Mobile Suit Gundam 00 - Episode 17 Discussion / Poll

[Nvis]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

That's because NONE of the 3 powers are at war with each other.

You get nothing from them when against CB.

[ThoHell]

Hot dang, tension up the yang with the new guys, but they're pretty bad ass. A lot more personality with these guys. All siblings.....weird.

A cool and leading older brother, a war hungry middle brother, and an outgoing little sisters.

LOL...Setsuna first kiss? I think things have gotten a lot more interesting.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by Nvis

You get nothing from them when against CB.

Watch episode 9,10 and 15.

A cool and leading older brother, a war hungry middle brother, and an outgoing little sisters.

You mean a battle freak. He makes Ali look like a saint.

[Kaioshin Sama]

It's funny because despite the fact that the response to this episode is overwhelmingly positive here and on RC, the usual blogs are still finding ways to describe (I say finding ways because at this point I think that is their true purpose. Not to blog, but to find ways to bash the series) how absolutely terrible this episode is for reasons such as, and I swear to god I am not making this up, Neena's Haro looking evil and talking rudely and Neena forcing a kiss on Setsuna is to blunt (paraphrased reasoning) and thus the writers are being to heavy-handed about the nature of the Thrones. That and the usual Sunrise bashing. I mean reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllly...

Deciding to turn Lemons into Lemonade, I decided to think about what they said and give it some consideration. Well I think the Thrones personality that we saw, but the Meister's haven't experienced, should have tipped the viewer off to their nature already, true enough, but the Meister's don't know that and think of them as allies. They never saw the Thrones disparaging remarks about them, nor heard the psychotic raving of Michael Trinity. The whole point of their initial interactions was that it give the Meister's bad vibes that the viewer already knew about. I mean that's not blunt and overkill, that's showing the angle from the Meister's point of view rather than the viewers like last time.

I personally don't see how it would be hard to come to that conclusion with just a little consideration of the narrative the writers layed out. Some people I swear just have an agenda against the series.

The only thing really blunt about this episode is seeing Rie Kugimiya playing a femdom type again.

[Dean_the_Young]

Originally Posted by Astrana

Spoiler for aa:

The guys started CB had some discovery team to Jupiter 120 years ago, I think it's a rare technology/material on Jupiter. His purpose for leading the discovery team is to construct gundam. So if the professor(who figured out) didnt die, we might see AEU making gundams lol

The Professor is from the Union. The AEU doesn't even have an Elevator, and is behind on its colonies. No real chance for them.

On the other hand... there are some interesting plot points to consider.

1) Graham's fight with the Gundams is getting personal. The Meisters were a challenge; the Thrones are enemies.

2) Sumeragi's reaction when she learns that the Professor is dead and Billy was heavily injured by the Throne attack.

3) Looks like the Professor is the first one to figure out Scheinberg's goal. Plenty of opportunities, but I'm betting something along the lines of forcing Earth to come together against an outside threat, in this case CB from Jupiter. The Gundam Meisters are CB-light, meant to reduce conflict and push the world to work together. Once the world starts cooperating, in come the Thrones, who are a hint of what is to come; a more violent and aggresive CB that won't fight according to the principles of old. Their job is to force the Powers even closer together or risk complete defeat.

And finally, the ultimate threat will be revealed to be more Gundams being built at Jupiter, and these won't just stop at destroying war. Their function will be the catalyst to force Humanity to not only work together for survival, but to force them to leave Earth and put a presence across the solar system in order to defeat CB, and THAT is the true purpose of Celestial Being.

Or, that's my take on it so far.

Spoiler for d:

you are right, and the professor also found out CB's real goal isn't stop war. Setsuna and others doesn't know about that, but i think the throne crew does.

Maybe, but maybe not. They could be as much pawns in the Plan as the Meisters and VEDA.

[ThoHell]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

Watch episode 9,10 and 15.



You mean a battle freak. He makes Ali look like a saint.

LOL..yup true he is a war freak, but you know what. He brings a lot of amusement with him. Now that I think about the little sister, she seems to have a dark side after watching her reaction to Setsuna ignoring her.

[HazardNights]

This is getting beyond silly now. Four gundams were bad enough but now there are 7. Seriously if it wasn't for Graham, Ali, and the others on the three Earth factions I'd have stopped watching already. It was great to see the gundams finally not ripping through grunt suits. I was really hoping that at least one of the gundams would have been captured but no. Now we have more named characters dropping like flies now.

If Billy is seriously injured there is a good chance he's the next to go. Making this really personal for Graham is good but unless he has a decent suit and ship to back up him there really is no point since he won't make a difference in the end. That's what makes this so disappointing and annoying for me to be honest. We have cool gundams but I can't bring myself to cheer them on because I can't stand the people piloting them for the most part and when they are challenged the technology gap always kills things in the end.

I guess I could hope that sooner rather then later Graham, Ali, Soma, Patrick, and Sergai might end up working together. I don't see the remaining OverFlags living much longer since they've already lost what four or five of them already between episodes 15, 16, and 17? Soma's team was pretty much taken out in episode 16, same for Patrick's.

Out of the three new pilots Johan seems decent but I can't wait to see the other two get killed. Just from episode 16 alone they've already annoyed the hell out of me.

[Deacon Blues]

@Dean_The_Young

The AEU does have an orbital elevator, it's called "La Tour". (Source: Meister's Mission page.25)

[Dean_the_Young]

Originally Posted by HazardNights

This is getting beyond silly now. Four gundams were bad enough but now there are 7. Seriously if it wasn't for Graham, Ali, and the others on the three Earth factions I'd have stopped watching already. It was great to see the gundams finally not ripping through grunt suits. I was really hoping that at least one of the gundams would have been captured but no. Now we have more named characters dropping like flies now.

Except, the named characters to die have been rather minor. Joshua's sole reason for existence was to illuminate a plot point of Graham's past, Ming was there to let Hallelujah be sadistic, and Mason was a Graham-buddy figure to die so Graham would have some tragedy-development: despite having been assigned to Graham from the start, Mason's first and only fight where he actually has done something has been this one. Dutch's only claim to relevance was his willingness to fight Joshua over Graham's good name.

The Professor has been the first moderately important character to die, but as the wise old teacher for both the Union and Sumeragi he was marked for death pretty early on. His death has served two main purposes from the start: he gave a hint that ending war is not CB's ultimate goal, and his death (and Billy's wounding) is going to cause shockwaves for Sumeragi.

If Billy is seriously injured there is a good chance he's the next to go. Making this really personal for Graham is good but unless he has a decent suit and ship to back up him there really is no point since he won't make a difference in the end. That's what makes this so disappointing and annoying for me to be honest. We have cool gundams but I can't bring myself to cheer them on because I can't stand the people piloting them for the most part and when they are challenged the technology gap always kills things in the end.

Billy won't go, though Dutch is a tier-1 for being knocked off later on. Billy is Sumeragi's last link to her past, and his wounding and the Professor's death are going to give us Sumeragi development and put doubts about CB into her heart. If he dies, it'll be much later.

I guess I could hope that sooner rather then later Graham, Ali, Soma, Patrick, and Sergai might end up working together. I don't see the remaining OverFlags living much longer since they've already lost what four or five of them already between episodes 15, 16, and 17? Soma's team was pretty much taken out in episode 16, same for Patrick's.

The Overflag's have lost four members since their start, over the course of 3 main encounters with the Gundams: Lockon, first Throne, Second Throne. Considering how the AEU has routinely been wiped out by the Gundams and the HRL has numerous times seen only Soma and Sergei as the survivors of a Gundam rampage, the Overflags are going to be the slow-but-steady deaths: one here, another there, with occasional reinforcements on the side.

Out of the three new pilots Johan seems decent but I can't wait to see the other two get killed. Just from episode 16 alone they've already annoyed the hell out of me.

I have already decided I don't like Johan: he has no self control, he's blood thirsty, and he killed Mason while Graham couldn't do anything. My only consolation is that he's all but marked for death as the lunatic!evilrival.

[Dean_the_Young]

Originally Posted by Deacon Blues

@Dean_The_Young

The AEU does have an orbital elevator, it's called "La Tour". (Source: Meister's Mission page.25)

It's not completed. Source: the anime (episode 1).

They are falling behind on their colony. Source: the anime (should be around the Taribia episode(s), IIRC).

[HazardNights]

Originally Posted by Dean_the_Young

I have already decided I don't like Johan: he has no self control, he's blood thirsty, and he killed Mason while Graham couldn't do anything. My only consolation is that he's all but marked for death as the lunatic!evilrival.

Wait. Johan is the one that saved Lockon in episode 16 right? He seemed the most calm. Unless I'm referring to someone else.

[Dean_the_Young]

Originally Posted by HazardNights

Wait. Johan is the one that saved Lockon in episode 16 right? He seemed the most calm. Unless I'm referring to someone else.

Not sure: I'm talking about the pilot of Zwei(?), the one with the GN Fangs. The mildly psychotic one.

Man, he makes the Meisters look sane...

[Empire]

Hmm... let's see....

+2 for Setsuna's "Don't touch me!" - youngest meister yet again proves he's strongest of all the four
+1 for Throne Zwei pilot - like first three psycho's from SEED, he's just lovely.
-2 for fight - more "CB mobile suits own everything". It's beyond boring, it's sad.
+1 for Char-Graham Black Comet AznableAcre. It's impossible to not love passion in his voice when he learns about Throne's deed

overall... 7/10... mmm, it's probably higest score I've given any 00 ep.

Now who the hell is going to develop a mecha which will stand up to the oryginal four and thrones?
I understand that now will be like 10-15 episodes which will end up with all-out battle of oryginal meisters vs throne meisters, but then what?

I'm comforting my hunger for a good, balanced battle with hope that Bandai will develop another Playstation 2 "VS" game which will feature MS from all previous shows and 00 - Providence vs Throne Zwei may be interesting
And of course SRW's...

Meanwhile, I'm waiting for sub. I'm wondering what is Felt saying at 8:38... something about her parents... I get a feeling this might be important.

[Dean_the_Young]

Quick question: When does the opening scene out of Jupiter take place? Before or after the series? (Am I to assume that those men are with CB?)

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by Dean_the_Young

Quick question: When does the opening scene out of Jupiter take place? Before or after the series? (Am I to assume that those men are with CB?)

It takes place 80 years prior to the current date in the series.

[sgogeta4]

somehow I have a Rau le Creuset feeling... EVERYONE MUST DIE!!! and the 4 protagonists are going to have an interesting battle with the 3 newer gundams (who don't use real GN drives - not that it makes them any less powerful). I wonder how Neena will react when fighting Setsuna...

My prediction is that Tiera will kill Michael with a massive beam through his chest while Alle takes out the funnel things, Lockon will outsnipe and kill Johann, while Setsuna faces off against Neena, who probably will also die.

[Empire]

Originally Posted by sgogeta4

somehow I have a Rau le Creuset feeling... EVERYONE MUST DIE!!! and the 4 protagonists are going to have an interesting battle with the 3 newer gundams (who don't use real GN drives - not that it makes them any less powerful). I wonder how Neena will react when fighting Setsuna...

My prediction is that Tiera will kill Michael with a massive beam through his chest while Alle takes out the funnel things, Lockon will outsnipe and kill Johann, while Setsuna faces off against Neena, who probably will also die.

Or maybe not?
Maybe 3 superpowers move their superpowered arses and make some MS which can actually stand up to CB Gundams and we'll see...

Throne Zwei beaten up by Patrick Coralsawar's Enact MK2. Hey, the guy already has some practice in dodging things.

Throne Drei totaled by Soma - I'm the badass lady in this story! GTFO newbie!

Throne Eins owned by Graham - Just because Black Comet wanted to.

(and 4 oryginal meisters sitting behind and drinking orange juice)

[monster]

That V-sign is starting to annoy me, but everything else was great, especially the Haros. And is it just me or did they toned down the Fangs in this episode? They were gone in the middle of the fight only to reappear for the finale. Lastly, that Flag's descent was cool.

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by monstert

That V-sign is starting to annoy me

I thought people were going to say this after episode 16.

Yeah we are seeing it a lot, though it's not really bothering me. With the way this show is headed, i don't think we'll be seeing as much as we do in this episode.

[Crusader]

Holy moly i surely didn't expect to see the good professor go. This pretty much set in stone that CB is up to no good. Poor Graham... i wonder how long before his honor no longer means anything.