Code Geass R2 - Episode 25 Discussion / Poll [END]

[Nogitsune]

Originally Posted by zalem

As far as we know, he is dead. Okouchi and Taniguchi have said so. The guidebook says so. IMHO, the anime is pretty clear on it even if some are in denial. That doesn't mean Sunrise can't bring him back....god knows they've done it before. But as of the moment, he is dead.

If the anime was clear on it, people wouldn't be in "denial".
On German boards, where the official statements haven't reached everyone yet, there are quite a few who feel that Lelouch being alive would ruin the ending for them, but at the same time agree that yes, the ending was open; which is why they usually won't jump anyone for seeing things differently.
Saying that everyone who views the ending as open is only fooling himself and "in denial" is a bit much.
And no one can tell me that there wasn't a single person amongst the staff members who saw this coming. After having Nunally see flashbacks when touching Lelouch's hand, and with C.C.'s little monolouge at the end, it was to be expected.
But yes, Lelouch's death has been confirmed.
And I don't see too many people here trying to convince anyone otherwise.

[zalem]

I said in my opinion it's pretty clear. I never found any of the so-called arguments for him being alive very convincing at all. The official statements only sealed things. *shrugs* But that's just my personal view on the ending. No point in arguing this anyway. It's a dead issue.

[SonOfHeaven]

I look at it in a simple way honestly. We all saw Lelouch get stabbed by a sword and he died on screen. There is no reason for me to believe he survived that. No evidence he received an Code other than fans gasping at straws about Charles or C.C giving it to him. I'll believe he's alive when Okouchi himself states other wise.

[dec4rhapsody]

Originally Posted by zalem

I read in a post elsewhere that that statement is not even from Sunrise themselves. Is this true?

Anyway, the problem with the article is that the (?) could have been inserted by the magazine to keep things ambiguous and not by Sunrise at all. In that new CG guidebook (which is official material and not some random magazine statement) they state numerous times Lelouch is dead and there are no question marks in it I assure you.

As far as we know, he is dead. Okouchi and Taniguchi have said so. The guidebook says so. IMHO, the anime is pretty clear on it even if some are in denial. That doesn't mean Sunrise can't bring him back....god knows they've done it before. But as of the moment, he is dead.

LOL, a friend told me that Fukuyama said on an Event that he and Mizushima (Rolo's VA) won't be in the last PD if it's after the epilogue...

[Akakishi]

Originally Posted by zalem

I said in my opinion it's pretty clear. I never found any of the so-called arguments for him being alive very convincing at all. The official statements only sealed things. *shrugs* But that's just my personal view on the ending. No point in arguing this anyway. It's a dead issue.

He's alive! Lelouchhhhhh-kun
To die so easily is inconsistent as he says, the emperor, which all hate within'd die
But him as a farmer (making origami for C.C as for his beloved sister who,
he knows she's in safety with the new Zero, his still? best friend alias Suzaku to protect her) may live on

& think about C.C.’s intonation voice at the end

imo, I hate this ending an ambiguous one (through all the statement, official stuff ...)


Just a personal beliving

(someone'd say ... [/denial mode] )

[linkinstreet]

officially he's dead. But if sunrise dare to pull one of their famous "ZOMG! Let's make monies by making him live" move, and it does not include Taniguchi or Okouchi, I won't be looking forward to it. The reason I wanted to watch Geass even BEFORE it was aired because the pair was behind the underrated but awesome adaptation of Planetes.
If they say Lelouch is dead, then for me he is dead.

[Nogitsune]

Originally Posted by zalem

I said in my opinion it's pretty clear.

And I wouldn't have said anything if you hadn't added "even if some are in denial".
So... you gave you opinion, I gave mine.
That's really all there is to it, because I agree that arguing about something like that would indeed be pointless.

Originally Posted by linkinstreet

officially he's dead. But if sunrise dare to pull one of their famous "ZOMG! Let's make monies by making him live" move, and it does not include Taniguchi or Okouchi, I won't be looking forward to it. The reason I wanted to watch Geass even BEFORE it was aired because the pair was behind the underrated but awesome adaptation of Planetes.
If they say Lelouch is dead, then for me he is dead.

Well, they could try to convince Taniguchi, since I've never seen him confirm anything personally.
Maybe he was the one who thought it was fun to make the fans jump each other in the first place? xD
Because I still can't believe that no one in the staff saw the wild theories coming.
...Or maybe I just overlooked something.
Oh well.

[zalem]

Originally Posted by SonOfHeaven

I look at it in a simple way honestly. We all saw Lelouch get stabbed by a sword and he died on screen. There is no reason for me to believe he survived that. No evidence he received an Code other than fans gasping at straws about Charles or C.C giving it to him. I'll believe he's alive when Okouchi himself states other wise.

Exactly. To be honest when I saw that ending it didn't even occur to me he was alive. Then I came here and there are people insisting he is alive and that all the 'evidence' was on their side, which really baffled me because the 'evidence' seemed to be primarily all conjecture. To me, it seemed like denial. Lulu is a beloved character and the romance plot was never resolved. I can see why people really want for him to be alive somehow.

I wouldn't be shocked if Sunrise pulled a Mu with Lelouch though. But I can't see Okouchi or Taniguchi supporting such a thing. They might possibly support something with a different cast though. Maybe. Though I thought Taniguchi was pretty much done with CG.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by zalem

Exactly. To be honest when I saw that ending it didn't even occur to me he was alive. Then I came here and there are people insisting he is alive and that all the 'evidence' was on their side, which really baffled me because the 'evidence' seemed to be primarily all conjecture. To me, it seemed like denial. Lulu is a beloved character and the romance plot was never resolved. I can see why people really want for him to be alive somehow.

I wouldn't be shocked if Sunrise pulled a Mu with Lelouch though. But I can't see Okouchi or Taniguchi supporting such a thing. They might possibly support something with a different cast though. Maybe. Though I thought Taniguchi was pretty much done with CG.

All I am going to say is this

EVERY SINGLE PERSON I HAVE MET THAT BELIEVES LELOUCH IS ALIVE SHIPS CC AND LELOUCH

In other words all they care about is having their precious ClCl to the detriment of the series.

Lelouch feels guilty about what he did? Who cares he's with C.C now
C.C has finally gotten over her past and can now step forward? Who cares she's with Lelouch now.

They are also state that they show "facts" like the scene where Nunnaly touches Lelouch while ignoring concrete facts like Okouchi and Sunrise stating his dead.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

All I am going to say is this

EVERY SINGLE PERSON I HAVE MET THAT BELIEVES LELOUCH IS ALIVE SHIPS CC AND LELOUCH

In other words all they care about is having their precious ClCl to the detriment of the series.

No need to shout it, and personally, I met people from every fanbases, even on Animesuki where the creator of the lelouch Lives club is a Kalulu fan.

So that's good for you but your little life is not the best source to do statistics.

[Akakishi]

oh yeah
you're right CK
it's state by okou-kami besides, he's god for CG
all people thinks lulu's alive are in deny, no hints concerning he's alive in the last turn
all proves that he's really dead

oh ck you're my god, you light me up!
I can see a/the morning, the sun tomorrow thanks to you my god

no one care about cc or if "she's with Lelouch now"
Normal, he's dead!
(you show some weakness in your believing here xD)

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

All I am going to say is this

EVERY SINGLE PERSON I HAVE MET THAT BELIEVES LELOUCH IS ALIVE SHIPS CC AND LELOUCH

In other words all they care about is having their precious ClCl to the detriment of the series.

Lelouch feels guilty about what he did? Who cares he's with C.C now
C.C has finally gotten over her past and can now step forward? Who cares she's with Lelouch now.

They are also state that they show "facts" like the scene where Nunnaly touches Lelouch while ignoring concrete facts like Okouchi and Sunrise stating his dead.

Someone could claim that the people that DO NOT THINK LELOUCH IS ALIVE IS ANYONE ELSE OTHER THAN CCXL fans. {again for NON-pairing possibilites} It is just not working anyway.

But the real point is, Lelouch is dead. Period.
Some people will always want to think that he is alive, be it for their pairing, either cause he was one of their fav chara blah blah
They obviously missed the bloodbath and the closed-dead-eyes and stuff. I do not know what else can show that someone is dead. Oh wait, the staff confirming he is dead. That happened as well? Yep. And some people still keep up with their illusion-belief. I say let them be.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Narona

No need to shout it, and personally, I met people from every fanbases, even on Animesuki where the creator of the lelouch Lives club is a Kalulu fan.

So that's good for you but your little life is not the best source to do statistics.

Oh that group

if they where true Lelouch is alive group than they would still be arguing that his alive, instead they have basically abandoned the entire forum to the Lelouch is dead group.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

Oh that group

if they where true Lelouch is alive group than they would still be arguing that his alive, instead they have basically abandoned the entire forum to the Lelouch is dead group.

Your statement was just wrong, that's all. The creator the group (and some other non cluclu fans like Youngde) still think about the possibility that lelouch could be alive. Don't try to spin it.

[zalem]

Originally Posted by Akakishi

oh yeah
you're right CK
it's state by okou-kami besides, he's god for CG
all people thinks lulu's alive are in deny, no hints concerning he's alive in the last turn
all proves that he's really dead

oh ck you're my god, you light me up!
I can see a/the morning, the sun tomorrow thanks to you my god

no one care about cc or if "she's with Lelouch now"
Normal, he's dead!
(you show some weakness in your believing here xD)

It's obvious you're being sarcastic to CK here, but I do want to know...you don't honestly still believe he is alive do you? Even after the release of the official guidebook and the clear statements by Okouchi and Sunrise? Just curious.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by zalem

It's obvious you're being sarcastic to CK here, but I do want to know...you don't honestly still believe he is alive do you? Even after the release of the official guidebook and the clear statements by Okouchi and Sunrise? Just curious.

Personally, I don't think anymore that he is alive, but honestly, what is the problem to let people believe what they want to believe?

I don't talk about Akakishi but about the general critiscism towards those who believes that he is alive.

Let people believe in that if they want, time will not stop, the earth will continue to spin, no puppy will be killed , if you do.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Narona

Personally, I don't think anymore that he is alive, but honestly, what is the problem to let people believe what they want to believe?

I don't talk about Akakishi but about the general critiscism towards those who believes that he is alive.

Let people believe in that if they want, time will not stop, the earth will continue to spin, no puppy will be killed , if you do.

The general criticism is because they are clearly in denial. I mean when Okouchi the guy who wrote that scene states that Lelouch is dead, than I don't understand how you can possibly state that Lelouch is alive.

When I mean the lelouch is alive fanbase I don't mean people like you who want Lelouch to be alive, I mean people who come up with crazy ideas like how Okouchi is lying to test the faithful, or who cares what Okouchi has to say. To them Lelouch being alive isn't a manner of opinion its a matter of fact.

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

The general criticism is because they are clearly in denial. I mean when Okouchi the guy who wrote that scene states that Lelouch is dead, than I don't understand how you can possibly state that Lelouch is alive.

When I mean the lelouch is alive fanbase I don't mean people like you who want Lelouch to be alive, I mean people who come up with crazy ideas like how Okouchi is lying to test the faithful, or who cares what Okouchi has to say. To them Lelouch being alive isn't a manner of opinion its a matter of fact.

Well, the way you said it now, you are absolutely right.
You can't dismiss facts that have been said directly from the staff. {that was dead-obvious in the series as well but still}

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

The general criticism is because they are clearly in denial. I mean when Okouchi the guy who wrote that scene states that Lelouch is dead, than I don't understand how you can possibly state that Lelouch is alive.

When I mean the lelouch is alive fanbase I don't mean people like you who want Lelouch to be alive, I mean people who come up with crazy ideas like how Okouchi is lying to test the faithful, or who cares what Okouchi has to say. To them Lelouch being alive isn't a manner of opinion its a matter of fact.

And what? Are you a masochist? If they want to believe in that, just let it be. You can grumble all you want but some people will not stop, so just let it be or blacklist the people you dislike, so you will not have to read their posts.

I never said that. I even promoted the idea to create a new Code Geass series with a new hero.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Narona

And what? Are you a masochist? If they want to believe in that, just let it be. You can grumble all you want but some people will not stop, so just let it be or blacklist the people you dislike, so you will not have to read their posts.

I never said that. I even promoted the idea to create a new Code Geass series with a new hero.

Your a member of Lelouch is alive group here are you not? Why would you be member if you didn't want Lelouch to be alive.