Code Geass (Generic discussion thread)

[azul120]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

The theory I heard is that Ougi is the self insert of Taniguchi (I heard this theory on TVTropes I believe), this explains the hot slutty wife, and the Prime Minister position.

I can't possibly imagine both Taniguchi and Okouchi thinking that Ougi is somehow competent enough to become Prime Minister. I mean they never even tried to show him as competent, the guy sell out Lelouch for Schneizel for pete sake.

Not to mention he was willing to die mid-season for Villetta. Isn't that irresponsible?

And that list seems a little wrong. You think Shirley would be higher up.

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by azul120

Not to mention he was willing to die mid-season for Villetta. Isn't that irresponsible?

Well, heart matters. Can't really blame the guy there, cause heart is heart. lulz
But yeah, he is not capable of this position he was given. But i said, appeasing the fans. Period

[azul120]

Originally Posted by incorrupts

Well, heart matters. Can't really blame the guy there, cause heart is heart. lulz
But yeah, he is not capable of this position he was given. But i said, appeasing the fans. Period

It was romantic, yes. But it would have involved abandoning his duty to the Black Knights, even though he'd already become useless.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by azul120

It was romantic, yes. But it would have involved abandoning his duty to the Black Knights, even though he'd already become useless.

Lelouch did the same by going saving nunnaly in R1. He left the BK alone. And so? Lelouch is a jerk like Ougi then? Heart matters, period.

[azul120]

Originally Posted by Narona

Lelouch did the same by going saving nunnaly in R1. He left the BK alone. And so? Lelouch is a jerk like Ougi then? Heart matters, period.

That was a little different. While he did abandon the Black Knights in their moment of need, Nunnally, as he saw it, was in danger as well, and quite possibly could have been used as a hostage by V. V./Charles for all we know. Looking beyond the fact that Suzaku intercepted and captured him, Lelouch felt that he could rejoin his comrades after he saved Nunnally.

Ougi on the other hand resigned himself to being killed by Villetta herself, thus dying in vain and leaving his comrades behind for good.

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by azul120

It was romantic, yes. But it would have involved abandoning his duty to the Black Knights, even though he'd already become useless.

This is what i meant. That Ougi is more of a heart-person, he can't think with his mind much. {as Kallen and Shirley}
But in the end, the "appeasing" i am say, seems that Ougi found a thin line between heart and obligation, so yeah. I still think he is a total knucklehead but whatever. XD

[Narona]

Originally Posted by azul120

That was a little different. While he did abandon the Black Knights in their moment of need, Nunnally, as he saw it, was in danger as well, and quite possibly could have been used as a hostage by V. V./Charles for all we know. Looking beyond the fact that Suzaku intercepted and captured him, Lelouch felt that he could rejoin his comrades after he saved Nunnally.

Ougi on the other hand resigned himself to being killed by Villetta herself, thus dying in vain and leaving his comrades behind for good.

I don't think Lelouchreally planned anything when he left. He didn't give any order, he just left. All the black knight could have been killed, and a lot were killed because he did that.

Yeah, Lelouch then returned in R2, but it doesn't excuse what he has done imo before that. Plus, he never explained to the Bk why he did that. And since that time, imo, the BK were not 200% loyal like what they used to be. It was even revealed ina side materials that C.C. was behind the door when he did his speech to the BK in Turn 3 (IIRC), because she and lelouch were not sure that the BK will accept to work with him without gaining an answer about what Lelouch did in R1. So, she was there to help him to escape in that case.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by incorrupts

This is what i meant. That Ougi is more of a heart-person, he can't think with his mind much. {as Kallen and Shirley}
But in the end, the "appeasing" i am say, seems that Ougi found a thin line between heart and obligation, so yeah. I still think he is a total knucklehead but whatever. XD

Without Lelouch, Ougi's actions would have found him under Schneizel heel eventually. His actions out of whatever thought, whether it is justice or revenge (I'd say this. I am looking at you Viletta.), would have ultimately ruined everything for everyone if it was not for Lelouch saving them.

He does not think with his mind at all. If he had he'd not have rushed in to sell out one Britannian noble that actually earned them everything they had for one they knew nothing about and that had just nuked a city. Thinking about the scene makes my head hurt.

He did not find the thin line, Lelouch put him there. If he did not find it when it was given to him, then I'd genuinely call him an idiot... oh wait, I already do.

Originally Posted by Narona

I don't think Lelouchreally planned anything when he left. He didn't give any order, he just left. All the black knight could have been killed, and a lot were killed because he did that.

He did, his orders were to hold down the fort while he was gone on an important mission. This would imply he had intention of going back. Even though Nunally is his reason for everything, if he just leaves her there will be consequences if she is used against him.

There is no such case with Viletta.

This isn't about excuses its about priorities. Lelouch's action have an actual tactical value behind them, and while it was not the correct action, he had no intention to just ditch the Order with Nunally, whereas Ougi was ready to forsake all his friends.

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by Frostfire

Without Lelouch, Ougi's actions would have found himself under Schneizel heel eventually. His actions out of whatever thought, whether it is justice or revenge (I'd say this. I am looking at you Viletta.), would have ultimately ruined everything for everyone if it was not for Lelouch saving them.

He does not think with his mind at all. If he had he'd not have rushed in to sell out one Britannian noble that actually earned them everything they had for one they knew nothing about and that had just nuked a city. Thinking about the scene makes my head hurt.

He did not find the thin line, Lelouch put him there. If he did not find it when it was given to him, then I'd genuinely call him an idiot... oh wait, I already do.

Yeah except you said what i said pretty much, i dont see why you make it like you do not agree or something.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by incorrupts

Yeah except you said what i said pretty much, i dont see why you make it like you do not agree or something.

I was agreeing but trying to paint much worse picture of Ougi, because I respect him as much as I respect a turd on the street corner baking in the sun. I may respect the turd more, at least it did not sell out the person who gave it everything.

I wasn't completely sure about the finding the fine line part either, because I do not think he found it by his own actions.

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by Frostfire

I was agreeing but trying to paint much worse picture of Ougi, because I respect him as much as I respect a turd on the street corner baking in the sun. I may respect the turd more, at least it did not sell out the person who gave it everything.

I wasn't completely sure about the finding the fine line part either, because I do not think he found it by his own actions.

You obviously missed the appeasing line of mine.

And anyway, about Ougi, sometimes i hate him, sometimes i can't help but sympathize with him for some odd reason. But yeah, "Betrayal" turn shed NOT in a good light the whole gang of BK. But then again, that epi was so rushed it hurt.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by incorrupts

You obviously missed the appeasing line of mine.

And anyway, about Ougi, sometimes i hate him, sometimes i can't help but sympathize with him for some odd reason. But yeah, "Betrayal" turn shed NOT in a good light the whole gang of BK. But then again, that epi was so rushed it hurt.

I completely did not see that word in there.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Frostfire

He did, his orders were to hold down the fort while he was gone on an important mission. This would imply he had intention of going back. Even though Nunally is his reason for everything, if he just leaves her there will be consequences if she is used against him.

There is no such case with Viletta.

This isn't about excuses its about priorities. Lelouch's action have an actual tactical value behind them, and while it was not the correct action, he had no intention to just ditch the Order with Nunally, whereas Ougi was ready to forsake all his friends.

I was not remembering he gave orders, sorry. But imo, if he thought (and i think he isn't) that the BK could wait for him to return without being crushed to pieces, he was an idiot, or rather, someone who only cared about nunnaly at this moment, and not about the BK.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Narona

I was not remembering he gave orders, sorry. But imo, if he thought (and i think he isn't) that the BK could wait for him to return without being crushed to pieces, he was an idiot, or rather, someone who only cared about nunnaly at this moment, and not about the BK.

He was not expecting Suzaku to interfere, if Suzaku had not interfered then there is a good chance he could have gone back before the Order lost. His logic about it makes sense even if it is a wrong choice.

At the same time if he loses Nunally and she is used against him, even if they win the battle, they'd lose the war.

[Rising Dragon]

Actually, the Black Rebellion was lost the moment Lelouch failed to secure Cornelia when Jeremiah attacked. Suzaku had nothing to do with that--Lelouch's strategy was to defeat Cornelia and hold her hostage, which would (he believed) force the Emperor to reveal himself, allowing Lelouch to take him down. Without Cornelia secured, the Black Rebellion could've only ended in failure. That is why the Black Knights lost. Now, Suzaku is the reason why Lelouch lost, but the Black Knights were essentially defeated before that point.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Actually, the Black Rebellion was lost the moment Lelouch failed to secure Cornelia when Jeremiah attacked. Suzaku had nothing to do with that--Lelouch's strategy was to defeat Cornelia and hold her hostage, which would (he believed) force the Emperor to reveal himself, allowing Lelouch to take him down. Without Cornelia secured, the Black Rebellion could've only ended in failure. That is why the Black Knights lost. Now, Suzaku is the reason why Lelouch lost, but the Black Knights were essentially defeated before that point.

Good call. I had forgotten Cornelia, which would fall on a surprising Jeremiah appearing out of nowhere. Even though Lelouch knew Nunally had been kidnapped he still attempted to capture Cornelia.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Frostfire

Good call. I had forgotten Cornelia, which would fall on a surprising Jeremiah appearing out of nowhere. Even though Lelouch knew Nunally had been kidnapped he still attempted to capture Cornelia.

C.C. said to him that Nunnaly was captured after having geassed cornelia no? I can't check it ATM, but I remember him leaving right after learning what happened to Nunnaly. I can be wrong though. Don't remember ^^"

Edit: No I think I am partly wrong. He learned what happened, then geassed cornelia, and left.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Narona

C.C. said to him that Nunnaly was captured after having geassed cornelia no? I can't check it ATM, but I remember him leaving right after learning what happened to Nunnaly. I can be wrong though. Don't remember ^^"

Lelouch then told C.C. to grab Cornelia, that is when Jeremiah bursts out of the blue and interupts the capture.

Edit: While he is questioning Cornelia, C.C. informs him and he rushes back to the Gawain, and then the above happened.

[eaglei3]

Originally Posted by Narona

C.C. said to him that Nunnaly was captured after having geassed cornelia no? I can't check it ATM, but I remember him leaving right after learning what happened to Nunnaly. I can be wrong though. Don't remember ^^"

Edit: No I think I am partly wrong. He learned what happened, then geassed cornelia, and left.

In the end going back to Oghi and the BKs being worthless, these events showed more of the hopelessness known as the Black Knights as they couldn't manage to hold off a weakened Britannia force that just like one of their commanding officers when Lelouch Geassed Cornelia and left her with her injuries.

[Sonae]

Okay! He geassed Cornelia and then he is walking back saying what they are going to do. C.C. then says Nunnally has been kidnapped, Lelouch doesn't believe her at first then C.C. says something about Nunnally being his reason for living and that they are headed for Kaminejima which catches his attention. Then Jeremiah bursts out of the groupd and Lelouch hurries and gets into the Gawain. They reach for Cornelia but Jeremiah knocks him away. Then as they are running away from Jeremiah, Lelouch calls and finds out Nunnally really has been kidnapped.