(L) Melody of Oblivion

[wao]

Originally Posted by Ezcentric

Warning: Very loooooong post coming up . Sorry about it .


Regarding the thoughtful discussion on Bocca's background, here is what I think might be an interesting possibility and also, to a certain extent, could explain why, as wao suggested, Bocca would seem to understand Sayoko's problems very well:

If various clues are considered, I think there's a fair chance that Bocca's brother, Nao, is a MU agent. Their family is well-to-do and he (Nao) is an excellent student. Typical of this trend are Hamasaki Keiko and

Spoiler:

Sayoko's brother.

The background of Toune and Miri was interesting (I think) because from what was shown, there was a fair chance that either one could have gone the other's path at the point where they met the "Girl with Red Hair". Their separation marked the point where their fates--and the distant roads lying ahead in their lives--were decided (sudeni erabareta tooi michi). Toune (well-to-do) theoretically could've ended up the MU agent. In any case, Miri ended up rich and successful as well. Eurgh... I'm digressing, but simply put, there seems to be a basic criteria to be a MU agent (well-to-do, honour student) and Nao would appear to fit it. We also did not see the agent in Bocca's hometown.

For those who have seen the later eisodes,

Spoiler:

you can see that there is a distinct similarity between the family situations of Sayoko and Bocca. That's why I think there is a unique bond between them, even if it is one they don't really notice (earlier on), or in Bocca's case, hesitates to accept. Besides, I think Bocca has shown that he is too slow to figure things out (), so even though he knows Sayoko's background, he wouldn't necessarily link it to his own.

Wait, WTF? Bocca has a brother? I so did not notice that. Dammit, dammit dammit that makes so much SENSE! I should rewatch the first few eps when I have time. I think I would find some interesting things if I did. Thank you so much for that....


==
About the whole thing of the Oblivion's Melody/Melody of Oblivion, that was what I was trying to grasp at but couldn't really explain. I think that was a very insightful theory; that MoO might be either a Melody people have forgotten, or a melody that causes people to be oblivious.
Right now I'm sure "oblivious" would describe the citizens well enough. So could it be that they've forgotten the Melody and are in this state, or are in this state because they heard the Melody?

Many hate the Melos Senshi because they lost the war of the 20th Century. I desparately want to know more details.
But what can we get from it from what we know?
-It happened in the 20th Century. What is the year now, though? How long ago was it exactly? I'm guessing Kurofune took part in it, he's max 38 years old I think...
-A lot of Melos Senshi took part. If they had a factory to produce Aiba-machines and there was so much development atking place, Melos Senshi must have been an essential front in the battle against Monsters. They were probably the only people who could fight. Melos Senshi are so rare now though. Did they really all die or something?
-I think the Melos Senshi could have won the war, but - I'm hypothesizing here - they live for the Melody, rather than listen to their own people. Perhaps in the end the Monsters proved to the people that the Melody was wrong. Perhaps the Melody is more evil than the monsters. And the Melos Senshi listened to the Melody instead of their own people?
-I STILL want to know why Chief V stopped the project. Why why why why why?

There's definite ambiguity in the "evilness" of the Monsters. While their attitude may smell of typical-villain ness, are they really all that evil?
And some may hate them for not being human, but how can you define that? Do you say they are not human because of the odd powers they have (turning people into stone, disappearing at will)? Then, would the Melos Senshi not be human as well? They can call upon powers to fire powerful arrows and use Meigen and all of that.

Also, I'm trying to see if there's any signifiance of Sayoko sitting in the Elan Vital's sidecar. Why does this machine have a sidecar in the first place? I"m sure it's not just convienence to fit the fact that Sayoko travels with Bocca. Perhaps it might be important because Sayoko is not a Melos Senshi, and yet she gets to ride an Aiba-machine? Sayoko is not a Melos Senshi, and yet she travels with one, when Melos Senshi are despised by the people...

EDIT: Another thing to think about is why the Melos Senshi can withstand the power of the Monsters. For example when Toune and Miri were in the forest, Toune knew that goign with the red-haired-girl was not a good thing to do, but Miri couldn't resist... Which is why, as pointed out earlier, Toune didn't get lured into the Monster Union even if she was more well off, while Miri did.
(Also in episode 13,

Spoiler:

when Bocca and Kurofune find Solo, Kurofune says that being in that cave long enough has the same effect as being in the presence of a Monster. Bocca and Kurofune can stay alive in that cave because they are Melos Senshi, and Bocca assumes Solo is a Melos Senshi beacause he seems to be fine. Well, he is and he isn't

)

EDIT2: And why have ANBU (along with AonE now?) released MoO#4 out of the blue? O_o I thought they'd have dropped it. Ah, whatever.

[Dark]

Originally Posted by wao

EDIT2: And why have ANBU (along with AonE now?) released MoO#4 out of the blue? O_o I thought they'd have dropped it. Ah, whatever.

I guess they started subbing it and want to at least and try to finish what they started... also, ANBU didn't have enough people to work on the subbing it so that is why AonE is helping now...

[dreamless]

There's definite ambiguity in the "evilness" of the Monsters. While their attitude may smell of typical-villain ness, are they really all that evil?

yup, and I think this is quite apparent in the last labyrinth island episode... where even Hol doesn't appear that "evil"...

And some may hate them for not being human, but how can you define that? Do you say they are not human because of the odd powers they have (turning people into stone, disappearing at will)? Then, would the Melos Senshi not be human as well? They can call upon powers to fire powerful arrows and use Meigen and all of that.

well, the difference between melos warriors and monsters are that melos warriors don't eat human children... speaking of which, I kinda wonder if all monsters eat humans? I mean, so far only Hol/Minotaurus is seen eating humans, Medusa seems to like turning humans into stone and then doing... umm... things to those stone statues... Hecate seems to like bowling, and lying around doing nothing? Pan likes to play flute, Talos likes to... walk around?

Is that somehow related to the myths? I mean in the myth only Minotaur eat boys and maidens as human sacrifice, Medusa doesn't eat human (as far as I can recall), nor does Pan or Talos or Hecate... but it seems the very idea of monsters being evil is based on that they eat humans?

[evil|plushie]

Ah...finally back from Aus.

Hmm...pardon me if I'm wrong but...

Spoiler:

I highly doubt Bocca's brother was the MU agent in their town. First of all, the monsters ALWAYS meet up through the MU agent in their town who's also responsible for arranging the sacrifices. Now, the person who did that in Bocca's town was Ganekos dad.

Hmm, a reason why there MIGHT have been more Melos Warriors back then (with reference to manga) was because maybe the Melody of Oblivion was free back then and was able to induct people more directly instead of having to appear to them from miles away? Not to mention she's also now chained by Solo which may have limited her power.

And I don't think people hate the Melos Warriors because they lost the war, I think it's because they are the foreign element. They are 'chaos'. They are sort of like terrorist/freedom fighters, working to undermine the current established hierarchy. And usually in such cases, the normal people may suffer. Not to mention it's probably not safe to publicly support Melos Warriors -_- They may end up as the next sacrifice for all they know

By the way....was there ANY meaning to Melody as a banana in 16? I haven't seen the raw

[sparrow]

more thinking if she'll ignore Bokka and don't shows up for him in the later episodes or will it be like the usual popping up anytime anywhere

[evil|plushie]

Aaah...if anyone has the deathraw version of the 16th episode , please PM me!!

[Ezcentric]

Some thoughts on the intro arc, which could be all wrong... read at risk!

Originally Posted by evil|plushie

Spoiler:

I highly doubt Bocca's brother was the MU agent in their town. First of all, the monsters ALWAYS meet up through the MU agent in their town who's also responsible for arranging the sacrifices. Now, the person who did that in Bocca's town was Ganekos dad.

No, I don't mean that Nao was the agent during the introductory arc. Rather, I believe there's a possibility that he is being groomed to be a MU agent in Bocca's hometown. You're right in that the Mayor was the one who arranged for the sacrifice. One reason why I think that was the case is because the Monsters had no specific role for the town yet. It would seem that all towns controlled by the MU have a specific function to carry out, with the agent being the supervisor of operations (Power Elite). It is possible the "performance" of Bocca's hometown was still under review, so there is no agent and the Mayor is tasked with "making the bid" so to say. This would also explain why Bocca's hometown only needs to offer a sacrifice once every 4 years (relatively low compared to other places, I think). We might also see the Sensei's actions as a means of putting himself in line for the MU agent job in town, if it gets selected for some purpose.

In fact, I think the sacrifice of K (Kei) might even be some kind of a test for the town--if I'm not wrong, K was caught and stored for 4-5 years before Hol got to him. This could suggest a certain inexperience in dealing with sacrifices or it could just mean Hol likes his specified child young and fresh (assuming K does not age in that "magic box") .

Why would they want to be selected as MU territory?
It would seem that all MU territories benefit greatly, namely in terms of $$$.

I think the whole introduction arc is quite interesting when you think about it in hindsight. I won't be surprised if they return to Bocca's hometown at the end for some sort of wrap-up. They can then have another cryptic title like "The Beginning is the End" or something .

[GUTB_]

I think the show should stop pretending the Agents matter...they are just too weak.

This show is very uneven. It tries to be a clever critisism of modern society, and sometimes it actually succeeds.

[wao]

If I'm not wrong, what very little I got from reading 3 pages of the 4th book of manga,

Spoiler:

Bocca DOES return to his hometown, without Sayoko I believe. They split up after somebody died It seems like it's under the control of the MU now.

Ah, and ep 12 is out. Thank you Rice-box! Cannot wait for 13 and 14 which are IMO the best episodes out of the lot.

I think the Monster Agents are hilariously useless as well, but perhaps this stems from them overrelying on their machines so much, and not actually being very strong themselves. I don't think they have enough will to match up with Bocca's.

We'll wait and see what the monsters will do. They can't be that evil...
I wonder what the meaning of episode 17's title, 天使もなくて持つ翼 (I hope I got that right - Tenshi mo nakute motsu tsubasa). Even though ____ is not an angel, _____ has wings or something like that. No subject as usual...
(thanks, katsuragi!)

EDIT: evil|plushie, check your PMs already!

EDIT2: Okay... After watching #16 subbed in Chinese, I suppose I do kind of begin to understand Sayoko's problems...

Spoiler:

It was kind of sad how she was absolutely tricked into being made a sacrifice. For a short moment I understood that feeling of being made a sacrifice, about to die...
Bocca really is too kind :<

And I really wonder WHAT Coco did to him. Bocca sounded like he was... er... er.... er.... >____>
Seems like Coco's going to be jealous of MoO too! But I think Bocca isn't interested in Coco as much as he cares for Sayoko. I think it's the age difference. How old is Coco, anyway... 15?

Plus, there's an important question I want to ask regarding Sayoko's name...

Spoiler for Ep 16:

It seems like Tsukinomori Sayoko is not her real name? I mean, she was called Sayoko by her parents when she was young, her name was Sayoko, but I don't think she was a Tsukinomori. Her parents and brother's surname is listed as 鹿川 (Kanokawa?). Wasn't she taken in by her grandparent (or was it a foster parent?) later anyway? That person called herself Tsukinomori something... So I suppose Sayoko was originally Kanokawa Sayoko or something like that.

Her brother, Shuuma (秀馬) also has a name which is obviously linked to the other things. Shuuma means something like "fine horse", fine as in good... not fine as in thin, or fine as in make-you-pay-money A fine horse is also a thoroughbred.
It fits in to everything else. His family thinks it's very lucky to have a son like him who seems so perfect, his own sister told Bocca at first that she told fortunes (based on luck), heck, she used to say "Luc-ky-ky~!" before and now I can link it, he himself is called Lucky Thoroughbred, as well as the gambling mini-theme with Flying BUnny, the derbies and races included that also denotes luck, the river is called Fortunate River for chrissake...

It seems Flying Bunny is not listed as Flying Bunny in the credits this time, but (I'm guessing this is her) as her real identity, "翔野ミト". What is that surname, Tono? Shouno? Kano? Argh. But that's definitely Mito as a given name...
Is this a pun on "to" the katakana looking exactly like "boku/ura" the kanji? 卜 (boku/ura) means divination/divining (that sort of thing) which also deals with luck...
And I know that's already quite a stretch, but let's pull it even further and say "ura" sounds like "uma" which is horse :P
EDIT2:The katakana "to" and kanji "boku/ura" don't type well together. They won't appear here, except the second time I used it as you can see earlier. Whatever. They look the same. Coincidentially the kanji is used in Chinese as "bo" in "luo bo", meaning... carrots :O! (Carrot... bunny... get it?)

By the way, for anyone who's watched ep 13, you know when

Spoiler:

Kurofune says "Yes. I have already defeated him once." and Hol collapses on the bull jeep which then staggers off, and also when Kurofune saves Sayoko

- the music played during these parts doesn't seem to be on a track on the soundtrack. Does anyone know if it really isn't there because I'm really quite blur... I think this music has been played before but I can't remember where.

[evil|plushie]

Hmmm

Spoiler:

Bocca does go somewhere after Kurofune dies, but I'm not sure if it's his old hometown or not. He sorta gets depressed and goes there to slum but something happens that awakens his spirit again

Hmm, I just watched ep 12 and 16. After watching 16 and THAT Coca and Bocca scene, all I have to say is 'woah...Woah!' o.O Way to go Coco -_-. That scene was just a H doujin waiting to happen.

Coco seems older than 17 though, or maybe it's just me. I think she's just small for her age.


Oh yeah, forgot to mention this, but the latest Newtype has an article on MoO. Quite a crappy one though. But that's just because I don't quite agree with what it says and it makes no mention of the plot of the show at all -_-

[katsuragi]

Originally Posted by wao

I wonder what the meaning of episode 16's title, 天使もなくて持つ翼 (I hope I got that right - Tenshi mo nakute motsu tsubasa). Even though ____ is not an angel, _____ has wings or something like that.

yeah... that's correct... ( u mean ep17 )
ahh...... ep16 was so awesome T_T
what I can remember from ep16 is an apple box only ......lol
Bokka u lucky b@stard...

[wao]

Geebus, what is wrong with me always wrongly numbering eps? First I thoguht ep 14 was 15, now I think ep 17 is 16. Ugh.

I have no idea why Coco is so sudden in ep 16... I still feel sorry for Bocca :P I think I'd be shocked and scared out of my wits if Coco just... did... that. Gah. I'm surprised nobody noticed the box moving around so much, though...

And evil|plushie, regarding that spoiler - ooh! Angst!

[evil|plushie]

I think anybody'd be shocked -_- but I'm not sure how many could resist it.

Spoiler:

It's one of the more impt parts in the story because thats where Bocca gets Kurofunes bow *the current one he's using in the anime was actually Kurofunes* and Kurofunes 'summon' creature -_-. Or at least that's what I'm taking it for, although I suppose spirit creature would be more appropriate a term for it.

[Chrno-Evil]

aaah Bocca is very lucky >_<

and Coco is.......
what happened to her lol

Bocca was very shocked ^^"


and what was that banana ??!! lol (if you know what i mean )
(at 9:47)

[wao]

Yeah. You know, up til now, I STILL don't get that bloody banana. Is it supposed to be a sexual reference (O_O;;;...) or uh.... well I just do not know.

The Melody's expression just before they cut away is pretty cute though :3 She looks slightly annoyed. Eh?

[kero]

just a quick side note, there's a film called 'Tora, tora, tora' and apparently is was the code word to initiate the attack on Pearl Harbour,

also

Tora , sounds very similar to Torro, which is Spanish for Bull, so maybe that's why the bull and the tiger were put together

[wao]

Wait in episode 16... I'm sure many of you noticed the ship's name was

Spoiler:

Tora-uma Maru. Tiger horse... Horse referring to the whole horse theme with Lucky Thoroughbred and all. But I was wondering what the Tora was doing there and NOW I REMEMBER!
Global Yamaneko saying "Tora tora tora. Torauma (trauma)".... ^_^

[katsuragi]

hmm.... 2 comments !

kero>
i don't think that 'tora' in this anime meant something special (like spanish's torro or 'tora x3' the movie about pearl harbor - actually it's dora) but a tiger (global yamaneco)
bull(cow) was mentioned w/ 'UshiTora'(Bull Tiger) ship in ep12~14

I think Coco likes Bocca since she saw him, and expressed her feeling in ep16 (err....that was excessive, kinda?) Think about Coco in ep9~10, she said 'kawaii' to Bocca and tried to sneak into factory with him instead of her Unicorns (well, Hikari was in their group too, but still !) I don't think that Coco changed or behaved unlike her... she likes Bocca =/

ahhhhhhh..... Coco X_X no!!!

[Ezcentric]

By the way, I really enjoyed this long-running joke in the recent episodes...

Ep. 9-12 spoilers:

Spoiler:

The defeat of Global Yamaneko turned out really funny in the end, I thought. He was lamenting about how he lost to Bocca because he didn't manage to get the new tiger head model. If you watch episode 9 again (when Kron destroys the truck while Bocca is fighting Hikari), you'll realise that the Centauro was the chief cause of delay--you see the tiger head lying in the back of the destroyed truck (~18:20 of ep 9). The whole Coco speech about the cat in the cardboard box might also be more relevant, if you take the cat to be Global Yamaneko and his robot creature, as NoSanninWa pointed out earlier.

As for the OST, I really like the song "Aozora" because the part where they used it in the anime is one of my favourite parts. It's at the end of episode 5 when Bocca was struggling with his decision to be a Melos Warrior. I just thought the music provided the perfect mood for what he was saying to himself.

I think there'll probably be an OST 2 because I don't remember hearing the opening song of the "Labyrinth Island" arc in the soundtrack. It's really quite cute and on hindsight, it sets up the ending of that particular arc very well. Quite remarkable if you think about it.

[wao]

Yes, I think a number of songs on the OST may be nothign so special when listened to on its own, but make excellent BGMs. Cyber Disturbance and Aozora come to mind very quickly... I also really liked the part where they played Aozora (It's one of the main scenes that made me decide to stick to this anime.) Some others would be Combinato Ostinato, Yuukeru Yami Rensa Suru Joudou, and maybe Missing You.

I think there might be an OST 2 as well. That's absolutely spiffy because it might mean we'll get even MORE new music later :O (Some of the tracks in OST 1 I haven't even heard in the show yet, like A Hard Battle's Night... Or maybe it played and I never heard it? Same for Frigian Koko and Toumei na Mori Koe no Shoukei, as well as Memories of February Leaves, A Last War, even Tears in the Dam [not so sure, I think it must have been played...])

Wheeeee~ 2 more days to the next episode. Is it going to be more <3 stuff?! Ah, probably.
If we're going by the zodiac cycle I wonder how many more Monster Agents we'll see then? About ah.... 2? 3? There's still 9 episodes to go... and there is I think much more in the manga, at least basing on what I'm assuming from what evil|plushie said so far...