Macross Frontier - Episode 12 Discussion / Poll

[seraphon]

Originally Posted by Tak

In fact, Hive Fleet Behemoth had a strength on paper of 1,000 ships,

Try 1000 millions (if not billions -_-) ships and you might be correct....... and that was only one fleet..... Dont forget either that the tyranids, the more they eat the more numerous they will be. I m sure they would be very happy with zentradi snacks.

Originally Posted by Tak

Not to mention each Zent stands nearly as tall as an Imperium Titan...

- Tak (DEUTSCHLAND vs. SPANIEN: Sonntag! 06/29/08)

Totally false.
They may be the same size of the smallest titans, but the biggest ones are about hundreds of meters tall. a zentradi is what? 100 meters tall? puny insects I must say.


Secondly you forget the demons and with just technologie the zent could do nothing .

Anyways, back to topic even if I think warhammer is more fun than frontier, but I m amazed by those pedophiles in macross frontier

Moe is one thing but its criminal to like this weird animal that is ranka better than sheril.....
And I find it disturbing that right it seems that ranka is gaining everything while sheryl is losing everything. Not to mention that ranka at least already had a brother (family then) and lots of friends whereas sheryl is a lonely wolf. Meh

[stray]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Ranka's very good at improvised replacements. Once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, but if she does it a third time, I'll start suspecting her of somehow sabotaging other performers...

Hmmm... Ranka has a fairy godfather...

Although, she is the Super Dimension Cinderella now...

Originally Posted by Westlo

Honestly wao I think it would the majority of people watching would agree with you with Alto, if his one liner to Temjin fixes his acting issues than I'll just /facepalm. Hikaru was an indecisive idiot, Basara was... Basara, Shin was meh and Alto has no character.. sigh @ Isamu being the only great male lead in the franchise. Good thing they had great side characters like Max and Millia as well as the girls and music.

I don't really see Alto as being that underdeveloped... but in all reality, Macross typically has an incredibly strong ensemble cast of characters; and alot like Basara so far, Alto is kind of... the mirror everyone sees themselves through. There's alot of telling things he does, though, like in episode 6 I think where he tells Ranka to just "do what she wants" when she talks about getting Ozma's blessings to start singing... and Nanase steps in to tell him something like "Um... she *did* get his blessing, Alto." Either way it seems like there's an equal amount of caring and resentment/jealousy/fear even to go around with him but we're really starting to see him let his guard down a bit. I'm pretty sure he was floored by what both Sheryl and Ranka did for him; it doesn't seem like (in his mind, anyway) anyone close to him has done anything but hold him back.

Of course, that doesn't have much to do with the triangle but I don't really think it's meant to just yet. I may be reading too much into it, but his blog http://ameblo.jp/altosaotome is completely empty, so... we may never know...

I think I've got to vote for OVA Isamu as the least developed character ever in Macross btw... sorry.

[Westlo]

Isamu's character was set in stone from the beginning so of course he didn't get much development, you knew what you were getting from Isamu after the very first scene. Sorta like Spike from Bebop (Same director) most of his development was done before the series started. And of course Alto's blog is empty, trying to guess what this idiot is thinking is half the fun and a blog would ruin that, they may have also grabbed that site so no one could make a fake one like people suspect the Klan one is.

[Ingram]

Originally Posted by Wesley84

No, no, they were clearly shooting over eachother's heads.

Maybe it was just a periodic letting-off-steam session that Zentradi use when there's no one to fight against (other than boredom)? Since it was Zentradi vs Zentradi, I like how their weapons have selectable beam colors so that they can choose blue team or red team (or does the gun choose which team they align with for that round?). ^_^

Will the concert crew back on Frontier now have to change the promotion for Ranka's concert, so that it no longer says 'first live'? Or maybe add in small print ("... on Frontier")... Did Ranka's movie get screened at the Zentradi base, or do they have a (non-specific) idol-singer Zentradi fanboy group. I was surprised that the word about her had made it out to that backwater.

So many important questions to ask... ;p

Sheryl's got my sympathy, but it's nice to see Ranka show more initiative. Alto's not defined enough for me at the moment, so I'm currently in the Ranka+Sheryl camp, but I think that it's among the least-likely results for the series. ^_^;

[Tak]

Originally Posted by seraphon

Try 1000 millions (if not billions -_-) ships and you might be correct....... and that was only one fleet..... Dont forget either that the tyranids, the more they eat the more numerous they will be. I m sure they would be very happy with zentradi snacks.

Continuing Apples vs. Bananas...

Nope. According to the Tyranid codex, the Battle of Macragge involved only a hive fleet at a strength of approximately 1,000 vessels. Thats more or less equal to what UN SPACY could come up with during Space War I, and far less than each Zentradi battle fleet. And I did mention the number of Tyranid fleets are uncertain. Yet, we have absolutely no approximation their strength, although 1,000 'million' or more is probably wishful thinking on your part.

You also tend to forget that Zents are a space-faring race, and don't usually commence ground assaults unless necessary and for other purposes. If Zentradi fleets were bent on total annihilation, they would have absolutely no problems hammering any planet they encounter through orbit. Wanting to eat a Zentradi is fine, but you'd have to have a place to eat them first.

And they have billions of guns bigger than those found on the Macross.

Originally Posted by seraphon

Totally false.
They may be the same size of the smallest titans, but the biggest ones are about hundreds of meters tall. a zentradi is what? 100 meters tall? puny insects I must say.

I never said they were as tall as a titan, but certainly they do surpass smaller ones. Moreover, the Zents can summon billions of 'small' titans (that being themselves) or mass-production titans in the forms of battle-pods, Gluags, and Gers on the go. On the other hand, the Imperium would be lucky to muster a couple hundred, in addition to maybe, just maybe, 3 Emperor Class Titans, which the Zents have plenty equal or surpassing in power.

Originally Posted by seraphon

Secondly you forget the demons and with just technologie the zent could do nothing .

The Tau, Orks and Tyranids did them just fine, and the Tau has no psykers while the Orks are as simple minded as Zents. Moreover, I said this before, I will say this again, the EYE OF TERROR is not necessary for the Zents to achieve warp travel. That is a major weakness to nearly every race in the W40K universe.

The Zents are very much like Orks in certain aspects. They are created to be battle-ready, with technologies surpassing that of the Tau and Eldars while possessing numbers equal if not surpassing to that of the 'Nids.

Of course, that is just... the Zentradi. There are many more legacies left by protoculture I have not even mentioned.

- Tak (DEUTSCHLAND vs. SPANIEN: Sonntag! 06/29/08)

[stray]

Originally Posted by Westlo

Isamu's character was set in stone from the beginning so of course he didn't get much development, you knew what you were getting from Isamu after the very first scene. Sorta like Spike from Bebop (Same director) most of his development was done before the series started. And of course Alto's blog is empty, trying to guess what this idiot is thinking is half the fun and a blog would ruin that, they may have also grabbed that site so no one could make a fake one like people suspect the Klan one is.

Yeah... Spike pissed me off even more, and I carry that f'ing weight of resentment over towards Isamu Samurai Champloo was awesome, though.

Sorry, thinking about Bebop makes me bitter. Anyway, I really like Plus, but something about it just screams late 80's/early 90's Hollywood action movie to me. Isamu really is a fun character, but he's so comically reckless and everything just kind of... falls into place for him. Meanwhile you've got kind of dark and brooding backstories for Guld and Myung... I dunno. Somehow I expected more than "I just love to fly" from him. I should really watch the Movie edition again tho, I don't even remember if I ever made it the whole way through.

[Wesley84]

Originally Posted by Tak

Continuing Apples vs. Bananas...

Nope. According to the Tyranid codex, the Battle of Macragge involved only a hive fleet at a strength of approximately 1,000 vessels. Thats more or less equal to what UN SPACY could come up with during Space War I, and far less than each Zentradi battle fleet. And I did mention the number of Tyranid fleets are uncertain. Yet, we have absolutely no approximation their strength, although 1,000 'million' or more is probably wishful thinking on your part.

You also tend to forget that Zents are a space-faring race, and don't usually commence ground assaults unless necessary and for other purposes. If Zentradi fleets were bent on total annihilation, they would have absolutely no problems hammering any planet they encounter through orbit. Wanting to eat a Zentradi is fine, but you'd have to have a place to eat them first.

And they have billions of guns bigger than those found on the Macross.



I never said they were as tall as a titan, but certainly they do surpass smaller ones. Moreover, the Zents can summon billions of 'small' titans (that being themselves) or mass-production titans in the forms of battle-pods, Gluags, and Gers on the go. On the other hand, the Imperium would be lucky to muster a couple hundred, in addition to maybe, just maybe, 3 Emperor Class Titans, which the Zents have plenty equal or surpassing in power.



The Tau, Orks and Tyranids did them just fine, and the Tau has no psykers while the Orks are as simple minded as Zents. Moreover, I said this before, I will say this again, the EYE OF TERROR is not necessary for the Zents to achieve warp travel. That is a major weakness to nearly every race in the W40K universe.

The Zents are very much like Orks in certain aspects. They are created to be battle-ready, with technologies surpassing that of the Tau and Eldars while possessing numbers equal if not surpassing to that of the 'Nids.

Of course, that is just... the Zentradi. There are many more legacies left by protoculture I have not even mentioned.

- Tak (DEUTSCHLAND vs. SPANIEN: Sonntag! 06/29/08)

So it was hyperbolic when I read that Nid swarms outmassed the planets they devoured?

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by seraphon

Moe is one thing but its criminal to like this weird animal that is ranka better than sheril.....
And I find it disturbing that right it seems that ranka is gaining everything while sheryl is losing everything. Not to mention that ranka at least already had a brother (family then) and lots of friends whereas sheryl is a lonely wolf. Meh

In fairness to them, Ranka sung to them. Sheryl didn't. Frankly, I think anything would have satisfied them. Alto should just have bitten the bullet and performed "Princess Sakura" for them...

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Wesley84

So it was hyperbolic when I read that Nid swarms outmassed the planets they devoured?

If you let the Nids grow on your planet, sure.

Then again, W40K has some seriously inconsistency in writing, far worse than any fictional universe I've encountered. So now if I am to read W40K material (aside from the Codex), I will read it as independent fiction.

Take for example:

Eldar's greatest foe used to be Chaos, now its the Necrons.

Necron warriors (or a form of it) used to be part of the Chaos army, but no longer.

40 years old is apparent old for a Tau, yet there are numerous accounts indicating that Tau can live well beyond hundreds of years old naturally.

And I won't even go into details how many times they screwed up the Imperial Guard.

- Tak

[cerrian]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

In fairness to them, Ranka sung to them. Sheryl didn't. Frankly, I think anything would have satisfied them. Alto should just have bitten the bullet and performed "Princess Sakura" for them...

I was actually expecting Alto to do exactly that when what's his name challenged him to sing for them.

[Wesley84]

Originally Posted by Tak

If you let the Nids grow on your planet, sure.

Then again, W40K has some seriously inconsistency in writing, far worse than any fictional universe I've encountered. So now if I am to read W40K material (aside from the Codex), I will read it as independent fiction.

Take for example:

Eldar's greatest foe used to be Chaos, now its the Necrons.

Necron warriors (or a form of it) used to be part of the Chaos army, but no longer.

40 years old is apparent old for a Tau, yet there are numerous accounts indicating that Tau can live well beyond hundreds of years old naturally.

And I won't even go into details how many times they screwed up the Imperial Guard.

- Tak

I understand that "It's all canon". Contradictions exist because of the varying points of view, intentions, and general mistrust and shenigians of the 40k universe. If something is to be believed, it will only be believed as a matter of consensus amongst those who choose to have a discussion concerning 40k.

That only applies to stuff that has actual contradictions though.

[Kaoru Chujo]

I think fangs are supposed to show a character has some kind of wildness and strength in them, that they are a little animalic, hard to control. The first time I noticed them was on Tina in Ai yori Aoshi: a wild foreigner. I think you will find them on foreign girls quite a bit, since foreign girls are supposed to be wilder.

I think they are emphasizing them on Ranka in this episode to show that she has become a force to be reckoned with, and that she is going for it, both in her career and in her love for Alto.

EDIT: And I think a fang suggests an anime girl is sexually forward. Fangs seem to appear and disappear on some characters depending on the mood or situation.

It seems to me that in real life a higher proportion of Japanese have crooked teeth than of other nationalities, but I don't see that as being particularly related to the anime use of the meme.

[Swampstorm]

Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo

I think fangs are supposed to show a character has some kind of wildness and strength in them, that they are a little animalic, hard to control. The first time I noticed them was on Tina in Ai yori Aoshi: a wild foreigner. I think you will find them on foreign girls quite a bit, since foreign girls are supposed to be wilder.

I think they are emphasizing them on Ranka in this episode to show that she has become a force to be reckoned with, and that she is going for it, both in her career and in her love for Alto.

Fang is also an image tag, used for images of characters with a single prominent canine tooth.

I wish I could pinpoint it down to one set of attitudes, but I've seen it tied in to everything from confidence and strength to embarrassment and vulnerability. I think it's more like italics.

[Darial]

Originally Posted by Swampstorm

Fang is also an image tag, used for images of characters with a single prominent canine tooth.

I wish I could pinpoint it down to one set of attitudes, but I've seen it tied in to everything from confidence and strength to embarrassment and vulnerability. I think it's more like italics.

For some strange reason, Japanese culture finds that girls with fang to be a symbol of cuteness. Here's an article on "yaeba"

http://swerveleft.blogspot.com/2005/...-of-yaeba.html

Now you know why next time you see an anime lolicon/moe-blob flasing a sharp fang.

[cheesie]

Fang = It's either used on a certain archtype ("wild" anime girls) or it's a moe/loli point.

[ReddyRedWolf]

Anybody else thinking that the glowing thing is a Protoculture spiral?

[ApostleOfGod]

All right, so someone tell me. Is Macross Frontier an Alternate universe mixed with the old versions or a whole new plot under same franchise? With the introduction of the Macross, I feel like I really need to understand the structure of this franchise's universe, as well as the background information. Of Zentradi, humans, etc. etc.

No doubt I'll keep watching, I mean I DID fall in love with Sheryl and all, but... You know.. It'd be better to know what you're watching rather than relying on popular Galaxy-idol service..

[Tak]

Originally Posted by ApostleOfGod

All right, so someone tell me. Is Macross Frontier an Alternate universe mixed with the old versions or a whole new plot under same franchise? With the introduction of the Macross, I feel like I really need to understand the structure of this franchise's universe, as well as the background information. Of Zentradi, humans, etc. etc.

No doubt I'll keep watching, I mean I DID fall in love with Sheryl and all, but... You know.. It'd be better to know what you're watching rather than relying on popular Galaxy-idol service..

It is a new continuation of the franchise. The original SDF-1 Macross was notoriously known for its ability to... randomly warp to different places as its warp devices were prone to failure. Alto and co. were stunned to see the Macross here, after all, it was supposed to have been enshrined on Earth.

The Zentradi first encountered humans back in the early 21st century (2010ish). At first, they were probing mankind to see if the humans had anything to do with the Supervision Army, since the SDF-1 Macross was a Supervision Army gunship. Later, Earth nearly got hammered out of orbit (10 billion dead), but a few survivors managed to convince the Zentradi fleet of 4 ~ 5 million that co-existence was a much better option. This entire process was known as Space War I, where an idol (Lynn Minmei) acted as the unifying catalyst for both mankind and Zentradi.

After Space War I, the Zentradi that invaded Earth (which is just 1 fleet, mind you, there are thousands of others) became part of UN SPACY and mankind embarked on a series of colonial expansions, first and foremost with Megaroad-I...

On a side note, we old fans are just as clueless as the new fans trying to figure out what the hell is the SDF-1 doing here!?

- Tak

[stray]

Originally Posted by Tak

It is a new continuation of the franchise. The original SDF-1 Macross was notoriously known for its ability to... randomly warp to different places as its warp devices were prone to failure. Alto and co. were stunned to see the Macross here, after all, it was supposed to have been enshrined on Earth.

You know... the fold system did vanish in SDFM... maybe it reappeared at some point and the Macross just randomly folded away...

[Tak]

Originally Posted by stray

You know... the fold system did vanish in SDFM... maybe it reappeared at some point and the Macross just randomly folded away...

Yeah, and you'd think, after the Sharon Apple incident, the UN SPACY would take the engines out, leaving nothing more than a shell of the original gunship as a tourist attraction.

But no, everything was intact! Or worse, the UN SPACY might have REPAIRED it!

If it really randomly warped away, I will absolutely not be surprised.

- Tak