2004-07-15, 13:07 | Link #81 | |
Kawaii Inspector
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: 9th Plane of Heck
Age: 54
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Experience is what will ultimately define you, and while it can certainly come while you're young, generally speaking in North America/Western cultures, it usually takes around the 25 year mark until you truly become an adult. Again, not impossible, but generally speaking, that's what it tends to fall under. As for older == wiser, it's generally true, but I also know MANY 40+ year old babies, as well as some 18 year old philosophers. - Z |
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2004-07-15, 13:25 | Link #82 | |
Senior Member
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I agree there also, people *usually* take quite a long time to mature. Though it certainly wouldn't cover everybody. Though generally, it is true. |
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2004-07-15, 15:36 | Link #84 |
Kawaii Inspector
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: 9th Plane of Heck
Age: 54
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Speaking of love...
I'm curious how many of you believe in love? It's something I've struggled with since my third girlfriend (about 2 relationships back/8 or 9 years ago). See, if you stop and think about it, and consider the scientific studies done on the brain, it's evident that all "love" is, is a chemical reaction in the brain brought on by millions of years of evolution combined with social conditioning/reinforcement. The general concensus seems to hold that this thing we call love has become a language definition of an evolved state of a desire to procreate, genetically programmed into us and has become a sort of catch-all for defining relationships that extend beyond simple contact. The truth is, there is no such thing as love. All that exists is elevated levels of dopemine that gets released into your bloodstream when certain stimulii are triggered. It's not as simple as something like a pheremone response in animals or insects, in fact it's very complex, in that it's typically a combination of stimulus response, social conditioning, and various cues, but ultimately, it's just a chemical reaction in the brain. The historical belief that love is some mysterious spiritual bonding which occurs is pure hogwash. There's nothing there except synapses firing based on stimulii and social conditioning. It most certainly has a powerful effect when it occurs, but that's no indication of anything beyond the fact that it's a powerful reaction. So having said that, after my 3rd girlfriend nearly destroyed me, along with other philosophical thoughts on mankind, it occured to me that we're not so removed from the animal kingdom as I had previously believed. Yes, we're certainly more evolved, but ultimately we're still bound by our genes. Obviously the only thing seperating us from animals is our brains, but truthfully, we really don't excercise that difference very much (if at all). We still are driven by genetic programming to procreate, we're still driven by the animus that drives the beast inside us, and add to that the societal reinforcements which are themselves a product of our genetic makeup, and we're nothing more than just a complex animal. Love is just an illusion. Just like control and freewill. - Z |
2004-07-15, 16:30 | Link #85 | |
Senior Member
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2004-07-15, 16:48 | Link #86 |
~DESU
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Vancouver, Canada eh?
Age: 37
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I seem to be the only lovesless loser who has never had a girlfriend. Must be because of my lack of social life, or the lack of social life due to being a loveless loser? Hmmm, what a paradox I seem to have created. Perhaps if I sit alone in my room for a couple days the answer will come to me....
anyway, yeah its sad, and i feel bad that I have never met anyone who wants to be with me/i want to be with. I guess there aren't many people who enjoy what I do around where I go. Everyone else is lucky, after all, "tis better to have loved and lost, than to never have loved before"........ |
2004-07-15, 17:06 | Link #87 | |
Kawaii Inspector
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: 9th Plane of Heck
Age: 54
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But let me ask you this Koshiba. Are you saying that you'd prefer to live ignorantly, simply because it would be easier? Or are you saying that you don't believe that love is an illusion? - Z |
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2004-07-15, 18:55 | Link #88 | |||
外人、漫画訳者
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Austin, TX
Age: 42
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http://kspark.kaist.ac.kr/Jesus/Inte...20religion.htm Quote:
Believe in the power of love!!! |
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2004-07-15, 19:30 | Link #89 | |
nya`
Artist
Join Date: Feb 2004
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2004-07-16, 00:42 | Link #90 | ||||||
Kawaii Inspector
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: 9th Plane of Heck
Age: 54
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Our brains are a double edged sword in that regard, and love, along with other emotional states that tie directly into procreation and the survival instinct (on a species level, not an individual level) exist to ensure that we try to continue on as a species, it's a genetic evolutionary insurance policy that's resulted from millions of years of evolution. At the same time, thanks to our inordinately large craniums and overly developed grey matter, we're also capable of positing the truth of the nature of the universe and existence itself, though truthfully, most will never even delve into that area thanks primarily again to the societal reinforcements brought forth from our genetic evolution, paired with plain and simple basic fear (one of the most powerful of our built in survival instincts). Once you come to the realization that eons of evolution and societal reinforcements are all in place simply to get us to procreate and nothing more, then couple that with an understanding of human nature along with an unwavering, truly honest view of the nature of the universe, it can be quite frightening to 'stare God in the eye' and try to come to terms with that. Hell, people have killed themselves for infinitely less. What do you think would happen if everyone in the world suddenly realized the truth of their existence tomorrow? Of course it would never happen, since no one would be willing to believe it thanks to the conditioning they've all received, and the fact that humans will willingly stop thinking if it means they can be a little happier. Why do you think that the majority of the world prescribes to some form of religious belief system? Quote:
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However, freewill is unfortunately, also an illusion. What's really scary is that science is beginning to prove this to be true. Or rather more precisely, it's scary what the result of that will be once the general populace finally casts off the chains of religion and begins to truly grasp the nature of existance on a species level. Personally, I have faith in mankind's inexhaustible ability to fuck itself in the ass, and am fairly certain we'll come pretty damn close to suicide on a species level, but it's a close call, as a certain level of maturity is required (as a species) to be able to finally cast off religion, so it's still possible that man will finally elevate himself above animal. We'll see Btw, sorry for all the male-centric expressions (man, mankind, etc.). 34 years of conditioning tends to form hard habits to break Quote:
- Z Last edited by Zapaan; 2004-07-16 at 00:50. Reason: Because I'm a 'tard ;) |
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2004-07-16, 01:02 | Link #91 | |
shush! I was only helping
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Under ur skin
Age: 33
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I sooooo dissagree how old do you have to be to know what love is then?? There is no age on love, if you love some one you love them right??I mean what life experience do you have to have??? some people get married to their first love, but because they havent played the feild a bit does it mean she/ he doesnt know what love is because they havent had any experience with other people to compare the feeling she/he gets in side against?? get wat im sayin? |
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2004-07-16, 01:28 | Link #92 | |
nya`
Artist
Join Date: Feb 2004
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To be in love, you need to let go your rationality, everything you have learn, everything you think is correct or make sense, forget about them. When you are in love, you'll be blind of everything around you, even if the world go crazy and doesn't make any sense to you anymore. As long as the person you love is thinking about you, then the world will look beautiful in your eyes and you are on the top of the world. ^^ |
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2004-07-16, 02:52 | Link #93 | ||||
Kawaii Inspector
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: 9th Plane of Heck
Age: 54
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Ask anyone that lives on their own, and is independant (financially), and ask them if what they thought was earth shatteringly important to them when they were 14 is anything more than a chuckle to them now. Aside from the one's who have faced some form of terrible tragedy, nearly every single one will respond the same. Why? Because they have life experience. Sadly, it comes at the cost of innocence, and a worse trade-off I can't think of. Quote:
Then there's also the fact that marriage != eternal love and happiness. I'd be even more curious to see just how many 'first love' marriages end in divorce, or a 'trapped in a loveless marriage' scenario. I'd be guessing, but the likelihood of those two possibilities would seem quite high to me especially in Western cultures, where divorce has about the same significance as buying a new car. It's naivete of this nature regarding human interpersonal relationships is what I'm talking about when I say young people don't have the life experience to understand what love is. At the same time Rhia, I'm honestly and truly envious of you. I say with no amount of shame that I would sell my soul (if I had one) to be innocent again. Because for you, love does exist. Not so for this old man. Quote:
What I'm getting at is that because I do understand it, there's now a schizm within me that didn't exist before. Part of me is as you say, casts logic and rational thought to the wind, letting my emotional state take over and is happy to do so. Unfortunately, there's also the other part of me that knows what's happening, and knows at the core of my being that this is all just an illusion brought on by millions of years of evolution and reinforced by societal conditioning. Eventually, the two will need to homogenize into a single thing that is me, and come to terms with that truth. To do otherwise is simply allowing myself to become the ignorant animal, and thus cheapening my existance, albeit likely in a more happy state, but ultimately lying to myself and reducing myself even more. To give you an analogy, it would be like believing in Santa Claus. I WANT him to exist, but I know he doesn't. Would you then cling to the belief that he exists, simply because you want him to? Or would you reconcile the fact that he doesn't exist and allow yourself to grow and become more than you were? Facing the world and the universe with open eyes instead of remaining willingly ignorant is the main point here. To do so requires that one actually think and ponder their existance, something that most don't seem to care about, let alone actually do. - Z |
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2004-07-16, 03:48 | Link #94 | |
nya`
Artist
Join Date: Feb 2004
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It just between you and the person you love. It's that simple. |
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2004-08-04, 23:33 | Link #99 | |
model bliss
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Dallas, Texas
Age: 42
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Getting back to the topic of this thread: I was in love once, the operative word being was. It ended badly. Lets just say she was a lying little sack of shit. Last edited by junko; 2004-08-05 at 00:40. |
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