Claymore Chapter 116

[Shiek927]

Originally Posted by Korinov

Shieky man, stop posting while drunk

If both of them were #1s at the moment of their deaths, it's more or less implied that Roxanne wasn't #1 when she struck the killing blow at Cassandra, but after that she eventually got the 'job'. What we don't know it's if she was #2 by that time and ascended right to #1 after slaying Cass (I'd bet my money on that) or she wasn't such a high number yet and got the #1 later.

Anyway, people are already speculating about Roxanne plotting everything against Cass to get her position... and I wouldn't rule out the possibility.

You know, it felt like a stupid question, but I wanted to ask it anyway

But that's what I meant - 'how' is it that both of them were No.1's. It could be that, even though they were "of the same era" like Roxanne said, Roxanne rebelled much earlier on, and then Cassandra took her spot and went to kill her....much like Teresa and the Slayers, except with much more time in-between.

On the other hand, Roxanne says "I was the one who dealt the finishing blow when you were all cut up" -- you can interpret that last bit in that it was Cassandra who rebelled and Roxanne was sent with others to kill her, and Roxanne finished her off.....or, in that Cassandra went with the team to kill Roxanne who rebelled, and Roxanne basically mutilated her before finishing her off.

Since they were both No.1's, we can assume one of them rebelled at one point; the events are still unknown, but we at least know it was Roxanne who killed Cassandra....considering Roxanne's personality, it feels all the more likely that it was Roxanne who rebelled, Cassy got the bump up to No.1, and was sent to kill her and failed miserably.

On the other hand, for all the cockiness Roxanne has, we still know practically nothing about Cassandra's....for all we know, she's the most dangerous of all like some think -- similar to cocky Teresa and the almighty Priscilla.

[Fenrir_valindri]

Cassandra went over her limit, and Roxanne was the one to deal the final blow. It was mentioned several chapters ago that Cassandra went over her limit and it took her hours to die despite receiving 100+ wounds, supposedly because of her great strength + the fear the warriors around her felt from her Yoki.

So that would indicate Cassandra was #1, while Roxanne was of unknown rank at the time (presumably #2 if she became a #1 later on).

[Guido]

Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri

So that would indicate Cassandra was #1, while Roxanne was of unknown rank at the time (presumably #2 if she became a #1 later on).

Not necessarily being the case.

If I recall from very past chapters in the manga, Claymores may get demoted off their current ranks by being surpassed by another one stronger than them.

For example, Priscilla:

Back in Teresa's age, the newbie Priscilla rose above the ranks and graduated in a short amount of time earning the number 2 spot from Irene at the time. She didn't receive her official emblem and comission, until passing the whole training and graduating in a matter of months time.

But that's about 50% or less of the cases.

[Double_friedman]

Originally Posted by irvinethearcher

I think we can be sure that hysteria the elegant wasn't in teresa's league because she gradually awakened but refused to let herself get killed. IF she would have been as strong as theresa was, something like that would have never happened. As far as we know claymores only gradually awaken(Hilda) if they overuse their yoki. But theresa said it herself: if i don't use it from time to time i forget howto use it at all

I don't think Hysteria is on Teresa's league. However, the fact that she was going to awake does not mean she was way weaker than Teresa.

Hysteria was known for her "Elegant strike" which demanded her to use huge amounts of yoki (like Miria). For what we can see, Hysteria is faster than Teresa, because Teresa was not able to do "ghost things", at least not without using Yoki.
So, if Hysteria's technique is that way, it means she was constantly using yoki to fight (even if she was fighting yoma, maybe she wanted to show off her power).

And Teresa, she didn't have any special fighting abilities (reading yoki flow is not an active fighting ability), if she had had Flashword, Rippling Sword, Raftela mind-control, or Drill Sword, then Teresa would have used yoki more often.
And you can tell me: well, it's because she was so powerful that she did not need to design special techniques. Maybe that's true, but Rafaela was weaker than Teresa and she didn't have special techniques, same as Galatea (she could control yoki sometimes, but she wasn't that awesome at it).

The surprising thing is that Hysteria did not awake before, because she was using so much yoki during any of her fights.

Let's imagine Teresa knew how to do the Elegant Strike, and did it very often. Do you think she could do it forever without making her body more vulnerable to awake?

[Shiek927]

Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri

Cassandra went over her limit, and Roxanne was the one to deal the final blow. It was mentioned several chapters ago that Cassandra went over her limit and it took her hours to die despite receiving 100+ wounds, supposedly because of her great strength + the fear the warriors around her felt from her Yoki.

So that would indicate Cassandra was #1, while Roxanne was of unknown rank at the time (presumably #2 if she became a #1 later on).

Ahhhhh.....which definitely promotes the idea that this girl is much more then she appears -- she could very well be the strongest of all 3 .

[Ouvea]

Guido made a valid point that warriors receive demotions, just as Noel and Sophia did, when Priscilla ascended to the number two ranking. There are several scenarios to consider in regards to the relationship dynamics between Roxanne and Cassandra.

Roxanne could have merely assumed the mantle of top warrior after Cassandra's death. We could also have a Teresa/Rosemary scenario where Roxanne, former number one raking, could have been demoted to a lower ranking in favor of Cassandra. She then regained the apex title after Cassandra's death.

Yagi does seem to portray some anomosity between these two former top warriors. Roxanne merely observes the melee that ensues with Cassandra and three current warriors. However, she's demonstrates a bit of cruelty/disdain toward the other by making Cassandra aware of her presence. Do you guys think that we have a Rosemary/Theresa or Sophia/Noel type of interaction? Perhaps such relations do not exist and Roxanne's personality merely mirrors that of Ophelia.

[Friday]

Why didn't Miria stopped fighting and tell Hysteria of her plans to overthrow the Organisation?

or

do we still see them fighting in the next chapter?

If Cassandra finds out that it was Roxanne who delt the final blow.......
revenge will be sweet for her or the twins will beat her first.

[Jean Claymore]

Originally Posted by Friday

Why didn't Miria stopped fighting and tell Hysteria of her plans to overthrow the Organisation?

or

do we still see them fighting in the next chapter?

If Cassandra finds out that it was Roxanne who delt the final blow.......
revenge will be sweet for her or the twins will beat her first.

AFAIR the 3 #1's won't listen to anyone before they get the mission done. Dae might have half-brainwashed to kill them and consider there reaction as an instinct. Thus, I guess they'll be fighting eachother until one gets knocked down (though I have a feeling Miria will get seriously wounded or half-dead in the next chap)

And if somehow Cassandra and Roxanne get to fight, I think I'll cheer for Cassandra Roxanne's smile's way too evil and bitchy for me

[Guido]

Originally Posted by Jean Claymore

And if somehow Cassandra and Roxanne get to fight, I think I'll cheer for Cassandra Roxanne's smile's way too evil and bitchy for me

And don't forget that Roxanne has a mole right below her right-eye that (to me) makes her look or project that aura of slutty whore.

It's just me, but I don't take well female characters that sport moles in their faces; I do not mind, if they have moles, as long as it is not in their faces.

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by Friday

Why didn't Miria stopped fighting and tell Hysteria of her plans to overthrow the Organisation? (...)

I think she thought it was pointless to reason with a Claymore that massacred Claymores in the past and now is murdering again without so much as blinking. Especially when she told her straight that one thing she knows is that she wants to kill her. Although it's still possible she will tell them about it later (however it's doubtful, if zombies would join forces with the ghosts there would be no competition, no fight and no action).

Edit:
After seeing raw I can finally roughly tell what symbols CRH have. The versions of the chapter I've seen have improved it too much and Cassandra's symbol is so blurry that you can't even begin to guess what it looks like. Thanks to the raw I see that it resembles Greek psi letter. See for yourselves (click the image to zoom):

[MalakTawus]

Imo there is no doubt about Cassy-Roxy dynamic.

Cassy was the n.1 and Roxy an unknown single digit warrior (probably n.2).

There is no possibility that Roxy rebelled first and Cassy, after becoming the new n.1, was sent to kill her and failed miserably.
That theory is not possible 'cause it's been stated clearly that that mission was to kill Cassy (not Roxy!),infact Roxy said that she give the final blow only when Cassy was already all cut up.


@Ouvea

We could also have a Teresa/Rosemary scenario where Roxanne, former number one raking, could have been demoted to a lower ranking in favor of Cassandra. She then regained the apex title after Cassandra's death.

Well,this is definitely possible,but in the end it's not in opposition of what i said before (it just speculates a bit more about Roxy-Cassy dynamic before and after Cassy's execution)

Do you guys think that we have a Rosemary/Theresa or Sophia/Noel type of interaction?

Maybe a Rosemary/Teresa interaction,but i highly doubt a Sophia/Noel interaction since Cassy surely doesn't seem to be the "competitive type".

[klare]

finally the 3 former #1 appear, the twintail one used lipstick? and the short hair one blushed at another warrior? the old era must be a crazy time...

seeing only 1 of the 3 matches is one-sided, the arrival of Deneve group may change the tides

[sonotme_9FedriqSama]

Originally Posted by Ryus

Just realized this might be a good place to post this. Best part of ch 116 ... animated (sadly form rules wont let me post this kinda file... link only)

http://ohforcryingoutloud.deviantart...claymore&qo=12

Cute....

Originally Posted by SkullFaerie

hi guys,

can i just come out of lurking for a second to say that Roxanne instantly reminded me of this person
xD

Apart from that, I really liked this chapter, and the new introductions- Hysteria is beautiful, Roxanne worries me, and Cassandra seems potentially reasonable. But since she appears that way, she might just turn out to be absolutely insane.

May I also say that I DO sympathize with the shrimp twins? I like them. They are so simple and totally visually unappealing, relatively sane and somehow innocent/blank/pure-like in what they do (because they are just trainees and so young and just.. do things). It is sort of refreshing, considering everyone else is rather heavy on the emotions and backstory.
They are just there and do (relatively) nice things.
I don't want them to die :<
Poor shrimp twins.

Roxanne most likelt resemble Emi Isuzu (slim version) of Tenjou Tenge....without her mole.

[Gooral]

Originally Posted by Double_friedman

However, the fact that she was going to awake does not mean she was way weaker than Teresa.

Doesn't mean but suggests it. Teresa could do every job without releasing youki and Hysteria couldn't and Teresa was fighting the most powerful creatures in the history of Claymore world. See my replies to Kinematics and Fenrir_valindri.

Hysteria is faster than Teresa, because Teresa was not able to do "ghost things", at least not without using Yoki.

That's just wrong. Can you see a bullet shot from a rifle? Nope. Some things are so fast that human eye won't register it and won't even see a blur and that was the case with Teresa. She could teleport basically (example 1, example 2, example 3 which shows it the best since she escaped from this situation in a split of a second) while Miria had problems with keeping up with Riguald (who BTW didn't leave after-images either). Clare was way faster than Riguald even and didn't leave after-images either. In short: Teresa >> Hysteria.

[MalakTawus]

In short: Teresa >> Hysteria.

This sums it all.....but Gooral,it's true that the fact that she was going to awake does not mean she was way weaker than Teresa, for example it's totally possible that she simply liked to use her powers a lot more, while (as we know) Teresa used her powers to "play" only rarely,or maybe she just had a more weak or "unstable" mind (like Prissy).

[irvinethearcher]

Yeah, there is this lonely league of awesomeness with only one player in it:
Theresa

[Faerie]

Originally Posted by sonotme_9FedriqSama

Roxanne most likelt resemble Emi Isuzu (slim version) of Tenjou Tenge....without her mole.

haha, they do look similar- I haven't watched TT, but Emi looks a lot more likeable than Roxy- who gives me creepy vibes, hence the Phoenix Wright comparison

edit: however- bahahahaha, now I have to imagine Roxy expanding into extreme obesity. Greatttt!!! xD

I guess it can pretty much be assumed that she's pretty psychopathic, she just gives off that creepy feeling, her lines are in this creepy fake-sweet manner, that reminds you of Ophelia (and other girls of this type), and the whole killing Cassandra business just adds to it.

Imo for now, Cassandra seems to be the only one that can potentially be reasoned with, or who may end up siding with the rebellion, provided that the brainwashing can be overcome- not saying this means she will survive. She might just stop trying to kill them.
For now that is- until we know the circumstances of her demise.

This storyline is really interesting, I love hearing about former/fallen warriors' stories. It always has a fascinating (SAD) feel to it in Claymore- like when we first learned about Clare. (As opposed to when the story focusses on the established characters. That is good too, of course. But I really enjoy the backstories of other, older or random warriors. Maybe that's just me )
Can't wait to see where this is going.

[Irene]

I like these 3 number ones... Gonna be interesting to see more of them. I don't really know what else to say

[germanturkey]

interesting chapter. a nice introduction to the three bosses. unfortunately, all my manga reading experience tells me that we'll get roughly a chapter apiece, detailing each one, then showing their inevitable downfalls. though i hope that isn't the case because it'd be nice to see something run against the norm.

also, thank god we didn't get zombie Teresa. that would have been horrible..

[creb]

This hogwash about Teresa not having any special things is just a bad interpretation based on Irene badly misunderstanding Teresa's strength. The reality is that she didn't have one special thing because she could do it all.

Take Irene's flash sword for instance. What do you think Teresa was doing when she was swinging her arm all flashy like right back at Irene? In a way, Teresa is so strong and cocky/confident, she doesn't need to give special names to moves that are just normal for her. ;p

That said, oh my gawd. Can we have one chapter discussion thread out of 110+ of 'em that doesn't turn into a discussion about how strong or weak Teresa really was? All that's important is she died. Maybe she was on some godly level power wise, but fat lot of good it did her. She still died. Strength in this series means absolutely nothing relative to plot advancement, which is why I feel like breaking out into hives every time this inevitable argument comes around.

Writing fiction is almost a waste of time if you're going to approach it like a bunch of if/and/not statements.

All this arguing about Rox and Cass is just so.... Do we really need to twist ourselves into contortions here? Cas was #1, was killed, Rox takes her place. No super secret mystery that requires microanalysis. Yes, this means Cas is probably technically stronger than Rox, but again, this series has always placed plot development over strength comparisons, so while it might make some Rox fanatics sad to think their sexy mascot isn't super strong, it doesn't really matter. If Yagi wants Cas to beat someone, she's going to do it, weak or strong doesn't really play a role in Yagi's reasoning. ;p Though, c'mon. Most of us have been reading Claymore long enough (and manga in general) to know these three #1s will have their moment in the sun for a few chapters before inevitably being defeated by the weaker Claymores.