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View Poll Results: Angel Beats! - Episode 9 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 131 | 64.53% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 41 | 20.20% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 21 | 10.34% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 5 | 2.46% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 3 | 1.48% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 1 | 0.49% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 0 | 0% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 1 | 0.49% | |
Voters: 203. You may not vote on this poll |
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2010-06-03, 11:10 | Link #341 | |
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Philippines
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Hinata was clearly denying his disappearance -- he didn't want to go yet (and he was even slightly nervous about it), so the assumption that he got caught up in the moment pretty much holds true. And, there is also no guarantee that he would have had actually disappeared if Yui hadn't interfered.
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2010-06-03, 11:35 | Link #342 | |||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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For the last point, Jun Meada clealy wanted us to believe that this was a serious situation and that Hinata would've disappeared. Perhaps there is a possibility that he wouldn't have but I think that's completely contradictory to what the writer wants us to believe. And about that I don't really see what you've said supports the belief that Hinata was just caught in the moment. It still seems to me that that moment was really Hinata's 'true self'.
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Last edited by Haak; 2010-06-03 at 11:50. |
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2010-06-03, 12:18 | Link #343 | |
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Philippines
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I'm specifically referring to Hinata's outright denial of his disappearance. If this has been brought up before, kindly point me to it as I merely skimmed the last few pages.
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The way I see it, if Hinata was really gonna disappear had Yui not intervened, then the act of attaining "nirvana" or whatever in that world is hardwired to incite some form of pleasure. This encourages the PCs to pass on, since it is a pleasurable experience and thus is instinctively considered favorable. What happened to Hinata is similar to instincts overriding logic and emotion.
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2010-06-03, 14:41 | Link #344 | ||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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And I fail to see how that contradicts it being Hinata's true self, either. Lot's of people do things that they're unsure of why they did so in the first place. It happens all the time in anime. And attaining inner peace is going to encite some form of pleasure anyway. And it can't encourage PC's to pass on instinctively unless they're hardwired to do that aswell.
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2010-06-03, 14:46 | Link #345 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
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The fact that he was nervous, does not give me more confidence to his answer, but doubts instead. It's just my subjective interpretation, and it could very well be the case that he indeed got caught up in the moment when he was about to catch the ball, but I don't think "that scene" is the deal breaker. Either way, it would be more valid if the question is also asked after the incident, not just before. Last edited by maplehurry; 2010-06-03 at 20:32. |
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2010-06-03, 15:26 | Link #346 | ||||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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You see, I accept that sometimes, life hands you a situation where you have to make a split second decision, while you're in the grip of a powerful emotion. Maybe that decision ends up killing you, or something that you regret bitterly, but them's the breaks. Maybe, given time to consider, you'd make the exact same choice, and maybe you wouldn't, but well, that's life. Stuff happens, and it doesn't have to be fair. I still think that someone who takes it upon himself, unasked for, to engineer such a situation hoping you'll die is a bit of a dick. Last edited by Anh_Minh; 2010-06-03 at 16:35. |
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2010-06-03, 15:37 | Link #347 |
Explodes when thrown
IT Support
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 37
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Sure, but that's where the disagreement seems to arise (and I think it's been mentioned before): the concept of "death" in this universe has been turned topsy-turvy, and is painted as not necessarily a bad thing. I expect the conflict in the next few episodes to address this exact subject, actually.
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2010-06-03, 16:01 | Link #348 | ||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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2010-06-03, 16:36 | Link #349 | |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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2010-06-03, 23:56 | Link #350 |
Carbon
Join Date: Nov 2003
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You can't force someone to move on
The final decision is made by the person itself Yes, Otonashi did want to stay because something was holding him back. Yes, Imasawa did want to move on. Yes, it was more important than whatever bonds she had with the SSs. To use Haibane Renmei parallels again, Otonoashi is going through the Nemu phase. Imasawa was Kuu |
2010-06-04, 04:27 | Link #351 | ||
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Philippines
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What Hinata thinks: I will never leave that girl's side. What he did in the game: Wow, catching this ball feels so good, it's almost as if I'm gonna disap-- Why not? The reason why humans love to eat and reproduce is because eating and sex is pleasurable (It has been hardwired into our brains and anatomy that the basics for the species' survival are deemed as pleasurable activities. For example, sensitive pleasure centers have developed to encourage these activities.). I don't see how this can't be the case in this imaginary world as well, especially since it was set up to specifically address their old regrets.
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2010-06-04, 04:51 | Link #352 | |||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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And I honestly don't see how that makes a difference anyway. Quote:
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2010-06-04, 06:34 | Link #353 | ||
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Location: Philippines
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On the other hand, Hinata was basically forced to catch the ball -- if he doesn't catch it, the team loses, which goes against Yuri's wishes. He was nervous going into that last play, since Otonashi hinted that if they'd win the game, Hinata might disappear. He outright denied this. And then, when the ball conveniently came to him, he basically blanked out, recalled his last game, and fell prey to the world's pleasure stimulators. Two seconds versus a minute and 30. Obligated vs volunteered. Do you see the difference? Still not enough? Quote:
If I pass out, Yurippe would be all alone again. I don't want to see that happen anymore. That's the way I am, and isn't that how you are? So, you can hit me as much as you like. The number of times I've been hit says that I'm still fine.And she will be again if and when Hinata disappears. He's one of the founders. The only person more important than him, other than Yuri herself, is Chaa, and he's too disjointed from the regulars due to Guild. What you implied to be Hinata's true self: I want to get out of this afterlife as soon as possible, and I don't care if I would pretty much destabilize the SSS if that were to happen. What the story implies to be Hinata's true self: I want to stay by this girl's side no matter what, collect allies and build a strong raid group so that she will never be alone again.
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2010-06-04, 08:27 | Link #354 | ||||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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Therefore, God does not exist. This is about as much sense as I'm getting out of this (Don't take that the wrong way. It's not meant to be insulting. I'm genuinley just not seeing the connection). Listen just try and reword it or something because it's obviously not clicking. Or better yet explain how Hinata saying 'Ofcourse I'm not going to disappear' and feeling nervous suggests that he's pressured into it rather than simply being at unease facing his demon and trying to reassure himself and Otonashi that nothing bad will happen. That was actually a factor? And in such a serious situation? You'd think they'd give exposition on such a an important factor. I mean it was only played for laughs. I'm pretty certain Yuri would've accepted the possibility of disappearing as a valid excuse for pulling out. Especially since losing wouldn't have been that big of deal. Especially if Yuri cares about Hinata that much. But it was actually enough to pressure Hinata into facing his demons? Honestly? Don't you think that a much more simple explanation was that the whole convo when Hinata denied disappearing was just an attempt to give exposition that Hinata might disappear? Quote:
No he didn't. Only reason he didn't try to disappear was because he had no idea how. Quote:
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Last edited by Haak; 2010-06-04 at 16:32. |
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2010-06-04, 09:31 | Link #355 |
✘˵╹◡╹˶✘
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Australia
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Since i'm pretty much agree with Ice Block's points so i probably won't need to mention much.
But Haak, i do not understand at all when you said that "Only reason he didn't try to disappear was because he had no idea how". Aren't you the one who understand yourself most in most case? It's not like Otonashi knows something that Hinata do not. If even Hinata do not know how, then Otonashi won't even have a close chance there. PS: yeah i survived
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2010-06-04, 09:41 | Link #356 | |
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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I'm not sure what Otonashi has to do with this. Are you trying to say that Otonashi saying 'Are you going to disappear?' shouldn't have been taken seriously? I think that's entirely different. Hinata wasn't sure how to go about finding inner peace. You're right, Otonashi probably won't either, but in Hinata's case he was given a very very very very strong hint, that anyone Genre Savvy enough could've picked up. And regardless, it's still exposition even if it is a little weird.
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2010-06-05, 11:04 | Link #358 | ||||||
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Join Date: Feb 2008
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So, you create the moment yourself, and then you get caught up in it for more than a minute and a half, complete with flashbacks into the happiest moments of your past? I think you need to check your definitions here. Also, see Yui's disappearance. No uneasiness, no denying, no sudden "wow this is the greatest feeling ev--". She even openly stated what she wanted. This is basically what I meant:
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Or did you not get the last part (forced into feeling pleasure from catching the ball)? It's like a set feeling/sense or instinct. If you eat something sweet, it's almost impossible for you to make it feel sour instead. You will never normally see red as blue, it will be very hard to ignore pain without painkillers or special training, orgasm will always feel pleasurable unless you have some disorders, etc. And I'm not sure about what you're trying to ask here, but this is basically what he did. Why would he do that? Because he doesn't want anything bad to happen. If he doesn't want anything bad to happen, why did he accept possible disappearance with open arms? Because he got caught up in the moment, or, for a better term, he got caught off-guard. Quote:
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Hinata doesn't want to disappear because he wants to take care of Yuri. Yuri formed the SSS together with him, and he basically recruited both Ooyama (gave him the courage to stay around Yuri) and Shiina (anime hints at Matsushita and probably Hisako too). It's like being in a long-lived guild/organization. When the co-founder suddenly throws in the towel (for no good reason), you're bound to have some group instability. Quote:
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Hoho, and I just noticed that it's confirmed that they (the core at least) have been there for many years, as Chaa casually remarks in Ep02.
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2010-06-05, 13:44 | Link #359 | ||||||||||||
Me, An Intellectual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Age: 33
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We can't talk about future events btw.
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And what you've described suggests good friendship. But not "He's the only thing important in my life" Quote:
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Last edited by Haak; 2010-06-05 at 15:08. |
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2010-06-06, 06:18 | Link #360 | ||||||||||
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Philippines
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Yuri's wish: Defeat Kanade's team; win baseball tournament if possible. If he doesn't catch the ball, their team would lose the match. Quote:
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Spoiler for Chapter 3 excerpt:
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Read it again. And again. And again. If you still can't see it after reading the chapter 10 times, then I can't help you. Just something I noticed while rewatching Ep02. Not particularly related, but should make you think of how relationships evolve over, perhaps, a decade.
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