Kantai Collection ~Kancolle~ (Browser Game)

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by JokerD

E3H is annoying the heck out of me. Any idea what's the condition to get night battle with the main fleet? Also a torp CI with Hatsushimo got a grand total of 74 damage on the boss

What fleet are you running with? I just cleared it right now, using 13 sorties. A bit more than necessary since I ran into four hankōsen and red Ts during the chipping phase. Thought E3 was pretty simple and straightforward.

[AC-Phoenix]

Is there a known debuff for E4? Doesn't have to be for the boss Node Node.In fact i'd much prefer one for Node S

[Strigon 13]

After I saw the align for E-4 first part, I regret locking Bep in E-1. Gotta see how I can do this with only drums since I'm a retard and I never took time to level Kinu or Abukuma, or more daihatsu-carrier DDs.

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Strigon 13

After I saw the align for E-4 first part, I regret locking Bep in E-1. Gotta see how I can do this with only drums since I'm a retard and I never took time to level Kinu or Abukuma, or more daihatsu-carrier DDs.

tbh I found its better to try S rank her with decent equipment than actually having tons of drums with you and having no punch at all. Sure it makes everything a bit more tedious but your pre-boss survival rate will rise significantly.

Edit: Meanwhile I'm starting to questiopn my choice of ships for E4;
Is it better to do E5 with a CVB or 2 CVL(Like high levelled Hiyou and Junyou)? Kaga going all Taiha on me the entire time is starting to wear me out... And zuikaku is a better carrier all over too.
I'd like to at least make an effort at doing e5 on hard.
As for just setting her as Flagship I am not sure if this actually helps - Setting Maya there should (theoretically) increase her cut in rate which ultimately saves the fleet.
For some reason I generally jsut see people using Carrier task forces isntead of STFs on youtube.

[Kakurin]

See what I got in PVP:



Respect, eight 甲 medals and Saratoga level 60 already.

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

tbh I found its better to try S rank her with decent equipment than actually having tons of drums with you and having no punch at all. Sure it makes everything a bit more tedious but your pre-boss survival rate will rise significantly.

Just use a support fleet to beat the crap out of the pre-boss nodes. Ran a fleet using eight daihatsu and three drums. Had a single retreat in six runs using the support fleet.

[Ithekro]

I guess that's a training cruiser for you.

[Klashikari]

This isn't E5, but I'm finally free from this hell. 1 damecon, 6 goddess, 60k fuel spent on this god forsaken map that reminded me way too much of IBS E4, Midway E7 and SN E7.

Every node can just outright kill you, which forced me to resort using damecon (which only occured in my case with the aforementioned maps, except IBS). I dunno what they were thinking with the nu morphing into wo kai units for the boss node AND air nodes.
I think every nodes had shared an equal chance to screw my progression. And even going full sparkle didn't increase my chances whatsoever. In fact, I've noted as many sudden taiha as my "normal runs".

It really felt like that map had a LBA feature in mind but was scrapped without considering some tweaking, at least in kou.

[Strigon 13]

Seriously, E-4 first phase is making me wanna drop to easy. Managed to drop the gauge to half, just to look afterwards how my girls get taiha'd by either that goddamn Tsu in C, or Black Woo in H the last 6 or so runs. And yet node support is still unreliable to take out the dangerous ones.

If this keeps up I've gotta go and unleash my carriers.

[Sheba]

Tanaka loves his wo kai and tsu a little too much.

[ganbaru]

BTW Klashikari, may I ask what formation did you use up to now ? I usually look up the wiki but there's isn't much info on it for now.

[Klashikari]

A reminder of the requirements for the boss route:
1) You will always be redirected to node N from node P if you have a slow fleet or more than 4 BB/CV combined (CVL not included).
2) P to S is possible only if you have no CV, at least 2DD and 1CL.
3) Any other combination that doesn't go to N or S will send you to R.

There are 3 formations that you can pick:
1) Light Fleet: 2DD, 1CL, 3 wild cards among FBB, CVL, CA(V), CLT. The usual setup is 1FBB, 2DD, 1CL, 2CVL (or 1CVL replaced by 1CLT). That comp has the shortest route, but also the highes risk of faling in term of boss killing because you are relying on your only 1 torp cut in DD as the other DD is most likely an Akizuki class. Using a CLT sounds great on paper, but that means you have no AACI, meaning that you will be toasted esp they have poor AA in general.
In kou, it is impossible to get air superiority against the boss in last dance, so it is mainly a huge gamble with the boss support and cut in.
Please note that there IS a LOS check right before the boss. I failed it once, but could stabilize it with 19 LOS (formula 33). I had no time nor courage to test the exact value required for this, but if you have at least 19, you pass 100%.

2) Medium fleet: 2FBB, 2CV, the other 2 ships can be anything as long they are fast and not a BB or CV. This comp will lead you to node R, but you will avoid node N.
I personally used 2FBB, 1CAV, 2CV, 1CVL, as the CVL allowed me to get air superiority on every node, last dance mode included.

3) Heavy Fleet: 2BB, 4CV / 3BB 3CV / 4BB 2CV. Since you have more than 4 BB and CV combined, it doesn't matter if you have a fast or slow fleet anymore. This setup has the highest chance to deal maximum damage against the boss, but they are battered left and right by the very long route.

I tested all of them, and medium version is most likely the least hazardous out of the three. It is still atrocious nonetheless, so I'd suggest using extra equip slot with damecon if you can afford that.
Chances that you can reach the boss in a pristine condition are extremely low. Within my 30-40 runs in last dance, I reached the boss with shoha max only once. Every time I reached the boss, I had at least 1 chuuha or taiha.

Finally, I recommend at least 600 Fighter power before starting the map if you want to secure Air superiority. Anything less than 550-580 will increase the risk of being stuck with air parity.
Air parity is a very big deal because BB like Iowa still struggle against Ne-class and Wo kai considering the very high armor. That's another reason why I think light fleet comp in last dance is too much of a gambit.

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Klashikari

A reminder of the requirements for the boss route:
1) You will always be redirected to node N from node P if you have a slow fleet or more than 4 BB/CV combined (CVL not included).
2) P to S is possible only if you have no CV, at least 2DD and 1CL.
3) Any other combination that doesn't go to N or S will send you to R.

There are 3 formations that you can pick:
1) Light Fleet: 2DD, 1CL, 3 wild cards among FBB, CVL, CA(V), CLT. The usual setup is 1FBB, 2DD, 1CL, 2CVL (or 1CVL replaced by 1CLT). That comp has the shortest route, but also the highes risk of faling in term of boss killing because you are relying on your only 1 torp cut in DD as the other DD is most likely an Akizuki class. Using a CLT sounds great on paper, but that means you have no AACI, meaning that you will be toasted esp they have poor AA in general.
In kou, it is impossible to get air superiority against the boss in last dance, so it is mainly a huge gamble with the boss support and cut in.

2) Medium fleet: 2FBB, 2CV, the other 2 ships can be anything as long they are fast and not a BB or CV. This comp will lead you to node R, but you will avoid node N.
I personally used 2FBB, 1CAV, 2CV, 1CVL, as the CVL allowed me to get air superiority on every node, last dance mode included.

3) Heavy Fleet: 2BB, 4CV / 3BB 3CV / 4BB 2CV. Since you have more than 4 BB and CV combined, it doesn't matter if you have a fast or slow fleet anymore. This setup has the highest chance to deal maximum damage against the boss, but they are battered left and right by the very long route.

I tested all of them, and medium version is most likely the least hazardous out of the three. It is still atrocious nonetheless, so I'd suggest using extra equip slot with damecon if you can afford that.
Chances that you can reach the boss in a pristine condition are extremely low. Within my 20-30 runs in last dance, I reached the boss with shoha max only once. Every time I reached the boss, I had at least 1 chuuha or taiha.

Finally, I recommend at least 600 Flighter power before starting the map if you want to secure Air superiority. Anything less than 550-580 will increase the risk of being stuck with air parity.

Did you use CVs or CVBs?

Adding to the light route problem:
Taking a CAV with you instead of a CVLis utterly useless too - the highest FP one is Mogami who will be rendered beyond useless as you have to use up all slots on Seaplanes. Chikuma can only make it with at least one III A12 or 601
Further adding to the problem is an unknown LoS requirement.

[Klashikari]

CV. I didn't want to lose Shoukaku and Zuikaku in E4, moreso that you are really tight in term of air power, so you really can't rely on them in that department unless you switch them back to regular kai ni.
Shoukaku and Zuikaku are only beneficial if you plan going with the heavy fleet.

Tone and Chikuma are cut for the job and they can deal enough damage against the flagship Ru. They are also effective against the boss due to the night battle combined power, although they struggle a lot against wo kai.

LOS requirement is fine as long you use a good max chevron obs plane. So you can swap Night scout as it is pointless unless you have at least air superiority. I've never seen it triggered with parity or lower.
As a matter of fact, 19 LOS is easy to achieve with a Zero Obs and enough levels. At worst, just put 2 5-6 recon planes on the CAV.

[AC-Phoenix]

LoS is apparently a real problem there without a CaV - at least one Double chevron Saiun isn't enough. and uhm 19? is that ELos or Formula 33? 34.58 Elos still brought me to the dead end.

CVs are apaprently a problem there - Kaga is far too liked by the Battleships (they really love her yeah) So I switched her for Shoukaku, as I got to go with the STF anyhow, due to the absence of enough CVs - So i guess a Hiyou and Junyou will have to fight the fleet through E5 later

TbH I'd really love to throw in Iowa instead of Kongou, but I feel like she'd be is wasted on E4

Greatest Jokes of all that are still though:

Sara does Shelling Yasen and looses that Ability upon remodelling.
Makes me wonder whether the Catapult isn't for her after all and she can do Yasen again with it - Plane Yasen.
Or they plan on holding that ability back for Enterprise's introduction

[Klashikari]

I always use Formula 33.
With the light fleet setup, I never used Saiun in E4 simply because I'd rather not want Hankousen on non boss, while Hankousen or red T is pretty much doomed on the boss node anyway. Also, losing one slot that could have been a max chevron fighter is a major loss in my books. Hell, even with my medium setup, I had no room for a saiun, but then again the natural los of such fleet is clearly enough anyway.

[AC-Phoenix]

In my Medium fleet I had a Saiun at first and later put it away - I actually want those Red Ts at Node S now.
True irony for me is that the rewards seem somewhat worth it and make me go extra rounds while I actually wanted to complete this on medium to save enough Buckets and Bauxite to do the next few on Hard...
I jsut hope that Catapult is either for Akagi and Kaga or to give Sara her Yasen back and not just so people have a chance of getting a Crane KaiNi without the bother of the questline.

[Master Assassin]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

Edit: Meanwhile I'm starting to questiopn my choice of ships for E4;
Is it better to do E5 with a CVB or 2 CVL(Like high levelled Hiyou and Junyou)? Kaga going all Taiha on me the entire time is starting to wear me out... And zuikaku is a better carrier all over too.
I'd like to at least make an effort at doing e5 on hard.
As for just setting her as Flagship I am not sure if this actually helps - Setting Maya there should (theoretically) increase her cut in rate which ultimately saves the fleet.
For some reason I generally jsut see people using Carrier task forces isntead of STFs on youtube.

You probably saw the composition guide on the Wikia, I wrote the STF part of it in and even now I feel it needs A LOT of review and rework (even after rewriting and revising the Fleet Composition section several times over for the big and small mistakes). The one I wrote there is a suggestion to say that doing the map with an STF is possible... but feasibility is something else unfortunately.

After a while I realized due to the nodes you're going to encounter in E-5, as well as the higher difficulties you are considering to challenge it on, it is much more optimal to go with a CTF instead of an STF, so I rewrote the composition guide to focus on CTF first.

Going with an STF basically forces you to carry a good maximum of 2 fighter-heavy CVLs (think Hiyou and Junyou) with the absolute best fighters you have, while using 2 CAVs with seaplane fighters to add to the air power available to the STF. Note that even with the best seaplane fighter you have you're not going to meet the AS requirements for the nodes till Boss onwards... unless if you forgo the guns on the CAVs for an all-seaplane fighter pair of CAVs. At this point this would be worse than going in with a CTF, and due to how the Player Combined vs Abyssal Combined fleet mechanic works I feel there's next to no difference fighting the boss fleet with either - except you get to carry more fighters and bombers with CTF instead.

On lower difficulties where you have lower AS requirements to reach, and in my case since it was Easy - carrying ONE CV can only afford me as much as Air Parity for all the nodes from N onwards (N-O-P-T), therefore I was losing out on artillery spotting and relied heavily on node/boss supports, LBAS airstrikes and opening torpedo strikes to make it work. It's expensive, but it works... for me.

So yeah, as someone who came up with the idea of trying E-5 post-2nd route unlock with an STF in the first place, I still would recommend people wanting to go ahead with the map to use a CTF. I was using STF there out of curiosity and saw it is possible, though expensive, even on Easy and I felt I could've went with CTF to be safer instead.

[Strigon 13]

Finished at last E-4 first phase, after 10 tries. Now for E-4 seconds phase, on carriers you guys use 2 blue/2 green planes on each or just go full fighters to gain AS?

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Master Assassin

You must've been following the composition guide on the Wikia, I wrote the STF part of it in and even now I feel it needs A LOT of review and rework (even after rewriting and revising the Fleet Composition section several times over for the big and small mistakes). The one I wrote there is a suggestion to say that doing the map with an STF is possible... but feasibility is something else unfortunately.

After a while I realized due to the nodes you're going to encounter in E-5, as well as the higher difficulties you are considering to challenge it on, it is much more optimal to go with a CTF instead of an STF, so I rewrote the composition guide to focus on CTF first.

Going with an STF basically forces you to carry a good maximum of 2 fighter-heavy CVLs (think Hiyou and Junyou) with the absolute best fighters you have, while using 2 CAVs with seaplane fighters to add to the air power available to the STF. Note that even with the best seaplane fighter you have you're not going to meet the AS requirements for the nodes till Boss onwards... unless if you forgo the guns on the CAVs for an all-seaplane fighter pair of CAVs. At this point this would be worse than going in with a CTF, and due to how the Player Combined vs Abyssal Combined fleet mechanic works I feel there's next to no difference fighting the boss fleet with either - except you get to carry more fighters and bombers with CTF instead.

On lower difficulties where you have lower AS requirements to reach, and in my case since it was Easy - carrying ONE CV can only afford me as much as Air Parity for all the nodes from N onwards (N-O-P-T), therefore I was losing out on artillery spotting and relied heavily on node/boss supports, LBAS airstrikes and opening torpedo strikes to make it work. It's expensive, but it works... for me.

So yeah, as someone who came up with the idea of trying E-5 post-2nd route unlock with an STF in the first place, I still would recommend people wanting to go ahead with the map to use a CTF. I was using STF there out of curiosity and saw it is possible, though expensive, even on Easy and I felt I could've went with CTF to be safer instead.

Not exactly following it more looking at it for reference. Even if I had kept Shoukaku back I'd be 1 Amagi or one Taiho short of being able to run a CTF there. I could have done a 1 CV, 2 CVB + Junyouk2 setup for a CTF. That is however assuming I'd never used more than 1 CV in E4 and saved boh my second Kaga as well as the cranes.

TbH i am still pondering if the F4 Wildcat is even worth the bother of doing it on hard - especially since I am far more likely to use a Focke on her in the end

[Master Assassin]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

TbH i am still pondering if the F4 Wildcat is even worth the bother of doing it on hard - especially since I am far more likely to use a Focke on her in the end

The F4F-4 is more or less the in-game's American equivalent of Zero Model 21 and Saratoga comes up with it on her remodel, so... if you want to add it to your collection then by all means do try. If you think it's not worth it, then you might want to reconsider about doing E-5 on Hard