Mobile Suit Gundam 00 Second Season - Episode 22 Discussion / Poll

[Kaioshin Sama]

Well 4Tran has finally shown up so that's thread I guess. It was actually a pretty good run this week folks. Until next time.

Okay, one parting quip. Considering it happened in the post credits portion of the episode (as in the "nothing is conclusive I the director get to do what I want for a minute and a half" segment) the only person who probably thinks that Ribbons is out of commission is Regene Regetta and really that's the most important part as far as next episode goes. Bets on Ribbons descending the stairs (this bit for the Innovators has become like the chair swivel for Blofeld) and Regene going all bug eyed within the first five minutes of the next episode are now open.

[wingdarkness]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

Nothing amazes me, although I'd wonder whether they're really fans and if they've been paying attention. The scene was so obviously not going to be conclusive that I actually half-expected Ribbons to get up right away.

Yeah because figuring out Ribbons isn’t dead is like Neo figuring out he’s living in the Matrix :soooopa-eyeroll:…

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

Okay, one parting quip. Considering it happened in the post credits portion of the episode (as in the "nothing is conclusive I the director get to do what I want for a minute and a half" segment)...

I consider this more apart of Japanese culture than the director’s whim…The Japanese (for whatever reasons) don’t like to surprise the hell outta the audience or create suspense for crucial matters during the weekly break in many animes…I’ve seen this for years upon years where crucial information, if not the whole crux of the surprise, is given away in the episode preview…There are many animes that I used to just skip the preview because they would give too much away…The reason I used to think they did this was because 90% of anime is produced from manga so they guessed the core audience already knew what was to come, but for non-manga shows, IDK….Western society, US specifically (again for some reason) tend to milk hidden surprises or crucial cliffhangers for all they’re worth, almost to the point of endless frustration (LOST fan speaking here)…But yeah, if you have a pretty decent IQ you can surmise that the impending shock is as much for Regene Regetta than it is for even the audience at large…

[DragoZERO]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

Another side switch I'm not fond of is Kati going over to Kataron. While it's reasonable that she really dislikes A-LAWS, there isn't much reason to side with these guys.

I had thought she joined the remnants and additions to the coup d'état faction of the Federation.

Originally Posted by 4Tran

About the only nice touch in the whole episode was when Feldt gave her flower to Setsuna. It's a humanizing gesture that Gundam 00 could use a lot more of. I do wish that there was more setup and substance for it, but I'll take what I can get.

I agree with you there.

[Zeta Gundam]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

[color=blue]


Another side switch I'm not fond of is Kati going over to Kataron. While it's reasonable that she really dislikes A-LAWS, there isn't much reason to side with these guys. On top of that, her little speech as she attacked the A-LAWS fleet was really, really awful. It's also fairly clear that the creators have no intention of treating the A-LAWS seriously at all. About the only thing that this development going for it is that Patrick finally gets some love - I'd be rather amused if he got into O Gundam instead.

Kati didn't go to Kataron.

She's leading the Coup d'état faction that was spearheaded by Sergei.

Goodman gives the okay to fight back against them and also deems them "Anti-Federation". I could see how initially the A-LAWS would have expected them to be helping against Celestial Being since the Earth Federation uses GN-XIII's, just colored differently than the A-LAWS. He wouldn't have had to give an okay if it had only been Kataron's crappy old Mobile Suits that came into the battle. The A-Laws have been fighting against them, so they would already know.

Even if she was to join Kataron, what would be of it?

It's been clear for a long time, that Kati doesn't think highly of the A-Laws or approve of their tactics. Her being on the inside, and seeing everything the A-LAWS do, why would it come as a big surprise that she decides to fight for a side that she deems, morally greater in Kataron(If she was actually a member of Kataron hypothetically speaking)?

[Major1138]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

Yeah the A-Heads probably bumped their own performance down thanks to the anti-GN field.

Speaking of which, that Anti-GN field is holder of one of the weirdest complaints I've heard about this entire series. And that is that "if the A-LAWS had these Anti-GN fields all along, why not use them against the Gundams". I'll leave other people to figure out what is wrong with the logic in that complaint.

Well there are two issues here as I see it - one, that they even have an Anti-GN field, and two, why the hell didn't they use it earlier? As to the first point, isn't it more of an anti beam-weapon gas more than anything else? If it was really an Anti-GN field, no one would be able to do anything, since all the Gundams and the A-LAWS mobile suits would shut down.

And obviously they wouldn't have used it way back in season 1, since hardly anyone had beam weapons except for Celestial Being. That being said, they've had the funky anti-beam weapon gas as far back as the first episode of season 2 - that hapless A-LAWS pilot tried to use it to hold off the 00 Gundam when it first activated. Obviously it didn't work, given it does jack all against physical weapons like swords (or missiles!), but to ask why they haven't used it between episode 1 of season 2 and now is hardly a stupid complaint. It's obviously plot-related in the "this is how we want to tell the story" more so than any real in-show reason, but it's not stupid to point it out. What is slightly ironic is that I never would have thought about it had you not brought it up....

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

One reason why the Aheads were being destroyed by the Katatron is MAYBE, just maybe, their armor isn't resistant to linear cannons.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by DragoZERO

I had thought she joined the remnants and additions to the coup d'état faction of the Federation.

Originally Posted by Zeta Gundam

Kati didn't go to Kataron.

Hmm... It looks like I was a bit in my wording. My meaning wasn't so much that Kati wanted to become a Kataron member, but that she was effectively joining forces with them. I guess I could have called them the mutineers, but nobody would have known what I meant, and it would have obscured my point. In any case, the wording isn't all that important - the point is that even with her grievances against the A-LAWS leadership, she still didn't have all that much reason to join who were effectively still her enemies.

Originally Posted by Major1138

Well there are two issues here as I see it - one, that they even have an Anti-GN field, and two, why the hell didn't they use it earlier? As to the first point, isn't it more of an anti beam-weapon gas more than anything else? If it was really an Anti-GN field, no one would be able to do anything, since all the Gundams and the A-LAWS mobile suits would shut down.

I don't know how effective an anti-GN field the A-LAWS have, but it is reasonable that they developed it just in time for this particular battle. What's a little harder to defend is why the A-LAWS deployed such a tiny force, and why they never noticed that the mutineers and Kataron had assembled (presumably anyways) most of their remaining forces there.

[Kaioshin Sama]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

Hmm... It looks like I was a bit in my wording. My meaning wasn't so much that Kati wanted to become a Kataron member, but that she was effectively joining forces with them. I guess I could have called them the mutineers, but nobody would have known what I meant, and it would have obscured my point. In any case, the wording isn't all that important - the point is that even with her grievances against the A-LAWS leadership, she still didn't have all that much reason to join who were effectively still her enemies.


I don't know how effective an anti-GN field the A-LAWS have, but it is reasonable that they developed it just in time for this particular battle. What's a little harder to defend is why the A-LAWS deployed such a tiny force, and why they never noticed that the mutineers and Kataron had assembled (presumably anyways) most of their remaining forces there.

Ummmmmmm, 108 MS is a tiny force?

Originally Posted by GN0010 Nosferatu

One reason why the Aheads were being destroyed by the Katatron is MAYBE, just maybe, their armor isn't resistant to linear cannons.

It's probably because GN based suits like the Gundams in the first season got their nigh invincibility to non-GN suits via having GN particles essentially fused into their armor, like beam coating. With the Anti-GN gas deployed the linear rifles were actually able to have a significant effect on the A-Heads because their armor was weakened by their own weapon.

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

Ummmmmmm, 108 MS is a tiny force?

For a force that supposedly controls the world, and that is seriously trying to destroy Celestial Being, it certainly is small.

[Kaioshin Sama]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

For a force that supposedly controls the world, and that is seriously trying to destroy Celestial Being, it certainly is small.

So far it's been CB versus between 8-16 or so MS and most engagements have ended in either a draw or a tactical retreat by one of the two groups. And you saw how quickly the Gundams were overwhelmed against those 108 MS. If Katharon hadn't shown up they probably wouldn't have been able to break through. If that was the response at the interception point I can only imagine what awaits at the coordinates Wang gave to CB.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

Ummmmmmm, 108 MS is a tiny force?



It's probably because GN based suits like the Gundams in the first season got their nigh invincibility to non-GN suits via having GN particles essentially fused into their armor, like beam coating. With the Anti-GN gas deployed the linear rifles were actually able to have a significant effect on the A-Heads because their armor was weakened by their own weapon.

This is the most powerful force in the Earth Government it should at least have over 10 thousand.

Okay that's overdoing it for this series but if A-Laws is truly the force behind the Earth Federation than I expect a ton of mechas like over 500.

Not a reference to Buddhism because Hideki Anno made being pretentious cool

As for the second point, its crap like that makes me wonder why A-Laws didn't use a combination of old mechas and the gas to pretty much wipe of Celestial Being earlier.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

Ummmmmmm, 108 MS is a tiny force?



It's probably because GN based suits like the Gundams in the first season got their nigh invincibility to non-GN suits via having GN particles essentially fused into their armor, like beam coating. With the Anti-GN gas deployed the linear rifles were actually able to have a significant effect on the A-Heads because their armor was weakened by their own weapon.

That could be a possibility. Kinda like how some toxic gases burn the skin in real life. HOWEVER, if that is the reason the Aheads were destroyed easily. Why weren't the Gundams also destroyed?

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by GN0010 Nosferatu

That could be a possibility. Kinda like how some toxic gases burn the skin in real life. HOWEVER, if that is the reason the Aheads were destroyed easily. Why were the Gundams also destroyed?

Honestly the whole thing looks like an excuse to have Katharon do something useful after spending an entire season basically being led by an even more useless version of Zapp Brannigan.

At least Brannigan has won battles by himself.

[Kaioshin Sama]

Say Charred Knight, do you have any interest in doing your thing in some other forums for a while or so you just have it in for mecha shows?

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

Say Charred Knight, do you have any interest in doing your thing in some other forums for a while or so you just have it in for mecha shows?

Most of my favorite anime are mecha series, also the fact that I complain shows that deep down I ike it enough to watch it. The same can't be said for Bleach which I have pretty much just stuck to readingf summaries because its gotten so bad.

[Kaioshin Sama]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

Most of my favorite anime are mecha series, also the fact that I complain shows that deep down I ike it enough to watch it. The same can't be said for Bleach which I have pretty much just stuck to readingf summaries because its gotten so bad.

I figured as much.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama

I figured as much.

That's because I told you that at the Code Geass area.

If you really want me to tell me what I did like

Kati and Patrick joining Katharon
Kati turning Katharon into a fighting force proving that Klaus is an incompetent moron
The other Gundams at least got new equipment,
The Alle, and Soma relationship actually going somewhere
Feldt, not the flower thing just feldt existing
That creppy smile by Louise
Ribbons being shot because it was unintentionnaly hilarious, I could watch Ribbons getting shot over and over

Most of my complaints for this episode are actually minor (the Buddhist reference for no reason) or are generally a problem the entire series has (Setsuna is boring, and Marina is the worst character in Gundam history)

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

I still can't make out what Seravee's new equipment is. All I see are two silver boxes on the shoulders. And more silver things on the knee and back GN Cannons.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

I don't think it would be that, since none of the Taus aren't connected to Veda.

[Ottocycle]

Originally Posted by GN0010 Nosferatu

I don't think it would be that, since none of the Taus aren't connected to Veda.

The Innovator suits are.