Misconception of Mecha anime

[Guernsey]

I am not a mecha fan but I use to beelieve that unless you are a hot blooded hero or even remotely awesome, you cannot be a pilot. To most non fans, the mecha anime is almost always about the robot fights, hot blood and explosion but not I am wiser, I realize that mecha is more than that even if it included all of these elements. I just want some more clarity on mecha whether it would be super or real robot, I admit my knowledge is limited but I from I had seen I realize that there is more mecha than what I hear from its fans.

[GreatTeacherKen]

So from my understanding of your post, you want an explanation on the difference between Super Robot and Real Robot?

Super Robot- Series like this are are on the soft side of science fiction as they're more likely to ignore things like physics in favor of what looks cool. They also have transformation sequences with mechs combining to form a bigger mech. The mechas are at times even sentient, are often powered by the pilot's sheer hot blood who often call out their attacks, and in some series the mechs can be summoned at will. Most mechas will be bipedal, human shaped, and often enormous. If they aren't big at first, they will be by the end of the series or after combining.

Examples:

Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann
Mazinger Z- more or less defined the genre
Gao Gai Gar
Giant Robo
G Gundam (anomaly in the Gundam franchise)


Real robot- Real Robot series aren't necessarily 100% realistic, but they're generally less over the top and pay more attention to physics so they're closer to the hard side of science fiction. The mechs are not powered by the pilot's hot blood or anything supernatural and are more like real life vehicles/ military hardware with limitations. There's also less hot blooded yelling and it's pretty common for such series to have a War is Hell theme. In some series, the mechs aren't human shaped or bipedal at all.

Examples:
Most Gundam series, G Gundam is a major exception. The original Gundam series pretty much defined the genre.
Full Metal Panic
Patlabor
Armored Trooper Votoms
Gasaraki


It is possible for series to blur the line between Real Robot and Super Robot. Some Real Robot series start off with relatively unimpressive mass produced mechs, but as the story goes on, increasingly powerful mechs are introduced to the point that the climactic moments of the series would not be out of place in a Super Robot series.

[HasuMasu]

It is possible for series to blur the line between Real Robot and Super Robot. Some Real Robot series start off with relatively unimpressive mass produced mechs, but as the story goes on, increasingly powerful mechs are introduced to the point that the climactic moments of the series would not be out of place in a Super Robot series.

reminds me of code geass

[Goblinator]

The super robot term was a marketing term that first appeared in Mazinger Z's opening. It was used to differentiate itself from the likes of Tetsujin 28th with its super weapons. In 1979, Gundam came and changed things around a bit and was called a real robot by the fans to differentiate it from Mazinger Z and the rest. It's not the 70s and 80s anymore and they are obsolete in the modern age. These terms should be dropped in favor of more sensible ways to describe shows like superpower, romance, mystery etc...

Also, how would you describe Giant Robo? It doesn't have super weapons, but it appeared before Mazinger Z. This is why these terms are useless outside of srw.

are often powered by the pilot's sheer hot blood

Completely false. Here's the problem, people do not actually watch 70s mecha and believe that super robots were all like gaogaigar and gurren lagann. This is again why I'm against the use of these terms to describe shows.

[ahelo]

Well there's two genres. The Gurren Laggan type or the Code Geass type. The super robot series probably land on GL while realistic ones land in Code Geass. Though if you're expectin realism anyway, you probably won't get it from a lot of mechas.

[wontaek]

A key measure to look for is how effective non-humanoid-mecha weapons are in fighting against humanoid-mecha that looks similar to those driven by the main characters. More realistic the series, more it will pay 'lip service' to tanks and fighter-planes being able to destroy mecha in mass battle situation. Take a look at Gundam Igloo Gravity Front series where you see infantry units and tanks destroying mobile suits. There are series like that, and then there are series like Gurenn Lagann. Many fall somewhere in between, while few are just magical.

[Revan21]

I agree that you don't have to be a mecha-fan to enjoy a mecha series. The best example for this is FMP where the mecha fights only make up a small part of the overall events while the larger part is a simple school-life comedy. It's still considered a 'mecha-anime', yet many people can enjoy it because it has colorful characters and great comedy to make up for the 'uninteresting fights'
Even Gundam series can be watched without being a devoted a mecha fan. I've seen every Gundam (and all the Macross) series and liked most of them but not because of the various mecha designs and all the frame-repeating fights. I was interested in the political anti-war stories and the fate of the characters, who many times suffered a gruesome death by the end. I remember every major character from all the series and their fate, but don't ever ask me about the Gundams. I probably couldn't tell which is which, who was piloting it, which series did it come from or what happened to it at the end - because I don't care about the 'simple tools of war'

So yeah, I can consider myself a mecha-anime fan, who's not particularly a mecha-fan

[Isegrim]

Originally Posted by Goblinator

The super robot term was a marketing term that first appeared in Mazinger Z's opening.

That's no entirely true - it was first used in Kazumasa Hirai's manga "8 Man", which started serialization in 1963. The 1967 Tokusatsu series "Ultra Seven" had the robot King Joe, called "the super robot of the people from planet Petan". The differentiation between super and real robots didn't pop up until the first SRW was released in 1991.

[Guernsey]

Well, I hope that the 70s and 80s weren't all awesoem and hot blood as some fans say.

[DonQuigleone]

Another important point of difference between the two is the type of plot contained in the show.

Super Robot tends to be straight good vs. evil, it's a lot like a conventional shonen action show, but with robots instead of ninjas or pirates. They also tend to use an "enemy of the week" format, IE every week a new villainous monster or mecha is introduced and the heroes have to save the day and destroy it.

Real Robot tends to go for a more "warring states" type plot, and have more ambiguous morality. They tend to use a plot along the lines of Romance of the Three Kingdoms. There is not usually any big good or evil, though sometimes one comes in towards the end, or individuals may be of dubious morality. In this sense they have a big overlap with Space Opera. Gundam or Macross both are along these lines. Legend of the Galactic Heroes is basically a more complicated Real Robot show, but without the Robots.

In both cases, however, a lot of attention is payed to the mecha themselves. They are the hook to get the audience watching, and they drive the action scenes which prevent the overall plot from becoming stale.

I personally prefer Real Robot, and it must be said that very often Real Robot becomes a frankensteinian hybrid of many different influences. Intrigue/thriller type plots, War movie emphasis on war being hell, conventional super robot feats of skill and action.

It's one of a few genres that is unique to anime. No direct equivalent can be found outside it, though you can find anticidents.

[mecharobot]

One thing that you will also most likely find in SR shows are the attacks. People will yell their attacks like FIRE BLASTER, ROCKET PUNCH and GIGA DRILL BREAKER, but that's very rare in real robot shows, although I've seen it used a few times as a joke mostly.

[Ithekro]

Super robot shows tend to focus one one giant robat, or a team that forms a giant robat. Real robot shows have lots of potentially mass produced robots (assuming the plot doesn't block production somehow or this happens to be the prototype only).

Take Full Metal Panic for examplem. The M9 is the new mass produced combat mech. The Lamba Diver equipped mech is a prototype that would have been mass produced as well if the creator hadn't killed herself.

But there is no mass produced Voltron robot.

[Bri]

Originally Posted by DonQuigleone

Another important point of difference between the two is the type of plot contained in the show.

Super Robot tends to be straight good vs. evil, it's a lot like a conventional shonen action show, but with robots instead of ninjas or pirates. They also tend to use an "enemy of the week" format, IE every week a new villainous monster or mecha is introduced and the heroes have to save the day and destroy it.

Real Robot tends to go for a more "warring states" type plot, and have more ambiguous morality. They tend to use a plot along the lines of Romance of the Three Kingdoms. There is not usually any big good or evil, though sometimes one comes in towards the end, or individuals may be of dubious morality. In this sense they have a big overlap with Space Opera. Gundam or Macross both are along these lines. Legend of the Galactic Heroes is basically a more complicated Real Robot show, but without the Robots.

In both cases, however, a lot of attention is payed to the mecha themselves. They are the hook to get the audience watching, and they drive the action scenes which prevent the overall plot from becoming stale.

I personally prefer Real Robot, and it must be said that very often Real Robot becomes a frankensteinian hybrid of many different influences. Intrigue/thriller type plots, War movie emphasis on war being hell, conventional super robot feats of skill and action.

It's one of a few genres that is unique to anime. No direct equivalent can be found outside it, though you can find anticidents.

Nothing personal, but this is a nice example of the oversimplified real robot versus super robot discussion in a nutshell.

First of all mecha, just like moe, is a theme not a genre. Simply put, you need a giant robot (not even necessarily that big or a machine) present in an anime to classify it as a mecha, same as you need a cute girl (not necessarily female or human) for an anime to be called moe. It doesn’t say much about the rest of the content. Mecha can be found in any anime genre: action, comedy, drama, erotica, fantasy, psychological, romance, scifi, supernatural, thriller etc.


As for Super robot versus Real robot, this distinction was made popular by SRW games to classify mecha for game stats. This difference has been a complete pain in the mecha fandom as uninformed elitists often start arguments on the supposedly superior and more complex storytelling in real robot. The good versus evil, enemy of the week style originates from the popular 1970s Go Nagai children’s shows, they are not inherently super robot. That is why they resemble modern shonen titles, because they are both primarily aimed at young kids. Many modern mecha anime pay tribute to those 1970s shows but are far more sophisticated. Even in the 70s Tomino already worked on somewhat darker, more complicated super robot shows like Brave Raideen, Voltes V and Zambot 3 before starting on MS Gundam. Don't forget that during the 80s the majority of mecha was still super robot and varied from simple shonen material to OVA like Gunbuster aimed at otaku.

In the narrow sense of the definition, a real robot is just a machine, while a super robot has some kind of special powers which may or may not be derived from the pilot. Anything else is tagged on. Compare it to the traditional definition of a tsundere, who goes from harsh to caring over time towards her love interest. They can be bipolar, abusive, have twin tails etc. but they don’t have to.
MS Gundam and SDF Macross have serious “warring states type plots” with politics, factions and drama because they are space operas, not because they are real robot. Macross 7 is every bit as real robot as the other two but runs with the tropes often associated with super robot shows. Patlabor another famous real robot show is a slice of life comedy. In comparison you have dark and gritty super robot anime like Raxhephon or Ideon.


More important than the division between super and real robot, is to consider for what audience a mecha anime has been made. Mecha traditionally either targeted kids or kids mixed with older teens/young adults. Not surprising as sponsors are predominantly toy companies. This hasn’t really changed after the arrival of late-night-anime. Daytime shows like Seed and Seed Destiny, Gurren Lagan, Eureka 7 and Star Driver are still the norm. Mecha for the most part hasn’t been too successful in the character centric otaku market and the number of shows has declined rapidly last few years. The few late night mecha that have been successful managed to please multiple audiences, like Macross Frontier, Code Geass (S1), Strike Witches and Infinite Stratos.

In recent years we have seen a number of OVA that exclusively target mecha fans like Gundam Unicorn and IGLOO, Votoms Pilsen Files, Macross Zero, Mazinkaiser and Broken Blade. These anime mostly ignore modern anime tropes and feel like updated versions of pre-Eva anime. It makes me wonder how far the mecha anime and late night/otaku anime fanbases still overlap.

[GreatTeacherKen]

Originally Posted by Guernsey

Well, I hope that the 70s and 80s weren't all awesoem and hot blood as some fans say.

Some of the examples I gave for real robot came out in the 70s and 80s. The original Mobile Suit Gundam is credited as the first 'real robot' series and came out 1979. Armored Trooper Votoms premiered in 1983. Patlabor came out in 1988.

In short, the difference between Super Robot and Real Robot mostly comes down to the way the mechs are presented. As Bri pointed out, it's still possible for series with Super Robots to be very dark (Zambot 3 being a good example of this) and for the latter to be very over the top and theatrical (Code Geass, Macross 7).

[Random32]

In super robot, mecha are treated like super heroes. Think TTGL.

In real robot, mecha are treated like tanks, fighter jets, etc military hardware. Think Gundam.

Neither tends to respect science that well with square cube law and all that, nor do they represent good designs for combat vehicles, the first example of this that I can think of being ATST's in Star Wars ep6.

[synaesthetic]

Gundam hasn't been Real Robot since The 08th MS Team.

The first season of Code Geass was more Real Robot than the last few major Gundam series.

Want some Real Robot? Watch FLAG, watch Armored Trooper VOTOMS, watch Patlabor. Play BattleTech and Front Mission games.

[C.A.]

Good to see that everyone is using 'hot blood' instead of 'GAR', no mecha fan should ever use the word 'GAR' to describe mecha anime. From the beginning, it has always been 'Nekketsu/ hot-bloodedness', the term to describe the will and passion of a mecha pilot that drives him to overcome all odds.

Seeing that most people have already described Super and Real Robots by the mecha itself, this is how I break down the line between Super and Real Robots using the context of the story:


The Story and the Setting:

Is the story about problems within the human society? About war and politics? Or is the story about the human world being invaded by extraterrestrial or even supernatural forces?

Is it set in a world very much like ours, with nations and politics established or an unfamiliar world with mysterious energy sources and supernatural phenomenon?

Real, realistic or Super, supernatural?

The Characters:

A realistic cast of characters would be made up of normal humans, sometimes students, sometimes civilians. But almost every time, the main character who acquired the mecha will be pulled into a military or armed force. These characters will have to follow rules of the military and the society, the will face problems that we may encounter in real life.

A super robot cast can still be made up of normal humans, but they will be thrown into extraordinary circumstances that are beyond human control. They will face problems that are not realistic, invasion by beings from a parallel universe within the earths core, ancient demons from outer space etc. Most likely we will find that if not the main character, at least one other character would not even be human.

How the Message is told to the audience:

The Message of the story, people often overlook this, the story is not the message and vice versa.

The message can be simple: "Courage/ Love/ Determination/ Trust overcomes all".

Or it can be less simple: "Do not beg, win it. And you shall be granted."

The producers can choose how they want to tell the message, it doesn't matter whether the message itself is simple or not.

We can have a love story of a mecha pilot and his lover torn apart by war between nations and the message is 'love overcomes all.' We can also have the same message from a story about a time traveling mecha pilot who falls in love with a princess from Jupiter.

---------------------

By examining the context of the story as demonstrated above, we can tell if the mecha story is leaning to more Real or Super. Especially for modern mecha anime, the line between Super and Reals have become a blur, we will have to examine the story this way to tell.

Do I have to talk about the mecha itself to determine whether it is super or real? No its not always the case, it is the context of the story itself that determines whether the mecha is super or real, not the mecha itself.

Of course one can clearly see how much Mazinger, Getter, Gaogaigar and Gurren Lagann are super robots. Real robots are harder to tell because mecha itself is very unrealistic, a Real robot can only try to be as real as possible. Votoms and Patlabor are probably the most realistic Reals.

[Nightbat®]

I never put 'Mecha' at equal definition as Super/Real robot shows

Mecha translates to me as 'hardware'

Mecha anime does not need to contain Giant robots to qualify as such, but it's gonna be pretty hard to make an anime about superrobots NOT contain mecha