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Old 2006-10-15, 17:13   Link #1
velocity7
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Okay, I'll start off...

What were the differences so far between 2002's first two episodes as well as 2006, in terms of pacing, animation, quality, storytelling, etc.?
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Old 2006-10-19, 21:01   Link #2
Catgirls
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It might be a good idea to have one thread where people could (if they wanted to) post comparison shots between the two shows, chat about the script changes (we know they're coming or already here) and so on.

=^.^=
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Old 2006-10-19, 21:24   Link #3
Daniel E.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Catgirls View Post
It might be a good idea to have one thread where people could (if they wanted to) post comparison shots between the two shows, chat about the script changes (we know they're coming or already here) and so on.

=^.^=
I actually posted these images in the image thread already, but I guess there wouldn't be a problem if they appear here as well.

-->


-->

On the whole comparison deal, Blog site, Anime on my Mynd already has a side by side comparison of the first two episodes; There he talks about some of the changes made to both the story and animation so far.

Of course the articles have some spoilers for those that have not watched the original version.
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Old 2006-10-20, 02:31   Link #4
DanielSong39
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After watching the first 2 episodes of the old version...

It's too early to call Kanon 2006 a bust or a disappointment. But if it's going to surpass the 2002 version, it will certainly have to do it from behind.

Animation - Clearly, this is a mismatch. The 2002 version has some of the worst character designs of all time. The 2006 version has a VASTLY improved character design, and much greater attention to details.

However - it is the old version that is more creative when it comes to color choices, particularly when distinguishing between past and present. And they have many more types of images compared to the new version. Nevertheless, the new version provides more eye candy - some of the sweetest drawings you will see since AIR.

Music - The old anime is better. By a longshot. They have several catchy tunes, with Ayu's theme being the highlight. Much better at setting various moods and transitioning between scenes. The music in the new version can only be described as incidental.

Voice acting - same actors, but different results. I actually preferred Yuuichi's old voice actor. As for the others - well, obviously, the voices are the same, but I got a better sense of character interactions and chemistry from the old version. I thought the timing was better in the original - conversations seem too stretched out in the new version.

Storytelling - Again, the original does a much better job, through 2 episodes. In the 2002 version, they let you know what's important from the beginning - the 7-year promise between Yuuichi and Ayu, and their efforts to keep and sustain the promise. In the 2006 version, after 2 episodes, I still don't have a clear picture of the main theme - and the show didn't really provide enough suspense to hold my interest.

Overall - The 2002 version had many flaws - but managed to provide some mild amusement at the start. The 2006 version, by comparison, is leaving me empty - it's not providing much comedy, and it's coming up short when it comes to drama, suspense, and action.

Outlook - I think the 2006 version still has a good chance of outdoing its predecessor - but will it because it will improve, or because the 2002 version nosedived in the second half? Let's all hope it's the former. Maybe the new version will improve if it ditches the comedic elements and launches straight into the depressingly sad parts. Hey, that's what KyoAni did in AIR, right?
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Old 2006-10-20, 02:41   Link #5
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Countary to the previous post, I feel quite the opposite over the old Kanon.

I find it too rushed and I have some contention with how Yuiichi's portrayed in it. There are things to love about the 2002 version, but the summary feels almost too simplistic an interpretation to what happened and the way how one calamity pile upon the other without Yuiichi even showing a scent of how crushing having one climax upon another leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. Leaving that aside, Yuiichi in the Toei version lacks ability to really express his starcastic nature due to time constraint. He's practically spending all the later half of the story, going from one crisis to the next, helping one girl after the other. Thus far, I am very satisfied with Sugita's performance actually. I admit however that this version of Kanon still feels as if it's going at a faster tempo than the game, just with how that Nayuki seems to have had a speed boost somehow...

Animation department wise, there is a marked improvement which I agree, should not be used as the only metric. Color pallete wise KyoAni has known to be less vibrant and soft.

I suppose I am critical of the previous release, having to release the Kazuhana after it is said and done to properly bring the saga to its closure. Kanon was clumped with 2 episodes shown in 1 run that pushes one girl after the next off the screen, in my view. I do not hope to see that with the KyoAni rendition.
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Old 2006-10-20, 03:48   Link #6
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I'm going to avoid the religious war that might develop over this topic .... in my case, I'm finding things I like about both series so far. The original's animation and character design reflected its time but though I like the new designs better, the soft lens filter look of the old one portrayed the dreamlike quality a bit better.

Yuuichi is so improved in this version it makes it a bit hard to watch him in the old version. The other VAs are the tops in the profession and they're not sleepwalking through this one.

I find what I've seen in the 2006 version sweetly funny in the opening episodes. I have to chalk that off to "tastes differ". I think Sugito's performance better captures the wit of the game character (the first anime Yuuichi just seemed to be as bland as those ubiquitous CGs that show the girl with the guy's head out of the camera shot or fuzzed out). He somehow manages to be more ascerbic and yet gentler with the girls at the same time.

OTOH... the old version did seem to do a better job of focusing in on the Ayu problem early on --- in that respect I think KyoAni is pulling a bit of AIR story philosophy into Kanon .... in other words, complete blindside coming to the average or new viewer, batten the hatches.

I like the more leisurely and in depth pace of story with the extra episodes. This is a character driven story so, hell, if a character stares off into space for a minute to build a mood... then so be it.

I'm ambivalent about the music... its BGM - if it sets the mood properly then its done its job. Using more of the game music is probably a way to be truer to the original source material.

All opinions subject to change as the series continues, of course.
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Old 2006-10-20, 05:36   Link #7
houkoholic
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There's no contest, 2006 versioni wins in every department.

As a big fan of the game, the 2002 version can only be, as the Japanese fans have, described as "black history" - we don't really want to acknowledge it's existance, but it's there. Basically Kanon 2002 had turned Kanon into a cliche harem series, which it is not from the original material. Yuuichi was made into a whiny teenager, of which he was not in the game either. Key's trademark mood setting is also not there due to the neck-breaking pacing of the 2002 version, where as the game sets it so it is to be dreamingly slow at first as the story is suppose to be about various people trapped in their past and the winter setting is suppose to add to that "frozen in time" feeling, as well as the repeated dream scenes. Also once the ball gets rolling everything will move again and it's unstoppable, it's akin to looking at a snow-covered object, you can make out the outline but you don't know what's underneath, and as the snow melts away you find what is (or isn't) there. 2006 version does this very well as Kyoani is experts at filling screens with little details which shapes the outline of the "object", and I'm confident that they *will* link them all together as the story progresses to reveal what that "object" is. So far everything Kyoani did to 2006 Kanon is so spot-on that it can only be described as almost perfection of what Kanon should be in animated form.

2002 Kanon is an okay anime which is fine for first timers new to the series, but it is not an okay adaptation of Kanon, which is what it boils down to for fans of the original work.
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Old 2006-10-20, 09:01   Link #8
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Old time lurker here.... Heh. So forgive me for coming in and getting right into this unannounced.

In my opinion (for it can only be that), I'm already quite more fond of the 2006 version as a person who's played the original game and seen the 2002 version and has been a old time Kanon fan.

Though the storyline seems to be going a *little* quickly (little emphasized since I don't really feel that rushedness that some people are describing when watching 2006), it is staying more true to the original storyline than the last did with exact scenes straight from the game... Which gives this old fan a smile and a chuckle to finally see some of his favorite scenes made into animation (Fear the Jam! And Makoto's vain punch and kicks.).

Music department. There can be no other to stay true to the series than the original BGM that was in the game. This in itself brings me back to fond memories in my own first play through of the game. Fond memories indeed.

The beginning "Slice of Life" scenes were pretty critical to Kanon's storyline, getting a person to become attached and know a girl before the big crush at the end. I enjoyed the slice of life scenes in the game and I'm loving them in the 2006 version very much. They're enjoyable (for me that is. Can't speak for everyone...) and I'm brought even closer to my experience in the game with the addition of Sugita's portrayal of Yuuichi (which is pretty good at the moment in my eyes).

In my eyes, Kyoani is succeeding in making this adaption of Kanon (at the moment at least).

Of course, opinions are always subject to change. (Although I doubt Kyoani will bomb the series, there is that small chance...) As of now, those are my opinions.
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Old 2006-10-20, 09:21   Link #9
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I can see this thread turning into a pretty nasty talk anytime soon, so i might as well just say what i gotta say.

Kanon 2006 is using the original games music score, also pack with its OP & ED. Those reasons alone are enough for me to adore the new version a lot more. But even with that said, the original Kanon shall always be something of importance to me~
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Old 2006-10-20, 09:32   Link #10
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Yeah... It might get a little heated in here...
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Old 2006-10-20, 10:13   Link #11
Catgirls
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Originally Posted by Shiroth View Post
I can see this thread turning into a pretty nasty talk anytime soon, so i might as well just say what i gotta say.
Hmmm...you might be right. I'll keep an eye on this thread. If it turns into a flame war, I'll lock it up.
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Old 2006-10-20, 13:20   Link #12
Vexx
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As long as everyone is pretty clear that what they post is their *opinion* or *critique* and not some sort of "accepted fact" ... we should be okay. As I say when teaching debate, "asserting it loudly does not make it fact"
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Old 2006-10-20, 16:46   Link #13
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Originally Posted by DanielSong39 View Post
In the 2002 version, they let you know what's important from the beginning - the 7-year promise between Yuuichi and Ayu, and their efforts to keep and sustain the promise. In the 2006 version, after 2 episodes, I still don't have a clear picture of the main theme - and the show didn't really provide enough suspense to hold my interest.
Ahh... for once, I actually think I might agree with you on this one point. I think that was what I was trying to say in the episode 3 thread about it seeming like scenes strung together. The original had a strong sense of focus/theme that it kept bringing you back to - it felt like it had something important it was trying to say right from the start and proceeded to tell you right to the end (which is why we disagree on the ending, but let's not get into that again). That "central theme" approach right from the start is probably not in any way true to the game, but as an adaptation (and one with only 13 episodes), it was probably necessary, and I thought that it was one of the biggest draws that pushed the story forward. In the new production, you can see that they're slowing building things on a lot of different fronts - which is fine, because I know that all the fronts are headed somewhere interesting - but while I enjoy each scene, they just don't seem to "add up" in the same way. There's nothing that compels me on the whole, although the parts are good. Maybe that still doesn't make sense, but it's as close as I've been able to describe it. Knowing where this is headed, though, is a strong enough driving force on its own.
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Old 2006-10-20, 16:58   Link #14
kj1980
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Kyo Ani Kanon hands down. The music, the animation, the pace is just right. The Toei version was what most people may consider a dark history. However, I did like it back then, except those weird chins really irritated me.

But as a person that played the game when it first came out...the Kyo Ani version brought me back more memories than it did when I saw the Toei version. I have said this so many times...it's the music, stupid. Whenever such visual novels are turned into anime, the music needs to stay intact, just like how Higurashi would've been so much better if they'd used the original score.
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Old 2006-10-20, 17:11   Link #15
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It does make you wonder why they'd think of changing the music when adapting a successful game since they have the rights to the material...

I always think of a segment in the British series "As Time Goes By" where the character Lionel is having his biography converted into a screenplay. The Hollywood yahoos bring in two complete idiots that within a few minutes have the story completely rewritten so it resembles his book... not at all.
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Old 2006-10-20, 17:44   Link #16
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It does make you wonder why they'd think of changing the music when adapting a successful game since they have the rights to the material...
I'm going to say "to sell more CDs". Since a lot of anime are funded at least partly by music labels (and usually a different music label than published the game soundtrack), using the game's OST would mean cutting out that potential revenue source. In this case, though, Key has their own sort of music label anyway, and all signs point to them being one of the lead sponsors/funders of the project to begin with. At this point, they're not worried about selling the OST - they're just getting people to buy the DVDs (and again when it hits BluRay). Off-topic, but yeah - that's my impression, anyway.
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Old 2006-10-20, 20:59   Link #17
Shiroth
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the music needs to stay intact, just like how Higurashi would've been so much better if they'd used the original score.
I do see where you're coming from, but i don't believe it should be that like that all the time. Just look at the Fate/Stay Night anime, indeed i'm a huge fan of NUMBER201's work, and adore the games soundtrack so much, but i just think that it wouldn't have worked for the anime at all. As for the Higurashi anime - it needed Dai's music. ;_;
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Old 2006-10-20, 21:31   Link #18
Richard 23
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I have enjoyed the new series as much as the old so far and I hope the new version surpasses the old. I own the original soundtrack as well as the Kanon 2002 series soundtrack and still enjoy them immensely. I'm glad they are using the original soundtrack for the remake.

One thing I fear is that they may throw in a couple of recap episodes in the middle of the series run like Chobits did. Hopefully not.

Likewise I was disappointed that Air's final episode (13) was a recap, albeit a pretty decent one. Please don't do filler episodes that only repackage the story so far. Onegai?

On the first watch of episode 3, I'm not liking Makoto as much as I did in the 2002 series although that may change when I watch it again or in upcoming episodes as her relationship with Yuiichi and the rest of the cast develops more. She was somehow more acidic, more bratty, this time around. And I'm not sure how I feel about the 'Auu' catchphrase. Although I did like her pained 'oooo' in the 2002 version.

I did however enjoy the scene where she woke up to Yuichi's promise of food.

All things considered though I'm really enjoying this run so far. The only complaint is having to wait a week for each new episode! That in itself is enough of a reason to hope for no useless recap episodes!

I am really looking forward to the next show.
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Old 2006-10-21, 02:40   Link #19
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Kanon 2006 for me now with 50% less chin!
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Old 2006-10-21, 10:53   Link #20
Daniel E.
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More comparison pics and comments courtesy of the AomM blog site.

There are lots of spoilers this time around, read the article with caution.

-->

Now with three episodes down the line, I think it's safe to say that I am completly sold on this new version. Everything seems so much better and cooler now.
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