AnimeSuki Forums

HandofFate · 2020-10-17, 13:14

I guess she's adopting a non-interference policy much like Kino, since she's a traveler, she doesn't want to meddle in affairs as an outsider. I feel she could have still just burned the flower field down though.

2nd story, I understand why she didn't interfere. Its not really her business. I think Witches are held to a higher standard too, they're obviously very powerful, but people don't seem to fear them. So I think them using their magic on harm is strictly forbidden unless self-defense or something.

BBOvenGuy · 2020-10-17, 15:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by HandofFate

I think Witches are held to a higher standard too, they're obviously very powerful, but people don't seem to fear them. So I think them using their magic on harm is strictly forbidden unless self-defense or something.

Well, when Elaina brought out her wand to clean up the broken pitcher, she first pointed it at the village chief, who was looking at her nervously. Then he relaxed visibly when all she did was fix the pitcher. It was pretty clear to me that he was afraid of getting his butt kicked.

mangamuscle · 2020-10-17, 17:26

Since no one has done an analogy about the zombie flower story & air transmitted infectious diseases I will. Neither can travel by themselves, they trick humans to carry them to new locations. Elaine was lucky that she was part of the population segment that do not seem to be affected by the disease. "But hey, the people at the towns gate should have known better!", yeah, we are in the 21st century and we know so well how to stop a deadly air transmitted disease on its tracks /sarcasm.

So, anyone wanting Elaine to take some responsibility should advocate some new laws to hold people accountable for unknowingly bringing covid19 to their communities, maybe death by immolation would be adequate?
-------------------------------------------
About the slave story, I would be surprised if she doesn't ends killing the village head honcho before killing herself, the son means well but he is an idiot. I do not have a facebook account for exactly the same reasons it was a bad idea to show the slave girl how everybody (whether she knows them or not) is happier than she will ever be.

MeoTwister5 · 2020-10-18, 07:46

Both stories really just show that the road to hell is sometimes paved with good intentions.

Wandering Soul · 2020-10-18, 15:18

Not all of these stories are going to end happily as these stories show. Elaine is ultimately a drifter and doesn't really get involved in things that don't immediately concern her. To her credit, a part of her did want to intervene on behalf of that girl.

Decel · 2020-10-19, 20:30

I think some are forgetting the context: the father bought the girl from a slave trader. Therefore, slaves are legit and she's technically someone's property. I wouldn't be surprised that Elaina would have been committing a crime had she interfered (I'm just speculating here, not enough details to confirm/infirm).

The whole world itself seem to have a class system. Elaina herself wasn't given the time of day (and repeatedly refused lodging) when she lost her brooch and thus status as a mage last episode.

Also, in the first story, the town doesn't seem to have any mages of their own or else I believe that a resident mage would have tried to take care of that field. Mages must be rather rare and have high status. I haven't seen a character that pulled any form of authority on her (as an identified mage) so far, though maybe it will come.

Rasty · 2020-10-20, 16:12

Urgh, I got pretty decevied by the art and first episode. I guess lots of people will like this and it might even become a new hype of "good tase" anime, but it's not to my taste. I just don't feel like watching story about miserable people being miserable, scumbags getting away with it, and the ones who care and can do something about it doing nothing. Yep, it is realistic, but is there really a need for fantasy of all genres to be so realistic?

Kanon · 2020-10-20, 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rasty

Urgh, I got pretty decevied by the art and first episode. I guess lots of people will like this and it might even become a new hype of "good tase" anime, but it's not to my taste. I just don't feel like watching story about miserable people being miserable, scumbags getting away with it, and the ones who care and can do something about it doing nothing. Yep, it is realistic, but is there really a need for fantasy of all genres to be so realistic?

It's not like every story is like that. I don't know what the ratio is though.

Blueknight78 · 2020-10-20, 20:04

yeah to be fair not everyone episode will be 'sad" following the manga they even "skipped some chapters", the "flower chapter was cut a "lot" , after the flower one we have others 2 diferent chapters, but i feel which since the anime is more "episodic" then they just changed the order and we gonna still see what they skipped.

Another note while i told which she "normally avoid" do things, it's not like she aways do that, she sometimes will "help" as long it is not "too risk/dangerous for her" and peoples "ask her" and it don't put her in trouble specially with the "local law, for exemple the slave girl, she could had attacked and even killed the guy but it could had lead to 2 issues:

1 - have the son goes "nutes" after see his father which even if he was a scum, the son was not still able to understand it and could see it as a bad action from her and want a revenge or go to the local laws and have elaine in troubles, it could be really bad for her.

2 - he was a "rich guy and as all the rich guys in that time and world have some "power" and importance then kill him because of a "slave" would be see as a crime and be a problem not only for her but for the "witches" in general it could be saw by the peoples as a "witch action" not just elaine, bot all the witches could be in trouble because of her.

this is why she hold herself, another stuff is which elaine again elaines mother told her to be really carefull with her action and since elaine while still have a heart and can want to help pepples she still stoic and calculist" and only do things again based on her judgment which again is based on "risk and reward", if somene ask her for help and it not put her in trouble and give her a "good reward" she will help, otherwise she will act very caution and measure if the "down side and risk are not something to pull her in big trouble, also again if the trouble goes "for her' like her brouch being stolen, then she will act

While normally she will avoid do anything in most of the times, if is really something she can't avoid then she will act or at lat the "reward" is good enough to pay for the risk then she act and by reward i'm not talking just about "gold"(but not gonna lie she really like being payed and have much money).

In the end she is just following what her mother told her to do as she had promised.

she is neither a "hero" or even anti-hero, look her more like a sort of "mercenary", only doing something when she really see it's necessary otherwise she really just go away.

AC-Phoenix · 2020-10-21, 15:28

I wonder whether the girl Elaina taught a few episodes ago will eventually become her apprentice. We only saw her pass the exam, but we never heard about her getting a teacher in the end, and she is on the cover art...

serenade_beta · 2020-10-23, 13:04

Spoiler for ep4:

Kazu-kun · 2020-10-23, 13:41

Great episode. People who can't stand Elaina is not a heroic character probably shouldn't watch this show. All the misplaced criticism is getting old. You people only have your expectations to blame. The show is just fine for what it is.

grecefar · 2020-10-23, 13:42

I only thought that witches magic in this anime is amazing, the teacher battle and this one were great showcase of magic and pretty lights.

Blueknight78 · 2020-10-23, 13:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by serenade_beta

Spoiler for ep4:

well again to be fair she have her own "moral code" and standarts about "what she can do or not, which is not exactly what we are expectated and the lack of more "info" also don't help, again in the girl slave case she clear could do nothing because "slavery on that time and world was acceptable", the lord was doing "nothing wrong" according to the local laws, the girl was his "slave" which means he could do anything he wants, if elaine did something it could be a big trouble for her and not only for her but also for magicians in general, they must follow the rules too, no matter how must "disgusting" the situation is she could not do anything without have a payback.

as i told this episode show how she works, she normally only helps if she receives any sort of proper "reward" not necessary money", or if she really feel which she can do it with minimal "negative effects" like helping from the shadows, if she feel which it not gonna bring her troubles or put her in a big danger then she will help if she feels it's diserver her help without any "reward", otherwise she will ask for a "payment", just see her as a "mercenary" which normally only do "payed jobs but sometimes can help for "free" and good will if she "feel it's safe enough or is something which is really bothering her.

while at first she refused to help in the battle she helped in create the trap, don't say which she "did nothing" she helped, she just at first not was willing to risk her life as her mother asked her, but in the end after the other woman give her the shelter and food, she feel in debt and goes to help but in the end it was not needed since the woman alone was "strong" and really strong, to do alone.

they seen to focus on the most "tragic" and sad tales, and skiped some of the "less tragic", they are really going full kirino route, because elaine have both "sad/dark tales but also some "funy ones".

Marina2 · 2020-10-23, 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by serenade_beta

Spoiler for ep4:

Hmm??? any author will make plot details convenience to the story. "X need to happen in order for Y to happen" That's the basic.

About the cost, I think it's a fair price. Losing your own memory also means you lost yourself and became someone else. No one will dumb enough to cast any magic with negative effect toward user if it's the exact 1:1 price of what they done .

Elena acts base on what she interests/wants to do. You can say she chooses who she want to help - not everyone. The show actually gave out enough reason why should Elena cares this time. Maybe the story of that woman interests her as a fellow witch? or Maybe she just want to returns the favor? Anyway, in the end, she just left everything behind and continue her journey as usual - There is no contradiction in her action.

At least we know she is not a completely heartless person.

Kanon · 2020-10-23, 18:51

Ok, I was not expecting an episode even darker than last week's so soon

What Milarose did was incredibly messed up. It was a great story, except for one thing: if she's that powerful a witch, why not run away with her lover after he was sentenced to death? It makes no sense.

Nachtwandler · 2020-10-23, 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanon

Ok, I was not expecting an episode even darker than last week's so soon

What Milarose did was incredibly messed up. It was a great story, except for one thing: if she's that powerful a witch, why not run away with her lover after he was sentenced to death? It makes no sense.

You know, the kings decision is even more stupid. If he knew his daughter is a powerfull witch, why the hell he provoked her?

I can only presume that she became powerfull after that events.

arkhangelsk · 2020-10-23, 20:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nachtwandler

You know, the kings decision is even more stupid. If he knew his daughter is a powerfull witch, why the hell he provoked her?

I can only presume that she became powerfull after that events.

If you have a medieval mindset, then from his point of view he has to deal with the "threat" of some commoner contaminating the "royal bloodline", even if it risks pissing off his daughter. You can't base all human interactions on the possibility your offense to someone will get you killed.

Endscape · 2020-10-23, 20:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by arkhangelsk

You can't base all human interactions on the possibility your offense to someone will get you killed.

You can when the other party is a super powerful witch.

Kazu-kun · 2020-10-23, 20:21

But he's a king. A king would be convinced of his own authority, even when dealing with witches. After all, If witches didn't obey governmental authority, they would be seen as revels. Contrary to that, the treatment they receive suggests they usually don't use their powers to go against the law.

He probably never even thought about the possibility of this witch (who also happened to be his daughter) reveling against him. That might seem irrational to us, but from the point of view of a medieval king who is totally convinced he's the one who calls the shots, it's perfectly understandable.

2020-10-17, 13:14	Link #81
HandofFate Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006	I guess she's adopting a non-interference policy much like Kino, since she's a traveler, she doesn't want to meddle in affairs as an outsider. I feel she could have still just burned the flower field down though. 2nd story, I understand why she didn't interfere. Its not really her business. I think Witches are held to a higher standard too, they're obviously very powerful, but people don't seem to fear them. So I think them using their magic on harm is strictly forbidden unless self-defense or something. __________________ ...

2020-10-18, 07:46	Link #84
MeoTwister5 Komrades of Kitamura Kou Join Date: Jul 2004 Age: 39	Both stories really just show that the road to hell is sometimes paved with good intentions. __________________ Medical Student vs. Anime Last Exile - Fam the Silver Wing -

2020-10-18, 15:18	Link #85
Wandering Soul Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: America	Not all of these stories are going to end happily as these stories show. Elaine is ultimately a drifter and doesn't really get involved in things that don't immediately concern her. To her credit, a part of her did want to intervene on behalf of that girl. __________________

2020-10-19, 20:30	Link #86
Decel Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Canada	I think some are forgetting the context: the father bought the girl from a slave trader. Therefore, slaves are legit and she's technically someone's property. I wouldn't be surprised that Elaina would have been committing a crime had she interfered (I'm just speculating here, not enough details to confirm/infirm). The whole world itself seem to have a class system. Elaina herself wasn't given the time of day (and repeatedly refused lodging) when she lost her brooch and thus status as a mage last episode. Also, in the first story, the town doesn't seem to have any mages of their own or else I believe that a resident mage would have tried to take care of that field. Mages must be rather rare and have high status. I haven't seen a character that pulled any form of authority on her (as an identified mage) so far, though maybe it will come. __________________ 2006- The year of the invasion of the Suzumiya Haruhi avatars and signature logos

2020-10-20, 20:04	Link #89
Blueknight78 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2014	yeah to be fair not everyone episode will be 'sad" following the manga they even "skipped some chapters", the "flower chapter was cut a "lot" , after the flower one we have others 2 diferent chapters, but i feel which since the anime is more "episodic" then they just changed the order and we gonna still see what they skipped. Another note while i told which she "normally avoid" do things, it's not like she aways do that, she sometimes will "help" as long it is not "too risk/dangerous for her" and peoples "ask her" and it don't put her in trouble specially with the "local law, for exemple the slave girl, she could had attacked and even killed the guy but it could had lead to 2 issues: 1 - have the son goes "nutes" after see his father which even if he was a scum, the son was not still able to understand it and could see it as a bad action from her and want a revenge or go to the local laws and have elaine in troubles, it could be really bad for her. 2 - he was a "rich guy and as all the rich guys in that time and world have some "power" and importance then kill him because of a "slave" would be see as a crime and be a problem not only for her but for the "witches" in general it could be saw by the peoples as a "witch action" not just elaine, bot all the witches could be in trouble because of her. this is why she hold herself, another stuff is which elaine again elaines mother told her to be really carefull with her action and since elaine while still have a heart and can want to help pepples she still stoic and calculist" and only do things again based on her judgment which again is based on "risk and reward", if somene ask her for help and it not put her in trouble and give her a "good reward" she will help, otherwise she will act very caution and measure if the "down side and risk are not something to pull her in big trouble, also again if the trouble goes "for her' like her brouch being stolen, then she will act While normally she will avoid do anything in most of the times, if is really something she can't avoid then she will act or at lat the "reward" is good enough to pay for the risk then she act and by reward i'm not talking just about "gold"(but not gonna lie she really like being payed and have much money). In the end she is just following what her mother told her to do as she had promised. she is neither a "hero" or even anti-hero, look her more like a sort of "mercenary", only doing something when she really see it's necessary otherwise she really just go away. __________________ Last edited by Blueknight78; 2020-10-20 at 20:29.

2020-10-17, 17:26	Link #83
mangamuscle formerly ogon bat Join Date: May 2011 Location: Mexico Age: 53	Since no one has done an analogy about the zombie flower story & air transmitted infectious diseases I will. Neither can travel by themselves, they trick humans to carry them to new locations. Elaine was lucky that she was part of the population segment that do not seem to be affected by the disease. "But hey, the people at the towns gate should have known better!", yeah, we are in the 21st century and we know so well how to stop a deadly air transmitted disease on its tracks /sarcasm. So, anyone wanting Elaine to take some responsibility should advocate some new laws to hold people accountable for unknowingly bringing covid19 to their communities, maybe death by immolation would be adequate? ------------------------------------------- About the slave story, I would be surprised if she doesn't ends killing the village head honcho before killing herself, the son means well but he is an idiot. I do not have a facebook account for exactly the same reasons it was a bad idea to show the slave girl how everybody (whether she knows them or not) is happier than she will ever be.

2020-10-20, 16:12	Link #87
Rasty Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015	Urgh, I got pretty decevied by the art and first episode. I guess lots of people will like this and it might even become a new hype of "good tase" anime, but it's not to my taste. I just don't feel like watching story about miserable people being miserable, scumbags getting away with it, and the ones who care and can do something about it doing nothing. Yep, it is realistic, but is there really a need for fantasy of all genres to be so realistic?

2020-10-21, 15:28	Link #90
AC-Phoenix Detective Join Date: Aug 2010 Age: 36	I wonder whether the girl Elaina taught a few episodes ago will eventually become her apprentice. We only saw her pass the exam, but we never heard about her getting a teacher in the end, and she is on the cover art... __________________ Those who forget about the past are condemned to repeat it - Santayana Sidenote: I'm seemingly too dumb for my current keyboard, so if you see the same character twice in a row, when it doesn't belong there just ignore it.

2020-10-23, 13:04	Link #91
serenade_beta そのおっぱいで13才 Join Date: Dec 2006	Spoiler for ep4: Lolol, what? The price of turning someone into a monster is to lose your own memories?! You don't lose an arm for an arm or anything, they turn into a monster and you lose your memories? Damn gotta love how these magics are all so convenient to the story. Anyways, while the story is bad, I do find it funny that the derogatory name "Ikiri Majo Hanako" is starting to spread in the JP community. Come to think of it, there are all these Narou Tarous, but there hasn't been any female protagonist that has been hated enough to be given such a name up until now. Oh, and: -Why does no one care she just burned down the door? -Despite being given shelter and food, why does she not give a s* about helping her? -Why does she suddenly want to help her despite not giving a s* about the previous episode's characters? The answer: BeCaUsE sHe'S a TrAvElEr! Yeah? The magic phrase? I mean, it's better than she's a racist (bigot?) that only saves witches! __________________ -Blog --> http://tdnshumi.blogspot.com/ (Mainly about video games) -R.I.P. Hiroshi Yamauchi, Gaming wouldn't have been the same without you (9/19/13) Last edited by serenade_beta; 2020-10-23 at 13:21.

2020-10-23, 13:41	Link #92
Kazu-kun Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2006	Great episode. People who can't stand Elaina is not a heroic character probably shouldn't watch this show. All the misplaced criticism is getting old. You people only have your expectations to blame. The show is just fine for what it is. __________________

2020-10-23, 13:42	Link #93
grecefar Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Blue Notes Blues	I only thought that witches magic in this anime is amazing, the teacher battle and this one were great showcase of magic and pretty lights.

2020-10-23, 18:51	Link #96
Kanon Kana Hanazawa ♥ Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: France Age: 37	Ok, I was not expecting an episode even darker than last week's so soon What Milarose did was incredibly messed up. It was a great story, except for one thing: if she's that powerful a witch, why not run away with her lover after he was sentenced to death? It makes no sense. __________________

2020-10-23, 20:21	Link #100
Kazu-kun Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2006	But he's a king. A king would be convinced of his own authority, even when dealing with witches. After all, If witches didn't obey governmental authority, they would be seen as revels. Contrary to that, the treatment they receive suggests they usually don't use their powers to go against the law. He probably never even thought about the possibility of this witch (who also happened to be his daughter) reveling against him. That might seem irrational to us, but from the point of view of a medieval king who is totally convinced he's the one who calls the shots, it's perfectly understandable. __________________