Code Geass R2 - Episode 16 Discussion / Poll

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Var

One problem, gods could very well entail killing all immortals, at which point, V.V. was seeking his own death as well.

VV made the point that the "gods" he talk about is more metaphorical than physical. Thus it is nearly impossible he would be talking about killing physical immortals.

2 out of 3 is not good enough.

[Micante]

Well, I don't exactly see how killing all the immortal has anything to do with exposing the lies of the world, so I think we can assume V.V. was talking about something else.

[Deathwing]

i find Charles badass nothing works against him and he strikes fear into the heart of everyone he might be my new favorite character of code geass

[Kaioshin Sama]

Originally Posted by Rembr

Yes, yes, bias is fun. But I was hoping you could expand on how the criterias you supplied for one cannot be applied to the other, because I think both the positives and the negatives you presented can be applied to both.

Absolutely, but in different ways. For example I strongly believe that Haruhi is a character driven series and as such the characters are designed in a way to have a specific appeal. Code Geass on the hand is more of a plot driven series and it's plotlines are often structured to have a very specific appeal. The list of positive and negatives can go on, but they'll be in different categories. Still I think Haruhi has more of a direct otaku appeal whereas Code Geass at least attempts to bring in different types of fans with different graphics. That's why for Code Geass the earlier season ratings were not enough.

Now what I want to know is how the same types of occurances/plots points/character actions can be variably held in positive and negative lights depending on which show some people are talking about. Once I understand and can theorize on that level of anime fandom I'll have levelled up again.

[Torri_fay_torren@hot]

Thoughts

Lelouch- I like seeing his sensitive side. Him takeing care of C.C. and worrying over his sister makes me respect him more.

C.C - C.C. has completly changed. Intersting! And yet she still likes Pizza and she is still giving Lelouch advice. Love it!

Kallen- YES!! Finaly somebody beat up that little traiter! Hit him again! I have always liked you Kallen! ( It looks like Garun might have been upgraded!)

Cornelia- I like her hair . Her character is very intersting to me right know. I hope she doesn't die.

Ogi- he's alive! does that mean Villeta is O.K? Yes!

Todou- figure out that that girl likes you!

Rolo and Nina- DIE!!!!!!!!!!!

Lloyd- I really think Lloyd might be one of the smartest in Code G. He is very wise.

Suzaku- Ha, Kallen gave you what you had coming to you HAHAH! Still.....Suzaku, you have a chance to redeem yourself next episode. DO NOT BLOW IT!!!!!

[Niar]

Pretty dangerous to throw a dagger into the grass, Susaku. The student will be happy.

[Claies]

Originally Posted by Liddo-kun

Trading Cornelia for Nunally might have been Lelouch's original plan.
Negotiations with Suzaku might just be for backup in case his plan to trade fails.

He never really thought of Suzaku as a backup, did he? It took C.C. to remind him of that. Without the whole bleeding scene, he would have continued freaking over it.

Seeing him crumble into asking Suzaku just from the Emperor's appearance puts his appeal down quite a bit though.

[sLum]

Originally Posted by Deathwing

i find Charles badass nothing works against him and he strikes fear into the heart of everyone he might be my new favorite character of code geass

He is definitely my favorite, and doesn't seem to lie to anyone. There must be something he wants because he could just take over by exposing his son.

[JesseJamesRocket]

Originally Posted by Taler

Charles=Palpatine.

I see him as more like Marvel's Apocalypse. He's all about Survival of the fittest, and ruling as the most fit, confident that he is that one. Yet, he tolerates those whom he knows might/will try to usurp his power in order to keep himself on his toes, and to live true to his belief that if he is defeated, he is unfit.

Though I see your point about Palpatine, who had the attitude of: "So be it, as long as the Dark side prevails."

[JesseJamesRocket]

Originally Posted by scifijimmy

Well, Charles is a big hypocrite when he took on V.V.'s Code. Like honestly how will he come to get Social Darwinistic change if he's the Emperor Forever?!

As we've seen, even immortality is no sure ticket in Code Geass. Though Charles is immortal and unlikely to lose, he knows that the right plan/combination of powers can defeat him.

[morbosfist]

Taking V.V.'s code doesn't make him a hypocrite, he's just upping the ante because one of his sons got on the same track. Whoever beats him should logically be able to gain or exceed the supernatural abilities he has gained for himself.

[Slighted]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

We had three immortals in the show, CC, VV and the Nun.

VV had no intention of dying, and in fact his goal was to "kill gods", which has nothing to do with suicide.

2 out of 3 immortals wanting to kill themselves does NOT add up to all immortals.

This reminded me of the complaint that "everyone is getting Geass", when there is currently only 2 living Geass users right now. (Anti-Geass is mechanical, and the Emperor isn't a Geass user anymore.)

How do you know that Charles doesn't have Geass anymore?

[Stargaze]

Originally Posted by Slighted

How do you know that Charles doesn't have Geass anymore?

Because he acquired the code. Like C.C. before him, once one received the code, geass can no longer be used.

[DarkLordOfkichiku]

Originally Posted by Slighted

How do you know that Charles doesn't have Geass anymore?

He says it himself, "I have received another power to replace Geass" or however it was...

[Liddo-kun]

Originally Posted by Claies

He never really thought of Suzaku as a backup, did he? It took C.C. to remind him of that. Without the whole bleeding scene, he would have continued freaking over it.

Seeing him crumble into asking Suzaku just from the Emperor's appearance puts his appeal down quite a bit though.

Well, I never said in my previous post when Lelouch started thinking of using Suzaku as backup plan for Nunally. I have same thoughts as you, it's only after the bleeding scene - not before.

[Anh_Minh]

I think if Lelouch had a plan at all, before thinking of Suzaku, he wouldn't have been so panicked and wouldn't have snapped at CC in the first place.

Also, would a Cornelia - Nunnaly exchange work? Charles may not agree. From his point of view, Cornelia's a loser. She threw away most of her power and ended up being captured. Holding Nunnaly, OTOH, is holding Lelouch by the balls. And Lelouch is successful. He and Schneizel are the only ones who have truly proven their worth.

At most, you could sell it to Guilford. Have him kidnap Nunnaly, if he can, and then exchange her.

[Kristen]

Originally Posted by Bennyswan

I don't think its a requirement to take the immortality away from the contractor but most immortal people we have seen in this show wants to die and force the immortality on the person with the geass. Uhh you probably know C.C doesn't have her power anymore, so shes a mortal, he can grant her wish with or without the immortality.

Oh, she doesn't have immortality? It was never explictly stated. So, it makes me wonder, where did it go?

[Lyllrik]

Originally Posted by Kristen

Oh, she doesn't have immortality? It was never explictly stated. So, it makes me wonder, where did it go?

My guess is Charles. :S

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Kristen

Oh, she doesn't have immortality? It was never explictly stated. So, it makes me wonder, where did it go?

My guess is that, like Geass, it is linked to memory.

It is never explained why someone who got their memory altered would have their Geass sealed away, but we know it does. But if we assume Immortality worked the same way (since only Geass users can become immortal), then it is not that far of a stretch that immortality as a power can be sealed by losing one's memory.

And thus as a result, CC's immortality is currently locked in "the world of C", and would come back as a package when she inevitability get her memories restored.

Note that you can't alter an immortal's memory by force as a means of killing him; Geass doesn't work on immortals. There has to be another means to alter Charles's mind before you can kill him that way.

[Anh_Minh]

Refrain overdose?