US Elections 2012 Part I: The Primaries/Caucus

[Ithekro]

In this part of California, most of the schools problems are either blamed on the teachers, or the admintration. And from what I've seem....it is the adminitration that is the problem. When a school can get all of its programs swapped out for other programs on the whim of a new principle or new district superintentent that will likely be gone in three years...it gets to the point where the teachers can't teach because they spend too much time trying to adjust to one change affer another. Trying to conform to some new standarized test, or other. Or being forced to make a list of what their students will learn that year. (not what they will teach the students, "what the students will learn"...which is something you cannot control with 30+ student class sizes.) I don't think I had two years in a row in middle school or high school that had the same hours schedule. One year it was semesters, the next it was quarters, the next it was trimesters. Back to Semesters, but now with block scheduling. Then block with study periods, then a different style of block with a trimester system. It was a mess of six years.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

In this part of California, most of the schools problems are either blamed on the teachers, or the admintration. And from what I've seem....it is te adminitration that is the problem. When a school can get all of its programs swapped out for other programs on the whim of a new principle or new district superintentent that will likely be gone in three years...it gets to the point where the teachers can't teach because they spend too much time trying to adjust to one change affer another. Trying to conform to some new standarized test, or other. Or being forced to make a list of what their students will learn that year. (not what they will teach the students, "what the students will learn"...which is something you cannot control with 30+ student class sizes.) I don't think I have two years in a row in middle school or high school that had the same hours schedule. One year it was semesters, the next it was quarters, the next it was trimesters. Back to Semesters, but now with block scheduling. Then block with study periods, then a different style of block with a trimester system. It was a mess of six years.

where did you go to school? I went to school in Alameda and i didn't notice much change teaching philosophy or tests or semester/qt system. Considering our age we both went at around the same time.

[Ledgem]

Originally Posted by Irenicus

Myself, I think school boards are a public danger. When you think about who would want to waste time running for the position, and why, it gets rather disturbing.

My wife and I want to run. We think it'd be fun.

Well, actually - my wife thinks it would be fun. I'm just tired of seeing people screw things up with policies founded on opinions that are based on little more than belief and emotion, and think we can do better.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

If you are obviously beyond your grade level, they should have skip a few grades for you. In the US this would have ran counter to the equality czar but i thought Singapore was better then this.

We aren't allowed to skip grades, they expected the stronger students to help the weaker ones while staying in the same class, and expect the stronger students to be very good at taking instructions (which I am completely a loser at because I always question them). They didn't realise that there are two ways of learning new things : either by getting someone to teach them, or by figuring out the whole shit yourself.

It is their way of homogenising society, but when popular culture kicks in, everyone is either brainwashed to become stupid, or forced to become so. We wouldn't have to import "foreign talent" from your side if we allowed the kids to build their own ideas about how to get things done instead of judging them by the number of distinctions they score.

And I can go out there and discuss about the Theory of Relativity without being treated like a social outcast. I find it horrifying that people of my age still didn't know that our global economy is in the midst of a stagnation right now, and that the Space Shuttle program has been decomissioned.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

We aren't allowed to skip grades, they expected the stronger students to help the weaker ones while staying in the same class, and expect the stronger students to be very good at taking instructions (which I am completely a loser at because I always question them). They didn't realise that there are two ways of learning new things : either by getting someone to teach them, or by figuring out the whole shit yourself.

It is their way of homogenising society, but when popular culture kicks in, everyone is either brainwashed to become stupid, or forced to become so. We wouldn't have to import "foreign talent" from your side if we allowed the kids to build their own ideas about how to get things done instead of judging them by the number of distinctions they score.

And I can go out there and discuss about the Theory of Relativity without being treated like a social outcast. I find it horrifying that people of my age still didn't know that our global economy is in the midst of a stagnation right now, and that the Space Shuttle program has been decomissioned.

so the Equality Czar got to you guys too.

[Ithekro]

Mt. Diablo School District changed a mess of times. It might have been localized to just the schools I was in, but it changed every year. (who ever heard of going on a trimester system?)

The "teaching philosophy or tests" comes from my mother's 30 years of teaching. It happened more after we left high school...at least in the Antioch School District.

[Zetsubo]

I am not sure the model that American secondary education is following right now is working.

One thing I do know, and I see it in my own country as well... Many parents do not want to have to be a part of their kids education.

They want the teacher to do everything... so much so that one of the education Ministers considered ranking teachers pay according to how well their students did on standardized tests.

The greater number of students you have passing standard exams, the better your pay.

Teacher of course fought back, because the truth is not all Kids come from backgrounds that foster learning as a way of life.

Some schools are more populated with "nerdy" kids while other schools are populated with "rabble rousers". It is not just the economic background of the kids... but how these kids as one poster said... see the value of education.

Fact is many in these "lower tier schools" do not beleive learning how to do Trigonometry will help them in life... and I can't argue with them.

If a teacher has to teach kids to take the test... and have a good reputation... then they won't bother coming up with neat ways to explain things.

I was in my early 20's before I fully understood how Geometry played an important part in my chosen career along with the Sine Cosine and Logarithmic rules.

In some countries Teachers don't connect the dots for you... your left to do that yourself and that can be disastrous for a hormonal struggling teenager.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by Zetsubo

I am not sure the model that American secondary education is following right now is working.

One thing I do know, and I see it in my own country as well... Many parents do not want to have to be a part of their kids education.

They want the teacher to do everything... so much so that one of the education Ministers considered ranking teachers pay according to how well their students did on standardized tests.

The greater number of students you have passing standard exams, the better your pay.

Teacher of course fought back, because the truth is not all Kids come from backgrounds that foster learning as a way of life.

Some schools are more populated with "nerdy" kids while other schools are populated with "rabble rousers". It is not just the economic background of the kids... but how these kids as one poster said... see the value of education.

Fact is many in these "lower tier schools" do not beleive learning how to do Trigonometry will help them in life... and I can't argue with them.

If a teacher has to teach kids to take the test... and have a good reputation... then they won't bother coming up with neat ways to explain things.

I was in my early 20's before I fully understood how Geometry played an important part in my chosen career along with the Sine Cosine and Logarithmic rules.

In some countries Teachers don't connect the dots for you... your left to do that yourself and that can be disastrous for a hormonal struggling teenager.

is it a good or bad you guys are turning into the US?

[Irenicus]

Originally Posted by Ledgem

I'm just tired of seeing people screw things up with policies founded on opinions that are based on little more than belief and emotion, and think we can do better.

Please, save us all. One district at a time.

[ChainLegacy]

Originally Posted by Bri

So true. Though during my own time in uni, and still today, they used calculus to block the weak and (the) wealthy from the (more expensive) science programs. Single ticket to the humanities was their only real option for a uni degree. Math is the great equalizer.

I can't picture why anyone would pursue a science degree if they aren't even capable of mastering calculus...

[Ledgem]

Originally Posted by Irenicus

Please, save us all. One district at a time.

C'mon, to affect positive change requires people to get their hands dirty. If/when you have children you should consider it, too.

Originally Posted by ChainLegacy

I can't picture why anyone would pursue a science degree if they aren't even capable of mastering calculus...

I took three semesters of calculus and then differential equations (that which comes beyond calculus). I don't remember much from any of it, and I didn't feel that I had mastery of it at the time.

But there's good news: in biology, you don't need to worry about it (possible exception: bioinformatics). The highest-level math you "need" is statistics, or more appropriately, biostatistics (which is probably watered-down statistics... and I put "need" in quotes because I didn't encounter many people who understood statistics beyond what p-value they wanted). Math is important, but I wouldn't say that people should shut themselves out of science just because they're not getting it. At least, not biology and certain aspects of chemistry. Physics is another story.

[solomon]

Quick question, who here still loves their country....Despite all this sillyness I still do.........and if you don't you are an EVIL COMMIE LIBERAL CHRISTIAN HATER WHO DESERVES TO GO LIVE IN FRANCE!!!!!!

Anyways, the Repubs will hold onto the Birth Control gaffe for a while but because it will give fire to the Santorum crowd, I think it will hasten the cannibalization of the GOP this election cycle.

Shields and Brooks were talking about Romney's problems on the PBS Newshour. They basically say like "who is he? what is he? where did he come from?" Hasn't a lot of this been reported on already?

He's a Mormon, was a missionary for a while, helped get SLC the Winter Games and was a part of Bain Capital, in addition to being the Gov. of Massachussetts.

Like is there anything really ELSE we really need to know? Does he need to write an auto-biography to sell to people to get him to vote for him? I mean what on EARTH is all this crap about?

[Ithekro]

Well Romney's father ran for President in 1968.

[DonQuigleone]

Originally Posted by ChainLegacy

I can't picture why anyone would pursue a science degree if they aren't even capable of mastering calculus...

Believe it or not, you don't need to use calculus as much as you might think.

Going purely by Mechanical Engineering, the core subject areas are Dynamics, Thermodynamics, Mechanics of Solids, Fluid Mechanics, Mechanics of Materials, and Vibrations.

Of those, only Vibrations require a lot of calculus, and even it uses a lot of shortcuts (for instance laplace transforms, which basically takes all that complicated calculus, and makes it into algebra). 90% of all my calculations was just applying the right equations to the right place with the right algebra, you didn't need much more then high school mathematics.

It sounds easy and... well I wouldn't consider it all that hard. It's the stuff at the edges that get you though.

[Demongod86]

Originally Posted by DonQuigleone

Believe it or not, you don't need to use calculus as much as you might think.

Going purely by Mechanical Engineering, the core subject areas are Dynamics, Thermodynamics, Mechanics of Solids, Fluid Mechanics, Mechanics of Materials, and Vibrations.

Of those, only Vibrations require a lot of calculus, and even it uses a lot of shortcuts (for instance laplace transforms, which basically takes all that complicated calculus, and makes it into algebra). 90% of all my calculations was just applying the right equations to the right place with the right algebra, you didn't need much more then high school mathematics.

It sounds easy and... well I wouldn't consider it all that hard. It's the stuff at the edges that get you though.

It's also the stuff at the edges that makes the difference between life and death. I'd hope my mechanical engineers had the edge cases very-well tucked away, otherwise we get an F-22 crash because the pilot passes out from lack of oxygen.

That said, most of the nasty calculations are tucked away in computer programs by now. But you still need mastery of them...I remember there was a case that an oil rig blew up because a popular computer program grossly overestimated the depth to which it could work.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by solomon

Quick question, who here still loves their country....Despite all this sillyness I still do.........and if you don't you are an EVIL COMMIE LIBERAL CHRISTIAN HATER WHO DESERVES TO GO LIVE IN FRANCE!!!!!!

Anyways, the Repubs will hold onto the Birth Control gaffe for a while but because it will give fire to the Santorum crowd, I think it will hasten the cannibalization of the GOP this election cycle.

Shields and Brooks were talking about Romney's problems on the PBS Newshour. They basically say like "who is he? what is he? where did he come from?" Hasn't a lot of this been reported on already?

He's a Mormon, was a missionary for a while, helped get SLC the Winter Games and was a part of Bain Capital, in addition to being the Gov. of Massachussetts.

Like is there anything really ELSE we really need to know? Does he need to write an auto-biography to sell to people to get him to vote for him? I mean what on EARTH is all this crap about?

People want to know if anything he told them today, would be relevant tomorrow.

I know the word "flip-flop" is overused in politics, as means to accuse politicians for changing their minds for legitimate reasons. But Romney simply has zero convictions. He isn't a Democrat, but he could have been, if he wanted to.

Romney had been caught repeatedly changing his policy positions on a weekly basis, depending on who he was talking to at the time. Knowing his history isn't telling us very much; we still have no idea what he wants to do if elected.

I am sure Romney has a clear idea of what his presidency would be like. But he certainly isn't telling anyone. He just makes up a position on the spot whenever he meets someone new.

Shields and Brooks made it very clear; they are waiting for Romney to say something the voters don't want to hear. We know it is impossible to please everyone all of the time. So what defines a politician is the things he is not willing to do.
Simply hating Obama isn't enough, as all GOP candidates do that. Romney needs to honestly tell people what he can't deliver. What he is not willing to agree with.

[Demongod86]

I'd rather have a president with no convictions than a capital H Hypocrite like Newt or the religious zealot that is Santorum. While Romney has few convictions, I'm just wondering if he simply wants to get into office in order to do whatever it takes to get our economy blasting on all cylinders so that he could make more money after leaving office.

Somehow I doubt that what he's after is aligned with my interests

[Vexx]

I suspect he just wants to be president.... the agendas are being set by the hyper-donors to his campaign. Kind of a Bush, jr. v2.0

[ChainLegacy]

Originally Posted by Ledgem

C'mon, to affect positive change requires people to get their hands dirty. If/when you have children you should consider it, too.


I took three semesters of calculus and then differential equations (that which comes beyond calculus). I don't remember much from any of it, and I didn't feel that I had mastery of it at the time.

But there's good news: in biology, you don't need to worry about it (possible exception: bioinformatics). The highest-level math you "need" is statistics, or more appropriately, biostatistics (which is probably watered-down statistics... and I put "need" in quotes because I didn't encounter many people who understood statistics beyond what p-value they wanted). Math is important, but I wouldn't say that people should shut themselves out of science just because they're not getting it. At least, not biology and certain aspects of chemistry. Physics is another story.

Well with biology it's a bit different, but even then you still have some minor calculus with the Fitness equations.

I was more referring to physics, theoretical and engineering, science was a bad word choice.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Vexx

I suspect he just wants to be president.... the agendas are being set by the hyper-donors to his campaign. Kind of a Bush, jr. v2.0

The problem with that theory, is that it would mean he does not need to keep any of his campaign promises after he is elected. If all he wants is to be president, then he would have no more responsibilities after obtaining the position.

This would mean any and all GOP voters would be wasting their time voting for him. They might as well tick the boxes blindfolded, if they don't know what Romney will do as President.