Clannad Game Translation Project [Archive] - Page 4

evilr00t

2009-04-20, 21:29

I finally got around to rebuilding the Voice Patch version. Turns out, after recompilation, the filesize has ballooned from 7.5MB to 9.45MB!! Yet, upon decompilation, I'm getting the same KE and UTF files. What gives?

Nevermind, got it. Strip debug info. FullVoice patch should, then, be smaller.

Integrated my changes with the SVN today. 10L causing r29 to be skipped, because SEEN1430 (Fuuko) was inconsistent with the rest of the name fix. Now the name fix is consistent and works across both versions. Also, small editing improvements in SEEN6800 (After Story). All of After Story needs serious editing work, which I will eventually get around to.

The only piece of bad news is that savefile compatibility is broken for Full Voice. I reduced the size of the SEEN file by removing the debug data, and this pisses off the interpreter when it loads an older savefile.

Link to patches, which are all-inclusive now.
Full Voice (SAVEFILE COMPATIBILITY BROKEN!!) (http://chan.srpe.org/src/patchFV_r30.zip)
Voice Patch (http://chan.srpe.org/src/patchVP_r30.zip)

If anyone wants a savefile-"compatible" version of r30, ask.

Ripdog

2009-04-21, 23:09

KaneDragon

2009-04-21, 23:20

The only piece of bad news is that savefile compatibility is broken for Full Voice. I reduced the size of the SEEN file by removing the debug data, and this pisses off the interpreter when it loads an older savefile.
So this is beyond the earlier savefile incompatibilities you've talked about? I do have a few pages of saves of memorable scenes. It would take a little time to retrace all of my steps (the walkthrough helps). If you already have the alternate patch on hand, sure, I'll take it. Either way it's likely only delaying the inevitable, though, so no need to make any extra effort for me.

dgreater1

2009-04-22, 01:36

Well, this is unsettling.

I'm using the r30 FV patch, and played up to the very early Nagisa route scene were Nagisa first learns of the disbandment of the drama club.

The lines Tomoya - "Nice to meet you."
Nagisa - ".....", "Yes, nice to meet you too.", "Well, the drama club..."

Loop three times. They also seem to overwrite the lines that would normally follow, because after the loop the next scene is them going home, Tomoya - "Are you going home alone?".

WHHHAGH IT'S ON THE WIKI TOO *cry*

Does this mean it's intentional? It looks very bad indeed.

And it's also been there for years... I do hope somebody can explain this to me :(

I think I remember these lines... April 15, Nagisa's route if I'm not mistaken. Anyway, it's probably intentional.

When Nagisa asked about the Drama club, Tomoya was trying to dodge the answer by greeting her until at some point (probably?), Nagisa ended up realizing that her question about drama club will go nowhere.

Tyabann

2009-04-22, 01:37

And it's also been there for years... I do hope somebody can explain this to me :(

Intentional. Tomoya's trying to take her mind off of the Drama Club. I think.

Edit: Dammit, beaten to it.

evilr00t

2009-04-22, 01:51

Ticket #9 is a tenacious beast. The code is similar for FV and VP, but for some reason, the VP version totally throws a tantrum with strS[0] in SEEN6425. I tried similar code in the very first SEEN (0414) but it doesn't reproduce there.

Also, new bug. First line of text display displays the first character overlapping. Bugfix in testing.
//// doesn't look like I can really fix it, it's a rlBabel bug, will try to fix once I get the source for it. OTOH I fixed another 'bug': "return to previous selection" (on the in-game menu) should be re-enabled on build r31 and later!

@KaneDragon: no real reason to switch from r28, changes are very minor for FV other than recompiling without debug data. But it is nicer having the VP and FV on the "same page" wrt release number, otherwise the VP fix would be r29 and FV r28... confusing.

evilr00t

2009-04-22, 19:26

Alright, here's the rundown of the savegame compatibility:
1) If the game is compiled without debug data, savegame compatibility across releases is shitty. (I think.)
2) there is no real gameplay improvement for Full Voice with r29+ vs r28, so I strongly suggest keeping r28 (the last version until savegame compatibility goes down the drain) until absolutely necessary. [Incorrect now, I rebuilt r30 to support a new gameplay feature that's very useful: "go back to previous choice"]

When I re-enabled "go back to previous choice" (this was disabled in previous builds due to rlc's rlBabel support disabling it for some reason), savegame compatibility broke AGAIN! Only my saves from After Story work fine between r30 and r30+choicefix, otherwise it locks up. If you have savegames, I strongly suggest not upgrading until the kinks are worked out.

Or better yet, fork your CLANNAD folder into multiple instances - with NTFS symlinks, the disk space consumption should be trivial.
The trick is a utility called junction.exe (http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb896768.aspx) from Microsoft.
Now how do you do that?

Assumption: CLANNAD installed at C:\CLANNAD. We want to fork to C:\FORK. Copy junction.exe to C:\FORK
0) Make a directory called C:\FORK
1) Run cmd.exe. Make sure it says C: on the leftmost side. It will open a command window, to which you will type commands.
2) Change to the FORK directory:
cd C:\FORK
3) Run these commands. This will create a symlink that connects the first argument to another folder.
junction BGM C:\CLANNAD\BGM
junction DAT C:\CLANNAD\DAT
junction G00 C:\CLANNAD\G00
junction GAN C:\CLANNAD\GAN
junction KOE C:\CLANNAD\KOE
junction MANUAL C:\CLANNAD\MANUAL
junction MOV C:\CLANNAD\MOV
junction SYS C:\CLANNAD\SYS
junction WAV C:\CLANNAD\WAV
4a) If you want SAVEDATA to be shared between your fork and original copy:
junction SAVEDATA C:\CLANNAD\SAVEDATA
**I highly recommend NOT doing that!**
4b) Using Windows, copy the SAVEDATA folder from your old CLANNAD folder to your FORK folder. Recommended.
5) Close cmd.exe; you're done with it.
6) Using Windows, copy all the files in the CLANNAD folder [EXCLUDING the folders, which we symlinked in step 3] to the FORK folder.

The independent files are the files in the FORK folder, and the SAVEDATA folder (if you followed step 4b). The rest of the files are shared. Therefore, you can replace the SEEN files in the FORK folder without affecting the ones in the CLANNAD folder. However, if you delete or change files in the G00 folder (ie. menu patch), it will affect BOTH copies.

Also, HUGE WARNING. Windows Explorer doesn't work with symlinks correctly for deletion. It will delete files inside symlinks, instead of deleting the symlink. So if you delete FORK using Windows Explorer, you'll also nuke your CLANNAD folder.
Solution: use cmd.exe, or better yet, junction -d (symlink path).

C:\KEY\oldClannad>dir
2006/06/22 17:27 88 1.3.9.5.map
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> BGM
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> DAT
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> G00
2009/04/22 02:42 23,345 GAMEEXE.INI
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> GAN
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> KOE
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> MANUAL
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> MOV
2006/03/22 00:03 2,035,712 REALLIVE.EXE
2008/12/20 17:53 221,184 rlBabel.dll
2009/04/22 02:44 <DIR> SAVEDATA
2009/04/22 20:02 7,855,304 SEEN.TXT
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> SYS
2009/04/20 21:59 <JUNCTION> WAV
5 File(s) 10,135,633 bytes
And yes, that's CLANNAD Voice Patch using Full Voice's data files. Heavily broken and full of FAIL, but usable.

Ripdog

2009-04-29, 03:49

evilr00t

2009-04-30, 00:19

Hey evilr00t, are you doing all the new SEEN compilations? If so, do you move the latest versions of the SEENs from the wiki before compiling, or do I have to commit to SVN to make edits? The SEENs on the SVN are very out of date.

Depends on what you mean by out-of-date. I'm focusing mostly on the KE files, and not really touching the UTF files. The UTF files are on the Wiki, and I have no idea how to merge them from the wiki into the SVN in a batch operation, which would be required to update the SVN.

Also, I did some minor editing/fixing to the UTF files so a diff from the SVN to the Wiki would be needed too. If you do merge the Wiki back into the SVN, let me know.
The list of updated UTF files is: 1009, 3416, 6800, 6801, (9032, 9033, 9034)

Tyabann

2009-05-01, 01:12

Might want to delete that, dude.

boku

2009-05-02, 12:01

to Chanimalx10
I recommend you to use full voice version, not voice patch. As for translation - look here (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents) and browse through this thread with more attention.

Chanimalx10

2009-05-03, 19:30

evilr00t

2009-05-03, 20:11

Darn. I got owned. Thanks for the suggestion though.

Also, does anyone know where I can look to find out what all these different file termonology names like SEEN and SVN are/mean. This kind of stuff seems pretty interesting.
SEEN: Typically the script for REALLIVE.
This is where REALLIVE is documented. (http://dev.haeleth.net/rldev/manual.html#func:SetSkipMode)

SVN:
Version control software (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subversion_%28software%29)

Chanimalx10

2009-05-05, 17:36

SEEN: Typically the script for REALLIVE.
This is where REALLIVE is documented. (http://dev.haeleth.net/rldev/manual.html#func:SetSkipMode)

SVN:
Version control software (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subversion_%28software%29)

Some nice light bedtime reading. Thanks!

Sun-Ku

2009-05-11, 16:44

Hi there,

I have Clannad Full Voice version, played with the december 20th batch

I have a problem with the akio route.

I have 12 lights now, but on May 16th nothin changes, no choice etc.
it doesnt matter if i load a savegame on may 16th oder play after story to this date. Nothing changes :/
I even had deleted all savegames (all files) and was playing strictly with this walkthrough http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=1191340#post1191340 ... but nothing had changed, no choice for the akio route

I had downloaded the r28 file, (deleted savegames 01-99, but not the rest so i had the 12 lights) shortly after, but again no choice on may 16th, even on the third full playthrough of after story

can someone help me?

sailorsean

2009-05-12, 01:57

Hey there I have the Full Voice edition installed and I can't play the OP at all?! The same with Tomoyo After and Little Busters! and Little Busters! Extacy... I can't play the OP in any of these games, however Air and Kanon seem to work just fine... and I can play all the other OP's just fine on my computer, but when I'm in the game it just won't play... You see, when I was playing Clannad after you meet Nagisa your supposed to see the op (am i right) but instead it just skipped to the classroom scene... So i basically need help...

grylsyjaeger

2009-05-13, 06:23

Wow, I didn't even know there was an introduction.

I too would like to know if there is some trick to getting it to play as it does look like it fits right after Tomoya says, "I gazed at the sky".

Vegard Aune

2009-05-13, 09:43

Wow, I didn't even know there was an introduction.

I too would like to know if there is some trick to getting it to play as it does look like it fits right after Tomoya says, "I gazed at the sky".
Actually, it shows up later in the game... MUCH later in the game. If I remember it right, it's played like, mid-way through Nagisa's route, just as she starts talking about the play she wants to do.

xShirayuki

2009-05-13, 12:48

Well, didn't know where to post so I decided to go ahead and place it here. Well I installed Clannad FV and SEEN.txt that seems to work with FV, the game works fine, text is in English and voices work, there's just one problem, when I try to open the menu the game freezes. If I try to open the settings menu in the Main Menu I get a series of messages and finally a text with something written in Japanese. Has anyone encountered this problem or does anyone know a solution?

EDIT: Actually never mind, I got the game to work following some procedures I skipped, I'm sorry for the trouble ^_^

Aaaah...

I have this problem. Can you tell me what procedures you used to fix it? Thanks !

Dextro

2009-05-13, 13:20

Actually, it shows up later in the game... MUCH later in the game. If I remember it right, it's played like, mid-way through Nagisa's route, just as she starts talking about the play she wants to do.

If I'm not mistaken is near the end of Nagisa's Route (before after story). It caught me off-guard the first time I saw it :P

SaintessHeart

2009-05-13, 16:49

Regarding the 10th Memorial Box Set, do you guys think the current versions would work with it?

grylsyjaeger

2009-05-13, 23:18

Actually, it shows up later in the game... MUCH later in the game. If I remember it right, it's played like, mid-way through Nagisa's route, just as she starts talking about the play she wants to do.

Ah, cheers mate.

Well it's definitely funny that the game lacks a proper introduction like most VN's but it sounds like it will suit more later.

aystee18

2009-05-15, 22:46

Aaaah...

I have this problem. Can you tell me what procedures you used to fix it? Thanks !

http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents

get the RealLiveFiles.rar and the latest SEEN.TXT from that site

xShirayuki

2009-05-18, 10:17

Now I got that RealLive thing fixed. But now... it doesn't have any voices. It's translated, but has no voices. And it's named CLANNAD Full Voice too... >_> Is there a problem?

sona-nyl

2009-05-20, 13:52

Could someone be kind to do a DETAILED walktrough for me I have readed all the posts and been on all the webbsites but i am not good with those things T.T I have never used this kinds of patches before

Seitsuki

2009-05-21, 01:21

Shirayuki: The game itself has no voices; a patch needs to be applied. If you try and play straight after installing and english patching you'll be disappointed.
HanyuuChan: Assuming you're talking about the voice patch:
-Extract it (if it's a rar.) You should have: a folder named KOE, a file named koeicon.g00 and a text file seen.txt
-Copy the file 'Seen.txt' and the folder 'KOE' to Clannad's root folder (the one with reallive.exe in it.) Overwrite the old seen.txt
-In that root folder there is a folder called g00. Copy koeicon.g00 into that folder.
-In that root folder (again) open gameexe.ini
-Find the line #FOLDNAME.KOE = "KOE" = 1 : ""
and replace it with
#FOLDNAME.KOE = "KOE" = 0 : ""
#WINDOW_KOEPLAY_USE = 1
#KOEREPLAYICON.NAME = "koeicon"
#KOEREPLAYICON.SIZE = 32,32
#KOEREPLAYICON.REPPOS = 540,50
just select and copy over it, much easier
save then done.
more or less a paraphrasing of the readme but hopefully easier to understand

KaneDragon

2009-05-21, 11:46

Shirayuki: The game itself has no voices; a patch needs to be applied. If you try and play straight after installing and english patching you'll be disappointed.
No, like xShirayuki just said, it's the "Full Voice" version. 800x600 and voices included. Not the original version + voice patch.

I don't know what your problem is, though, xShirayuki.

Seitsuki

2009-05-24, 00:15

Ahh ic. Didn't know there was a full voice version, just a pc and ps2 ed.
and btw hanyuuchan I just realised that replacing the seen.txt is gonna screw up your english translation xD sorry

animebuster

2009-05-24, 23:57

sorry i know this is off topic but does anyone know where i can get the keys for the songs in clannad like Dango Daikazoku i want to try to play some on the keyboard

thanks

Seitsuki

2009-05-25, 17:53

There has been a disk of various pieces from Clannad and Tomoyo After transposed to the piano, but as far as I know there have been no releases of the actual scores.
FYI it's called Piano no Mori
edit: I take it back, theres a sheet music book called Toki o Kizamu Uta / Torch. No idea where to find it tho.

AngryDango

2009-05-28, 22:48

Halp!
I'm using Fullvoice and used 2008 12 20 snapshot.

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/1451/clannaderror1.png

And get this:

http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/2953/unabletext.png

Seitsuki

2009-05-29, 00:26

maybe the problem is with your .seen files?

AngryDango

2009-05-29, 16:14

I solved the problem using this:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=200b2fd9-ae1a-4a14-984d-389c36f85647&displaylang=en

The Assembla page says that you need to use msvcp80.dll and msvcr80.dll if you get this error. It seems it's not true.

Reikken

2009-05-30, 01:52

Tomoya's name is untranslated? Everything else seems fine.
Why is this? I see "Tomoya" in screenshots, yet I am presented with an empty name box when Tomoya speaks.

btw, I'm using full voice, SEEN r30 (tried r28 and the one that comes with snapshot_20081220; neither made any difference there), and the graphics translations v1.5

It was untranslated in the unvoiced version, too, except it had kanji instead of a blank or symbols ("ª[box]" for Okazaki) like it has now.

boku

2009-05-30, 06:37

Try to delete save-files.

Reikken

2009-05-30, 07:34

Oh, I get it now. Thanks.
.............

Kudryavka

2009-06-07, 19:47

Regarding the 10th Memorial Box Set, do you guys think the current versions would work with it?
Pretty sure the 10th Memorial Box version of Clannad is exactly the same as Full Voice. And even if it isn't, it can't be that different, so it won't take much tinkering with to get it in English.

evilr00t

2009-06-12, 03:25

Deprecated. See http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=2450110#post2450110

KaneDragon

2009-06-12, 09:26

Translation notes look good, finally... and we now have Return to Previous Selection.
The translation has also been updated from the Baka-Tsuki wiki.
Cool. This one might be worth the hassle of recreating all my saves of previous scenes, if I ever really pick up Clannad again... :)

TubZzz

2009-06-12, 20:20

evilr00t

2009-06-12, 23:13

i seemed to have tryed the r45 patcher on my VP and it has corrupted the GAMEEXE file... anybody have any solutions?

i now replaced it with the appropriate r30 SEEN.TXT for VP and i get a black screen with "!" in the text box... :S

thanks in advance

Edit: i got it working... disregard the above comment ^^

The patcher I posted yesterday is for full voice only. I'm sorry that I forgot to mention that in my previous post. However, I had someone with Voice Patch do some testing for me, and...

New: r46 build for Voice Patch!

http://irc.srpe.org/src/gloss_final.jpg
Full Voice: r45
Patcher (http://shizuka.mine.nu/vera/clannadFV_r45.exe) (2.03MB)
Mirror (http://irc.srpe.org/src/patchFV_r45.zip) (2.0MB)

http://shizuka.mine.nu/vera/clannad_glossVP.jpg
Voice Patch: r46
Patcher (http://shizuka.mine.nu/vera/clannadVP_r46.exe) (2.44MB)
Mirror (http://irc.srpe.org/src/patchVP_r46.zip) (2.40MB)

What's new:
Translation notes look good, finally... and we now have Return to Previous Selection.
The translation has also been updated from the Baka-Tsuki wiki.

You can grab the relevant files at the SVN files page (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents) as well.
Note: Do not grab the Full Voice r46 release. It's there for the rlvm developer, and is not savegame compatible!! (not that it means anything)...

animebuster

2009-06-13, 01:36

is there a translation patch for Tomoyo After? if there is can anyone post a link

thanks

Proto

2009-06-13, 02:29

Wow, thanks for the translation patch, evilr00t! I'll be sure to tr it as soon as my new copy arrives.

animebuster: not yet, now now. Check back in one year :p

Chaos Chaud

2009-06-19, 08:07

Hmm, how much of the game is currently translated?

My copy arrives tomorrow and I would like to know if I'll be able to play it....:)

Also, could you say the site of the current translation?

sekihoutai

2009-06-19, 15:15

Clannad has being fully translated.

If you are speaking of Tomoyo After, I think it's still a open wiki were anyone could help translate at baka-tsuki.

Chaos Chaud

2009-06-19, 16:06

No, I was really asking for Clannad.

So, is there a site where I can get this translation?

boku

2009-06-24, 04:44

It is right here ^_^
Search for preicise instructions in this thread (in general, copy SEEN, map, dll in game folder, edit some ini). Files with translation located here (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents).
Also, interface (menu) translation is not included in this project, but link can be found in this thread.

ginytah

2009-06-25, 17:57

hi.. I got this problem
http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/2063/screencapt.jpg

:( I think is because the japanese language is'nt installed...

http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/8318/41519953.jpg

but there's no option to install a new language :uhoh:
also, there's a problem to install tle Applocale in Vista, that sucks
what should I do?

HEEEEEELP!

TubZzz

2009-06-25, 21:20

select the "Formats" tab on that screen and change "Current format" to Japanese

ginytah

2009-06-25, 21:44

:upset: that's what I did but nothing happens... I downloaded the japanese langiage pack, a 200mb file but is that the file I need?

FhnuZoag

2009-06-27, 11:19

Does anyone know what the status of this project is now? The OP URL seems very obselete, so I was wondering if people were still working on this, and how far they've gotten.... And I'm a bit too lazy to read all 41 pages of this thread.

(HINT: Someone should update the OP?)

TubZzz

2009-06-27, 19:49

:upset: that's what I did but nothing happens... I downloaded the japanese langiage pack, a 200mb file but is that the file I need?

i'm not sure if that is the file you need mate... i didn't have to dl anything for mine so i'm not too sure about that

Neji0392

2009-06-28, 19:45

Um.. I'm really confused. How do I get the game? Or how do I download it? Please reply ; Thank you.

sekihoutai

2009-06-28, 22:42

You purchase it through some online shop like himeyashop or some other one.

Chaos Chaud

2009-06-30, 07:05

zandercp11

2009-07-01, 10:03

Ive got the game and its installed and works ok. When I installed the voice patch, it still works, though im not sure if the voice patch does. When i replaced the seen.txt with the one from the SEEN_FV_snapshot_20081220, the game doesn't work. When I open the game, the screen just stays black and i get the flower mouse cursor, but the menu doesn't show up. Do I have to move any other files?

Rdei-San

2009-07-02, 04:33

i got the spirit to download the full game again, can someone tell me how to install and patch the game to make the game English subbed and japanese voiced? I'm too stupid for these patches :P

Thanks in advance!

Kykio

2009-07-03, 17:17

Having a bit of trouble. I've installed the game + voice patch. However, there are still no voices.

BakaMatt

2009-07-07, 09:16

ugh.. sorry bout this newb question.. but can anyone give me the link on where to download the visual novel? >.<

Ottocycle

2009-07-07, 09:19

ugh.. sorry bout this newb question.. but can anyone give me the link on where to download the visual novel? >.<
Sorry, but this is one place where people are not allowed to tell you.

risingstar3110

2009-07-07, 14:43

I guess this thread really need an FAQ section, since i admit i struggle with all of the mixed information go around.

I don't even know how big a translation patch is (thought it would be like 100~ mb, like all other game patch....but i guess not...seems like ~ 9 mb). Anyway, is enjoying myself by reading the translation script :P

Hope i can figure something out before i finish reading Kyou route...

BakaMatt

2009-07-08, 06:04

Edited ; i found out what the problem was.. i had the same problem as bladeofdarkness.. =p

But http://library.ust.hk/faq/faq-locale.html is no longer available >.< can anyone help me?

How do I have to have your system locale set to Japanese?

And is the voice patch = SEEN.txt? or is it another file that i need to download?

swtrooper42

2009-07-09, 12:13

Great. I'm halfway through Tomoyo's route, got a bad end, started over, and now the game freezes up on two of Kyou's scenes for no reason whatsoever.
I can't even fix it by upgrading or reinstalling because the resource page is down.

risingstar3110

2009-07-10, 01:44

...almost finished Kyou route. Actually i'm only up to 30th of April (oh man i almost say 30th of August.... Endless Eight syndrome xD) , so didn't really start at Kyou yet...

Struggle to start the game at 1st since the translated SEEN 9mb file didn't work for some strange reasons. Replace it with the 7.5mb and it works almost perfectly ( Some of Kyou's shouts look likes it was censored in that version :p)

I loves how Tomoya can freeze time when he sense flying dictionaries

evilr00t

2009-07-10, 07:54

r76-77-78 build compiled for Full Voice. Voice patch version later.

Changelog:
1) It looks like we have editors working on the project.
2) The wiki has been merged with the SVN. Translation quality has gone up a bit.
3) Whitespace has been stripped out of parts of the source. Please let us know if we have text running into other text.

Download from SVN here. (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents/a2qB54Bu8r3O9neJe5aVNr/download/SEENr78_FV.txt)

swtrooper42

2009-07-12, 18:36

I changed my SEEN file, but all I get is a black screen with the sakura cursor when I play.

nsl41288

2009-07-14, 19:36

In your picture, your able to click the word "Anpan" and then a popup shows explaining it further? That doesn't work for me. The game just freezes til I click the word again and nothing shows. Any help?

I'm using the Full Voice version with the SEEN_FV_snapshot_20081220.rar, no-dvd patch, and SEENr78_FV.txt

Nevermind. I got it to work by putting the VS2005_CPP_Runtime.rar in the folder.

One more question: Should I use the GAMEEXE.INI in the snapshot rar or the newer one?

Also, Whenever 2 character speak at the same time (ex. Tomoya and Kyou ganging up on Sunohara) You won't see any text in the spot where their names are and the only text you see in the textbox is one of the 2 speakers' names.

BakaMatt

2009-07-15, 08:02

nvm.. i've found it all and mine's working perfectly with voice patch and all.. :p

FhnuZoag

2009-07-26, 13:02

Is there any point getting r78 instead of r45 for FV? Translation notes seem to have disappeared from the newer version.

EDIT: Wait, huh, it is working?

Koneko-Kun

2009-08-13, 02:04

I'm very confused, and, from what I've read, most of you already have some sort of translation patch. All I want is a patch that translates the text. I dont care too much about voice translation or songs, just plain text. Can anyone give me a link to where I can download one? Anything is helpful as long as I understand what I'm doing while playing the game. Thanks!

boku

2009-08-13, 11:06

Koneko-Kun

2009-08-16, 03:36

Thanks SO much! I've been looking everywhere for one and haven't found anything at all. Great help =)

TsundereCake

2009-08-16, 11:13

Here it is. (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents)
For full voice version of game you need FV version of SEEN.txt, for voice patched version - simple version.
For more instructions, just browse through this thread.

So does that work for all versions of the game? More specifically, this one (http://www.himeyashop.com/product_info.php/products_id/200)? I haven't bought it yet, just planning for the future^^

boku

2009-08-17, 03:27

So does that work for all versions of the game? More specifically, this one (http://www.himeyashop.com/product_info.php/products_id/200)? I haven't bought it yet, just planning for the future^^Yes, it works with Full Voice version.

Aqua Knight

2009-08-26, 07:21

Umm...how do you save in the game?
And also when I press Esc or right click the game freezes,does anyone have that problem?

Tjfarmer

2009-08-28, 01:34

I need some help, I had the game working and got most of the routes done, but then I decided to do the voice patch, and after that, it fucked up my game.

So I reinstalled it and put the patch (not the voice patch, but all the files needed to get the game in English) back in, but now every time I try to load/save the game crashes, anyone know how to fix this problem?

spawnofthejudge

2009-09-02, 08:24

Umm...how do you save in the game?
And also when I press Esc or right click the game freezes,does anyone have that problem?Esc or right-clicking should bring up the context menu, in which the save option (I can't type kana at work, but it's spelled se-i-vu in katakana, IIRC) can be found.I need some help, I had the game working and got most of the routes done, but then I decided to do the voice patch, and after that, it fucked up my game.

So I reinstalled it and put the patch (not the voice patch, but all the files needed to get the game in English) back in, but now every time I try to load/save the game crashes, anyone know how to fix this problem?Did you try to keep your save files? I've heard that save files don't do well with reinstalls.

Khu

2009-09-04, 03:31

Save files do NOT work after patching.

I found this out myself. The data for the ones BEFORE the English patch come up in hiragana/kanji, whereas the English patch converts to English dates.

prnoct90

2009-09-16, 02:38

I was wondering, I'm learning Japanese, but I feel like it could be years before I know enough Kanji to play Clannad. Is there any type of kana (hirigana/katakana) or furigana patch for the game?

boku

2009-09-16, 14:30

Play it by ear ^_^
But honestly, it would be great. And something like a small "switch language on the fly" button, perhaps...

soka

2009-09-17, 18:30

I was wondering, I'm learning Japanese, but I feel like it could be years before I know enough Kanji to play Clannad. Is there any type of kana (hirigana/katakana) or furigana patch for the game?

You can try using AGTH (http://agthook.googlepages.com/index.html) and Furigana inserter (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/7913)
AGTH basically captures the text from the game and copies it to the clipboard, then furigana inserter monitors the clipboard and adds the sentences to a firefox page inserting furigana above the kanjis.
You can get more details in this hongfire (http://www.hongfire.com/forum/showthread.php?t=75958) thread.

Mooncow

2009-10-26, 11:11

Is this still being checked?

I tried various seen files, - the first seen and reallive files i used were fine, but the game was a bit glitched graphically, and the text was translated - but a bit weird (all colons were replaced with v, and few c's appeared randomly, some text was spaced out)

I've been trying the links found here, but i always get a "unable to format text" error.

Is there a quick tutorial in patching the game? what extra files are meant to be in the game folder? (im running windows 7, with clannad full voice)

i got the new seen.txt, do i need to replace the game ini? add the maps file? add the dll's? install the c++ redistributable?

I've tried a bunch but i keep getting the subtitle error. help would be great thanks!
Awesome work on the translation also! thanks!

EDIT:::::::

i got it to work!

I used SEEN_FV_snapshot_20081220.rar and copied all the files in there, and it works fine

SEENr78_FV.txt is the latest update right? so i'm using that seen file, with the snapshot files

thanks! If this is wrong (ie there a better updated version) please let me know!

xKeen

2009-11-08, 07:37

Kudryavka

2010-01-03, 02:25

I have the game already,no voice and no translation.I don't really know where to start =S
Anyone help?
How do I get After Story? I want to make it working perfectly.

Hmmm,I got the translations working.Now what?
You got the translations working, so you're done. :) Unless you want the Voice Patch as well?

Regarding the 10th Memorial Box Set, do you guys think the current versions would work with it?
I found a way. http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=2819216#post2819216

Chaos Chaud

2010-01-09, 19:18

I changed my SEEN file, but all I get is a black screen with the sakura cursor when I play.

I had to format my HD these days, I was reinstalling Clannad now when I came across this same problem. Does anyone know how I solve it?

Seitsuki

2010-01-11, 01:48

links for the voice patch for you torrent-phobic people.
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785527/KCvP.part01.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785702/KCvP.part02.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785603/KCvP.part03.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785471/KCvP.part04.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785655/KCvP.part05.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785961/KCvP.part06.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785664/KCvP.part07.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785675/KCvP.part08.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785811/KCvP.part09.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785633/KCvP.part10.rar
http://rapidshare.com/files/56785965/KCvP.part11.rar

Poetic Justice

2010-02-07, 09:10

So help me out here a bit.

I did a clean install of the game which was without voice, Got the voice patch, extracted all the files in the right places just like the readme said and then modified the gameexe.ini file.

Then i ran the game by using locale japanese, The game loads and the menu is in english.

Now when i click on new game i get the empty dialogue box and the game just hangs, What am i doing wrong?

Khu

2010-02-07, 23:57

You can't use the locale changer.

You have to change your non-unicode language to Japanese (found in Control Panel > Languages and Regional Settings)

Using AppLocale won't work.

Also, I had this problem before, I think it was because of the locale thing.

Also, did you make sure you put the .g00 files and modified the gameexe.ini correctly? Sometimes it helps to double check lol.

Poetic Justice

2010-02-08, 12:59

Ah thanks so much that worked, And goodbye social life!

Khu

2010-02-09, 00:20

Lol.

It'll be strengethed afterwards hopefully. :)

Poetic Justice

2010-02-16, 17:48

Well that was fun, But the game ended pretty quickly doncha guys think..:dots:

Dextro

2010-02-16, 18:00

Well that was fun, But the game ended pretty quickly doncha guys think..:dots:

Quickly? Are you really saying that about Clannad? Really? :heh:

Poetic Justice

2010-02-17, 08:53

I was being sarcastic, Most of the time i was cursing at the game to just end already. It kept dragging itself on and on and this was a painful problem in after story and some routes where the plot was really stretched out.

As someone who has never seen the anime before i still have a lot of complaints about the plot, Particularly the way Tomoya comes to terms with his father, But that doesn't stop it from being one of the best visual novels I've played.

Jun Maeda has really figured out the right way to overwhelm the player with emotions at the right time, And the motif right in the end about the Big Dango family being a metaphor for the people of the town, Its excellent writing, Pure and simple.

lolipedofin

2010-02-19, 21:44

The patcher I posted yesterday is for full voice only. I'm sorry that I forgot to mention that in my previous post. However, I had someone with Voice Patch do some testing for me, and...

New: r46 build for Voice Patch!

Full Voice: r45
Patcher (2.03MB)
Mirror (2.0MB)

Whoa... I'm lost here.... So, is the translation patch uploaded here, made with the consent of the people at baka-tsuki?? Is this fully a fully working 99.9% bug free patch?? What does the r45 stand for??

Could this is be a different endeavor altogether with the baka-tsuki's project, does anyone have any idea on what's happening there?? Asking for status, milestone, or even just some "how are you guys doing?" after almost 9 months without any updates can't really be called pestering, right?? >.<

Kudryavka

2010-02-21, 01:49

Whoa... I'm lost here.... So, is the translation patch uploaded here, made with the consent of the people at baka-tsuki?? Is this fully a fully working 99.9% bug free patch?? What does the r45 stand for??

Could this is be a different endeavor altogether with the baka-tsuki's project, does anyone have any idea on what's happening there?? Asking for status, milestone, or even just some "how are you guys doing?" after almost 9 months without any updates can't really be called pestering, right?? >.<
-No, the patch is not uploaded here. The translation files are at Baka-Tsuki's SVN.

-At this point, this is not yet a patch, just a bundle of files to modify the game. And it sure ain't bug free.

-r45, and all other r##, are names given to different releases of the SEEN, the main file of Clannad that contains all of the lines ingame, flags, keys, etc. needed in order for Clannad to work. Baka-Tsuki has gone about translating Clannad by taking the original Japanese SEEN, extracting text, translating it, and inserting it back into a new SEEN. This new SEEN replaces the Japanese lines with corresponding English lines. r45 is just the release number of the SEEN, and if you plan on going to the SVN to get the translation files, be sure to always get the latest SEEN release, which will be marked with r##, the ##s replaced with the highest number available. The newest release as of today is r78.

-Whaddaya mean, "a different endeavor"? Please explain.

-Don't ask about when this'll be done, because it is done. Yeah, it isn't completely bug free, so if you wanna watch the programmers talk about the new bugs they found and how to fix them on the SVN, go ahead. But they can't put a time estimate on how long to fix an unknown total amount of bugs, so please don't ask them to do the impossible.
If you see a typo in the translation while playing, feel free to head on over to the Wiki or SVN (I can't remember which) and fix it, and make the next SEEN release even better.

lolipedofin

2010-02-21, 05:13

Dextro

2010-02-21, 09:47

Kudryavka

2010-02-21, 12:20

By different endeavor, I'm referring whether the files uploaded here is made from a wholly different translation project to the one done at baka tsuki.... But nvm that, I understand now....

So, let me get this clear.... The project is done, there will be no "convenient patch" (that will do all the work) released anywhere... we just gotta take the latest SEEN file, replace the original SEEN file at the game folder, and that's it?? we're good to go?? Or do
I have to do something else??

I'm curious though, if the project is done and playable already, why has there been no announcement made at the wafflehouse or the baka-tsuki itself... i literally been waiting for the translation since.... well, forever.
There are still plans to release an easy-to-use patch, as there have been ever since Baka-Tsuki revived the project back in 2007. There isn't one now because it isn't 100% done. Translations are done, programming works basically, but like I said, there are still bugs and technical problems throughout that the team is still trying to fix. This is what's kept the patch at 99.9%.

And the SVN and everything, I'm pretty sure that isn't quite meant for the general public to use, but is for people from the team over at Wiki to transfer. The SVN is open like that to keep with the "everyone can contribute to the patch" motto that the entire project has. So, it hasn't been announced to the public to come and get the mostly done translation files because they aren't meant for the entire public yet.

Sorry about your waiting forever for the translation. You've just been looking in the wrong places for updates. Understandable, though.

legohorse

2010-02-21, 20:18

Anyone knows if the translated version works with Clannad VN for the PSP?

Kudryavka

2010-02-21, 20:56

Anyone knows if the translated version works with Clannad VN for the PSP?
Possibly. The translation project only supports the regular release and Full Voice atm. The chances of them ever trying to support a console or handheld port of Clannad are pretty much nil. You can try it yourself, though you're on your own with tweaking and programming and stuff.

Seripha

2010-02-22, 17:05

Does anybody possibly have screenshots of the menu translated?? I have the translated game but the menu is really getting to me...I don't need to translate it, I just want to know what everything I'm clicking on is. :|
I just need to know the ones with the question marks...

http://i47.tinypic.com/oh348g.jpg

Dextro

2010-02-22, 20:11

Here you go:

http://i47.tinypic.com/29upwl3.png

Seripha

2010-02-22, 21:18

Here you go:

http://i47.tinypic.com/29upwl3.png

AHH Thank you so much! How did you get yours translated like that?? Is there a patch for it? :D

Kudryavka

2010-02-23, 01:12

AHH Thank you so much! How did you get yours translated like that?? Is there a patch for it? :D
There's been a group of many people, known and anonymous, who've all put work into translating the images of the game. I found it on Hongfire, in a thread on how to get Clannad in English.
Don't want to encourage visiting Hongfire, a site that openly allows and promotes illegal game downloads, so I will thank Eversynth and everyone else who put work into this, and put a link to direct download.
Mediafire: http://www.mediafire.com/?znzwyheqnyh
Megaupload: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=JYPQFVY0
This only works with Full Voice, NOT the unvoiced version NOR the unvoiced version with the voice patch installed. And I don't know if these image translations have anything to do with Baka-Tsuki's translation project. Probably not.

Seripha

2010-02-23, 13:53

There's been a group of many people, known and anonymous, who've all put work into translating the images of the game. I found it on Hongfire, in a thread on how to get Clannad in English.
Don't want to encourage visiting Hongfire, a site that openly allows and promotes illegal game downloads, so I will thank Eversynth and everyone else who put work into this, and put a link to direct download.
Mediafire: http://www.mediafire.com/?znzwyheqnyh
Megaupload: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=JYPQFVY0
This only works with Full Voice, NOT the unvoiced version NOR the unvoiced version with the voice patch installed. And I don't know if these image translations have anything to do with Baka-Tsuki's translation project. Probably not.

Oh thank you so much... :D
I got my game from my friend for Christmas but it was in Japanese :|
I just recently got the translation haha but the menus were what kept bothering me xD

Edit: Bahh, for some reason it didn't work... :( The menus are still in Japanese. >.<

Another Edit: I think this may be it ...I don't actually have "Clannad Full Voice" what I have is the actual game which I applied the voice patch and translation patch to. :/

gaffer7

2010-02-27, 04:09

Oh thank you so much... :D
I got my game from my friend for Christmas but it was in Japanese :|
I just recently got the translation haha but the menus were what kept bothering me xD

Edit: Bahh, for some reason it didn't work... :( The menus are still in Japanese. >.<

Another Edit: I think this may be it ...I don't actually have "Clannad Full Voice" what I have is the actual game which I applied the voice patch and translation patch to. :/

Yeah, if you don't have the Full Voice version of the game, the patch won't translate the menu; that was my problem too before I managed to get the FV version! Depends I guess on how much you care about that menu being translated; you may not think it's worth your while getting the FV version, and I certainly loved this game to bits even without a translated menu!

legohorse

2010-03-06, 08:32

Anyone knows how to play the game in full screen? For some reason when I first start the game it can be played full screen but after quitting it once and starting again it goes to window mode.

Khu

2010-03-06, 20:10

Alt ENTERRRR.

rinoaa52r

2010-03-14, 16:50

I have a Installer file for the Translation for the Full Voice version of the game. It has the r78 version of the Seen file and English menus.

http://www.4shared.com/file/241258241/885daab0/Clannad_English_Patch.html

Please backup your install of clannad before running patch just in case it messes it up. You might have to change the install dir if you didn't use the default in origional install. Any problems I will try to work out.

laxio

2010-03-24, 08:23

May I know what to download and where to put them when I'm done? Thanks a lot!

animebuster

2010-04-23, 03:17

Does either translation patch work with the unvoiced version with no voice patch?

Khu

2010-04-23, 03:35

Yep, they do.

Doesn't matter which version, but for the voiced you cannot change your name otherwise it goes weird.

justinefremlouw

2010-04-24, 16:14

just wondering, I heard a while back that some parts of the epilogue aren't translated, is this still the case?

Kudryavka

2010-04-24, 18:47

just wondering, I heard a while back that some parts of the epilogue aren't translated, is this still the case?
Nah, everything's translated now.

justinefremlouw

2010-04-24, 19:04

oh that's cool...i've been holding back all this time because I heard some parts of the epilogue (i think it was clips/CGs of Misae's path?) isn't translated...

I'll go ahead and start playing this soon then 0.o

Lord Metaknight

2010-04-25, 08:07

please tell me when the translation files for the psp version of this game is available and where to download it

THANKS IN ADVANCE!!!

Khu

2010-04-25, 09:11

Probably never will.

Translating for the psp is hard since you have to get into the iso and wrangle round with it yourself, then recompile it. Too much work, really.

Get yourself the PC version, lol.

And stop stealing my personal text. *whack*

Lord Metaknight

2010-04-25, 18:52

oh if that's the case i guess i have to do it myself since the translation files are not available

WISH ME LUCK!!!

and sorry for stealing your personal text T_T

Khu

2010-04-25, 22:01

lol.

I guess, gl with that.

remember to share afterwards~

justinefremlouw

2010-04-26, 15:16

Actually, it has been done...kinda

I think it only works for unvoiced version (and no, you can't "voice patch" it), and I'm not even sure if it works 100%....I kinda stopped using the PSP for VN as they most often suck for VNs...

BTW, regarding my earlier question on Full Voice PC version...I looked around and apparently, there still are some CGs that are untranslated >>

waterhaus

2010-05-10, 13:54

Hi, I was wondering if anyone had any info about Clannad FV with rlvm on mac:

I decided to install the Full Voice on a friend's computer so I could transfer it. The install went fine, most recent Seen.txt update and menu patch all OK, and I ended up with a perfectly working Windows install with English txt. So I transfer the file directory whole to my external HDD and put it on my macbook, use most recent rvlm, and everything appears to work. I get to the point in the prologue when Okazaki looks at the sky and the KEY logo shows up, then Nagisa sighs, then it freezes. Music continues, but it stays looking at the sky, and I become unable to click anywhere to save or load or get to the menu. Does anyone have any idea what I might be able to do?

Thanks!

kevs926

2010-05-17, 11:53

http://clannad.thewafflehouse.net/index.php

according to that the project is not done how come you guys seems like you already finished this??? you know how to read jap?

please please i need an answer drop me a pm on rizon pls pls nick: kevs926

Khu

2010-05-18, 01:16

There are several versions of the incomplete one. It is indeed mostly complete, actually, they are just doing the menus and adding T/L notes and things. You can get all the routes, at least.

ISighZ

2010-05-24, 18:13

Hi. Not sure if this is the right place to go, but I have a question.
Since you need 8 light to play After Story.. If I use 1 light to grant Fuko's wish... I will only have 7 light left.. Do I still get to play After Story???

Khu

2010-05-25, 01:57

yes, you actually do need to pray for Fuuko. However, "pray" is different from granting her wish, so I dunno. it's probably the same, though.

ISighZ

2010-05-25, 21:20

Thanks but.. I don't think you answer my question...Lol.

zette

2010-05-26, 06:19

Yes, you will still be able to unlock After Story even if you use one light to grant Fuko's wish.

grylsyjaeger

2010-05-26, 07:05

There are several versions of the incomplete one. It is indeed mostly complete, actually, they are just doing the menus and adding T/L notes and things. You can get all the routes, at least.

Where can you get the latest SEEN file, again? I haven't touched mine for well over eighteen months.

Khu

2010-05-26, 07:13

I haven't either. XD

I used the one I first got when I got the game, lol.

*shrug*

Leo_Otaku

2010-05-27, 16:45

was wondering if there were plans to translate the psp games i think they are the light novel version stories.

Khu

2010-05-28, 03:05

Way too hard to, really.

You can put Clannad on your iPhone pretty easily, though XD

Claude~

2010-06-09, 19:27

I am expecting my copy of Clannad Full Voice to come in in the next few days, and I'm getting things ready for the translation patch. I am somewhat clueless about how it all works, but I want to make sure that I am going to do everything correctly.

Please excuse the fact that I probably don't know what I'm talking about. Can someone tell me if I have all the right things:

-Downloaded the SEEN_FV_snapshot_20081220.rar, which contains the SEEN.txt the rlBabel.dll, gameexe.ini, and 1.5.0.4.map. Are these files correct or is there a more recent SEEN.txt I should get or something? I have come to understand these files go in the main directory and that I should overwrite everything, is this right?

-I also have the menu and graphics translation .rar, which I can follow the readme to install - shouldn't be a problem.

Are there any other files I need? Or do I have anything that I actually do not need? Also, are there any other steps or details about putting these files in that I should know?

I also heard about some kind of "no DVD" patch - what does this do and do I need it?

I appreciate it if anyone could help me out. I am sorry if I have this way wrong; I really don't understand it much. This is just what I gathered from reading various parts of this thread.

Orophin

2010-06-09, 21:19

I am expecting my copy of Clannad Full Voice to come in in the next few days, and I'm getting things ready for the translation patch. I am somewhat clueless about how it all works, but I want to make sure that I am going to do everything correctly.

Please excuse the fact that I probably don't know what I'm talking about. Can someone tell me if I have all the right things:

-Downloaded the SEEN_FV_snapshot_20081220.rar, which contains the SEEN.txt the rlBabel.dll, gameexe.ini, and 1.5.0.4.map. Are these files correct or is there a more recent SEEN.txt I should get or something? I have come to understand these files go in the main directory and that I should overwrite everything, is this right?

-I also have the menu and graphics translation .rar, which I can follow the readme to install - shouldn't be a problem.

Are there any other files I need? Or do I have anything that I actually do not need? Also, are there any other steps or details about putting these files in that I should know?
Here's an installer that will do everything for you: Clannad English Patch (http://www.4shared.com/file/241258241/885daab0/Clannad_English_Patch.html)

Kudos to rinoaa52r (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=2957715&postcount=870) for making it.

I also heard about some kind of "no DVD" patch - what does this do and do I need it?
The game requires you to put the DVD inside your computer every single time you start it up. The no DVD patch, however, lets you play the game without having to do so.

Claude~

2010-06-10, 07:41

Ah okay that sure makes it easier. Thanks a lot!

Ocatio

2010-06-23, 19:10

You can put Clannad on your iPhone pretty easily, though XD

woah woah woah, hold on a minute. Are you serious? And if so would you mind sharing with me how you go about doing this?

Khu

2010-06-24, 03:24

Have fun. Found it while trying to find a way to put it onto PSP straight from the comp installation. XD (http://salburg.net/clannad.html)

Dextro

2010-06-24, 08:32

Have fun. Found it while trying to find a way to put it onto PSP straight from the comp installation. XD (http://salburg.net/clannad.html)

Dang... now I wish I could do the same on my Android phone... :(

Mintree

2010-06-24, 21:02

Have fun. Found it while trying to find a way to put it onto PSP straight from the comp installation. XD (http://salburg.net/clannad.html)

Has anyone got this to work? I tried, but the files are not on the sites the guide link to you. Has anyone have the files or am i misunderstanding what the guide is saying?

nekokitty7

2010-07-17, 02:15

Everytime I try to download and install this game it comes up with 'Please insert disk 1 and click okay' at the last step of installation. Is there any way to fix that? All the problem solving with the disk I read about were after the game was installed, not before...

Claude~

2010-11-19, 11:04

Here's an installer that will do everything for you: Clannad English Patch (http://www.4shared.com/file/241258241/885daab0/Clannad_English_Patch.html)

Kudos to rinoaa52r (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=2957715&postcount=870) for making it.

Hello again,

I uninstalled Clannad because I went off to school for awhile, but during winter break I will want to play it again. I no longer have the translation patch, and noticed that this link does not work anymore. Does anyone have a new link to the installer?

TheRealTRXD

2010-11-21, 18:54

Hello again,

I uninstalled Clannad because I went off to school for awhile, but during winter break I will want to play it again. I no longer have the translation patch, and noticed that this link does not work anymore. Does anyone have a new link to the installer?

A quick google search gives you it :)

Link (http://clannad.thewafflehouse.net/index.php)

Claude~

2010-11-24, 12:39

Thanks, I had actually been hoping someone had another installer that could do the work for me but I was able to figure it out using the files on there so I got it working.

dashkid

2010-12-07, 10:26

Slayer91

2010-12-11, 12:40

yO,
People I desperately need your help!:upset: For few last days I keep reading posts here and didn't found a solution.
I have Clannad Voice Patch version. Of course there is a problem with Fuuko route - game freezes when Tomoya&Nagisa declare to help her. So i downloaded lots of good seen files but there were lots of problems. First the screen turn black and only a flower that means to do choices was visible. Then when I updated the seen/RealLive or both files there was only "Error: cannot translate the text" message in boxes. Now when I thought that I finally patched the game correctly with reinstallation of the game, then the Voice Pack and the PatchVP_r30 that I've found in this forum the new problem appeared displayed in the picture below:
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/2549/59239872.jpg
This error is displayed even when I have newest SEEN for VP (r46). :upset:

So my question is how to patch Clannad to the version where every route is translated and everything is ok (everything I need is text - I am not interested in English menu or voices). Please people help me with this task couse this is really important for me :upset: :(

Polarem

2010-12-11, 23:29

dashkid, I have no experience with rlvm, sorry.

Slayer91, I'm on the Full Voice version so I might be stabbing in the dark, but try also updating rlBabel.dll, ?.?.?.?.map (the "?"s should be numbers that match your version of reallive.exe), gameexe.ini and reallive.exe.manifest

Slayer91

2010-12-20, 08:41

THX but I made it somehow (course Okazaki-san irritating bug is in game ehhh). Could someone explain me the difference between VP and FV versions? :)
Actually I'm downloadin' the FV version but I'm afraid if there are English voices (i REALLY hate this couse I really like voices from original Clannad - please tell me that I'm wrong :( ).

Khu

2010-12-20, 09:23

There is no English dub for the game o_O;

It hasn't been released in America like...ever.

Polarem

2010-12-20, 12:32

Like Khu said, you have nothing to fear. ;-) No English voices exist for the Clannad visual novel.

The original 2004 version of Clannad for PC had no voices. The 2006 PS2 version was voiced, and these voice files were used (by fans) to create the "Voice Patch" that modifies the original PC version. Then, in 2008, the "Full Voice" version for PC was released (by KEY), which had voices plus new artwork.

If you know how to use rlDev and SVN, you could compile the SEEN.txt yourself from the latest translations, which is free of the Okazaki-san bug, I believe. :D It also features improved translations, the ability to "return to previous selection", and voice playback of previous dialogue.

Polarem

2010-12-26, 00:45

Actually... is there any reason you're sticking with r30? r46 is available for the Voice Patch version at http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=2450110#post2450110

For Full Voice you can find r78 at http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents

Khu

2011-01-04, 22:23

Hey hey, might wanna edit that.

or you get owned by mods :/

No illegal stuff here.

Hooves

2011-01-04, 22:38

Hey hey, might wanna edit that.

or you get owned by mods :/

No illegal stuff here.

Yep, you will be enacting the wrath of rule 1.1 the part where it says.

Illegal copies of software (e.g. ROMs, ISOs, "warez", etc.)

Is not allowed on this forum.

Xcandescent

2011-01-19, 16:46

Just got Clannad FV up and running on WinXP last night, after a few days of wrestling with OCaml and compiling the latest (test?) version (r94?) from SVN. For the record, the rldev toolchain is nearly impossible to build, and seems to require a 32-bit version of WinXP with Cygwin, and OCaml native-code support. (There seem to be problems with compiling the assembly code for OCaml 3.09 on 64-bit platforms, which is where the 32-bit OS comes in.) GODI flat out won't build OCaml 3.09 on Snow Leopard or Cygwin on XP (haven't tried Linux), so all the rldev dependencies have to be built manually (joy!)

I have a few questions about the status of the project:

1.) When was the last time someone associated with the project posted here? evilr00t/Shizuka (I assume they're the same person) last posted in July of 2009. That was also the last time a test SEEN.txt build was posted (r78). There's a "keksmeister" who's been working on a new branch in the SVN, but I don't think that person's posted here (and the branch hasn't updated since October 2010). That's discouraging.

2.) There's glacial movement on the Wiki. If there's any editing/proofreading happening, it ain't obvious. The last major change was that Polarem posted strings from graphics files that need to be translated, which include the untranslated text during the hill-climbing sequence at the beginning. I'm guessing translation and bitmap edits need to happen here, as separate processes? (I'm assuming any scanlator with a working knowledge of vaconv could make their own test fixes for this.) This and "Image-based text (baseball, system, menu)" seem to be the last untranslated parts, as far as I can tell.

3.) It looks like the kepago strings are fully translated -- at least the ones marked as actually used in-game. keksmeister's branch has a Python script to incorporate the fixes into a build; I guess I'll know if it works when I get the chance to (finally) play the game.

4.) There are allegedly fully-translated menus (NOT Eversynth's) in an internal build somewhere. I don't see them in the SVN, and the untranslated strings (+ instructions for incorporating into a build) haven't been posted either.

5.) There also exist internal scripts to sync SVN with Wiki -- again, not released. (I don't count mDuo13's "scraper.py" script, since he insists that it's buggy, and strips out bold and italic codes ... making it not much more useful than a manual copypasta of the wiki.) There IS a script that syncs the Wiki with SVN, but I'm guessing that was done out of necessity, because someone made a bunch of changes in SVN without changing the Wiki (whoops).

Have I got all that right?

I'd like to see someone on the team post a Wiki to SVN sync script, and test translations for the remaining menus not done by Eversynth. It would also be nice to get a clarification on what's left to translate. Actually, it would be nice to see ANY signs of life from the leads on this project, because it looks and smells abandoned to me, and that's really discouraging.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-01-19, 19:11

GODI flat out won't build OCaml 3.09 on Snow Leopard or Cygwin on XP (haven't tried Linux), so all the rldev dependencies have to be built manually (joy!)
Yep... I'm sure I gained some grey hairs from the frustration of trying to build OCaml and rldev. In the end I set up a new Ubuntu virtual machine just for this purpose, as I don't like introducing libraries into a system without a package manager for easy uninstallation.

1.) When was the last time someone associated with the project posted here? evilr00t/Shizuka (I assume they're the same person) last posted in July of 2009.
2009 sounds right for AnimeSuki; the last core-team post on the wiki talk page was in 2008. I tried IRC recently; Velocity7 and Shizuka seem perpetually logged in but I haven't seen them post. The few people who answered my queries weren't sure where to find them.

The last resort would be to leave a message on Velocity7's blog.

2.) There's glacial movement on the Wiki. If there's any editing/proofreading happening, it ain't obvious.
Since November 2010, there has been 1 person doing glacial editing/proofreading, and 2 people popping by the talk page to ask questions.

I'm guessing translation and bitmap edits need to happen here, as separate processes? (I'm assuming any scanlator with a working knowledge of vaconv could make their own test fixes for this.) This and "Image-based text (baseball, system, menu)" seem to be the last untranslated parts, as far as I can tell.

Yes, the only texts that still really need translation (as far as I know) are those locked in image files, which include some story text but are mostly menu text, system text (credits, legal stuff + notifications), and baseball stats + scoreboard. If what you said in (4) is true, then there's less translating required.

Translating and bitmap editing can indeed be done separately; I was going to ask around for translators after I upload the system, menu, and baseball text onto the wiki (I can Photoshop, but can't translate anything complex)

3.) It looks like the kepago strings are fully translated -- at least the ones marked as actually used in-game. keksmeister's branch has a Python script to incorporate the fixes into a build; I guess I'll know if it works when I get the chance to (finally) play the game.

It works :) The "Whump!"s need spaces after each "!" though (You'll see them lots if you follow Sunohara as he bugs Tomoyo)

4.) There are allegedly fully-translated menus (NOT Eversynth's) in an internal build somewhere. I don't see them in the SVN, and the untranslated strings (+ instructions for incorporating into a build) haven't been posted either.

I'll get those onto the wiki later today. It might be easier to re-do them than to hunt for them.

The process for incorporating them is:
i) Use vaconv to convert .g00 --> .png
ii) Paint translated text into .png
iii) Use vaconv to convert .png --> .g00
iv) Replace relevant .g00 files in your [Clannad_FV]/g00/ directory

5.) .... someone made a bunch of changes in SVN without changing the Wiki (whoops).
I've manually merged all the SVN changes into the Wiki (see talk page for more details). Corollary: If you want the most up-to-date edits for your game, build your SEEN.TXT from the Wiki files instead of the SVN.

I'd like to see someone on the team post a Wiki to SVN sync script, and test translations for the remaining menus not done by Eversynth. It would also be nice to get a clarification on what's left to translate. Actually, it would be nice to see ANY signs of life from the leads on this project, because it looks and smells abandoned to me, and that's really discouraging.

I wouldn't bother with sync scripts until we manage to get in touch with a core-team member, as I don't have SVN write access. See above for menu/translation progress.

The project has stopped and started a few times before, so don't get too discouraged just yet!

Polarem

2011-01-20, 10:28

Ok, most image texts have been uploaded (I've left out the baseball scores and credits -- I'll do those myself). They're at
http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Clannad:Image_text_%28Story%29
http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Clannad:Image_text_%28System%29

Any translation help would be greatly appreciated!

Xcandescent

2011-01-20, 17:04

Yes, the only texts that still really need translation (as far as I know) are those locked in image files, which include some story text but are mostly menu text, system text (credits, legal stuff + notifications), and baseball stats + scoreboard. If what you said in (4) is true, then there's less translating required.I think it's was velocity7 who said it in this thread, but it was a few years ago, and it was (to my knowledge) never released anywhere.

It works :) The "Whump!"s need spaces after each "!" though (You'll see them lots if you follow Sunohara as he bugs Tomoyo)So I need to add spaces at the end of each line, and rebuild? OK.

I'll get those onto the wiki later today. It might be easier to re-do them than to hunt for them.OK, looks like those are up now. Unless the core-team plans on publically releasing the menus Eversynth hasn't already done, re-doing those is the only option. There's also the issue of translating the Windows dialog boxes; there's at least a Font dialog and a Movie dialog accessible from the Config menu, and there may be others. I'm guessing that'll involve having to patch the executable (and that's well out of my league).

I've manually merged all the SVN changes into the Wiki (see talk page for more details). Corollary: If you want the most up-to-date edits for your game, build your SEEN.TXT from the Wiki files instead of the SVN.

I wouldn't bother with sync scripts until we manage to get in touch with a core-team member, as I don't have SVN write access.The issue is less updating the SVN, than keeping my own files up-to-date. We know core team has their own scripts, so any issues with the SVN being out-of-date is their responsibility. I just don't like the idea of having to manually copy/paste tons of files out of the Wiki for updates (and the history/revisions logs seem to only be accessible by clicking on each file). I don't know if that scraper script can be hacked to worked properly either (since I don't know Python).

Also, it's unclear to me how people have been editing files in the SVN, if you can't even get write access now. Did they change that? There seems to have been at least one major incident where a person (Kinny Riddle) edited a bunch of files in SVN, and the core team had to write a script to resync the changes to the wiki (see the "wiki-merge" branch).

The project has stopped and started a few times before, so don't get too discouraged just yet!Well, it's good to know someone's still trying to finish this thing. :) I mean, most people would be fine with just a finished rough translation (as evidenced by all the people who have played on earlier builds), and this project is so close to that point that it's absolutely maddening.

I can't translate, but I'll see if I can persuade some Japanese-speaking friends into possibly helping out.

-XCN-

Xcandescent

2011-01-20, 17:09

Yep... I'm sure I gained some grey hairs from the frustration of trying to build OCaml and rldev. In the end I set up a new Ubuntu virtual machine just for this purpose, as I don't like introducing libraries into a system without a package manager for easy uninstallation.Out of morbid curiosity: did you use a 32-bit kernel? Because it would be nice to have another point of data regarding OCaml 3.09's native-code compiler and 64-bit kernels. (I couldn't get anything earlier than 3.11 to build on Snow Leopard ... and there were major changes in the pre-processor and the language that made 3.09 code incompatible.)

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-01-21, 04:36

So I need to add spaces at the end of each line, and rebuild? OK.
The Python script needs to be changed (I don't know how)... Currently, any spaces we add to to the end of a line in kepago_translations.txt will be stripped.

It does compile as-is though... you'll just see lots of missing spaces whenever Sunohara gets kicked around by Tomoyo.

I'm guessing that'll involve having to patch the executable (and that's well out of my league).
Yes, those are embedded into RealLive.exe. Reshack can be used to view and edit them. I haven't tried it yet though.

I just don't like the idea of having to manually copy/paste tons of files out of the Wiki for updates (and the history/revisions logs seem to only be accessible by clicking on each file).
If you're happy to install the Qt SDK and PM me your email address, I'll send you the source code for the program I wrote to grab the Wiki pages. Or, I can send you the binaries for Windows if you don't want the SDK (it's 32-bit, but should run under 64-bit Windows)[/QUOTE]

Out of morbid curiosity: did you use a 32-bit kernel?
No... all my environments are 32-bit, sorry.

Also, it's unclear to me how people have been editing files in the SVN, if you can't even get write access now. Did they change that? There seems to have been at least one major incident where a person (Kinny Riddle) edited a bunch of files in SVN, and the core team had to write a script to resync the changes to the wiki (see the "wiki-merge" branch).
SVN has always been core-team only, I believe. There was a bit of confusion in the beginning about whether the Wiki or SVN should be the "main" editing grounds. It was eventually decided that all work is to be done on the Wiki, with changes pulled into SVN periodically.

Yea, I saw the de-sync incident. It was a shame, since his changes were great! Oh, did they have a script hat could tell which lines to keep? I compared them manually and imported them into the Wiki. Looking back now... I must be crazy. :D

Well, it's good to know someone's still trying to finish this thing. :) I mean, most people would be fine with just a finished rough translation (as evidenced by all the people who have played on earlier builds), and this project is so close to that point that it's absolutely maddening.

I can't translate, but I'll see if I can persuade some Japanese-speaking friends into possibly helping out.
Hehe, I hear ya! I thought Clannad is too good a story to be told with a mediocre presentation. Some of the graphical text is crucial to the story too, like...
...the last thing said by the girl in the Illusionary World: "Sayounara, Papa". I misread it as "sayounara pa-pat-su" at first, so was very confused. Got goosebumps when I realized the proper meaning later.

It'll be great if you can find Jap-speakers to pitch in; I've been unsuccessful so far :( Feel free to pick a SEEN and proofread, too.

Khu

2011-01-21, 04:53

Wow, this thread has become the home for the team. :D

CARRY ON, GOOD SIRS.

Polarem

2011-01-21, 05:03

CARRY ON, GOOD SIRS.
That's the plan! ;) Would be better if we can get hold of the core team though; anyone know where to find them?

Jecht2

2011-01-21, 19:12

That's the plan! ;) Would be better if we can get hold of the core team though; anyone know where to find them?

You can always try contacting Velocity7 through his twitter feed. He seems to update that semi frequently.

Xcandescent

2011-01-21, 21:03

The Python script needs to be changed (I don't know how)... Currently, any spaces we add to to the end of a line in kepago_translations.txt will be stripped.

It does compile as-is though... you'll just see lots of missing spaces whenever Sunohara gets kicked around by Tomoyo.Hmm ... OK. I don't know Python either, but it shouldn't be too hard to figure out what's happening in that script just from reading the Python documentation. If I have time, I'll poke at it.

If you're happy to install the Qt SDK and PM me your email address, I'll send you the source code for the program I wrote to grab the Wiki pages. Or, I can send you the binaries for Windows if you don't want the SDK (it's 32-bit, but should run under 64-bit Windows)Source is fine. I'll PM you my E-mail later.

No... all my environments are 32-bit, sorry.Don't be; I think that's why you were ultimately able to build the tools.

On further poking around, I think the issue I ran into is something similar to this bug in 3.11.0 (http://caml.inria.fr/mantis/view.php?id=4861). Since I'm not a complete masochist, I'm not going to try another rebuild ... but maybe that'll be a good starting point if anyone else wants to try a 32-bit build under a 64-bit OS. Fun fact: the last official OSX binaries for OCaml 3.09 were built for Tiger ... which was the last 32-bit iteration of OSX.

Yea, I saw the de-sync incident. It was a shame, since his changes were great! Oh, did they have a script hat could tell which lines to keep? I compared them manually and imported them into the Wiki. Looking back now... I must be crazy. :DCheck out the "wiki-merge" branch. There's a bit of JavaScript there that seems to have been used to sync changes from SVN to the Wiki. Of course, if you went back and manually synced things by hand, you would actually know if that script had been run or not, but from the discussion, it looks like that was the plan.

Hehe, I hear ya! I thought Clannad is too good a story to be told with a mediocre presentation. Some of the graphical text is crucial to the story too, like...
...the last thing said by the girl in the Illusionary World: "Sayounara, Papa". I misread it as "sayounara pa-pat-su" at first, so was very confused. Got goosebumps when I realized the proper meaning later.Yeah, the graphical text is crucial, esp. when you realize how much of it is spoken out loud (and translated) on the DVD's for the anime.

It'll be great if you can find Jap-speakers to pitch in; I've been unsuccessful so far :( Feel free to pick a SEEN and proofread, too.I've pointed a couple of people to the BT wiki, and mentioned that there's basically only a couple pages left to translate. Hopefully something good will happen.

I have no problem with proofreading things in English, but it's frowned upon by the core team, due to the potential for rewording things in a way that doesn't match the meaning/intent of the original Japanese. That said, I've seen a fair bit of awkward wording just playing through the beginning, and I don't think a little clean-up would hurt ... but it's not something I'd be comfortable doing on the Wiki.

-XCN-

Xcandescent

2011-01-21, 21:28

Wow, this thread has become the home for the team. :D

CARRY ON, GOOD SIRS.:)

Well, to be fair, it started as the home for the core team, before they vanished into thin air.

I wouldn't consider myself to be part of that team; more like a random fan who's desperate to see the project wrapped up, and knows just enough to be able to run build scripts, but not much more. There's not a whole lot I can do, besides be a cheerleader for new translators.

Given the choice, I'd much rather see the core team finish this up ... but given that the last beta (r78) shipped in July 2009, you can understand why I'm skeptical of that ever happening. So I'm just doing what I can.

Or, to be blunt: if this was a stalled-out open source project, it would've been long since forked by another team, finished, and released as a completed rough edit/beta. I don't know the etiquette of how that works with fan translations (or what sort of drama that would entail), but that's definitely how it works for open source code.

-XCN-

Xcandescent

2011-01-22, 03:32

The good news is I think I've fixed the Python script. The bad news is I've had a closer look at the .ke files in the keksmeister_bugfix branch from SVN, and they're in some weird half-fixed state -- some of the strings have already been replaced, some haven't. Example: SEEN0414.ke already has English replacements on lines 14-15.

So if there are already places where "Whump!" or "Whuump!" have been previously inserted, they'd have to be found and replaced with extra space versions BEFORE replacing the remainder of the Japanese text. Either that, or there would need to be code to check whether there's trailing spaces before an EOL. Probably a piece of cake for anyone familiar with Python ... which I am not.

Anyway, in apply_ke_translation.py, replace line 19 with:

tl_dict[lines[i].rstrip('\r\n')] = lines[i+1].rstrip('\r\n')

Then add extra spaces at the end of the "Whump!" and "Whuump!" lines in the kepago_translations.txt file before you run the new script.

I thought about regenerating the .ke files in a disassembly and running the script on that ... but I just found out my build of rldev (the patched version from Assembla SVN) isn't disassembling properly, as the outputs are subtly different from the working versions in keksmeister_bugfix; it's adding extra lines that shouldn't be there, and it's not outputting font size tags properly. No idea why, and no real way to troubleshoot. I can still build a working SEEN.txt, thankfully.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-01-23, 00:51

You can always try contacting Velocity7 through his twitter feed. He seems to update that semi frequently.
Ok, I will do that. Thanks!

Check out the "wiki-merge" branch. There's a bit of JavaScript there that seems to have been used to sync changes from SVN to the Wiki. Of course, if you went back and manually synced things by hand, you would actually know if that script had been run or not, but from the discussion, it looks like that was the plan.
Ah, so they did. Hmm... that script only replaces the entire Wiki page with the SVN version though... it would've been Bad News if the script was run, as any updates on the the Wiki would've been wiped.

Yeah, the graphical text is crucial, esp. when you realize how much of it is spoken out loud (and translated) on the DVD's for the anime.
There's a good point for consideration... do you think we should make the VN dialogues match their anime counterparts?

I've pointed a couple of people to the BT wiki, and mentioned that there's basically only a couple pages left to translate. Hopefully something good will happen.
Huzzah!

I wouldn't consider myself to be part of that team; more like a random fan who's desperate to see the project wrapped up
Same here... I jumped on board hoping to help iron out the final wrinkles in the project. Was a bit shocked to find it stalled, and wasn't quite sure what to do, so I decided to start cleaning until the core team comes back.

I don't know the etiquette of how that works with fan translations (or what sort of drama that would entail)
That's something I forgot to consider :-S Maybe I should stop editing until I talk to one of the project leaders.

Anyway, in apply_ke_translation.py, replace line 19 with:

tl_dict[lines[i].rstrip('\r\n')] = lines[i+1].rstrip('\r\n')

Then add extra spaces at the end of the "Whump!" and "Whuump!" lines in the kepago_translations.txt file before you run the new script.
That did the trick; great work!

http://i56.tinypic.com/useqd.jpg

The bad news is I've had a closer look at the .ke files in the keksmeister_bugfix branch from SVN, and they're in some weird half-fixed state -- some of the strings have already been replaced, some haven't.
That's actually not an issue :D They only translated names to fix certain bugs (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/tickets) (as seen from the SVN logs and diffs). No "Whumps" or anything like that have been inserted.

Now that reminds me: There are still some bugs to fix (e.g. Fuuko prank selections aren't spaced properly, + they "spill" out of their text boxes; there are still BGM issues when gaining Fuuko Master). Time to learn Kepago...? :heh:

I thought about regenerating the .ke files in a disassembly and running the script on that ... but I just found out my build of rldev (the patched version from Assembla SVN) isn't disassembling properly
rldev's algorithms are "lossy"; you can't regenerate the source files from the output, especially if it's translated (I think kprl relies on the presence of Japanese text as guidance).

BTW, did you manage to get proper English .utf files from kprl? When I tried, my lines were filled with "\s{strS[1901]}" instead of translated game text.

Xcandescent

2011-01-23, 04:31

There's a good point for consideration... do you think we should make the VN dialogues match their anime counterparts?Well, they'll sort of match anyway, since they're basically the same thing, but the translation should be a translation of what's actually said in the game (which I'm finding can differ in subtle ways from the anime).

That's something I forgot to consider :-S Maybe I should stop editing until I talk to one of the project leaders.Well, it's a moot point while B-T is down, but there are guidelines for changes and submissions. I don't believe they'd discourage a contribution, and ultimately it's their responsibility to keep the Wiki cleaned up. What we're doing here isn't really forking the project at all; it's more or less wrapping up the .0001% that's left for a rough translation.

I personally think it's OK to fix blatant errors like misspellings or word swaps (one of which I ran into during a play test today), but anything concerning word choice should be left to a translator (and probably * for an editor's attention).

Speaking of B-T ... does that script you sent me request files from the Wiki one at a time, or all at once?

That did the trick; great work!Sweet! I haven't gotten to that point in the game yet, so I had no way to test it.

That's actually not an issue :D They only translated names to fix certain bugs (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/tickets) (as seen from the SVN logs and diffs). No "Whumps" or anything like that have been inserted.OK, cool. Actually, on the topic of weirdness in files -- have you noticed untranslated <9999> lines in some of the UTF's? Because I have, and I don't get what they're there for. They usually show up in the middle of a file, seemingly out of line order.

Now that reminds me: There are still some bugs to fix (e.g. Fuuko prank selections aren't spaced properly, + they "spill" out of their text boxes; there are still BGM issues when gaining Fuuko Master). Time to learn Kepago...? :heh:(shudder) It may be an easier fix than that ... hopefully.

rldev's algorithms are "lossy"; you can't regenerate the source files from the output, especially if it's translated (I think kprl relies on the presence of Japanese text as guidance).Well, the problem isn't getting back source files -- it's that I'm not generating identical .ke bytecode dumps to what's in SVN. That bothers me because I don't know if it's an issue with kprl, with ocaml, or something else. As it stands, I still can't get OCaml 3.09.3 to pass its own bootstrap test on Cygwin -- it always fails at the exact same point. I can build the native code compiler and the rldev toolset, but I have no guarantee that they're built correctly.

Oddly enough, I was able to get a proper OCaml 3.09.3 build running on Leopard (which defaults to 32-bit builds). However, the resulting kprl build keeps choking on SEEN7500. However, the questionable kprl on Cygwin has no issues with it, and the resulting SEEN.txt seems to run fine (at least, as far as I can tell without 300 hours of testing). Basically, I have zero confidence in the toolchain, and would feel much more comfortable if the code was updated to OCaml 3.11 or 3.12 -- but that ain't happening.

BTW, did you manage to get proper English .utf files from kprl? When I tried, my lines were filled with "\s{strS[1901]}" instead of translated game text.I'm a little confused -- are you saying that your SEEN.txt builds are causing weird characters to be printed in-game? Or is this a question about disassembling one of the beta builds which already have some translated text? I haven't tried the latter yet.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-01-24, 02:47

I personally think it's OK to fix blatant errors like misspellings or word swaps (one of which I ran into during a play test today), but anything concerning word choice should be left to a translator (and probably * for an editor's attention).
I see. Besides the awkward expressions, there are numerous mistranlations in the current text (e.g. see this diff (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Clannad%3ASEEN6801&diff=77980&oldid=77646)), so it's in the "awkward + altered" state. My thought was that if we remove the awkwardness and move it into just the "altered" state, it'll still be a step forward.

When I first started I restricted myself to correcting typos (there's many of those in the After Story), but the urge to work on the awkward expressions was hard to ignore. As a precaution, for any edit that caused subtle (or massive) changes in meaning, I marked the line and retained the original in the comments for review if necessary. Ended up making many many marks though :heh:

have you noticed untranslated <9999> lines in some of the UTF's?
In SEEN6430, the text isn't displayed properly when 2 people speak simultaneously. I THINK the Jap version duplicates the line but rlBabel can't do that, so the devs hard-coded a new line (labelled <9999>, because that's easier than re-numbering all the other lines) into the script.

Not sure about the rest though... I marked them in my "to-investigate" list but haven't looked at it since.

I'm not generating identical .ke bytecode dumps to what's in SVN.
Do you mean your SEENxxxx.ke are different from the SVN's? If I'm not mistaken, the SVN files were disassembled from the Japanese SEEN.txt, and then modified by hand (e.g. the <9999> hack) so the code structure would be different from how a machine would produce it. Plus, rldev seems to be unable to understand an English SEEN.txt the same way it understands a Jap one... When I disassemble a beta build (or my own personal build), I get:
// Pre-compiled English SEEN7500.utf
<0000> Tap, tap, tap... so Misae-san runs inside.
<0001> She stops in front of a single door.
<0002> \{Misae} "Here, right?!"

// After compiling and dececompiling
<0000> \s{strS[1901]}
<0001> \s{strS[1901]}
<0002> \s{strS[1901]} The text is left in the .ke file, andthe \s{} code was extracted into the .utf file. I wanted to know if you get this too, to see if it's because of rldev's code or because of my installation.

Regarding OCaml and rldev, the same Cygwin bootstrap problem drove me to Ubuntu. Even then, the tests failed on extlib's database and graphics modules, so mine's not a fully-stable build... I actually have trouble with SEEN7500 too; if you got a Ulex exception, try removing the {- -} block quotes.

Xcandescent

2011-01-24, 18:00

Besides the awkward expressions, there are numerous mistranlations in the current text (e.g. see this diff (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Clannad%3ASEEN6801&diff=77980&oldid=77646)), so it's in the "awkward + altered" state. My thought was that if we remove the awkwardness and move it into just the "altered" state, it'll still be a step forward.

When I first started I restricted myself to correcting typos (there's many of those in the After Story), but the urge to work on the awkward expressions was hard to ignore. As a precaution, for any edit that caused subtle (or massive) changes in meaning, I marked the line and retained the original in the comments for review if necessary. Ended up making many many marks though :heh:Yeah; reading through those diffs was painful; I can't believe some of the original wording made it in at all.

OK, I can see where you're coming from, and given that everyone else is AWOL, I think you're correct in addressing the awkward wording, as long as it's flagged for review. Of course, in the cases above, you had an alternate option given to you by another translator, so that's an easier call than changing up wording without knowing Japanese.

What's really needed here is another translator. Not an editor, but a translator on-call, who can give us options whenever you run into really awkward lines. That would keep the project moving forward, and if an editor from core-team wants to revert the changes, they can do so later. Maybe put up a "to fix" log pointing to things that need re-translation?

Do you mean your SEENxxxx.ke are different from the SVN's? If I'm not mistaken, the SVN files were disassembled from the Japanese SEEN.txt, and then modified by hand (e.g. the <9999> hack) so the code structure would be different from how a machine would produce it. Plus, rldev seems to be unable to understand an English SEEN.txt the same way it understands a Jap one... When I disassemble a beta build (or my own personal build), I get:

// After compiling and dececompiling
<0000> \s{strS[1901]}
<0001> \s{strS[1901]}
<0002> \s{strS[1901]}

The text is left in the .ke file, andthe \s{} code was extracted into the .utf file. I wanted to know if you get this too, to see if it's because of rldev's code or because of my installation.OK, it's good to know that the code was hand-edited later. I didn't notice any comments in the diffs on the one file I ran, so I assumed something went wrong in the disassembly of my Japanese SEEN.txt.

I probably won't have the time to try a disassembly of an English SEEN.txt today, but I will check it as soon as I can. (I'll have to do it in both Cygwin and Leopard for comparison.)

Regarding OCaml and rldev, the same Cygwin bootstrap problem drove me to Ubuntu. Even then, the tests failed on extlib's database and graphics modules, so mine's not a fully-stable build... I actually have trouble with SEEN7500 too; if you got a Ulex exception, try removing the {- -} block quotes.OK, I'll try that the next time I hit Leopard. It was throwing Ulex errors ... something about missing commands. It's good to know that it may just be issues with that one file, and not the build.

B-T looks to be back up again. May need to look into scripts to back up the wiki for the next time it implodes.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-01-25, 08:43

What's really needed here is another translator. Not an editor, but a translator on-call, who can give us options whenever you run into really awkward lines. That would keep the project moving forward, and if an editor from core-team wants to revert the changes, they can do so later. Maybe put up a "to fix" log pointing to things that need re-translation?
Agreed... we need to be able to know what the lines mean on demand before we can make truly useful progress. I don't know where to find them though; this is the first translation project I got involved in. The only translator I've ever spoken to is GundamAce who's currently translating Never7 by himself, and he has also signed up for a few other projects. I guess it won't hurt to try asking him for occasional help.

I grew up in a Chinese elementary school (so Kanji isn't too daunting) and am learning Japanese now, but haven't reached the competency required for Clannad... really felt it when I was trying to decipher the After Story. Should've started learning earlier!

The wiki did have a log system (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Category:ClannadCleanup) going, but it's starting to look unmanageable. Inline asterisks and comments are easier to use... Ctrl+F (or grep) finds them quickly.

It was throwing Ulex errors ... something about missing commands.
Uh oh... mine simply says "Fatal error: exception Ulexing.error" after loading SEEN7500.utf, with no mention of missing commands. I hope that doesn't mean that different builds have different issues.

B-T looks to be back up again. May need to look into scripts to back up the wiki for the next time it implodes.
Tarballs. ;)

Polarem

2011-01-25, 09:09

First attempts to modify reallive.exe and graphical text... success!

http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/4003/reallivemoviemode.jpg
http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/521/kotomieng.jpg
Almost 4 months too early for Kotomi's birthday, but oh well.

When translating reallive.exe, there seems to be odd limitations on how much text I can embed... write too much and the .exe blows up in size, then refuses to run. I haven't figured out the rules yet... It seems like the I'm allowed less English text than Japanese text.

As for Kotomi's story text, the top-left corner of each line is defined in SEEN.txt. I can safely make each line wider, but it'll be off-center. If we want longer lines we'll need to modify the .ke code.

Xcandescent

2011-01-26, 03:19

The wiki did have a log system (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Category:ClannadCleanup) going, but it's starting to look unmanageable. Inline asterisks and comments are easier to use... Ctrl+F (or grep) finds them quickly.It's only unmanageable, because the editors aren't editing. (There's entries in there from 2008.) If we can find more translators, then a separate log that actually gets updated and cleaned out may be OK.

Uh oh... mine simply says "Fatal error: exception Ulexing.error" after loading SEEN7500.utf, with no mention of missing commands. I hope that doesn't mean that different builds have different issues.I tried it again in Leopard, and this time it threw the Ulex error. However, the error didn't go away when I eliminated the block quotes (which a quick look at the RLdev manual says shouldn't be there anyway, because they're un-nestable). I think the fact that I can build it to completion in Windows means that there ARE platform-specific build issues -- and because of OCaml 3.09.3 being a trainwreck on Cygwin, there's no real way to sort out where the problem lies.

Also, I attempted to disassemble r78 on Cygwin and Leopard. The results were flat-out disastrous -- it kept choking and aborting on each file. Curious, I tried disassembling one of my own SEEN.txt builds; it still choked on Leopard, but on Cygwin, it was slightly better; there were only a few files it couldn't decompile. HOWEVER, it was utterly unable to separate the text strings from the code, resulting in .utf files with the \str[] nonsense you mentioned, and .ke files with the dialogue still embedded in the code.

So, as of right now, I have no rldev toolchain that can properly decompile its own SEEN.txt builds. However, on reading (and re-reading, and re-reading) the INSTALL readme, I did notice a couple of things I missed the first few times (specifically, that configure default encoding option.) (facepalm) However, a cursory search through the rldev manual shows only two references to default encoding -- and for the purposes of kprl, specifying "-e UTF-8" (which I always do) should do the exact same thing. A quick grep of the source code seems to confirm this; the variable "default_encoding" is only referenced in kprl and rlc; it acts as default output encoding for kprl, and default input encoding for rlc. I don't think it warrants a rebuild.

First attempts to modify reallive.exe and graphical text... success!Awesome!

When translating reallive.exe, there seems to be odd limitations on how much text I can embed... write too much and the .exe blows up in size, then refuses to run. I haven't figured out the rules yet... It seems like the I'm allowed less English text than Japanese text.Huh. If it's throwing errors on a byte-for-byte replacement, then I guess there are other things at play. I do recall the DirectX dialog having multiple lines per option, but I dunno how those lines are packed in the executable.

As for Kotomi's story text, the top-left corner of each line is defined in SEEN.txt. I can safely make each line wider, but it'll be off-center. If we want longer lines we'll need to modify the .ke code.Oof. Well, I guess it can't be helped.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-01-27, 05:45

It's only unmanageable, because the editors aren't editing. (There's entries in there from 2008.) If we can find more translators, then a separate log that actually gets updated and cleaned out may be OK.
Good point. I've dropped a message at Velocity7's blog (message was too long to fit in a Twitter feed). Fingers crossed for a reply!

the error didn't go away when I eliminated the block quotes (which a quick look at the RLdev manual says shouldn't be there anyway, because they're un-nestable).
Odd... they've been on the Wiki for years now, so I assumed that others could compile it, just me...

Anyway, there are two blocks of quotes: After <1408> and <2702>. Did you get rid of both?

because of OCaml 3.09.3 being a trainwreck on Cygwin, there's no real way to sort out where the problem lies.
I think so too. So now I'm just using the parts of rldev that work. Being able to compile a working SEEN.txt was what I was most concerned with, hehe. It would've been great if OCaml had better backwards compatibility.

Also, I attempted to disassemble r78 on Cygwin and Leopard. The results were flat-out disastrous -- it kept choking and aborting on each file.
Does this (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=CLANNADFVProgress) help?

it was utterly unable to separate the text strings from the code, resulting in .utf files with the \str[] nonsense you mentioned, and .ke files with the dialogue still embedded in the code....

....I don't think it warrants a rebuild.

I'm getting more and more convinced that rldev is incapable of properly disassembling English SEEN files, not because the build is broken. kprl -S suggests to me that it looks for Japanese text to decide what to extract. Also, I'm able to use my build to disassemble a Japanese SEEN.

Zenemis

2011-01-27, 09:12

Don't mean to be a stalker or 'nothin, but Velocity7 is active on the forums, so you might be able to PM him :)

Xcandescent

2011-01-27, 17:37

Odd... they've been on the Wiki for years now, so I assumed that others could compile it, just me...

Anyway, there are two blocks of quotes: After <1408> and <2702>. Did you get rid of both?Both are fixed now, as well as a word swap in SEEN3416 I ran across during gameplay. All files from Wiki will now compile in my Leopard toolchain.

There are a couple of things that are telling about this bug. The first is that my Leopard toolchain was behaving correctly, because the RLdev manual clearly states that you cannot nest comments. The second is that, when playing through my freshly-built SEEN.txt from Leopard, I realized that my old build from Cygwin had at least one major bug: it was skipping one of the choices during the "rap" sequence in Sunohara's room -- a choice that was both available AND produced the correct responses later in the classroom with my Leopard rldev.

Conclusion: My rldev toolchain on Cygwin is completely broken. It's producing incorrect builds, and it's doing so silently. If core-team was building using a similar toolchain, they would've never seen the compilation error. I plan on doing all my test builds on Leopard from here on out.

Does this (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=CLANNADFVProgress) help?Nope; the FV key is actually built into the version of rldev in SVN, and should be invoked by default.

I'm getting more and more convinced that rldev is incapable of properly disassembling English SEEN files, not because the build is broken. kprl -S suggests to me that it looks for Japanese text to decide what to extract. Also, I'm able to use my build to disassemble a Japanese SEEN.That's my gut feeling as well, though I haven't had time to dig into the code to verify it.

On a different topic, I have a feeling that this bug (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/tickets/13-full-voice-has-lots-of-places-where-rlbabel-does-not-kick-in-) is going to be hell to troubleshoot. The weird formatting on the save/load screens is somewhat minor, but having poorly formatted choices during Fuuko's route is bad news.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-01-28, 03:29

Both are fixed now, as well as a word swap in SEEN3416 I ran across during gameplay. All files from Wiki will now compile in my Leopard toolchain.
Error-free compilations are great, eh? ;) Now, to eliminate those compiler warnings! Keep those corrections coming too.

my Leopard toolchain was behaving correctly, because the RLdev manual clearly states that you cannot nest comments.
I thought that meant we can't nest BLOCK comments, like C/C++, so that the preprocessor doesn't need to keep track of how many block openings it has encountered so far; it's trivial to ignore line comments in a block comment.

My rldev also borks when I put the line "{- -}" anywhere in a .utf file. But we don't have to worry about those anymore.

I realized that my old build from Cygwin had at least one major bug: it was skipping one of the choices during the "rap" sequence in Sunohara's room -- a choice that was both available AND produced the correct responses later in the classroom with my Leopard rldev.
Do you mean that you didn't get to choose to say something fitting/stupid even though you wanted to mess up his tape? That's the expected behaviour IF it's your first playthrough... The option to say stupid things only comes up after you start "New game" again. (confirmed with an unpatched Japanese game)

Nope; the FV key is actually built into the version of rldev in SVN, and should be invoked by default.
You're right, it chooses the correct key once the target is supplied. What's even better is that it can decompile Clannad ME too! (haven't tested the output yet though)

The weird formatting on the save/load screens is somewhat minor, but having poorly formatted choices during Fuuko's route is bad news.
Oyes...

http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/4807/fukoprank1.jpg
http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/2808/fukoprank2.jpg

It looks somewhat acceptable if the text is within the box... A possible workaround is to shorten the text, if we can't fix rlBabel.

Polarem

2011-01-28, 04:11

Don't mean to be a stalker or 'nothin, but Velocity7 is active on the forums, so you might be able to PM him :)
*facepalm* ... I can't believe I didn't think of looking up his stats... just assumed he's inactive here 'cause he hadn't posted in Clannad forums in ages. I need to improve my stalking skills.

Thanks for the tip, Zenemis. But just so that I don't act like a stalker, I'll wait a bit more for a reply before sending him another message. :heh:

Xcandescent

2011-01-28, 18:28

Error-free compilations are great, eh? ;) Now, to eliminate those compiler warnings! Keep those corrections coming too.Well, it was nice while it lasted, but ...

Do you mean that you didn't get to choose to say something fitting/stupid even though you wanted to mess up his tape? That's the expected behaviour IF it's your first playthrough... The option to say stupid things only comes up after you start "New game" again. (confirmed with an unpatched Japanese game)To be clear: if you start a New Game without finishing it, save it, and start another New Game, you get the new options? Or is this some sort of "New Game+" feature that kicks in after you've completed a route? (And where the heck is the code that checks for that? Ick.)

So far, I've ALWAYS gotten the additional options to say stupid things, using the SEEN.TXT built with my Leopard toolchain. Arrrrgh. I suspect this is going to require a lot of Kepago debugging.

I thought that meant we can't nest BLOCK comments, like C/C++, so that the preprocessor doesn't need to keep track of how many block openings it has encountered so far; it's trivial to ignore line comments in a block comment.I don't know. The manual does not define the proper behavior, outside of nesting blocks in blocks (which you can't). The test would be to use block comments with no nested line comments, and see what happens.

It looks somewhat acceptable if the text is within the box... A possible workaround is to shorten the text, if we can't fix rlBabel.Shizuka's read of the problem is that rlc is not hooking in the necessary calls to rlBabel when parsing calls to select_s(). That's the Kepago function that generates multiple choice buttons in the middle of the screen, and I'm guessing it has a direct bytecode equivalent in RealLive (vs. being implemented in rlc using custom bytecode routines). The only ways to confirm this are to either step through the compiled bytecode to see what's being called (which implies knowing the bytecode calls involved in triggering rlBabel and/or select_s()), or to dig through the rlc source, and compare how ordinary text strings are processed, to strings passed to select_s(). Neither approach is trivial. There's a third possibility, which is that rlBabel IS being called, but the #SELBTN variables in GAMEEXE.INI aren't set properly (specifically the MOJI variables, which have caused problems in the past with normal text). This is unlikely, as there is zero documentation for those variables, and we don't know if rlc even processes them.

-XCN-

Xcandescent

2011-01-29, 03:26

To be clear: if you start a New Game without finishing it, save it, and start another New Game, you get the new options? Or is this some sort of "New Game+" feature that kicks in after you've completed a route? (And where the heck is the code that checks for that? Ick.)UPDATE: I went back and re-tested this after nuking the savegame directory. I don't get the secondary option anymore for the Sunohara rap, even after saving and restarting. If that option really was intended for a New Game+ (or whatever the RealLive equivalent is), I'm guessing it was some weird fluke.

Since I work most of the time on Snow Leopard, I have also been playing on rlvm. I consistently get the secondary option there, even after nuking saves. I'm guessing it's a bug in rlvm.

So, after a moment of panic, the Leopard toolchain does seem to be holding up.

-XCN-

GundamAce

2011-01-29, 11:19

Polarem

2011-01-29, 11:37

Polarem

2011-01-29, 11:42

Hey, I just noticed your conversation. If you need an on-call translator, I'll volunteer to do it. Of course, I can't work with you as a full time translator due to my commitment to translating Never7, but I'm willing to work with you as a consultant of sorts if you want to.
That'd be awesome, thanks man! :) Will give you a buzz when we start cleaning in earnest.

What's the best way to contact you?

GundamAce

2011-01-29, 12:57

Just PM me, and I'll try to check every day. But if you need to contact me frequently, I can just give you my e-mail.

Xcandescent

2011-01-30, 03:06

Ah sorry, that was a pretty vague description. From my experience in RealLive, the rap options get updated each time you dub Sunohara's tape, AND finish listening to him complain in class (no saving required). It worked for me when I returned to title screen when he said "You really know how to get on someone's nerve, don't you?!" (reading that again... should that be "nerves"?). Restarting before he finishes complaining does not trigger an update.

The first time round, the update enables the option to "say something fitting"; subsequent updates give you a different dumb rap when you choose "say something fitting" (I don't know what happens if you choose "Forget it, this is stupid", but it probably doesn't update).I checked my latest SEEN.txt build from Leopard, and it does in fact behave like that. (There are 7 responses, which are cycled through in order, cycling back to the first after the last response is played.) Checking the .ke and .utf files for the scenario confirm that there's a counter which is incremented at the points you indicated, and there are 3 files in the SAVEDATA directory which are updated on every play, regardless of whether you actually save -- which means that the game engine has persistent global variables, which it updates and uses across plays.

Mine still threw an exception.Weird. Well, no point using block comments, then.

That sounds like a messy job alright... is it something you'd take up? I might start digging into the rlc code on Monday (it's probably good coding experience, although I have no idea how long it'll take). BTW, where did you find Shizuka's diagnosis?So ... Shizuka's theory was in the bug he posted to SVN. (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/tickets/13-full-voice-has-lots-of-places-where-rlbabel-does-not-kick-in-) I assumed it was an educated guess ... but then I noticed this bit in section 6.1.2 of the rldev manual:

Limitations of dynamic formatting

Certain RealLive features are not available in rlBabel-formatted text. In particular, the \ruby control code is not supported at present.

Proportional text formatting has not been extended to cover all cases. In particular, text displayed by select_s(), objOfText(), grpTextout(), and related functions still uses the fixed advance width system built into RealLive. Support for these functions is planned for a future release.

So there you have it, straight from the author's mouth: the feature ain't there at all. It's really unclear why that's the case -- what makes those functions any harder to hook rlBabel into than the windows it already uses?

As a sidenote, the manual also says this:

The select() family of functions are the primary interface between player and game in a standard visual-novel-style work. They present a set of options. The return value is a zero-based integer indicating the option selected, or a negative value indicating an error.

The difference between the three variants is the manner in which the options are presented:

* select() displays them in the normal text window; unlike the AVG32 equivalent, it appears not to break them into columns if there are too many options to fit in the window, so use with care.
* select_s() displays them as a series of buttons, formatted according to the settings of the #SELBTN variables in gameexe.ini. This is the command used to display Fūko's “donna itazura wo?” selections in Clannad.
* select_w() displays them in a separate selection window, which automatically expands to fit the number of options.If I'm not mistaken, ordinary select() also has rlBabel properly hooked into it (as evidenced by the proper formatting of choices in the normal text window). However, what's more interesting is the mention of #SELBTN. While currently undocumented, it's likely that their functions parallel their #WINDOW equivalents. Hacking those variables won't magically give you proportional text, but they might be useful for positioning the text within the buttons (or repositioning the buttons themselves). You should give it a try with the Fuuko menus.

And no: hacking rlc to add the appropriate bytecode to select_s() calls is something way beyond my current skill set. That would require actually learning enough OCaml to make sense of the parser and the bytecode modules, and knowing what bytecode is necessary to call rlBabel properly. The guy who writes rlvm would probably know the bytecodes.

Ok, I fixed 2 of the rlc compiler warnings, and unearthed a few more Japanese lines (see Wiki project page), which accounts for the rest of the warnings.Those untranslated lines are so random (WHY are they untranslated?) ... but there is code to print them in the .ke files, so I guess we have to assume they show up at some point? (Or are they never called?) Also strange that 3 of those lines are numbered <9999>; were they hacked in manually?

There was no warning for untranslated #character directives though, like the "Jet Man" in SEEN0422. "Jet Saito" seems to allude to some kind of in-joke, but none of the English discussions I read really knew what it's about...In theory (according to the rldev manual), #character directives don't do a damn thing in RealLive. However, it's kind of sloppy to leave them untranslated like that, so I went ahead and hacked in the temp name (Water Jet Man) already being used in the translation.

Also found some translations for the graphical text!Incidentally, all the text linked there is said aloud by characters during the course of the anime. I would check the anime subs for additional guidance on how to interpret those lines (esp. since all of those are crucial lines to the story).

-XCN-

Khu

2011-01-30, 05:47

Jet Saito is an easter egg in Tomoyo's route, you might wanna you know...keep that in there. lol.

Xcandescent

2011-01-31, 01:15

Jet Saito is an easter egg in Tomoyo's route, you might wanna you know...keep that in there. lol.Oh, it's not going anywhere; there's just some confusion as to what it's all about. :) I haven't proofread Tomoyo's route yet, but there's a character in SEEN0422.utf whose name has been rough translated as "Water Jet Man" -- because no one knows what the translation is SUPPOSED to be. Shortly thereafter, Kinny left a comment implying that character was 'the elusive "Jet Saito"'. I'm guessing that name will have to be fixed later, but this is something the editors should've figured out already.

-XCN-

Khu

2011-01-31, 02:02

No no, I'm talking about the actual NAME Jet Saito - probably better to just leave that in there rather than try to translate it. Easier to recognise for those that are hunting for the easter eggs. :)

lonewolf179

2011-01-31, 08:33

Polarem

2011-01-31, 11:28

Ha, so it turns out that Key likes to slip characters named "Saito" into their works for laughs. There's Jet Saito in Clannad, Bush Saito in Kanon, Mask Z Saito in Little Busters! and Fish Saito in Angel Beats! ...apparently there's a Hop Saito out there as well but I couldn't find him/her.

The thing is I'm not sure if the jet ski dude IS Jet Saito... When he appears, his name is displayed as 「ジェット男」 (romaji: Jetto otoko, literally "Jet Male"/"Jet Man"). After he leaves, Sunohara talks about a junior SCHOOLMATE called 「ジェット斉藤」 (romaji: Jetto Saitō), kinda like a guy named Saito who has the title "Jet" (like "Rocket Dan", I suppose).

Saito is a reasonably common surname, so it has no translation anyway. For the label, I'm inclined to use "Jet ski man" instead of "Water jet man" as "jet ski" refers to the whole vehicle but "water jet" refers to the propulsion system only.

Anyway, our Saito isn't tied to Tomoyo's route only; the key to summoning him is to ditch Sunohara every chance you get (one possible route out of two is in this walkthrough (http://soukyuu.emevas.net/CLANNAD_guide.html)).

Polarem

2011-01-31, 12:35

Sorry, but I have a quick question regarding the newest seen.txt file, r78. I know I did everything correctly regarding installing the files, but whenever I try to play, anything the protagonist tries to say stays blank. everyone else's dialogue works perfectly fine, and anything the protagonist is thinking is displayed fine, it's just that whenever it's something he is supposed to say out loud, the text box remains blank until I click and then it moves on to the next line. If anyone could help me out with this it would be really appreciated.

Hmm, I haven't seen that before, so I can only work on hunches... Let's try anyway: Does the name "Tomoya" show up in the little name-box, or is it blank too? Your name variable might be malfunctioning. Try going into the Name menu and choose "Reset to default" [bottom left] --> "Accept" [middle] --> "Yes" [Blue left].

Have you used any of the older patches before?

lonewolf179

2011-01-31, 13:48

Hmm, I haven't seen that before, so I can only work on hunches... Let's try anyway: Does the name "Tomoya" show up in the little name-box, or is it blank too? Your name variable might be malfunctioning. Try going into the Name menu and choose "Reset to default" [bottom left] --> "Accept" [middle] --> "Yes" [Blue left].

Have you used any of the older patches before?

No, it doesn't. I reset the name, but unfortunately it didn't help. It's weird because everything else seems to be working fine. I only noticed because I was using a different patch before (not sure of the creator, but it wasn't very well made, which is why I switched) and the text with his name displayed fine, but when I switched to this patch, every line that would display his name (so whenever he would speak out loud) turns up blank. it doesn't affect gameplay or anything, it's almost as if the text is there, but it's just invisible or something.

I tried switching to some of the earlier patches, I think I tried the r45 and r46 versions. I thought it might be something to do with rlvm, since i'm using a mac, but nobody else seems to have this problem.

Thank you very much for your time, I assure you it is much appreciated.

Xcandescent

2011-01-31, 18:09

The thing is I'm not sure if the jet ski dude IS Jet Saito... When he appears, his name is displayed as 「ジェット男」 (romaji: Jetto otoko, literally "Jet Male"/"Jet Man"). After he leaves, Sunohara talks about a junior SCHOOLMATE called 「ジェット斉藤」 (romaji: Jetto Saitō), kinda like a guy named Saito who has the title "Jet" (like "Rocket Dan", I suppose).I noticed that, but the English translation is really unclear, and makes it sound like Jet Saito is the same person as Jet Man, even though the Japanese names are clearly different. ("The junior that I'm bothering at the moment is named Jet Saito" is said 4 lines after talking to Jet Man.)

I guess we could use "Jet Ski Man" or "Jet Ski Guy" for the moment, but it would be nice to get some clarification about that whole scene. If Jet Ski Guy and Jet Saito are different characters, then it's probably some sort of pun -- but it doesn't read as one in English. It's just confusing.

No, it doesn't. I reset the name, but unfortunately it didn't help. It's weird because everything else seems to be working fine. I only noticed because I was using a different patch before (not sure of the creator, but it wasn't very well made, which is why I switched)

I tried switching to some of the earlier patches, I think I tried the r45 and r46 versions. I thought it might be something to do with rlvm, since i'm using a mac, but nobody else seems to have this problem.rlvm is ... quirky, at best.

In general, if you drop a new SEEN.txt over your old one, you need to either rename or nuke your entire SAVEFILE directory. The RealLive engine has persistent global variables which it saves to certain files in that directory, even if you never actually save a game. Since savefiles generally don't work across versions, it wouldn't surprise me if those state files are giving you problems. (It's actually something I've run into myself, during testing.)

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-02-01, 01:03

So ... Shizuka's theory was in the bug he posted to SVN. (http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/tickets/13-full-voice-has-lots-of-places-where-rlbabel-does-not-kick-in-)
D'oh... that's what happens when I skim recklessly :P

So there you have it, straight from the author's mouth: the feature ain't there at all. It's really unclear why that's the case -- what makes those functions any harder to hook rlBabel into than the windows it already uses?
No idea... maybe because RealLive used different rendering functions to paint pixels for different window types? Or maybe rlBabel isn't called when the text rendering is hard-coded into the Kepago files like Shizuka said; I'll see if Kepago contains any clues.

Also, I believe that the last two untranslated lines in SEEN9071 are for the Tomoya + Tomoyo tag team against Sunohara, which is displayed in the same rounded window as the Fuuko pranks. Shizuka reasoned that hard-coding without .utf files made the compiler overlook the rlBabel call. I wonder SEEN9071.utf triggers rlBabel... (detective music starts playing)

If I'm not mistaken, ordinary select() also has rlBabel properly hooked into it (as evidenced by the proper formatting of choices in the normal text window). However, what's more interesting is the mention of #SELBTN. While currently undocumented, it's likely that their functions parallel their #WINDOW equivalents. Hacking those variables won't magically give you proportional text, but they might be useful for positioning the text within the buttons (or repositioning the buttons themselves). You should give it a try with the Fuuko menus.
Your deductions sound reasonable. Time to play with variables! (it's a good thing that bad software instructions no longer cause hardware damage)

And no: hacking rlc to add the appropriate bytecode to select_s() calls is something way beyond my current skill set. That would require actually learning enough OCaml to make sense of the parser and the bytecode modules, and knowing what bytecode is necessary to call rlBabel properly. The guy who writes rlvm would probably know the bytecodes.
Fair enough. I think we can put that on the backseat for now... (I got nowhere myself)

Those untranslated lines are so random (WHY are they untranslated?) ... but there is code to print them in the .ke files, so I guess we have to assume they show up at some point? (Or are they never called?) Also strange that 3 of those lines are numbered <9999>; were they hacked in manually?
Hmm... SEEN4421.ke has contained #res<9999> since the beginning of the SVN (2008-12-08), but SEEN4421.utf had <9999> added on 2008-12-20. The latter update was labelled "Merge functional FV branch". The file history isn't available before 2008-12-08, but it sounds like #res<9999> was inserted into .ke (breaking the code) shortly before the SVN import, then the system was fixed later by updating .utf.

Problem: The Voice Patch .ke files don't have the full set of #res<9999> in the Full Voice version. Since they share the same .utf files, it looks like any VP build will have missing text.

Incidentally, all the text linked there is said aloud by characters during the course of the anime.
An excuse to re-watch Clannad! :D

If Jet Ski Guy and Jet Saito are different characters, then it's probably some sort of pun -- but it doesn't read as one in English. It's just confusing.
My best guess is that "Jet Man" was a bit of nonsensical amusement, and an excuse/link for Sunohara bring up the name "Jet Saito"... but while the Japs can get away with saying "Jet Man", it doesn't work in English.

Polarem

2011-02-01, 01:12

Xcandescent

2011-02-01, 01:48

Also, I believe that the last two untranslated lines in SEEN9071 are for the Tomoya + Tomoyo tag team against Sunohara, which is displayed in the same rounded window as the Fuuko pranks. Shizuka reasoned that hard-coding without .utf files made the compiler overlook the rlBabel call.Well, we know the rounded window is what you get from calling select_s(), which doesn't have rlBabel hooked into it due to Haeleth not implementing it. I'd need to try the --single-file option in kprl to see what the equivalent Kepago calls are for displaying normal resource strings.

Problem: The Voice Patch .ke files don't have the full set of #res<9999> in the Full Voice version. Since they share the same .utf files, it looks like any VP build will have missing text.Honestly, I haven't touched the original/VP files at all, as I own the Full Voice version, and not the earlier release. You're probably right that missing code means missing text in VP, but I have no way to test it.

My best guess is that "Jet Man" was a bit of nonsensical amusement, and an excuse/link for Sunohara bring up the name "Jet Saito"... but while the Japs can get away with saying "Jet Man", it doesn't work in English.Yeah; that's something I'll want a translator to make a second pass at ... after the remaining image/system text and misc. stuff gets translated. I guess we can use "Jet Ski Man" for now ...

-XCN-

lonewolf179

2011-02-01, 07:54

@lonewolfYou're most welcome :)

I guess I shouldn't have assumed that you're using RealLive... the name menu actually does absolutely nothing on rlvm.

Like XCN said, the easiest way to guarantee zero compatibility issues is to delete old data, as it's too hard to keep track of what's compatible and what's not. I believe your rlvm save files are under /Users/[username]/.rlvm/KEY_CLANNAD_FV ...backup KEY_CLANNAD_FV if you want to preserve your old progress, and delete everything inside it. See if that helps.

Did you download gameexe_ini_r43.rar along with SEENr78.txt?

oh. I didn't even notice it doesn't work. D:

after I tried replacing the seen.txt file the first few times, I deleted everything and re-copyed all the files from the FV .iso, then re-applied seen.txt r78 and the correct gameexe_ini , but it still didn't fix the problem. I guess this is what I get for buying a Mac. xD

Polarem

2011-02-01, 12:14

Also, I believe that the last two untranslated lines in SEEN9071 are for the Tomoya + Tomoyo tag team against Sunohara, which is displayed in the same rounded window as the Fuuko pranks. Shizuka reasoned that hard-coding without .utf files made the compiler overlook the rlBabel call. I wonder SEEN9071.utf triggers rlBabel... (detective music starts playing)
Well, we know the rounded window is what you get from calling select_s(), which doesn't have rlBabel hooked into it due to Haeleth not implementing it. I'd need to try the --single-file option in kprl to see what the equivalent Kepago calls are for displaying normal resource strings.

Ok, putting English text into SEEN9071 indeed gave me a text banner instead of an empty banner during Tomoyo combos, but the text still wasn't formatted properly. Conclusion: Having the strings in .utf vs .ke files has no effect.

The Tomoyo banner doesn't use select_s(), but objOfText(), which is also unsupported by rlBabel. In the rlbabel source code itself, there's a set of functions specifically for processing arguments from Kepago's select(). Looks like we need to write similar functions to process select_s() and objOfText() (there's no grpTextOut() in Clannad).

Other places that use objOfText() are the save/load labels (SEEN9042), Fuuko Master Achievement announcements (SEEN9070), and parts of Kappei's route (SEEN9071).

The Tomoyo banner and the Fuuko announcements (not prank choices) also use the rounded-window, but Kappei's doesn't -- the text is just bitmapped and painted over the background (which is unusual -- all other routes use pre-rendered bitmaps in .g00 files)

Polarem

2011-02-01, 12:17

@lonewolf179: Unlike RealLive, the save data of rlvm is stored separately from the other game files. Try looking in /Users/[username]/.rlvm/KEY_CLANNAD_FV (you may need to tell Finder to show hidden items)

Speaking of Kappei, I encountered some missing text in that route -- the voice plays, but there's no corresponding text, so "Tomoya" is displayed instead. If anyone comes across those, could you record the line immediately before (or after), and report it here? (Edit: Silly me, I was using an OLD seen.txt)

lonewolf179

2011-02-01, 17:45

@lonewolf179: Unlike RealLive, the save data of rlvm is stored separately from the other game files. Try looking in /Users/[username]/.rlvm/KEY_CLANNAD_FV (you may need to tell Finder to show hidden items)

I deleted the save files, and it displays all of the text properly now. Again, thank you so much. :D Now I get to spend all of my free time playing Clannad.

Xcandescent

2011-02-04, 00:09

FYI: Looks like a new version of rlvm (0.10) has shipped. Haven't tried it yet.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-02-04, 03:06

In the rlbabel source code itself, there's a set of functions specifically for processing arguments from Kepago's select(). Looks like we need to write similar functions to process select_s() and objOfText() (there's no grpTextOut() in Clannad).
I've been digging around the source codes...

One huge source of confusion was that the name "Textout" refers to:
1) An older lineation library that is incompatible with rlBabel
2) The set of Western text formatting functions WITHIN rlBabel

Good news: It looks like we don't need to modify the compiler (no need to learn OCaml!). Updating its headers should be enough -- assign ID numbers for our new functions, and insert a small wrapper to call rlbabel.dll (passing the relevant ID and data) instead of RealLive's native functions. (http://subversion.assembla.com/svn/clannad/rldev/trunk/lib/rlBabel.kh)

The rlBabel source code is at http://subversion.assembla.com/svn/clannad/rlBabel/trunk/. The ID numbers from rlBabel.kh are mapped to enums in textout.h and select.h; the DLL entrypoint of interest is reallive_dll_func_call() in rlbabel.cpp, which accepts 5 arguments -- the 1st is the ID number, the rest are for us to decide.

reallive_dll_func_call() passes the arguments to TextoutCall() to handle main text, or SelectCall() to handle selections. So, we want to implement our own ObjOfTextCall() and Select_SCall(). The former is easier, I think.

FYI: Looks like a new version of rlvm (0.10) has shipped. Haven't tried it yet.
If you install it, can you tell me if you notice any performance drops? My 0.09 was slow enough (being run from within VirtualBox), but updating seemed to make the save/load menus nightmarish :-S

Xcandescent

2011-02-04, 13:34

Good news: It looks like we don't need to modify the compiler (no need to learn OCaml!). Updating its headers should be enough -- assign ID numbers for our new functions, and insert a small wrapper to call rlbabel.dll (passing the relevant ID and data) instead of RealLive's native functions. (http://subversion.assembla.com/svn/clannad/rldev/trunk/lib/rlBabel.kh)

The rlBabel source code is at http://subversion.assembla.com/svn/clannad/rlBabel/trunk/. The ID numbers from rlBabel.kh are mapped to enums in textout.h and select.h; the DLL entrypoint of interest is reallive_dll_func_call() in rlbabel.cpp, which accepts 5 arguments -- the 1st is the ID number, the rest are for us to decide.

reallive_dll_func_call() passes the arguments to TextoutCall() to handle main text, or SelectCall() to handle selections. So, we want to implement our own ObjOfTextCall() and Select_SCall(). The former is easier, I think.To be clear: rlBabel.dll would need modification and recompiling? Because I don't have Visual C++ (and I'm not really a programmer either). The INSTALL doc says that rlBabel.dll can only be built using Visual C++ with the Win32 SDK installed. Probably still better than having to learn OCaml though (shudder).

If you install it, can you tell me if you notice any performance drops? My 0.09 was slow enough (being run from within VirtualBox), but updating seemed to make the save/load menus nightmarish :-SYikes! rlvm is slow enough running native in Snow Leopard; I can't imagine what it's like on a virtual machine.

0.10 actually seems faster in the Save/Load menus (for me) than 0.09; I used to have to hold down a mouse button to get clicks to register in that menu, and I don't anymore. However, what's really interesting is that the text is properly formatted in that menu now, which means that Elliot has successfully implemented his own version of ObjOfTextCall(). (I don't know if he's done the same for Select_SCall(), but combing through his changes on GitHub might clarify that.) You might want to grab the source to rlvm and have a look; I don't know how much of it would be Windows-portable, but it's probably better than starting from scratch.

Things that haven't changed from 0.09 to 0.10: fonts are still not selectable from the Config menu, and Auto Mode is still semi-broken -- there are no numbers when you adjust the sliders for wait time, and it still doesn't wait for voice clips to finish playing before moving to the next message.

That bit you posted about the location of rlvm save games was super-helpful, because it's not documented in any obvious place. (OK, it's probably noted somewhere in the source code, but that doesn't count. It's certainly not in any of the README's accompanying the tarball.) Thanks to that, I was able to re-test the Sunohara rap issue under 0.10, and confirm that it's not a problem; I'm betting it probably would've worked in 0.09 too if I'd known where the save files actually lived.

I should (hopefully) have some time this weekend to do some more proofreading.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-02-06, 09:22

Yikes! rlvm is slow enough running native in Snow Leopard; I can't imagine what it's like on a virtual machine.

0.10 actually seems faster in the Save/Load menus (for me) than 0.09; I used to have to hold down a mouse button to get clicks to register in that menu, and I don't anymore.
I now have to wait several seconds after clicking "save" or "load" for the menu to show up :( Oh well!

Things that haven't changed from 0.09 to 0.10: fonts are still not selectable from the Config menu, and Auto Mode is still semi-broken -- there are no numbers when you adjust the sliders for wait time, and it still doesn't wait for voice clips to finish playing before moving to the next message.

That bit you posted about the location of rlvm save games was super-helpful, because it's not documented in any obvious place. (OK, it's probably noted somewhere in the source code, but that doesn't count. It's certainly not in any of the README's accompanying the tarball.)

Glad to be of help. :) If you're up for bug reports and suggestions, head on over to https://github.com/eglaysher/rlvm/issues

To be clear: rlBabel.dll would need modification and recompiling? Because I don't have Visual C++ (and I'm not really a programmer either).

...

However, what's really interesting is that the text is properly formatted in that menu now, which means that Elliot has successfully implemented his own version of ObjOfTextCall(). (I don't know if he's done the same for Select_SCall(), but combing through his changes on GitHub might clarify that.) You might want to grab the source to rlvm and have a look; I don't know how much of it would be Windows-portable, but it's probably better than starting from scratch.
Yea, the DLL needs to be recompiled. I have VC++ 2008, and was able to build a working, modified DLL (just small optimizations and reformatting for now; the thing is a horrible obfuscated mess).

rlBabel uses the Windows API to format the text, so rlvm's code won't be portable, but it might provide insight into meanings of byte values. The current biggest annoyances in the DLL code are hard-coded numbers with no written explanations.

I should (hopefully) have some time this weekend to do some more proofreading.
You can be in charge of that (or at least for the time being)... hacking rlBabel is surprisingly fun, hehe...

Xcandescent

2011-02-06, 16:47

If you're up for bug reports and suggestions, head on over to https://github.com/eglaysher/rlvm/issuesElliot suggested the same thing, so I guess I'll be making a github account shortly.

Yea, the DLL needs to be recompiled. I have VC++ 2008, and was able to build a working, modified DLL (just small optimizations and reformatting for now; the thing is a horrible obfuscated mess).VC++ Express or Pro? I did download the offline .iso for Visual Express 2008, but I wasn't sure if it was worth installing, as it's unclear what dependencies rlBabel has (and Express doesn't ship with all the libs).

(Also, you're using the branch from SVN, right? I think litghost hacked both rlBabel and rldev for 1.5.0.4 compatibility with FV.)

rlBabel uses the Windows API to format the text, so rlvm's code won't be portable, but it might provide insight into meanings of byte values. The current biggest annoyances in the DLL code are hard-coded numbers with no written explanations.Yeah, Haeleth mentioned in another thread that parts of the implementation are super ugly. Obviously, anything having to do with actual text display won't be portable, but the idea is to simply hook objToText() and select_s() into the pre-existing text formatting routines, which Elliot has clearly done (well ... at least for objToText(), anyway).

What's interesting to me is that there's an implementation of rlBabel in rlvm ... in fact, there's a file in the rlvm source (under src/Systems/Base) called "RlBabelDLL.cpp", which looks like a consolidated, cleaned-up version of various functions from the rlBabel source.

You can be in charge of that (or at least for the time being)... hacking rlBabel is surprisingly fun, hehe...Will do. Good luck with the hacking! :D

-XCN-

kazuki27

2011-02-07, 09:54

Polarem

2011-02-07, 22:24

umm sorry maybe i was too late, but please help me
i've downloaded clannad game for psp,also the english patch, but it said something about CD, maybe CD is required for this game? is there any way to enjoy this game without cd?
please help, thanks
Sorry kazuki27, AnimeSuki doesn't allow members to discuss how to crack pirated games. http://forums.animesuki.com/faq.php?faq=rules#faq_rules_1_1

Polarem

2011-02-10, 09:57

Good news: It looks like we don't need to modify the compiler (no need to learn OCaml!).
...I was sorely mistaken. Rldev and rlBabel are tightly integrated, and the compiler source code contains extensive (and scattered) instructions for processing data destined for rlBabel. So that route is starting to look unlikely, unless we can find someone with the know-how. I contacted gemot encubed last week and Elliot today.

the idea is to simply hook objToText() and select_s() into the pre-existing text formatting routines, which Elliot has clearly done (well ... at least for objToText(), anyway).

What's interesting to me is that there's an implementation of rlBabel in rlvm ... in fact, there's a file in the rlvm source (under src/Systems/Base) called "RlBabelDLL.cpp", which looks like a consolidated, cleaned-up version of various functions from the rlBabel source.
Unfortunately, Text-Windows and Objects might have different rendering mechanisms (just an educated guess though, judging by the function call trees I looked at). Even if I knew how to modify rlc, I can't find a way to convert rlBabel's tiled strings into RealLive Objects.

An alternative possibility for static text (Tomoyo, Kappei and empty save slots) would be to pre-render them as new .g00 files and modify the Kepago code to use obfOfFile() instead of objOfText().

For Fuuko's pranks... we COULD replace select_s() with select(), but I can't see fans being happy with that :heh:

VC++ Express or Pro? I did download the offline .iso for Visual Express 2008, but I wasn't sure if it was worth installing, as it's unclear what dependencies rlBabel has (and Express doesn't ship with all the libs).

(Also, you're using the branch from SVN, right? I think litghost hacked both rlBabel and rldev for 1.5.0.4 compatibility with FV.)
I have Pro, courtesy of MSDN, so I don't know if Express can handle it, sorry... but yes I'm using the Clannad version.

Xcandescent

2011-02-10, 21:58

...I was sorely mistaken. Rldev and rlBabel are tightly integrated, and the compiler source code contains extensive (and scattered) instructions for processing data destined for rlBabel. So that route is starting to look unlikely, unless we can find someone with the know-how. I contacted gemot encubed last week and Elliot today.

Unfortunately, Text-Windows and Objects might have different rendering mechanisms (just an educated guess though, judging by the function call trees I looked at). Even if I knew how to modify rlc, I can't find a way to convert rlBabel's tiled strings into RealLive Objects.... damn, that bites.

I talked with Elliot privately over E-mail, and discovered that he actually fixed objToText() by accident. It also turns out that the fix was trivial for him, because he isn't doing gymnastics to get RealLive.exe to do stuff through an external DLL. That's the upside of writing your own implementation of RealLive. (The downside, of course, is that he can only clone behaviors and functionality he's aware of, which is tricky when you're dealing with an undocumented VM.)

An alternative possibility for static text (Tomoyo, Kappei and empty save slots) would be to pre-render them as new .g00 files and modify the Kepago code to use obfOfFile() instead of objOfText().

For Fuuko's pranks... we COULD replace select_s() with select(), but I can't see fans being happy with that :heh:The first is totally doable for banner messages (since Clannad is fixed resolution -- though beware of resolution differences between original and FV), but not really practical for save slots, since slots that are used still have to be rendered using the fixed-width routines. But I only see three solutions to the Fuuko issue:

1.) Get someone to properly implement select_s(). (Unlikely, but possible.)
2.) Replace RealLive with rlvm. (However, rlvm is written for Linux and OSX, which implies that it would have to be built and run under Cygwin or Cygwin + MinGW. Even assuming you can get it to run in Windows, you'd then have to extensively test its behavior against the original RealLive Windows build, to make sure that everything behaves in the same fashion. Also, you can't choose fonts in rlvm, due to differences between supported platforms.)
3.) Implement all Fuuko's menus as .g00 objects, then write your own routines in Kepago to properly detect and interpret mouse clicks on them, and process the choices appropriately. (If possible, it's still a load of pain and suffering.)

For now, let's see if we can stir any interest in getting select_s() properly implemented. May as well try, anyway. Implementing Fuuko's menus by hand is a rather ugly fallback ... but not impossible. (SEEN9520.ke seems to do just that with the right-click menus, but the number of op calls in there is frightening.)

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-02-12, 00:00

I talked with Elliot privately over E-mail, and discovered that he actually fixed objToText() by accident. It also turns out that the fix was trivial for him, because he isn't doing gymnastics to get RealLive.exe to do stuff through an external DLL. That's the upside of writing your own implementation of RealLive. (The downside, of course, is that he can only clone behaviors and functionality he's aware of, which is tricky when you're dealing with an undocumented VM.)
I'm actually quite amazed at the amount of knowledge that Jagarl and Haeleth managed to glean by dissecting RealLive! The documentation is incomplete, but it's proven to be more than enough to make cloning RealLive viable. And it just may be enough to let us do (some of) what we want to do, too (see below)...

...beware of resolution differences between original and FV
All translated graphics will need to be redone to support the original Clannad (including EverSynth's menus). The Memorial Edition uses the same graphics as Full Voice (except for copyright dates, the legal notice at the start of the game, and the config menu).

I haven't tested rlBabel-GenMap yet, but if it works on ME's RealLive, it should be easier to port our work to ME than to the original edition.

...slots that are used still have to be rendered using the fixed-width routines.
That'll be a toughie.

But I only see three solutions to the Fuuko issue:
1.) Get someone to properly implement select_s(). (Unlikely, but possible.)
2.) Replace RealLive with rlvm. (However, rlvm is written for Linux and OSX, which implies that it would have to be built and run under Cygwin or Cygwin + MinGW. Even assuming you can get it to run in Windows, you'd then have to extensively test its behavior against the original RealLive Windows build, to make sure that everything behaves in the same fashion. Also, you can't choose fonts in rlvm, due to differences between supported platforms.)
3.) Implement all Fuuko's menus as .g00 objects, then write your own routines in Kepago to properly detect and interpret mouse clicks on them, and process the choices appropriately. (If possible, it's still a load of pain and suffering.)

For now, let's see if we can stir any interest in getting select_s() properly implemented. May as well try, anyway. Implementing Fuuko's menus by hand is a rather ugly fallback ... but not impossible. (SEEN9520.ke seems to do just that with the right-click menus, but the number of op calls in there is frightening.)
...I can't believe I didn't think of #3! That's actually not as painful as you might think. SEEN9520.ke is in Assembly-style code, which is why it looks scary; when written in C-style (and using only a small subset of functions) it looks quite tame. Here's a sample of a Kepago-implemented menu:

http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/2274/clannadselects.jpg

I haven't made any .g00 files for it yet so the above uses objOfText() with monospaced font (there's another option, a la Kanon: ship Deja Vu Sans Mono and recommended players to use it).

The menu isn't interactive yet, but from other mouse experiments (pun intended) I believe it's possible to mimic most of select_s()'s behaviour (minus the ability to read the text log while the menu is open, and maybe the ability to mark it as a return point for "Return to previous selection")

In the process, I also found out that we can alleviate the CPU overdrive (http://forums.novelnews.net/showthread.php?t=35908) issue by inserting a wait() command into the menu loops.

I wouldn't replace RealLive with rlvm on Windows (at least just yet), as we'd lose more features than we gain (screen shake, sepia toning, text input, animated selections [both select() and select_s()], playback of previous speech... just off the top of my head)

Out of curiosity, by "implement select_s()" properly, did you mean getting the compiler to do it, or getting rlBabel to do it?

Xcandescent

2011-02-14, 20:43

I haven't tested rlBabel-GenMap yet, but if it works on ME's RealLive, it should be easier to port our work to ME than to the original edition.I think GenMap had to be hacked to recognize the version of RealLive that shipped with FV (see SVN), so it's far from a sure thing that it'll work with ME.

...I can't believe I didn't think of #3! That's actually not as painful as you might think. SEEN9520.ke is in Assembly-style code, which is why it looks scary; when written in C-style (and using only a small subset of functions) it looks quite tame. Here's a sample of a Kepago-implemented menu:... holy crap.

I can't believe that suggestion is not only viable, but practical! Actually, it's probably not as hard as I was thinking, because the actual code for what the buttons DO doesn't have to change, only the routines to detect mouse clicks and animate the buttons.

I haven't made any .g00 files for it yet so the above uses objOfText() with monospaced font (there's another option, a la Kanon: ship Deja Vu Sans Mono and recommended players to use it).It really should be implemented graphically, but you raised a potential blocking issue (below). Players are already familiar with the previous patches that supported proportional fonts, and will (rightfully) scream if that goes away ...

The menu isn't interactive yet, but from other mouse experiments (pun intended) I believe it's possible to mimic most of select_s()'s behaviour (minus the ability to read the text log while the menu is open, and maybe the ability to mark it as a return point for "Return to previous selection")Temporarily suspending the text log functionality is probably fine (since it's accessible everywhere else); I'm more concerned about the "Return to previous selection" issue, since there was a fair bit of work done in past patches to fix that. Since you said "maybe", I'm guessing you don't know how it's implemented (I certainly don't). That question needs to be answered, in order for a replacement of select_s() with graphics + custom code to be viable.

I wouldn't replace RealLive with rlvm on Windows (at least just yet), as we'd lose more features than we gain (screen shake, graphics filtering [e.g. sepia toning, colour inversion], text input, animated selections [both select() and select_s()], playback of previous speech... just off the top of my head)Agreed.

Out of curiosity, by "implement select_s()" properly, did you mean getting the compiler to do it, or getting rlBabel to do it?I mean whatever it takes to get it working properly, whether it's hacking rlc, rlBabel, or both.

-XCN-

Polarem

2011-02-15, 01:35

I think GenMap had to be hacked to recognize the version of RealLive that shipped with FV (see SVN), so it's far from a sure thing that it'll work with ME.
Only 1 way to find out: Try it! :D I bought ME, so I'll investigate (...when I get around to it)

It really should be implemented graphically.... Players are already familiar with the previous patches that supported proportional fonts, and will (rightfully) scream if that goes away ...
I didn't like that solution either. ;)

I'm more concerned about the "Return to previous selection" issue, since there was a fair bit of work done in past patches to fix that. Since you said "maybe", I'm guessing you don't know how it's implemented (I certainly don't). That question needs to be answered, in order for a replacement of select_s() with graphics + custom code to be viable.
Nope, I have no idea how it's done. The rest of the game will be unaffected; it's just that players will skip PAST the prank menus to the last select() call... which might be acceptable, I think, because IIRC, 6 out of the 7 prank menus come immediately after a select() choice to either "play a prank" or "wait"!

Anyway, for the menu, we have 2 options at this point:
1) Use the custom menu, and find a way to trigger a save point (or ignore it, if a way can't be found)
2) Use the built-in menu, forcing RealLive to use a monospaced font for the menu text (check your email; I sent you some test code)

kazuki27

2011-02-18, 02:26

how can i get the english patch for my clannad iso psp?

Jecht2

2011-02-18, 21:37

Polarem

2011-02-19, 09:07

how can i get the english patch for my clannad iso psp?
As Polarem already mentioned...
Sorry kazuki27, AnimeSuki doesn't allow members to discuss how to crack pirated games. http://forums.animesuki.com/faq.php?faq=rules#faq_rules_1_1

I have somewhat mixed feelings about this at the moment, as it's near impossible to find a legit copy of Clannad Full Voice (or the original version) nowadays... Does anyone know where to get one?

Besides that, I believe that the patch being developed is not compatible with the PSP version of the game.

-----

I belive that I may have installed the Seen from the SVN incorrectly. I keep getting an error stating:

Error: interpreter detection failed. Unable t
o format text.
You're right, there is no English patch for the PSP version.

That error message is due to a missing W.X.Y.Z.map file. W-Z correspond to the version number of your RealLive.exe, so assuming that you have the Full Voice version, place 1.5.0.4.map (http://www.assembla.com/code/clannad/subversion/nodes/current/1.5.0.4.map) (the download button is at the right hand side) into your Clannad installation directory.

Xcandescent

2011-02-19, 17:56

I have somewhat mixed feelings about this at the moment, as it's near impossible to find a legit copy of Clannad Full Voice (or the original version) nowadays... Does anyone know where to get one?Not off the top of my head. I'd have to ask people who routinely import DVD's from Japan, because I don't. (There are probably third-party shipping services to get around the whole "we don't ship outside Japan" nonsense.)

--

That said, I'm going to briefly spell out for everyone why console patches for Clannad are never going to happen.

First, patching a console game means hacking said console, ripping and potentially re-burning said game, etc ... and we can't discuss any of that here, for obvious reasons.

Second, there is no console equivalent of rlBabel.dll, which does the proportional text formatting. That would have to be rewritten for every single platform, and then forcibly hacked into the existing executable, which is a huge hurdle. (Given the amount of reverse engineering required, you'd probably be better off porting rlvm to each console -- which is also no picnic, as you'd still have to custom code routines for handling input from controllers.) Substituting some ugly fixed-width English font might work, but that also requires hacking each executable.

Third, the version of SEEN.TXT currently used in the PC patch (or, more specifically, its source files) has been hacked in various, mostly undocumented ways to work properly with the rldev toolchain -- and there are further hacks in the pipeline to deal with needed functions that haven't yet been implemented in rldev. It's unclear how those hacks would work (or not work) on a ported engine (or a different engine).

Finally, there's a small (but critical) amount of text that's only implemented graphically -- and it's not just the menus. Those graphics would have to be redone for every single console version, in whatever format each one takes. (And that assumes the Japanese text hasn't already been "baked" into the compressed movie ... which would be really difficult to undo.)

--

The real issue here is that Key is consciously ignoring the non-Japanese fans. If they really wanted English-localized versions of Clannad, they would've made the licensing arrangements years ago. (How else do you explain the existence of Clannad on PS3 and Xbox360 in Japan, and nowhere else?) It probably doesn't make sense for them to expend resources where the market is far smaller, and they can't get away with charging the "premium" prices that the Japanese customers are used to. Believe me, I sympathize, but I can't do anything about that; we're having enough trouble scraping together manpower to finish the PC patch.

-XCN-

Kamiye

2011-02-22, 16:37

spawnofthejudge

2011-02-22, 16:39

I've recently acquire a Clannad game, the full voice version... (It's a present of a friend)
And I've try to install the unofficial patch 4 times and the 4 times it crashed so I need help to install the patch (My Japaneses friends won't traduce the entire game for me... XD)

So, someone can help me ? I really need to play to this game because I'm a Clannad fan since a long time ago and finally I get the game yesterday.

PS : Sorry for my bad englishOkay, what happens? Does a pop-up indicate that the installer crashed? Do you get the BSOD?

In order for any of us to give you any help, you're going to need to give us more information on the problem that you're experiencing.

Kamiye

2011-02-23, 02:18

OK, so at the beginning there's a pop-up with Japanese word and when I click on Ok the game open and the screen is black.

One times the beginning of the game start and the game is in the up-left corner and the rest of the screen is black. When this happen the game freeze at the beginning of the story and the game is a white screen.

When there's no translation, the game runs perfectly normally

Khu

2011-02-23, 02:41

I had this problem before. I think your seen.txt is corrupted or something. Re download the patch and apply it again.

Either that or change your system locale to Japanese.

Kamiye

2011-02-23, 03:01

I've try all the seen.txt I've find but have you got any link for me ? All the link I find are corrupted
My system locale is already change to Japanese...
thanks for help me

Polarem

2011-02-23, 05:13

Steps for a Full Voice patch on Windows, using the Wafflehouse text patch and EverSynth's graphics patch (as of 2011-02-23)

1. From http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clannad/documents, get:

SEENr78_FV.txt, then rename it to SEEN.TXT
rlBabel.dll
gameexe_ini_r43.rar, then EXTRACT the Full Voice version of gameexe.ini

2. From http://www.assembla.com/code/clannad/subversion/nodes/current/1.5.0.4.map, get:

1.5.0.4.map (use the "download" button to the right)

3. From http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=2209340&postcount=603, get:

Clannad Full Voice Menu and Graphics Translations v1.5.rar (choose MediaFire or Megaupload -- it doesn't matter which)

4. Put all the bolded files from (#1) and (#2) into your Clannad installation folder.

5. EXTRACT all the files from (#3), except the README file, into your Clannad installation's G00 subfolder

6. Have fun!

EDIT: Latest patches available at http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=3581568#post3581568

=====================================
Troubleshooting tips
1. If you have used a different patch before, or if you have played in Japanese before, delete your SAVEDATA subfolder to remove incompatible data (you will lose your saved games)

2. If you have trouble loading rlBabel.dll (the game should do it automatically), install the Microsoft Visual C++ 2008 SP1 Redistributable Package (x86) (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/en/details.aspx?FamilyID=a5c84275-3b97-4ab7-a40d-3802b2af5fc2&displaylang=en) and restart your computer.

Kamiye

2011-02-23, 10:23

spawnofthejudge

2011-02-23, 10:36

http://i74.servimg.com/u/f74/13/34/29/98/th/captur10.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=248&u=13342998)

This weird message appear when I try to open the game (I did all you tell me to do...)
When I click on "ok" the pop-up close and the game start running but the window is black, there's no sound, no pictures...

Something about setup is not found at the location specified (C:\KEY\CLANNAD_FV). Probably a file it needs to open is not there. I think it recommends an uninstall, and then to install again.

Polarem, have you seen this before?

Kamiye

2011-02-23, 10:53

I tried but its the same pop-up... T-T
I'm in despair

Polarem

2011-02-23, 11:24

Weird... I've never seen that before, and I couldn't produce it by messing with my folder names and registry either.

Okay Kamiye, try these:

1. Delete SAVEDATA, then run the game. Does it work?

2. If not, delete SAVEDATA again, then take Seen.txt and Gameexe.ini from your CD (from E:\SETUPDATA\GAMEDATA, where "E" is your CD drive), and put it in your installation folder (choose "copy and replace"). Run the game. Does Japanese Clannad appear?

Kamiye

2011-02-23, 11:52

1. Its the same pop-up...

2.Yes the japanese Clannad appear.

Polarem

2011-02-23, 12:37

Ok, new questions:
1. What browser do you use?
2. When you saved SEENr78_FV.txt, did lots of weird characters appear on your screen? (if you saved it after you see weird characters, the file probably got corrupted)

=====
If #2 happened, try to re-download it using a right-click:

Internet Explorer: Right-click -> "Save target as..."
Firefox/Chrome: Right-click -> "Save link as..."

(make sure it's saved as a ".TXT" file, not as a ".HTM" file)

Kamiye

2011-02-23, 13:09

1. I use Google Chrome
2. Do you talk when I open the file because if you speak of that... It means my file is corrupted...

#2 There's no pop-up, the game open, theres a black screen and... I see the cursoor/flower... Its really weird...

Polarem

2011-02-23, 13:35

Hmm... try using the files here: Link removed: see newer version (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=3516905#post3516905) (I don't want more SEENs to appear on the internet, so I'll delete this link tomorrow. EDIT: There were 5 downloads over the past half-day. Would people like regular updates?)

I'm going off now; if this still doesn't work, I'm sorry I won't be able to help you till tomorrow. Good luck!

Kamiye

2011-02-24, 02:33

When I use your pack the game do the same thing...

In fact... Anyone can translate for me the pop-up ? I think I got a little idea.

Polarem

2011-02-24, 02:54

セットアップ先が見つかりませんでした。
[C:\KEY\CLANNAD_FV]
一度アンインストールしてから再度セットアップし直して下さい。

The setup destination cannot be found.
[C:\KEY\CLANNAD_FV]
Please uninstall and run the setup again.

==========================
Could someone double-check that the translation?

It's also weird that it shows "C:\KEY\CLANNAD_FV", since a Japanese locale usually shows "\" as "¥"

Jecht2

2011-02-24, 04:07

Would people like regular updates?

I grabbed that Seen you posted. I figured that If I notice any spelling mistakes or awkward translations, I would have a look over at the wiki and make any appropriate changes.

It makes it easier having an up to date seen file. Goodness know how many changes has been made to the wiki since the last Seen file was released on the SVN.

I would compile my own Seen file but I wouldn't know where to begin.

Kamiye

2011-02-24, 04:44

Polarem

2011-02-24, 04:47

I grabbed that Seen you posted. I figured that If I notice any spelling mistakes or awkward translations, I would have a look over at the wiki and make any appropriate changes.

It makes it easier having an up to date seen file. Goodness know how many changes has been made to the wiki since the last Seen file was released on the SVN.

I would compile my own Seen file but I wouldn't know where to begin.

Yes, please do contribute any corrections/rephrasings that you think of. We'd appreciate all the help we can get. :) The SEEN.TXT I posted is over 3 weeks old though. Xcandescent is our main proofreader, and he has made lots of improvements since then (along with a few of my own).

I haven't compiled a stable, fully-playable SEEN in the past 3 weeks as I've been experimenting with the code. I hope to put finishing touches on the save/load menu and Fuko prank menu over the next few days, and put up a patch that you guys can test. Stay tuned!

Setting up RLDev for compiling SEENs is painful, even for those with experience in software development... this is because RLDev requires on an ancient version of OCaml and its libraries (add-ons). However, if you have a 32-bit Linux machine and are interested, I can teach you.

Polarem

2011-02-24, 05:50

The folder name of the game is "CLANNAD", when I rename it to "CLANNAD_FV" there's no pop-up but the screen is black, so I think I'm near of the problem.
When I use the real Clannad (in japanese) and when the name is "CLANNAD_FV" the same pop-up appear but this message appear :

セットアップ先が見つかりませんでした。
[C:\KEY\CLANNAD]
一度アンインストールしてから再度セットアップし直して下さい。

So the pop-up is an folder mistakes, what can I do... The pop-up error is gone but not the black screen.

Good job with figuring out the error source. For some reason, Clannad is looking in the wrong folder...

I have one last idea. Open the Japanese Clannad, and take a screenshot of the title menu (the one with "New Game", "Load", etc.). Post it here; that will tell me if I'm right or wrong.

Kamiye

2011-02-25, 02:04

http://i74.servimg.com/u/f74/13/34/29/98/th/captur11.jpg (http://www.noelshack.com/upload/8601616952280_capture.png)

Here is what you ask for. ^^

Oh, crap... It's not the full voice version but on the game jacket its written... I understand what you want to say to me... (My friend buy that with Ebay and no returns are accepted s I'm gonna take that version...) Have you got the link for the SEEN and other ?
There's an error...

Error : Interpreter detection failed. Unable to format text.

PS:Sorry for my late I was celebrate my birthday...

Jecht2

2011-02-25, 05:13

Setting up RLDev for compiling SEENs is painful, even for those with experience in software development... this is because RLDev requires on an ancient version of OCaml and its libraries (add-ons). However, if you have a 32-bit Linux machine and are interested, I can teach you.

I will let you know once I dig out my old XP machine once I install linux onto it. Any recommendations on a Linux distro. For a while I was using Ubuntu.

Polarem

2011-02-25, 07:51

Here is what you ask for. ^^

Oh, crap... It's not the full voice version but on the game jacket its written... I understand what you want to say to me... (My friend buy that with Ebay and no returns are accepted s I'm gonna take that version...) Have you got the link for the SEEN and other ?
There's an error...

Error : Interpreter detection failed. Unable to format text.

PS:Sorry for my late I was celebrate my birthday...
Happy birthday! :)

Yes, that's the source of your troubles... you have the Original version of Clannad. Sorry to hear that you and your friend got tricked on Ebay :(

Anyway, delete 1.5.0.4.map, since that's for the Full Voice version. The last tested patch for your version is at http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=2450110#post2450110. Download "Patcher (2.44MB)" under "Voice Patch: r46". It is about 1.5 years old, so it will have a lot more bad English, and some missing lines...

Keep watching this thread; I will try to post an updated patch in a few days. I don't have your version of Clannad, so I'll need your help to test it. Will you be willing to do that?

Polarem

2011-02-25, 07:59

I will let you know once I dig out my old XP machine once I install linux onto it. Any recommendations on a Linux distro. For a while I was using Ubuntu.
Ubuntu is pretty good; I find it well-maintained and easy to use. I build my SEENs on Ubuntu 10.10. Once, I tried to set up RLDev on Ubuntu 6.06 to see if it behaves better in an old environment, but found no improvements. (I tried making it handle block comments in .utf files, but turns out it can't. Other than that, it works fine)

Kamiye

2011-02-25, 16:18

Thank you very much. ^^

Ok I can help you to test the game. ^^

Is there a menu translation for the VP version ?

And thanks a lot for helping me, the game runs perfectly !

Xcandescent

2011-02-26, 02:07

Ubuntu is pretty good; I find it well-maintained and easy to use. I build my SEENs on Ubuntu 10.10. Once, I tried to set up RLDev on Ubuntu 6.06 to see if it behaves better in an old environment, but found no improvements. (I tried making it handle block comments in .utf files, but turns out it can't. Other than that, it works fine)Also: if you're running OSX, Leopard will work, but Snow Leopard won't. My assumption is that it's because XCode on Leopard makes 32-bit builds by default, whereas Snow Leopard is all 64-bit. Haven't tried it on Tiger. 32-bit BSD variants might be worth looking into as well, if you're bored.

RLdev used to be buildable on 32-bit Windows under Cygwin (since that was Haeleth's development platform), but the required version of OCaml (3.09) will not build at all under the latest Cygwin release. (To be precise, it will compile, but then immediately fail when you try to bootstrap it.) I don't know why, and I spent a week pulling my hair out troubleshooting it, before I gave up and built it on Leopard. (There is a pre-compiled Windows GUI version of OCaml 3.09 available ... but good luck figuring out how to build anything with it.)

-XCN-