spoiler:

For this episode, I believe it's one where it shows one of the more important differences in mindsets both Lelouch and Suzaku have regarding the Britannian Empire-One that might well be what the two could be fighting against each other for.

So far though, I would agree with Lulu on his friend. Those empirical 'bastids' certainly don't seem even the slightest bit gratified by what Suzaku had done to quell the 'small' bit of unrest in Shinjuku.

There were a few things that shocked me quite a little:

Spoiler:

-Suzaku being related to the former Prime Minister of Japan.
-C.C's reappearance. How the heck did she get into Lelouch's place and appear behind Nanaly?

Now those two need to be explained in the next two episodes, especially the latter.

[Nightengale]

Just watched Episode 4. Man...I don't know if I can keep a non-biased fanboyism towards Code Geass after this episode. The entire 2nd half of this episode had my stomach in a total pain in a good way, forcing myself into holding my muffles of laughter. Hadn't happened since Final+ of GSD.

Spoiler for Thoughts on Episode 4:

Though it may be biased, I thought it was pretty much well-executed. We're treated once again to Lelouch's love of theaterics, what's with his snazzy outfit and over-dramatic movement. I can totally symphatize with Kallen here... I would've thought Zero was totally out of his mind as well. Though this episode does has me wondering how long the apparent effect of Geass last on a particular person depending on the orders. I don't think Lelouch's cape and mask was something that could've been done in a short time, yet apparently the Geass had an effect on the old man long enough for it to be completed and handed over to Lelouch. Same with those guys in the train. They've must had been hypnotized for quite a while.

Jeremiah was totally awesome this episode. He was like an unintentional comedy relief. I'd wonder what would happen to him now that his shameful acts are all caught on tape.

Next week, Lancelot and Guineveere!! Lelouch posing...again. Shirley spying on Lelouch and Kallen...again. Suzaku vs Jeremiah!! I'm getting the unexplainable feeling Suzaku and Jeremiah may just end up good friends though.

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by monstratboy

Lulu:*Left eye beam attack* Stop being an idiot!

Suzaku: (under geass) Oh my God! Oh my God!! What nonsense have I been saying. They tried to kill me, TWICE! I bet it won't be the last time too. You're right Zero-san, to change the world Britannia must be des.....(geass wears off) huh, What was I saying?

Zero: Yes! Yes! Go ahead! You were saying Britannia needs to be ...

Suzaku: .... changed from within! With me protecting them with my stength and strong righteous emotions and self sacrifice I shall change the world the right way or die trying!

Zero: Ye...... What? Noooo! Die trying?! What again?!! What is wrong with you man!!

hahaha! nice one seriously after seeing ep 4 suzaku needs to be smacked for saying something like that...lulu risked himself to save his sad ass

Spoiler:

another good ep with lots of events happening...is it me or does karen seem a bit unstable and not as sure and confident in herself than before? while driving the truck she was literally shivering with fear anyways the end of this ep got my heart racing...the green haired girl is back? :O

[evil|plushie]

All this lancelot and guinevere talk is making me think of the myth of King Arthur. Then would Lelouch = King Arthur? But then again...Arthur gets royally screwed by one of his close friends *Suzaku*

[Renegade334]

I think it's more because Suzaku is nicknamed 'the White Knight' in the show (reference to the chess piece), while Lelouch is referred to as 'the Black Prince/King'. I'm not sure there are Round Tables parallels to truly make here...unless you want to peg C.C. as a Neo-Morgana or something like that. Suzaku 'White Knight' could only get a mech whose name would be of the same theme...

Continuing on the topic around Suzaku - yet while unwilling to delve further in this 'nationalistic hidden nature' about the show - I hope his being the son of Japan's last prime minister isn't a way to say 'Japanese prime ministers and their kin can't do evil while Britannian royals can'.

Anyway, it looks like there is a second activist group around, seeing that group of former Japanese soldier. Anyway, I'd like to know where does that cameraman fits in (haven't downloaded the subs yet) since, if I were to judge the ED, he seems to be acquainted with one of those former soldiers (namely the one wielding a katana).

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by Renegade334

I think it's more because Suzaku is nicknamed 'the White Knight' in the show (reference to the chess piece), while Lelouch is referred to as 'the Black Prince/King'. I'm not sure there are Round Tables parallels to truly make here...unless you want to peg C.C. as a Neo-Morgana or something like that. Suzaku 'White Knight' could only get a mech whose name would be of the same theme...

but if you put it that way then it makes "brittania" tha good guys? or another meaning would be that lulu and suzaku are destined to clash together...

[-KarumA-]

is there anyone else subbing these series btw beside [GG] ?

[Retsoor]

Lelouch certainly has a flair for the dramatic. I was relatively in stitches at times during the latter half, especially during the part where he looked at the camera and said "It was me!" All in all, Zero's portrayal was very well done.

Lelouch notwithstanding my favourite character has to be Jeremiah. I already thought in the first episode that there's a man who enjoys his job, and although he was played by Lelouch he was intense and imperious to a fault in the current episode. While it is inevitable that Suzaku in Lancelot will overpower him - or at least have the upper hand in their bout - I hope Jeremiah will show Suzaku some tricks of the trade only old war horses know.

Another potentially interesting character was revealed in Mart- Kyoshiro Toudou, the Liberation Front's General. I suspect he and Lelouch will have a power struggle in the end, since he didn't seem the character who would gladly follow someone else.

With the introduction of Euphemia, I sincerely hope she and Suzaku will not engage in a saccharine relationship. Regarding Suzaku's naivete, I don't think he's all that. He's naive in his thoughts in changing the empire from within* but not when he decides to return to the military tribunal. He knows what awaits him, but after the debacle there's a better chance of being acquitted and thus he could stop the purging of the Britannian army.

* Maybe it was all planned out in Suzaku's mind. The next episode meeting with Euphemia, sweeping her off her feet, marrying into the royal family, power plays in the dark... It was all pre-meditated! Suzaku is the real bad guy here, he intends to succeed the throne and turn into a traumatized, dark-hearted tyrant! Thus we can conclude that Lelouch is the true paragon of virtue in this series.

[cyoti]

Originally Posted by Paranoia833

The correct term for Suzaku would be an idealist. Lulu would be the pragmatist of the pair, concerned purely with ends rather than means

Yes and overthrowing Britannia via terrorism is going to work? Sorry, but ingratiating himself into the power structure is probably the more expedient method to accomplish his goals.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Originally Posted by Deathkillz

Spoiler:

another good ep with lots of events happening...is it me or does karen seem a bit unstable and not as sure and confident in herself than before? while driving the truck she was literally shivering with fear anyways the end of this ep got my heart racing...the green haired girl is back? :O

I don't see it as a wavering of confidence as much as pure fear.

Spoiler:

First of all, considering that Karen is part of a terrorist group most probably involved in guerilla tactics due to inferior numbers and firepower (until Lulu stepped in, of course), it's extremely uncommon for them to just barge in and make a scene. Besides, anyone traveling into the lion's den would feel fear, unless we're talking about Mr. Zero.

Originally Posted by cyoti

Yes and overthrowing Britannia via terrorism is going to work? Sorry, but ingratiating himself into the power structure is probably the more expedient method to accomplish his goals.

I recall Lelouch telling the rebels that terrorism isn't going to work in the latest episode. That is perhaps another reason why he wanted to make himself known as 'Zero'.

[JediNight]

Terrorism will only hurt your chances of getting the people behind you and getting more people to help. Although there is a fine line between rebellion and terrorism

[Tiberium Wolf]

The more I watch Suzaku the more I think he is Syaoran.

[Guppy]

Originally Posted by JediNight

Terrorism will only hurt your chances of getting the people behind you and getting more people to help.

I think that really depends. If the targets of the terrorism are a sufficiently small and unpopular group, it's unfortunately quite possible that terrorist acts could even draw a fair amount of public support.

Although there is a fine line between rebellion and terrorism

I don't really agree with that. Rebellion is a conflict against the government. Terrorism is one means of waging that conflict. The two often go together, but not always - for instance, Gandhi's Indian independence movement brought tens of thousands out in open resistance to the British colonial authorities, but I doubt if anyone could say he came anywhere near being a terrorist.

[evil|plushie]

Originally Posted by Renegade334

I think it's more because Suzaku is nicknamed 'the White Knight' in the show (reference to the chess piece), while Lelouch is referred to as 'the Black Prince/King'. I'm not sure there are Round Tables parallels to truly make here...unless you want to peg C.C. as a Neo-Morgana or something like that. Suzaku 'White Knight' could only get a mech whose name would be of the same theme...

Nah, I peg C.C more as Merlin, the one who helped arthur rise to power.

[Eurys]

I like the role reversal : the righteous good guy working for the "evil empire" versus the twisted arrogant guy fighting for the resistance and "freedom".
Of course I'm making gross generalizations on purpose .

And I completely agree with W-General. I want an anime that entertains me first. Too often I've watched anime pretending to be deep and thought-provoking. But they're actually mostly confusing and superficial.