'Pacific Rim' (2013) - Guillermo Del Toro's Mecha VS. Kaiju film.

[JokerD]

Originally Posted by Helius

That's not the point. As Waven said humanity managed to pollute the Earth in under 200 years so as to cause the planet to be suitable for colonisation, surely it should've been within the capabilities of the aliens to "pollute" Earth millions of years ago instead of terraforming per se.

I agree the whole premise makes little sense, unless I'm missing something here.

True, but I'm guessing that there were other planets to go to. Why spend precious energy and resources fighting the native just to terraform (kaijuuform ) a planet when you can open a portal to another place already suitable for you?

[wingdarkness]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

They are not underground they are in another universe. Also Kaiju are not carbon based but silicon based lifeforms.

In the Master's dimension we the Kaiju built in an assembly line.

I'm sorry I'm aware it was another universe, but basically the portal was under the earth (underground) is what was saying...I just think the concept of examining whether the kaiju were originally the dinosaurs is a bit cooler considering how they all looked like exaggerations of them...

[Ithekro]

Because they are in another dimension, it means they might not have taken the long way like our planet did. They might have opened the rift, saw the planet wasn't viable, than closed it again, reset the temporal coordinates and opened it again to see what it was like later on until they found a time suited to their needs.

Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon

Hence why this race exists, at all.

LOL, taking this crack and this race together, makes us on Earth sound like Gargantia already!

That or this group of speces: Silurians
(Though they could be the same thing....)

[Helius]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Because they are in another dimension, it means they might not have taken the long way like our planet did. They might have opened the rift, saw the planet wasn't viable, than closed it again, reset the temporal coordinates and opened it again to see what it was like later on until they found a time suited to their needs.

Should've opened up the portal circa 1900s then, when the biggest weapon we could muster at the time was a giant cannon built on railway tracks...

[Ithekro]

Maybe they required a bit of radiation as well, and we didn't have enough scattered around until the late 20th century. Or polution from coal doesn't suit them as much as other kinds of polution.

That or the rift technology is not all that accurate within the span of a century or even a millenia.

[germanturkey]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Saw it today ... spent 99% of the movie with a stupid grin on my face. I've never seen such a massive collection of tropes, cliches, and easter egg references done ... so well..

my exact reaction. i had a smile on my face the whole time. watched it last night. one word to describe it: awesome.

i did, however, take issue with how 4 helicopters could pick up a jaeger.

[Waven]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Maybe they required a bit of radiation as well, and we didn't have enough scattered around until the late 20th century. Or polution from coal doesn't suit them as much as other kinds of polution.

That or the rift technology is not all that accurate within the span of a century or even a millenia.

Unless that method is even more ressource-intesive than creating Kaiju couldn't they just trial and error until they nail the right date then? Also, how could they know by just looking at jurassic times that eventually intelligent life would evolve on earth and that this race would bring about exactly the terraforming they need?

I generally like your idea of timed wormholes but there's always a little detail missing to not make them look like cheapskates, slackers or irresponsible entrepreneurs.

PS: That cute train-cannon would make a perfect Kaiju tooth-pick - Just because you're a giant mindless biological machine of destruction doesn't mean you have to neglect your oral hygiene; especially if you're the acid-spitting type.

[ReddyRedWolf]

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by Helius

Should've opened up the portal circa 1900s then, when the biggest weapon we could muster at the time was a giant cannon built on railway tracks...

That would basically be a "humans go extinct" kinda scenario. A railway gun really doesn't have the kind of mobility or turn rate to be effective at engaging Kaiju emerging from the water near cities. Especially when you consider 1900 humans wouldn't have the early warning sensors to warn of a Kaiju approaching. It'd pop out of the water when the gun crews were unprepared, and smash past the defensive line before a single heavy shot could get off.

And this kinda defense won't even be immediately operational. Which means the first few Kaiju that show up will basically be unkillable, and will proceed to turn the entirity of the pacific Rim into a literal ring of death and fire.



Every industrialized nation on the planet will likely have been long reduced to ruin by the time the first category 3's arrive.

[Solace]

Originally Posted by Roger Rambo

That would basically be a "humans go extinct" kinda scenario. A railway gun really doesn't have the kind of mobility or turn rate to be effective at engaging Kaiju emerging from the water near cities. Especially when you consider 1900 humans wouldn't have the early warning sensors to warn of a Kaiju approaching. It'd pop out of the water when the gun crews were unprepared, and smash past the defensive line before a single heavy shot could get off.

And this kinda defense won't even be immediately operational. Which means the first few Kaiju that show up will basically be unkillable, and will proceed to turn the entirity of the pacific Rim into a literal ring of death and fire.



Every industrialized nation on the planet will likely have been long reduced to ruin by the time the first category 3's arrive.

I would predict something more akin to Muv Luv's scenario, where the world would radicalize into military factions and rapidly advance their technology. I'm sure some would even develop nuclear technologies rapidly as well, like the United States. The first bunch of Kaiju were taken down by conventional weapons after all, it just took a lot of hits to do it.

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by Solace

I would predict something more akin to Muv Luv's scenario, where the world would radicalize into military factions and rapidly advance their technology. I'm sure some would even develop nuclear technologies rapidly as well, like the United States. The first bunch of Kaiju were taken down by conventional weapons after all, it just took a lot of hits to do it.

Yes. By conventional weapons...that were over a century more advanced than anything available to people in 1900. People who had access to modern main battle tanks. To strategic bombers, smart bunker busting bombs and cruise missles. The qualitative difference between these things and early 20th century military technology is mind boggling...and it took modern day 21st century earth days of sustained attacks to take out the first category 1-2 Kaiju.


As for tech advances...I really doubt it. There's only so much that concentrated military R&D can do with limited material sciences and immature state of physics. We're talking about people who at the start of this conflict hadn't yet developed working heavier than air flight, and Einstein hadn't even conceived of E=MC2. How fast can 1900 jump start themselves? Even if you're generous and give them a few decades...that leaves them with pre-WW2 tech. still not all that well outfitted to fight Kaiju head on. Especially if at this point the Kaiju start escalating by sending in groups of Category IV's and V's (Hello. I'm Slattern. I just took a 1.2 megaton nuke to the face. I let myself get hit by little boys and Fatmans when I feel like getting a tan).



Besides...nukes and heavy bombardment are ultimately not viable tactics against Kaiju. Sure you can kill them with such methods...but you basically write off the city that they're in at the time. Either from the nuclear attack, or the fact that your death by a thousand cuts attack left toxic Kaiju blood splattered all over your city.

[Ithekro]

Technology is one thing...explosive and penetration power is something else. By the time of that railway gun (1918) the world powers have a lot of naval battleships and cruisers with a lot of heavy guns (though most of them are in the Atlantic). San Francisco and many other port cities had a massive network of defensive coastal batteries. Yes their would be no warning, but the Kaiju would be facing the world powers that had been in the process of rapidly advancing weapons of war during the Great War.

Then they start making Steampunk Jaeger, or try to come up with something like the Martian Tri-pods from H.G. Wells "War of the Worlds" to fight the Kaiju.

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Technology is one thing...explosive and penetration power is something else. By the time of that railway gun (1918) the world powers have a lot of naval battleships and cruisers with a lot of heavy guns (though most of them are in the Atlantic). San Francisco and many other port cities had a massive network of defensive coastal batteries. Yes their would be no warning, but the Kaiju would be facing the world powers that had been in the process of rapidly advancing weapons of war during the Great War.

That's true, but mobility and accuracy is a huge issue here. Modern jets, helicopters, tanks, and artillery have the mobility and accuracy to fight Kaiju from stand off distances. The film showed a few desperate close in suicidal air attacks, but what likely brought kaiju down was a massive sustained (and accurate) bombardment from stand off ranges, where the Kaiju had little ability to retaliate.


Battle ships and coastal batteries are incredibly vulnerable to being attacked by Kaiju. It can simply approach both from under the water, and pop up in claw range. They'll get a few shots off, but promptly get smashed by the Kaiju. Once it's punched through the ship and coastal line, a premechanized pre-aircapable military will have a very difficult time deploying heavy assets fast enough to keep up with the movements of a Kaiju.


And all that aside. There's the problem that even if you do manage to shell a kaiju to death, you have the problem of a carcass ridden with bullet holes bleeding toxic sludge all over your cities. The same cities whose factories are manufacturing your ships and artillery.

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Then they start making Steampunk Jaeger, or try to come up with something like the Martian Tri-pods from H.G. Wells "War of the Worlds" to fight the Kaiju.

Well given the narrative conventions of giant monster movies, that certainly is something to consider! Though I'm not sure 1900+ steam punk earth would be able to create any robots as powerful as the cyber punk Mark I Jaegers. What with the lack of high tech jet fighter neural interfaces and nuclear reactors for power.

[LoweGear]

‘Pacific Rim’ #1 Internationally Over Weekend

Originally Posted by Yahoo

EXCLUSIVE: Warner Bros has bragging rights today for distributing the Legendary Pictures 3D scifi actioner around the world after co-financing it. I’ve learned the studio discovered this morning that last weekend’s results came in $500K higher than forecast on Sunday. The result is that Guillermo Del Toro’s Pacific Rim grossed $35.3M with 4.7M admissions from 9,610 screens in 50 territories. That was just enough to knock off Universal’s 3D toon Despicable Me 2 and become the #1 film internationally over the weekend now that all the numbers are in. This brings the expensive $180M-$220M budget pic’s international cume to $110.9M and its worldwide total to $178.5M. Unfortunately, U.S. theatrical sales are not expected to exceed $100M all in so overseas coin is crucial. Foreign territories for Pacific Rim opening last weekend included France, Germany, Hong Kong, and Holland. The movie already has debuted in major markets Russia, Korea, Mexico, UK, Australia, and Italy. Upcoming releases include July 31st for China, Spain, Japan, and August 9th for Brazil.

[Shyni]

According to the fake newspaper clipping ReddyRedWolf posted, the kaiju had to be killed using nuclear weapons before they had Jaegars. So I assume any period before WW2 would mean human extinction.

Also, I loved this movie so much.

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

‘Pacific Rim’ #1 Internationally Over Weekend

That certainly is promising news! Always suspected that Pacific Rim's performance in the USA was a bit localized.

Originally Posted by Shyni

According to the fake newspaper clipping ReddyRedWolf posted, the kaiju had to be killed using nuclear weapons before they had Jaegars. So I assume any period before WW2 would mean human extinction.

Also, I loved this movie so much.

Yep. Though even then, it's a somewhat unsatisfactory solution unless you manage to detect and nuke the Kaiju while they're at sea. Otherwise, you're just constantly exchanging cities for individual Kaiju...and given that the Kaiju makers seem to strategically treat them as expendable ordinance/suicide troops, that's the equivalent of defending a city from a nuclear attack by nuking it yourself. The makers certainly don't mind trading a major human metro area for a kaiju.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

‘Pacific Rim’ #1 Internationally Over Weekend

I don't know what do you guys think?

I know the US market means a lot but there's absolutely no way WB/Legendary green lighted this without knowing that they would be making most of their money overseas. I just can't see it.

I mean it's a movie with no big time actors like Tom Cruise, Del isn't a big time director like Cameron or Nolan, takes place pretty much around the world but centered in Hong Kong and involves an international group.

According to the Chinese news site it's gaining some buzz.
http://www.china.org.cn/video/2013-0..._29382859.html

[JokerD]

Originally Posted by Roger Rambo

That certainly is promising news! Always suspected that Pacific Rim's performance in the USA was a bit localized.

Yep. Though even then, it's a somewhat unsatisfactory solution unless you manage to detect and nuke the Kaiju while they're at sea. Otherwise, you're just constantly exchanging cities for individual Kaiju...and given that the Kaiju makers seem to strategically treat them as expendable ordinance/suicide troops, that's the equivalent of defending a city from a nuclear attack by nuking it yourself. The makers certainly don't mind trading a major human metro area for a kaiju.

Still, can't they nuke it while in transit between cities? Besides what stopped it was a tac nuke not a strategic nuke warhead (small yield, correct me if I'm wrong)

What I'm thinking is if they came anytime before WWII, humans are basically all dead. Humans got a lot better at killing each other during and after WWII. I'm not sure if a bunker buster like a Tallboy would work again a kaijuu, but the penetration should be on par with a small tac nuke at least. (If you can get it to hit)

[RobotCat]

Originally Posted by JokerD

Still, can't they nuke it while in transit between cities? Besides what stopped it was a tac nuke not a strategic nuke warhead (small yield, correct me if I'm wrong)

What I'm thinking is if they came anytime before WWII, humans are basically all dead. Humans got a lot better at killing each other during and after WWII. I'm not sure if a bunker buster like a Tallboy would work again a kaijuu, but the penetration should be on par with a small tac nuke at least. (If you can get it to hit)

Well, the areas that the Kaiju attack are so densely populated that there's no transit between cities, it's just city joined with city. There's going to be huge collateral damage either way.

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

I don't know what do you guys think?

I know the US market means a lot but there's absolutely no way WB/Legendary green lighted this without knowing that they would be making most of their money overseas. I just can't see it.

I mean it's a movie with no big time actors like Tom Cruise, Del isn't a big time director like Cameron or Nolan, takes place pretty much around the world but centered in Hong Kong and involves an international group.

According to the Chinese news site it's gaining some buzz.
http://www.china.org.cn/video/2013-0..._29382859.html

I wonder if they will recut it somewhat for international to give the Chinese and Russian teams more screen time. I did feel a little short-changed there (especially with the Russians - who seemed to be wonderful over-the-top characters)