Why did Kakashi fight Itachi and not Orochimaru?

[Nine Devil]

Originally Posted by FireBorn

My guess,

Kakashi was stupid to thought he could have beat Orochimaru alone. Kakashi had help against Itachi. Itachi, even then, probably could have taken on two of them while Kisame took on one. But, Itachi knew that only more jounins would come, and eventually he would be overwhelmed. Both Orichimaru and Itachi would own the hell out of Kakashi in a one verses one situation.

Also, Kakashi had the element of surprise in the battle against Itachi if I remember correctly. It wasn't head on head like against Orochimaru.

No he won't be overwhelmed, he would wipe them all out. Thus starting a war

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

actually hunter, the mange sharingan doesn't use genjitsu right? it was sorta reality. its not exactly an illusion right?

Its a genjutsu, the best on we saw till this day.

[Fuji_Sempai]

the mange sharingan doesn't use genjitsu right? it was sorta reality. its not exactly an illusion right?

well it's kinda an illusion in that the thing going on is in your mind but aslong as the mind sees that whats going on is painful you will feel real pain

[brassmonkey]

isn't that genjitsu? illusions which confuses the body into thinking it is real. i think itachi's sharingan does more than just mere genjitsu. i tink it transport the mind into his own imagination, his own reality where he controls everything.

[Nine Devil]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

isn't that genjitsu? illusions which confuses the body into thinking it is real. i think itachi's sharingan does more than just mere genjitsu. i tink it transport the mind into his own imagination, his own reality where he controls everything.

Mangekyou sharingan is not an genjutsu. Tsukuyomi one of the jutsu that comes with Mangekyou sharingan is a genjutsu. Amaterasu is a ninjutsu.

[fzz]

funny actually, the sharingan is all protection vs genjutsu
but the bloodline limit jutsu is actually genjutsu..


just felt like saying that

[Jetthi]

Believe it or not but I think Kakashi has a much bigger fear of Snake face than of Itachi. And rumor says that they were on the same Anbu team. So Kakashi probably had more confidents when facing Itachi.

[lotus_lee]

Originally Posted by Tsukuyomi

Way back in the chuunin exam preliminaries... there was a point where orochimaru and kakashi encountered each other... kakashi uses chidori... after talking more with orochimaru.. he backs off and wonders how stupid that was thinking he can take on orochimaru> later on after in the series when Itachi appears he just goes on taking on both Kisame and Itachi > wait~ isn't itachi alone stronger than orochimaru? didn't orochimaru fear itachi? o.o Kurenai and Azuma weren't able to take on Itachi alone... so my point is why did Kakashi fight Itachi and not Orochimaru??

Well, Orochimaru may think that he's weaker than Itachi but do you think he would actually tell that to others, lol. I don't think Kakashi knows that Itachi may be stronger than Orochimaru. All he knows is that they are both pretty powerful and that he would need help to defeat the two. Also, like others have said, he had help with him against Itachi while against Orochimaru, he could have never been able to defeat a Sannin alone.

[fieryshadowcard]

There seem to be uncertain boundaries about strength between certain people. One thing is clear, though; Kakashi would lose to either Orochimaru or Itachi (as he has). Now, let's review the facts.

1) Orochimaru has admittedly said that Itachi is stronger than him.

2) Orochimaru has his own definition of strength that gets refuted almost every time he fights someone on his level (he thinks more jutsus = more power)

3) Orochimaru seems stronger than Jiraiya and Tsunade (not combined, but on a one-on-one level... perhaps it will become clearer when Orochimaru fights with both his arms)

4) Jiraiya forced TWO Akatsuki members to retreat. Rather than Itachi using the last of his strength (WITH backup from Kisame) to deal with Jiraiya before Jiraiya could completely contract the frog's stomach, he used Amaterasu for a retreating motion. He's certainly faster than Jiraiya, but it seems Jiraiya's moves make speed irrelevant.

Now, Orochimaru values the Sharingan very much. Knowing what Itachi's Sharingan can do certainly affects Orochimaru's approach to it. Plus, Orochimaru is a theoretical person. He's not the type to find it necessary to fight against someone to compare his strength with them. After all, his idea is talent owns all else. Theoretically, he could be right in many occasions, but simulations are not 100% accurate, so his assessment of Itachi's strength could be off. His views are very pre-Naruto-Neji-esque.

He would most likely approach the Mangekyou in the same manner as Kakashi.

Now, there's also the issue of matchup. A drugged Jiraiya loses to an armless Orochimaru, but forces two Akatsuki members (one low on energy with a trump card, the other at full strength with unknown but definitely powerful moves) to retreat. The issue of matchup is also important, because one person's abilities can make another's useless, or less effective than they could be. Lee's weightless speed and Initial Lotus are useless against Neji, who creates a field of Chakra with his Byakugan not only to see almost all around him, but to FEEL almost all around him. If he can detect Lee, and has a decent, even if inferior, level of reflexes, he can create Chakra to brace for Lee's impact and initiate Kaiten or just counter-attack once Lee is in close range. As long as he is prepared for Lee's attacks, he is strong enough to deal with Lee's speed, which is why Primary Lotus is necessary, since it would overpower Kaiten and then Neji's preparation wouldn't matter; its most important factor would be power, and not speed. So, Lee's approach to Neji's abilities becomes different.

Returning to Orochimaru's approach to the Mangekyou, his assessment might be different if he approached the Mangekyou in the same manner as Gai (who greatly reduces the Sharingan's effect on him--no Tsukiyomi or mind tricks but his moves would still be anticipated-- reducing the fight to a matter of who is the better fighter, but whether Gai would still lose is uncertain: as he is, probably, but with the gates open, who knows?)

So, now strength, matchup, and approach are all important when looking at this. Being stronger than someone does not mean being able to beat someone, especially in a ninja world. Itachi is not the best matchup for Orochi or Kakashi, especially because of their approach, but Orochimaru would have to have superior strength because he is a Sannin, regardless of what he says; Gai is probably not the best matchup for Itachi, but for all we know, his approach and strength are probably superior.

So, Itachi wins not necessarily on account of superior strength, but definitely because of matchup and approach.

-Yusef "The B.A.T." Pittman

[lotus_lee]

But then again, Itachi could be down the bog (come on, everyone has to!), not knowing that there is an explosive kunai in it and BOOOM!!! My point? Anything could happen in Naruto

[SnComet2]

If you go back and look at the episode you will see that orochimaru showed kakashi his death. That's why he got so scared. It happens when the grey shadow appears over kakashi (similar effect to what happened to sasuke only toned down). He was ready to fight until that jutsu hit him.

[hiko]

Hehe I'm sure this will shock the Itachi fanboys, but he isn't really much of a "legendary" ninja. During his formative years in Konoha he was part of what seems a pretty secretive clan and he obviously forged an impressive name for himself as a truly amazing talent, not to mention the old Uchiha culling (has anyone from Konoha every referred to Itachi as the legendary man who wiped out an entire clan single-handedly? I kinda get the impression his feats have been kept secret to many ninjas) but he just didn't stick around long enough to acquire the kind of rep and respect the Sannin did. We all know that the Akatsuki are a secretive bunch of mofos so no one knows Oro couldn't beat him (only Jiraiya probably).

To put it simpler, who would you fear more: A prodigal teenager who you know very little about, or a battle-hardened veteran ninja who is not only famous across the Ninja countries for being Kage class (as I feel all the Sannin are), but was also one of the most famous ninjas during your formative years?

Also, Kakashi didn't even hesitate when Oro arrived on the scene during the Chuunin arc, he fired the Chidori up and got ready, he only went wobbly after the situation had diffused and it was clear Oro wasn't there to fight. Against Itachi, Kaki was unconcious by the time his opponent left, so we didn't get to see whether Kaki would've gone wobbly with fear afterwards

Oh and merry xmas folks, tis Xmas where i'm posting now anyways

[Nine Devil]

Originally Posted by hiko

Hehe I'm sure this will shock the Itachi fanboys, but he isn't really much of a "legendary" ninja. During his formative years in Konoha he was part of what seems a pretty secretive clan and he obviously forged an impressive name for himself as a truly amazing talent, not to mention the old Uchiha culling (has anyone from Konoha every referred to Itachi as the legendary man who wiped out an entire clan single-handedly? I kinda get the impression his feats have been kept secret to many ninjas) but he just didn't stick around long enough to acquire the kind of rep and respect the Sannin did. We all know that the Akatsuki are a secretive bunch of mofos so no one knows Oro couldn't beat him (only Jiraiya probably).

To put it simpler, who would you fear more: A prodigal teenager who you know very little about, or a battle-hardened veteran ninja who is not only famous across the Ninja countries for being Kage class (as I feel all the Sannin are), but was also one of the most famous ninjas during your formative years?

Also, Kakashi didn't even hesitate when Oro arrived on the scene during the Chuunin arc, he fired the Chidori up and got ready, he only went wobbly after the situation had diffused and it was clear Oro wasn't there to fight. Against Itachi, Kaki was unconcious by the time his opponent left, so we didn't get to see whether Kaki would've gone wobbly with fear afterwards

Oh and merry xmas folks, tis Xmas where i'm posting now anyways

Lol, true yet that doesn't make the Sannin stronger than Itachi. But it makes Itachi seem more badass. Yes it was mentioned by Konoha folk that he killed his entire clan on his own. Actually why should It be mentioned? Entire Naruto world knows about it already

Itachi>all. hehe

[Faktor-IV]

Originally Posted by hiko

Hehe I'm sure this will shock the Itachi fanboys, but he isn't really much of a "legendary" ninja. During his formative years in Konoha he was part of what seems a pretty secretive clan and he obviously forged an impressive name for himself as a truly amazing talent, not to mention the old Uchiha culling (has anyone from Konoha every referred to Itachi as the legendary man who wiped out an entire clan single-handedly? I kinda get the impression his feats have been kept secret to many ninjas) but he just didn't stick around long enough to acquire the kind of rep and respect the Sannin did. We all know that the Akatsuki are a secretive bunch of mofos so no one knows Oro couldn't beat him (only Jiraiya probably).

To put it simpler, who would you fear more: A prodigal teenager who you know very little about, or a battle-hardened veteran ninja who is not only famous across the Ninja countries for being Kage class (as I feel all the Sannin are), but was also one of the most famous ninjas during your formative years?

Also, Kakashi didn't even hesitate when Oro arrived on the scene during the Chuunin arc, he fired the Chidori up and got ready, he only went wobbly after the situation had diffused and it was clear Oro wasn't there to fight. Against Itachi, Kaki was unconcious by the time his opponent left, so we didn't get to see whether Kaki would've gone wobbly with fear afterwards

Oh and merry xmas folks, tis Xmas where i'm posting now anyways

what? you didnt see kakashsi was being very reluctant when oro was walking toward him? kakashi was intimadated by oro from the very beginning. Some of that might had to do with circumstance, where he was caught off guard where oro just showed up. But the main reason (other than circumstance)why he was indecisive against oro and not Itachi was, AGE&EGO. You know the saying,Its better to be ignorant than being a coward(specially toward a guy who is about 10yrs younger than you) If the pain is equal, what is the difference between "snake" biting you and , in this case a 17-18yrold boy hitting you with his jutsu? it is perception and fear. When your mentally broken ,the pain is amplified.

When you become an adult, you'll understand.

[Hairydolphin]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

actually hunter, the mange sharingan doesn't use genjitsu right? it was sorta reality. its not exactly an illusion right?

Its not, its the same concept that is in the Matrix, its like a dream but its so real, your mind percieves it as real.

[hiko]

Originally Posted by Nine Devil

Yes it was mentioned by Konoha folk that he killed his entire clan on his own. Actually why should It be mentioned? Entire Naruto world knows about it already
Itachi>all. hehe

I could've been clearer with my wording on that, sorry. What I meant was: Has anyone mentioned that Itachi is now a legend in his own right, known across the land? Sure we've seen the higher-ranked Konoha ninjas refer to him killing off the whole clan, but they don't seem to respect his reputation as much as you'd think they should. Even Kurenai and Asuma fancied their chances when fighting him. Maybe it's because no one knows 100% for sure if he did kill everyone singlehandedly, as they never witnessed it (not even Sasuke witnessed it 1st hand). What I find hilarious is that didn't Kaki warned Kurenai and Asuma not to take him lightly because he became an ANBU captain at 13, what about slaughtering the most powerful clan in Konoha single-handedly at 13? lol.

Might as well make it clear that I'm not arguing that Itachi is a pussy or anything, I personally think he's most likely the most powerful ninja we've seen yet in the Narutoverse, but he clearly doesn't have the reputation of the sannin and so it's only natural that he doesn't inspire as much awe in his enemies before he faces them. Once they get a taste of his abilities though, then the trousers get soiled .

Falktor-IV, it seems to me that you simply drooled out an incoherent regurgitation of what I said - that Kaki didn't fear Itachi because he was some young prodigy who hadn't amassed the rep of the much older and experienced Oro. I would have thought it was obvious that the character's own ego is part of the basis for that way of thinking. I can also assure you I'm old enough to understand the concept you so ineloquently tried to express.