Haku's Potential

[pizzajincuuriki]

Originally Posted by Believe it!

Because Haku did know that they would meet again in battle, and she could not have known how that battle would go, if Naruto would see her face, or if Naruto would be able to recognize her voice.

Also, don't you think the fact that she claimed to be a MAN strongly indicates that she was lying? I mean, she was only 15 years old. That isn't old enough to be a man.

Yeah and Yondaime isnt dead, because they said he was, and Tobi isnt the AL leader, and Orochimaru actually loved Sandaime, JUST cause they said the opposite.

[Believe it!]

Originally Posted by Rahan

Ok, so if he didn't say he is a man, he is a girl, and if he said he is a man, he was lying, therefore he is a girl ?

No. Just hear me out. All I am saying is that since a 15 year old is not old enough to be considered a man, it obviously indicates that what Haku said was a lie. It was a lie because it was not true.

That does not mean she was a girl, or that she wasn't a boy, but it does mean that what she said to Naruto is not proof that she was a boy.

Originally Posted by pizzajincuuriki

Yeah and Yondaime isnt dead, because they said he was, and Tobi isnt the AL leader, and Orochimaru actually loved Sandaime, JUST cause they said the opposite.

You're not making any sense. I am saying that Haku was said to be a tracker, and yet that wasn't true. So why is it that baseless claims are considered proof when it comes to Haku's gender when the same does not apply to anything else?

[sakun]

because at the time when she told naruto that she was a male she wasnt a ninja she was a person who found naruto and decided to talk to him that is all. at the time haku wanted to help naruto with his dream. so y would he lie of all things his gender when he didnt lie about anything else at that time

[Believe it!]

But she still knew that she would meet him in battle again. She didn't know if Naruto would have been able to identify her. If so, then he would already think that Haku was a girl.

Now, if this had not been the truth and Haku had been a boy, then there would have been nothing to worry about, since that info was untrue. However, if it was true, then it would put Haku at risk of getting caught. That is why Haku had to lie to Naruto at the end of their conversation. That's what I think.

Plus, you are right about her being mostly open and honest with Naruto when they spoke face to face. However, at that time she did not deny it when Naruto referred to her with female titles, and also at the end of their conversation Haku had her back turned to Naruto and she was no longer talking to him face to face. This indicates dishonesty. So by the time she told Naruto the lie, she was already far away from him and going back into ninja mode, so to speak.

[Sandaime78]

Just out of curiosity...

Why are we still talk about a shemale character of "ago" and not concentrating on characters of "now?"

Just curious... just curious...

[Believe it!]

Because Haku was a much better and more influential character than most current ones put together. Plus, you never know, Naruto might run into her again when he dies. LOL!

[Sandaime78]

Originally Posted by Believe it!

Because Haku was a much better and more influential character than most current ones put together. Plus, you never know, Naruto might run into her again when he dies. LOL!

Now you're scaring me.

Since when did HE became HER?

Hey I like Haku ONLY because he's probably a sexier b!tch than Sasuke but I don't think Kishi is planning on making Naruto Part II, the Aftermath anytime soon...

[Believe it!]

I think she's always been a her. I mean, as far as I know the facts of the series indicate that she was a girl, and Kishimoto hasn't caller her a "him" even to this day.

[amOKchen]

haku the gender bender

[Lost-Wisdom]

He would of been such a bad-ass character.

But they JUST HAD to kill the most best characters from the beginning.

Why isn't anyone mentioned Zabuza also?
What would happen if HE had lived?

I bet he would be just be travelling to different countries with Haku by his side.

[pizzajincuuriki]

You're not making any sense. I am saying that Haku was said to be a tracker, and yet that wasn't true. So why is it that baseless claims are considered proof when it comes to Haku's gender when the same does not apply to anything else?

Neither are you. They provided (they bieng Kishimoto) proof thet showed Haku wasn't a tracker-nin, but didnt show anything that said he wasn't a boy. He actually said he wasnt a girl.

[Believe it!]

No, Haku did not say that she wasn't a girl, she said that she WAS a MAN. That is simply not true. She was not old enough to be considered a man. She was 15 years old, which would be shounen, or boy, not man. Believe it!

Her claim of being a tracker did not make it the truth. Therefore, her claim of being a man does not make IT the truth either. If that doesn't make sense to you, then there just isn't any hope for you.

Now, while they did not outright state that Haku was a girl, they did suggest it. She used a female word in the Japanese language for self reference, and she showed physical attraction for Zabuza. Both indicate that she was female. So can you at least see where I'm coming from?

Also, Zabuza sucked. I am glad they killed him off. He was a piece of crap who threw away the one thing in life he should have cherished the most.

[sakun]

Originally Posted by Believe it!

No, Haku did not say that she wasn't a girl, she said that she WAS a MAN. That is simply not true. She was not old enough to be considered a man. She was 15 years old, which would be shounen, or boy, not man. Believe it!

Her claim of being a tracker did not make it the truth. Therefore, her claim of being a man does not make IT the truth either. If that doesn't make sense to you, then there just isn't any hope for you.

Now, while they did not outright state that Haku was a girl, they did suggest it. She used a female word in the Japanese language for self reference, and she showed physical attraction for Zabuza. Both indicate that she was female. So can you at least see where I'm coming from?

Also, Zabuza sucked. I am glad they killed him off. He was a piece of crap who threw away the one thing in life he should have cherished the most.

In some cultures u become a man extremely early like 10-13 is considered a man and he also used male words as someone pointed out. And yes he did have affection to zabuza but thats because he saved him so he loved him because of that. and about zabuza yea his personality did kinda sucked but at the end he turned out to be someone with honor. and i no the story behind zabuza but i forgot what it exactly was didnt they betray him or something? And like most ppl they consider zabuza evil because he was willing to kill to accomplish his goal. BUT his goal was good he wanted to make his village stronger and better. And also i think he wanted haku to only think of himself as a weapon because when ppl have no emotional ties they are better killers. so this way if someone did kill zabuza haku wouldnt mourne him and such even though it did not work. And he did love haku just in a different way then most ppl. He loved haku for becomeing a high level ninja at such a young age. and becoming a power weapon. just my opinion.

but can someone help me refresh my memory about wat exactly happen to zabuza.

[pizzajincuuriki]

No, Haku did not say that she wasn't a girl, she said that she WAS a MAN. That is simply not true. She was not old enough to be considered a man. She was 15 years old, which would be shounen, or boy, not man. Believe it!

Which makes him a boy, man whatever!! All im trying to say is that HE had male genetalia and the manga did not disprove that!! They actually said that he was not a tracker-nin!! They did not say he was not a man, but guess what it did say. That he wasnt a girl. Now who's word would you take? Kishi's or mine?

[Arsanii]

.....
Ummm. Haku's a guy. Sorry to burst your bubbles. Didn't the author even say so?? Why are we arguing about this? He even looked like a boy when he was a little kid. Besides, he's got an EXTREMELY flat chest for a 15 year old if he is a girl.

I'm really upset that the author killed off Haku so quickly. I think he really did have potential. Personally, I don't really think much of any of the Naruto characters, but I actually liked Haku. Sooo... Kakashi is the only reason for me to watch Naruto now. xP. Haku could've easily beaten Sasuke and Naruto. Haku didn't want to kill Sasuke, and he didn't. He intentionally missed all those times and he only got beaten by Naruto because of the Kitsune chakra thingy. Not to mention, he wanted to die because he got defeated just once. When he said to Naruto "I'm sorry, I can't die just yet" he easily caught his hand and disappeared.

Yeahhh... I really wish Haku wasn't a minor character. He really was awesomee~<33

[amOKchen]

He would probably have been one of the strongest characters by now if he had lived.
It was pointed out that he was well beyond normal geniuses.

I'd like to have seen more of his one-handed jutsu, that only seemed to be possible because of his bloodline.

[Believe it!]

Originally Posted by sakun

In some cultures u become a man extremely early like 10-13 is considered a man and he also used male words as someone pointed out.

But not in the Japanese culture. In Japan, 15 is still "shounen" meaning "boy" or "of middle school age". Haku used "boku", which is used by both boys and girls. Mostly boys, but girls can use it too. Also, she used the word "atakushi" which is used only for females. So her choice of words does not prove anything.

Originally Posted by sakun

And yes he did have affection to zabuza but thats because he saved him so he loved him because of that.

The reasons are not in question. The type of love she felt is. She had more than simple admiration or graditude for Zabuza. She loved him in a deeper way. She is described as a consort. Also, she showed physical attraction for Zabuza, which means she was a heterosexual girl.

Originally Posted by sakun

and about zabuza yea his personality did kinda sucked but at the end he turned out to be someone with honor. and i no the story behind zabuza but i forgot what it exactly was didnt they betray him or something?

Gatou had his thugs go to the bridge with him so that they could kill Zabuza and the rest, seeing as how the battle wore every down. So yes it was a betrayal.

Originally Posted by sakun

And like most ppl they consider zabuza evil because he was willing to kill to accomplish his goal. BUT his goal was good he wanted to make his village stronger and better.

But his success was based on the suffering of others. Plus, he wanted to rule over his village, not make it stronger. He wanted to rule over a strong village, of course, but again it goes back to him wanting power for himself.

Originally Posted by sakun

And also i think he wanted haku to only think of himself as a weapon because when ppl have no emotional ties they are better killers.

Correct. I agree. However, I would also suggest that Zabuza wanted Haku to think of herself as a boy as well, since doing so would eliminate any gender differences between them as well as any attraction that might take place between them.

Originally Posted by sakun

And he did love haku just in a different way then most ppl. He loved haku for becomeing a high level ninja at such a young age. and becoming a power weapon. just my opinion.

Yeah I agree with that. There may have been more to it than that, or there may not have been. However, Haku did see Zabuza as more than a sensei, brother/father, or friend. Believe it!

Originally Posted by pizzajincuuriki

Which makes him a boy, man whatever!! All im trying to say is that HE had male genetalia

Stop. There is no offical source that even suggests that Haku had male genitalia. Also, her claim that she was a man does not make her a man or even a boy, just as her claim that she was a tracker ninja did not make her a tracker ninja, or her claim that Sasuke was dead made him dead.

Originally Posted by pizzajincuuriki

and the manga did not disprove that!!

No I think it did. However, assuming that it did not, that still doesn't mean that her claim makes it a fact.

Originally Posted by pizzajincuuriki

They actually said that he was not a tracker-nin!! They did not say he was not a man, but guess what it did say. That he wasnt a girl.

No it didn't. It never said that Haku was not a girl. It never proved that Haku was a boy. Moreover, it did prove that she wasn't a man. The age information proves that.

Originally Posted by pizzajincuuriki

Now who's word would you take? Kishi's or mine?

Kishimoto's obviously. Which is why I believe that Haku was a girl.

Originally Posted by Arsanii

.....
Ummm. Haku's a guy. Sorry to burst your bubbles. Didn't the author even say so??

No, the author did not say so.

Originally Posted by Arsanii

Why are we arguing about this? He even looked like a boy when he was a little kid. Besides, he's got an EXTREMELY flat chest for a 15 year old if he is a girl.

No, she always looked like a girl. Also, she was small chested but she did have breasts. Even if she had been flat, it does not prove that she wasn't a girl.

...

*sigh* Ya know what? It looks like I will just have to make a thread about this. The issue is not about her gender, so lets stop talking about it here. I'll make a new thread and post all my evidence that Haku was a girl and we can talk about it there. So I am done discussing it in this thread.

Originally Posted by Arsanii

I'm really upset that the author killed off Haku so quickly. I think he really did have potential. Personally, I don't really think much of any of the Naruto characters, but I actually liked Haku. Sooo... Kakashi is the only reason for me to watch Naruto now. xP. Haku could've easily beaten Sasuke and Naruto. Haku didn't want to kill Sasuke, and he didn't. He intentionally missed all those times and he only got beaten by Naruto because of the Kitsune chakra thingy. Not to mention, he wanted to die because he got defeated just once. When he said to Naruto "I'm sorry, I can't die just yet" he easily caught his hand and disappeared.

And if she had been cold hearted about it, she probably could have placed Naruto in front of the Lightning Blade instead of herself.

Originally Posted by amOKchen

I'd like to have seen more of his one-handed jutsu, that only seemed to be possible because of his bloodline.

Yes, she is the only one to use one handed signs.

[pizzajincuuriki]

No, the author did not say so.

WTF yes he did he writes the effin story.

No it didn't. It never said that Haku was not a girl. It never proved that Haku was a boy. Moreover, it did prove that she wasn't a man. The age information proves that.

It said Haku wasn't a girl when he said himself he wasnt a girl. YOUR age information does not prove anything because you dont write jack shit in this manga.

No I think it did. However, assuming that it did not, that still doesn't mean that her claim makes it a fact.

Waiting for an explanation on this one.

[Davitz]

Originally Posted by Believe it!

But not in the Japanese culture. In Japan, 15 is still "shounen" meaning "boy" or "of middle school age". Haku used "boku", which is used by both boys and girls. Mostly boys, but girls can use it too. Also, she used the word "atakushi" which is used only for females. So her choice of words does not prove anything.



The reasons are not in question. The type of love she felt is. She had more than simple admiration or graditude for Zabuza. She loved him in a deeper way. She is described as a consort. Also, she showed physical attraction for Zabuza, which means she was a heterosexual girl.



Gatou had his thugs go to the bridge with him so that they could kill Zabuza and the rest, seeing as how the battle wore every down. So yes it was a betrayal.



But his success was based on the suffering of others. Plus, he wanted to rule over his village, not make it stronger. He wanted to rule over a strong village, of course, but again it goes back to him wanting power for himself.



Correct. I agree. However, I would also suggest that Zabuza wanted Haku to think of herself as a boy as well, since doing so would eliminate any gender differences between them as well as any attraction that might take place between them.



Yeah I agree with that. There may have been more to it than that, or there may not have been. However, Haku did see Zabuza as more than a sensei, brother/father, or friend. Believe it!



Stop. There is no offical source that even suggests that Haku had male genitalia. Also, her claim that she was a man does not make her a man or even a boy, just as her claim that she was a tracker ninja did not make her a tracker ninja, or her claim that Sasuke was dead made him dead.



No I think it did. However, assuming that it did not, that still doesn't mean that her claim makes it a fact.



No it didn't. It never said that Haku was not a girl. It never proved that Haku was a boy. Moreover, it did prove that she wasn't a man. The age information proves that.



Kishimoto's obviously. Which is why I believe that Haku was a girl.



No, the author did not say so.



No, she always looked like a girl. Also, she was small chested but she did have breasts. Even if she had been flat, it does not prove that she wasn't a girl.

...

*sigh* Ya know what? It looks like I will just have to make a thread about this. The issue is not about her gender, so lets stop talking about it here. I'll make a new thread and post all my evidence that Haku was a girl and we can talk about it there. So I am done discussing it in this thread.



And if she had been cold hearted about it, she probably could have placed Naruto in front of the Lightning Blade instead of herself.



Yes, she is the only one to use one handed signs.

why al this over a character that is dead?
this is the same pathetic stuff as wot goes on in the claymore thread about teressa, the characterr is dead so, who cares? yeh theres 'what if' they survived etc, but 'HE' (haku is a man/boy <-- doest make a difference still male) died
end of really id say

[sakun]

no i meant his village not the thugs that cant even scratch him when he is injured to all hell and he can only use a kunai in his mouth.