Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha Character Creation and Discussion (second reincarnation)

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

Hmm. Raising Heart/Raging Heart is an belka device which was there before the standard mage staffs.

*tilts head* Raising Heart a Belka device? Where did you get that idea?

Originally Posted by Kyral

Well, here are the artworks for the standard GAS Barrier Jackets and Devices.
http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/2362/sideb100.jpg

The Devices look awkward, but the Jackets are cool.

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

Hmm. Raising Heart/Raging Heart is an belka device which was there before the standard mage staffs.

Belkan?

Intelligent Devices are Mid-type Devices. Belkan/Neo-Belkan users prefer to use Armed/Storage Devices.

Originally Posted by Yurichan

Yes though I don't look alot in the mecha stuff. So I wonder are they like copies or clones made out of the idea from Rasing Heart/Raging Heart?

I don't think Devices would be classified as 'mecha.'

Since there is no definite time table provided for the evolution of Devices it is hard to state which predates which. One case is Raising Heart was developed first as an experimental Device and then the other mass-produced Devices were made minus the AI for cheaper/easier production. The second case is that Raising Heart was developed upon the foundation of the already in-use Devices used my the majority of the TSAB as a type of 'custom' Device.

Originally Posted by Keroko

P
Hehe. Cadia. Sane. Hehe.

I thought we are sane and everyone else is just crazy?

Originally Posted by Kyral

Well, here are the artworks for the standard GAS Barrier Jackets and Devices.
http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/2362/sideb100.jpg

Kinda look like giant tuning forks

[Kyral]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Om nom, tasty indeed.

Yes, I think I will keep her that way. :3

That brings me to the question, how much OCs actually are wearing white uniforms?

Originally Posted by Keroko

The Devices look awkward, but the Jackets are cool.

The Devices also seem only to be able to fire and create a barrier. They are also pretty short if you compare them with other devices.

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

Intelligent Devices are Mid-type Devices. Belkan/Neo-Belkan users prefer to use Armed/Storage Devices.

Well actually Storage can be both, S2U and Durandal were Storage Devices and obviously Mid-typ.

[Yurichan]

Originally Posted by Keroko

People here would prefer this thread not give birth to yet another NanoFate debate. It's okay to write a story about it, just... don't try to claim it's canon and turn it into a debate.

I understand yes sir. I behave now . No more infractions please (´；ω；`)

Originally Posted by Keroko

*tilts head* Raising Heart a Belka device? Where did you get that idea?

Yuuno-kun found RH while excavating a site. And he used the device. He then went on the run for a monster and came across Nanoha. And that's how Nanoha got it.

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

Belkan?

Intelligent Devices are Mid-type Devices. Belkan/Neo-Belkan users prefer to use Armed/Storage Devices.

Belkan devices can be intelligent as well.

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

Since there is no definite time table provided for the evolution of Devices it is hard to state which predates which. One case is Raising Heart was developed first as an experimental Device and then the other mass-produced Devices were made minus the AI for cheaper/easier production. The second case is that Raising Heart was developed upon the foundation of the already in-use Devices used my the majority of the TSAB as a type of 'custom' Device.

Hmm this is new for me. I though RH is an ancient device that was created by Belka if I remember correctly. Or an other old civilization. At least to my knowledge bardiche is.

[Comartemis]

Yuuno-kun found RH while excavating a site. And he used the device. He then went on the run for a monster and came across Nanoha. And that's how Nanoha got it.

I don't believe it's ever stated that Yuuno got RH from a Belkan excavation site, though it's not much of a logic stretch if you assume said site was the site of a battle between Belkan and Mid forces. He could easily have requisitioned it or just built it himself, but more likely he obtained it from a relative, which would help to explain why he had such trouble using it.

Regardless, RH has none of the traits of a Belkan device; it's not an Armed Device, it lacks the cartridge system, and it's designed for the Mid system. Clearly a Mid-type device.

[LimitedEternal]

Originally Posted by Kyral

The Devices also seem only to be able to fire and create a barrier. They are also pretty short if you compare them with other devices.

They can't exactly hand the rank-and-file the shiniest Devices. How else are they gonna make the main cast look better by comparison? :P

Originally Posted by Comartemis

I don't believe it's ever stated that Yuuno got RH from a Belkan excavation site, though it's not much of a logic stretch if you assume said site was the site of a battle between Belkan and Mid forces. He could easily have requisitioned it or just built it himself, but more likely he obtained it from a relative, which would help to explain why he had such trouble using it.

Now that the topic's been brought up, how does one go about constructing a Device? I doubt it's a simple thing to do.

[Kyral]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

Belkan devices can be intelligent as well.

'Intelligent Device' is just a name for Mid-typ Devices like Raising Heart or Bardich.

The Devices of the Wolkenritter (like Graf Eisen or Laevatin) are called 'Armed Device'

It's just a name, of course both have AIs

Originally Posted by LimitedEternal

They can't exactly hand the rank-and-file the shiniest Devices. How else are they gonna make the main cast look better by comparison? :P

I never suggested anything else!

[Yurichan]

Originally Posted by Comartemis

I don't believe it's ever stated that Yuuno got RH from a Belkan excavation site, though it's not much of a logic stretch if you assume said site was the site of a battle between Belkan and Mid forces. He could easily have requisitioned it or just built it himself, but more likely he obtained it from a relative, which would help to explain why he had such trouble using it.

Regardless, RH has none of the traits of a Belkan device; it's not an Armed Device, it lacks the cartridge system, and it's designed for the Mid system. Clearly a Mid-type device.

No RH and Bardiche are both from Belka a period in where there was a development in intelligent weapons. In this period also The book of Darkness was created. It was in a battle time. I agree RH looks rather friendly. It might be from the Saint Kaiser period? But the other devices of the TSAB are made out of an image of RH. TSAB analyzes the devices and develops them further. That's how RH got it's upgrades.

Originally Posted by Kyral

'Intelligent Device' is just a name for Mid-typ Devices like Raising Heart or Bardich.

The Devices of the Wolkenritter (like Graf Eisen or Laevantin) are called 'Armed Device'

It's just a name, of course both have AIs

I know but it's what has the name to do with it's origin. It's just a name given by TSAB for those devices.

[Tempy]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

I understand yes sir. I behave now . No more infractions please (´；ω；`)


Yuuno-kun found RH while excavating a site. And he used the device. He then went on the run for a monster and came across Nanoha. And that's how Nanoha got it.

Raising Heart is not a Belkan device. If it were so, RH would be utilizing Belkan spell triangles rather than the Mid-Childan spell circle. Just because Yuuno found it does not make the device Belkan.

Also, just because Raising Heart was first to be introduced in the series does not make it the basis for all devices used by the TSAB. RH is only one of several Intelligent Devices shown in the series, unique due to its attunement to Nanoha. Intelligent devices tend to be much more rare compared to the mass-produced stuff because of the amount of work needed to make one.

Originally Posted by LimitedEternal

Now that the topic's been brought up, how does one go about constructing a Device? I doubt it's a simple thing to do.

Apparently, a certain grade of artificer is needed. For example, Shario is a Meister-class Device Artificer.

Originally Posted by Yurichan

No RH and Bardiche are both from Belka a period in where there was a development in intelligent weapons. In this period also The book of Darkness was created. It was in a battle time. I agree RH looks rather friendly. But the other devices of the TSAB are made out of an image of RH. TSAB analyzes the devices and develops them further. That's how RH got it's upgrades.

I'm curious, where are you getting this information from?

[Kyral]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

No RH and Bardiche are both from Belka a period in where there was a development in intelligent weapons.

Excuse me, but when was this said? And who said it?

It is official that Raising Heart and Bardich are Midchilda-typ Devices not Belka.
It is stated so on the official Device cards.

[Comartemis]

Now that the topic's been brought up, how does one go about constructing a Device? I doubt it's a simple thing to do.

Simple enough that Teana could build her Anchor Gun before she even entered the Ground Forces. I imagine building a basic Storage Device is probably the Mid-Childan equivalent of building your own computer; you have to know what you're doing, but it's not hard to learn the ins and outs of the process and it isn't exactly rocket science to build the device itself. Anything with a more advanced AI is another story altogether, however, enough that the bureau needs recognized Device Meisters to build the more advanced stuff.

No RH and Bardiche are both from Belka a period in where there was a development in intelligent weapons.

Bardiche was built by either Precia, Fate, or Linis. It has nothing to do with Belka.

Seriously Yuri, where are you getting these ideas from?

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

Hmm this is new for me. I though RH is an ancient device that was created by Belka if I remember correctly. Or an other old civilization. At least to my knowledge bardiche is.

Bardiche is a newer Device, created after Fate's 'birth' but before the Jewel Seed incident. It was stated in source materials that Precia's familiar, Linith, created the Mid-type Device for Fate if I recall.

[Yurichan]

Originally Posted by Tempest Dynasty

Raising Heart is not a Belkan device. If it were so, RH would be utilizing Belkan spell triangles rather than the Mid-Childan spell circle. Just because Yuuno found it does not make the device Belkan.

Also, just because Raising Heart was first to be introduced in the series does not make it the basis for all devices used by the TSAB. RH is only one of several Intelligent Devices shown in the series, unique due to its attunement to Nanoha. Intelligent devices tend to be much more rare compared to the mass-produced stuff because of the amount of work needed to make one.

You say all this but this is just quessing isn't it
ANd it's rather silly. Because the magic triangle that you mention. WHo says Belka weapons only uses triangle forms? RH uses a magic form as well. Those symbols are belka

Originally Posted by Kyral

Excuse me, but when was this said? And who said it?

It is official that Raising Heart and Bardich are Midchilda-typ Devices not Belka.
It is stated so on the official Device cards.

They are being updated and cared for by TSAB. So they classify them as from themselves.

Originally Posted by Comartemis

Bardiche was built by either Precia, Fate, or Linis. It has nothing to do with Belka.

Seriously Yuri, where are you getting these ideas from?

How can you say this to me while you don't even for yourself know who made Bardiche you are just quessing

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

Bardiche is a newer Device, created after Fate's 'birth' but before the Jewel Seed incident. It was stated in source materials that Precia's familiar, Linith, created the Mid-type Device for Fate if I recall.

I see I read that too. But who doesn't say she used an allready found device and upgraded that one. But it's interesting to know more about it yes.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Kyral

Yes, I think I will keep her that way. :3

That brings me to the question, how much OCs actually are wearing white uniforms?

Keroko: White uniform, checking in.
Tesla: Blue uniform, checking in.
Eden: No uniform, checking in. Loving the investigation department.
Jun: White uniform, checking in.
Wes: White uniform with a Rogue Squadron commander patch, checking in.
Tycho: White uniform, checking in. Also, I'll have a large cola, and a good portion of rice.
Phanan: White uniform, checking in. I'll have what Tycho's having.

Originally Posted by Kyral

The Devices also seem only to be able to fire and create a barrier. They are also pretty short if you compare them with other devices.

That's all we've seen them doing, doesn't mean that's all they're capable off.

Originally Posted by Yurichan

Yuuno-kun found RH while excavating a site. And he used the device. He then went on the run for a monster and came across Nanoha. And that's how Nanoha got it.

Hmm this is new for me. I though RH is an ancient device that was created by Belka if I remember correctly. Or an other old civilization. At least to my knowledge bardiche is.

Originally Posted by Yurichan

No RH and Bardiche are both from Belka a period in where there was a development in intelligent weapons. In this period also The book of Darkness was created. It was in a battle time. I agree RH looks rather friendly. It might be from the Saint Kaiser period? But the other devices of the TSAB are made out of an image of RH. TSAB analyzes the devices and develops them further. That's how RH got it's upgrades.

I am very curious where you got this info.

The Bardiche bit is already wrong, Linith created Bardiche for Fate right before Precia ended their contract.

[Tempy]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

You say all this but this is just quessing isn't it

No. It's not guessing. I am very certain in my assertion that RH is a Mid-Childan type Intelligent Device, and that the TSAB does not mass-produce devices based on Raising Heart.

ANd it's rather silly. Because the magic triangle that you mention. WHo says Belka weapons only uses triangle forms? RH uses a magic form as well. Those symbols are belka

I... what?

Have you watched the series at all? Bardiche and Raising Heart use distinctively circular magic forms. Compare that to Laevatein, Graf Eisen, Klarer Wind, and hell, even the Book of Darkness, they utilize a very triangular magic shape. The difference between Mid-Childan and Belkan magic styles and devices has been already established and confirmed.

How can you say this to me while you don't even for yourself know who made Bardiche you are just quessing

And what proof do you have that Raising Heart and Bardiche is Belkan? You make claims that has virtually everyone in this thread scratching their heads, wondering how you got this information.

And it's "guessing," not "quessing."

[Comartemis]

You say all this but this is just quessing isn't it

Not really, no.

ANd it's rather silly. Because the magic triangle that you mention. WHo says Belka weapons only uses triangle forms?

Every Belkan weapon seen in the series uses the Belkan triangle instead of the Mid circle. That's one of the big ways you can differentiate between Mages and Knights, by their spell templates. We've never seen Mid mages use triangles and we've never seen Belkan knights use circles. Even if the difference isn't spelled out directly in the series at some point (and I'm sure it is somewhere) it's not much of a logic leap to deduce that the triangles are unique to the Belkan system.

RH uses a magic form as well. Those symbols are belka

*Facepalm*

Those symbols are Mid-Childa spell circles, Yuri.

How can you say this to me while you don't even for yourself know who made Bardiche you are just quessing

I at least have a general idea of who created Bardiche, and the others have confirmed that it was Linis/Linith/however you say her name. So I know more about this then you do with your wild mass guessing.

Yuri, we've got several hundred pages of discussion both in this thread and in Cadia Eins; we know what we're talking about here. RH and Bardiche are not Belkan devices.

[Kyral]

Originally Posted by Yurichan

They are being updated and cared for by TSAB. So they classify them as from themselves.

Same goes for Strada and this one is classified as Belkan-typ.

Also I was talking about the official Device cards you got with the Nanoha A's DVDs.
They have nothing to do with TSAB but with the REAL world you and I are living in.

[Comartemis]

Do you have scans of those cards handy, Kyral? They might prove rather useful in solving this little debate.

[Kyral]

Originally Posted by Comartemis

Do you have scans of those cards handy, Kyral? They might prove rather useful in solving this little debate.

Yes I have:

Spoiler for Some cards:

There is also:

Raising Heart Excelion - System: Mid-childa, Style: Intelligent Device + Cartridge System
Bardiche Assault - System: Mid-childa, Style: Intelligent Device + Cartridge System
Buch der Dunkelheit - System: Belka, Style: Lost Logia
Klarwind - System: Belka, Style: Armed (Rings)
Reinforce - System: Belka, Style: Unison Device
S2U - System: Mid-childa, Style: Storage Device
Durandal - System: Mid-childa, Style: Storage Device

I can upload them all if you want.

[Comartemis]

That would probably help. Yuri seems to need a helpful little thump on the head to show him/her that we really do know what we're talking about here, and having every Belkan device directly associated with the Belkan triangle (and Mid with the circles) would probably go a long way to proving our point.