Anime Saimoe Tournament 2007 - Tournament Proper

[DisavateraMX]

Originally Posted by Deathkillz

whaa! hamster won >_<

and tamao had such a good number too (888)

eruruu vs sayuri...

sorry eruruu but "ahahaha~~" wins over this round

oujo vs louise

Eri chan all the way :3

I think out of all the loli type characters out there, louise is the one who ranks pretty low in my books - she is just so annoying sometimes

Heheheh, Deathkillz, you know Chinese by any chance?...In Chinese, "888" would prolly mean something very very nice, and has a lot to do with succeeding and getting a hell lot of money.

And anyway...dog-girl and the blonde get my vote. Simply because of the Mai-Sayuri thing, I think I prefered Mai, and Louise...man, I'd rather not say

And...after watching the comments fly back and forth, I'm finally ready to sleep.

[Ultenth]

Originally Posted by OverFunk

@Ultenth:
That's your logic. I also think that ZnT was done poorly (looking forward to translations of the novels), that Eri is a superior character all in all, but I'm voting Louise because I feel more moe for her. I'm not voting for shows.

I've heard the term moe as a verb referred to as feeling a protective and loving response to a character. Again, to each their own, but I just can't understand how you would feel that way towards a psycho stuck up B who is so violent she doesn't even qualify as tsundere, and wants to whip you for almost no reason at any given time. But that's just me. Personally I think Nagi is a much better example, if you're going by the definition of tsundere moe, to me. Louisa just seems like some lolicon fetishists S&M fantasy.

[Micchi]

Originally Posted by rikchik

Might that be some form of 女 on the right? I can't make anything out of the left side radical or radicals.

It looks like teki (敵) to me.

[RevanAD]

Originally Posted by Psieye

Well, here's my attempt at deciphering - not even sure if that's an existing Kanji.

The kanji is 敵 (teki or kataki)... in this case it's kataki (revenge) because the line is アルルゥの敵うちじゃあああああああ！(Aruruu no kataki uchi jaaaaaaa! = Revenge for Aruruu!)

[Aya Reiko]

Spoiler for Current Status:

Spoiler for Current Status Part 2:

Will vote for...
Tail-gasm
Ojou-sama

Vote for Eri because there are far too many times I would've tossed Louise into the moat or at a very hungry dragon than I could count. Plus I'd like to have a champion that could wear a bra if she wanted to. (Has there even been one like that?)

[OverFunk]

Originally Posted by Ultenth

I've heard the term moe as a verb referred to as feeling a protective and loving response to a character. Again, to each their own, but I just can't understand how you would feel that way towards a psycho stuck up B who is so violent she doesn't even qualify as tsundere, and wants to whip you for almost no reason at any given time. But that's just me. Personally I think Nagi is a much better example, if you're going by the definition of tsundere moe, to me. Louisa just seems like some lolicon fetishists S&M fantasy.

Eventually Saito tames her...

Nagi just happens to have more dere-dere (not that I don't appreciate that). Louise has her dere-dere moments too, but the anime breaks them in the worst ways possible.
----
In a match related post, lately most votes seem to be for Eri. So take what I said as the beginning as delusion.

[Branduil]

Well I can't complain about today's results.

[Psieye]

Ahhh, naruhodo~ Thanks again RevanAD


Regarding Louise - blame that on the inherent nature of non-narrator anime being unable to express inner thoughts fluently. From Modern Earth's perspective, Louise is rampantly violating basic human rights on Saito. But what does it look like from that world? What IS a Familiar in that world? Things start to make sense when you transcribe ZnT into a parallel world where Familiars are replaced by obedient robots - Louise happened to get an AI instead of a Robot and she can't understand why it has a will of its own (for starters). Thus as you go through the ZnT timeline (which was scrambled into an unchronological form by the anime...) you compare Louise's changing attitude to what she started as.


Kinda why Tsundere is so popular (well... at least the Original definition of Tsundere, not the 'Tsun exterior, Dere interior' - see Shiraishi's rant) - because it Forces character development to pull off properly. Not that other Moe types can't have development attached to them, but when a character designer decides to put "Tsundere" among a new chara's stats, they're forced to think ahead. Of course, just being a Tsundere doesn't make you extremely well fleshed out - it means you're 2 dimensional instead of 1 dimensional. Well grown characters are multi-dimensional (and it annoys me that often a fanbase/meme shoehorns such characters into only 1~2 dimensions).

[DSJFX18]

Ara ara... A series of disappointments one after another. Well.. Hoping Eri and Sayuri can break that chain for me.

[Furudanuki]

Originally Posted by Swampstorm

I must say that I'm pleasantly surprised with your choice. It strikes me as rather unusual to see you voting for a tsundere.

Unusual, maybe, but hardly unheard of. I don't have a blanket dislike for tsundere, it simply isn't one of my primary moe properties. I do have a preference for the Ice Princess and Strict Iinchou/Leader variety, which is why I supported characters like Eika Ichijou (Sky Girls), Kaori Misaka (Kanon), and Takako Itsukushima (Otome wa Boku ni Koishiteru). But I am very firmly in the same old-school camp as Minoru Shiraishi when it comes to what I consider to be a proper tsundere. They start out or quickly become almost entirely tsun - cold, haughty, strict, hostile, and/or what have you. Over time they gradually become less tsun, more moderate, and begin showing their dere side on occasion. And once the dere side starts to become more common they will not switch back and forth at the drop of a hat. The tsun side is still there and will certainly manifest itself on occasion, but they are not prone to what I would consider wildly bi-polar mood swings. So many characters that are referred to as being tsundere do not actually fall into that category as far as I'm concerned, and I hope another term will eventually be coined to differentiate between the two.

[Rainfall]

Yue-chan lost in KS, as I expected. Well, C.C. pulling through is fine for me as well. Will be giving Shana all the support today. To be honest, nothing ever caught my attention about Maria. I never found her moe, never found her extraordinary, never found her engaging. I tried to be agreeable as to why she is moe to lots of fans, but as a result, I found it impossible for me to feel the same way. So vote for Shana. Despite that I'm not that much of a tsundere fan, Shana gets credit here for her dere-dere moments and her battles. Hence, against Maria, I will be giving her the backing. *points to temporary sig* If Shana should lose, I will be upset indeed . . .

The defeat of Tamao will definately leave behind a trail of dissatisfaction.

Spoiler for Tamao's Reaction:

Tamao: "Iya! How could I have lost?!?!"

I'll be voting for Sayuri and Eri today. I find Eri less exasperating than Louise and a bit more dere-dere. Eri and Harima's relationship helped lead me to this decision. Thus, although I'm not much of an Eri fan, she has enough for me to toss her a vote. Eri for victory! Sadly, this will be the last time I support her.

[Aya Reiko]

Current totals (inc. fake votes):
G3-1
Eruruu@Utawarerumono = 213
Kurata Sayuri@Kanon = 251

H3-2
Louise Françoise Le Blanc de La Vallière@Zero no Tsukaima = 203
Sawachika Eri@School Rumble Second Term = 214

- - - - -

Low votes = low possibility of fake votes.

[Rainfall]

G3-1
Eruruu@Utawarerumono = 213
Kurata Sayuri@Kanon = 251

H3-2
Louise Françoise Le Blanc de La Vallière@Zero no Tsukaima = 203
Sawachika Eri@School Rumble Second Term = 214

I can't stop suspecting Louise trying to catch everyone off-guard again like with Mai and Otoha in the past. She starts off a bit behind, or in Otoha's case, a bit lower than expected. But towards the end, all those Louise supporters would jump out of nowhere and ambush the opponent. . . Same with Eruruu. During her match against Ayu, Ayu was leading slightly, almost like Sayuri right now. But in the end, Eruruu stole the game with one sweep. Proceed with caution, Eri and Sayuri.

[Visiroth]

Originally Posted by Furudanuki

So many characters that are referred to as being tsundere do not actually fall into that category as far as I'm concerned, and I hope another term will eventually be coined to differentiate between the two.

Tsundere and Tsungire?

Originally Posted by Psieye

Kinda why Tsundere is so popular (well... at least the Original definition of Tsundere, not the 'Tsun exterior, Dere interior' - see Shiraishi's rant) - because it Forces character development to pull off properly. Not that other Moe types can't have development attached to them, but when a character designer decides to put "Tsundere" among a new chara's stats, they're forced to think ahead. Of course, just being a Tsundere doesn't make you extremely well fleshed out - it means you're 2 dimensional instead of 1 dimensional. Well grown characters are multi-dimensional (and it annoys me that often a fanbase/meme shoehorns such characters into only 1~2 dimensions).

Tsundere is a path of character development. A character who is tsundere has, by definition, developed in a particular way. The big mistake that producers are making is in trying to replicate that effect and mass produce it. As a result, you have a number of characters who appear to take on the traits of tsunderes in a very loose sense, but who lack the proper character development to properly qualify them as such.

Tsundere doesn't really work in the same way as most moe stats, which are static by nature. You can't just tack on tsundere on to something in the same way that you could, say, meido. If you try, you'll end up with one of those absurd caricatures that we see so much of nowadays.

I think the thing that works both for and against Eri is the fact that she is no-frills in the gimmick department. The main thing to recommend her is in the fact that she is a very well developed, believable character. Those subtle parts of her personality are what really draw you into her moe.

[Psieye]

Originally Posted by Visiroth

Tsundere and Tsungire?

I put forth "TsuDeTsuDe"~ My first thought was "Untemporal Tsundere" but that's unwieldly. Tsude-tsude gets across the 'broken' and 'repeating' feeling of poorly produced not-quite-Tsundere characters. Though this term can't really be applied to all such characters as e.g. Kagami has bloomed quite well despite not being a true Tsundere.

Actually what's the "gire" of Tsungire stand for?

Tsundere is a path of character development. A character who is tsundere has, by definition, developed in a particular way. The big mistake that producers are making is in trying to replicate that effect and mass produce it. As a result, you have a number of characters who appear to take on the traits of tsunderes in a very loose sense, but who lack the proper character development to properly qualify them as such.

Tsundere doesn't really work in the same way as most moe stats, which are static by nature. You can't just tack on tsundere on to something in the same way that you could, say, meido. If you try, you'll end up with one of those absurd caricatures that we see so much of nowadays.

Mmm, well put. Though it makes me ponder: how was Kagami born during the chara design stage...? It's a believable personality as Kagami reacts realistically (instead of forcibly just to create more Tsun vs Dere bipolarity). Perhaps it's because the magnitudes of Tsun and Dere she shows are controlled and appropriately rationed out?

The other path of rationing out Tsun and Dere is for a character to be Tsun to most characters but Dere towards a favourite few/one... but that rarely is called Tsundere in any form is it?

[Konata-chan]

I was gonna vote Sayuri but forgot my laptop. I'm done until the Shana/Nagi match, since I have no interest in either today's or tomorrow's matchup. Hopefully at least one of the newbie characters can take care of those darn dolls.

[neutralizer]

Voted for just Eri

I couldn't find any good Eri AA on that AA site. There were only 2 and they didn't seem to be able to fit with my vote. Oh well... I hope to see some nice templates for the rush tonight.

[Psieye]

Spoiler for Round 227:

<<倉田佐祐理＠Kanon>>
It's not an easy choice and it's not an easy fight... but I'll go for Sayuri.
Her "I won't pry if you won't say" respect for privacy and her ever cheerful attitude decide it for me.
Though that Eruruu entry for the VS Poster really had me checking my loyalties...
<<沢近愛理＠スクールランブル 二学期>>
I may be hardcore Onigiri, but that doesn't mean I can't support Eri as an individual character. Had some seemingly rough moments, but they were cleared up and recovered from.
Louise... I can't judge until I've read the original novels. The anime really could have done with a narrator to directly explain the Alien Logic that exists in her world.

Oh and neutraliser? Do you keep up with the School Rumble manga or do you wait for it all to be animated?


And mmm... supload is blanking out - meaning ando's uploads are unavailable. Let's hope it's temporary but in case not I've got all the posters saved anyway. Which reminds me... I ought to make a .zip of them and put them on the wiki once this is all over this year...

[todkapuz]

Originally Posted by ando

Today's result was confirmed.

awww none of the image links are working.. all the thumbnails are blue boxes... I want my match posters for the file... hope it's just a temp problem.

[Mad Dog]

Originally Posted by todkapuz

awww none of the image links are working.. all the thumbnails are blue boxes... I want my match posters for the file... hope it's just a temp problem.

They work just fine for me.