[Game] Umineko no Naku Koro ni Chiru - Ep. 6 Dawn of the golden witch

[Nontype]

Originally Posted by Midnight Bliss

He's very original and what he wants is to make us brainstorm countless theories, and then in the end totally surprise us with something unexpected and different from what we thought. So, everything is possible. In the end, everything will eventually make sense. Or almost everything. xD

He did say Umineko would have a more ambiguous end than Higarushi...

[chronotrig]

Originally Posted by Nontype

He did say Umineko would have a more ambiguous end than Higarushi...

No, he actually said that he wouldn't explain every little detail for us like he did in Higurashi. It might end up being ambiguous, or it might not.

[Midnight Bliss]

I believe there were complaints about Higurashi giving away the identity of the culprit too early, so for Umineko he'll leave up to the readers to replay all the episodes, gather the clues, and solve themselves who the real mastermind behind everything is, and for the readers to interpret things their own way, but he won't give it all away.

[Kazuki_Kun]

Originally Posted by Midnight Bliss

I believe there were complaints about Higurashi giving away the identity of the culprit too early, so for Umineko he'll leave up to the readers to replay all the episodes, gather the clues, and solve themselves who the real mastermind behind everything is, and for the readers to interpret things their own way, but he won't give it all away.

That sounds like a bit of a cop-out. I'd feel a little cheated after playing through 8 Episodes and not finding out who the culprit is by the end. I hate open- ended endings. =P Not all of us are great detectives, haha.

[NarkNarks]

Originally Posted by Kazuki_Kun

That sounds like a bit of a cop-out. I'd feel a little cheated after playing through 8 Episodes and not finding out who the culprit is by the end. I hate open- ended endings. =P Not all of us are great detectives, haha.

That would be disapointing though I doubt it would end quite so open. More a Answer in which the cuprit is revealed but questions remain over why and other occurences during the games.

Though i reckon anything which at first look would be difficult to explain would be explainable if the reader made an effort to look through the stories.

[chronotrig]

Originally Posted by Kazuki_Kun

That sounds like a bit of a cop-out. I'd feel a little cheated after playing through 8 Episodes and not finding out who the culprit is by the end. I hate open- ended endings. =P Not all of us are great detectives, haha.

Well, don't call it a cop-out First off, I think Ryuukishi will at least make it clear who the culprit is by the end of the story. I just doubt that he'll go back and explain how each and every scene and trick works.

You have to realize that this is a no-win scenario for Ryuukishi. Back in the time of Higurashi, there was a large number of people annoyed that he went back and revealed all the details one by one, even for parts that should have been guessable for the player. So if Ryuukishi solves each and every riddle for us, those fans will be annoyed. If he leaves some unspecified, other fans like you will be annoyed.

I think the best solution is what he seems to be doing now: explain most of the riddles in-game and let fans look up the rest of it online if they're having trouble. I'm almost certain that he'll explain enough of the story that this forum will be able to reach the correct answers when it's all over.

[ferthepoet]

I've not read the episode but can anyone explain how can erika be the 18 guest.... even if you count Natsuhi, Krauss and Jessica as guests, which would be a stretch since they live there (although the house is legally owned by kinzo) and Nanjo who can count either way.... there is no way you can count the servants as guests

[Kazuki_Kun]

Originally Posted by chronotrig

Well, don't call it a cop-out First off, I think Ryuukishi will at least make it clear who the culprit is by the end of the story. I just doubt that he'll go back and explain how each and every scene and trick works.

You have to realize that this is a no-win scenario for Ryuukishi. Back in the time of Higurashi, there was a large number of people annoyed that he went back and revealed all the details one by one, even for parts that should have been guessable for the player. So if Ryuukishi solves each and every riddle for us, those fans will be annoyed. If he leaves some unspecified, other fans like you will be annoyed.

I think the best solution is what he seems to be doing now: explain most of the riddles in-game and let fans look up the rest of it online if they're having trouble. I'm almost certain that he'll explain enough of the story that this forum will be able to reach the correct answers when it's all over.

Ah, well that explains it then. I guess it's just finding a middle-ground and keeping both sides happy. I never played the original Higurashi VN's, and so, being an anime-viewer I had to find out many of the answers from AS, anyway. Shouldn't be so bad if Umineko turns out that way, then.

I'm expecting a bittersweet ending. :P

[NarkNarks]

Originally Posted by chronotrig

You have to realize that this is a no-win scenario for Ryuukishi. Back in the time of Higurashi, there was a large number of people annoyed that he went back and revealed all the details one by one, even for parts that should have been guessable for the player. So if Ryuukishi solves each and every riddle for us, those fans will be annoyed. If he leaves some unspecified, other fans like you will be annoyed.

From what i've seen Ryuukishi has been pretty good at dealing with the often overbearing expectations of fans. He likes to lead them on at times and mess with them at others, but he seems to stick to his own way from what i've seen.

[Leinne]

Originally Posted by ferthepoet

I've not read the episode but can anyone explain how can erika be the 18 guest.... even if you count Natsuhi, Krauss and Jessica as guests, which would be a stretch since they live there (although the house is legally owned by kinzo) and Nanjo who can count either way.... there is no way you can count the servants as guests

she's the 18th person, the unexpected guest, that's it, you forgot the person part

[Rias]

I just hope that he's able to wrap it up without having the story too forced at the end. Higurashi revealed several points that resulted in weird characters behaviour as a wrap up.

I'm interested what he's going to do with stating ep1-2 = bottle message ep3-6 = made by ms.18.

[Used Can]

About Higurashi, the answers didn't honestly bother me. What bothered me was how, at the end, children were able to beat a group of professional killers with mere tricks, or how Takano just got away with it.

Originally Posted by chronotrig

"So, are you Featherin, or is Featherin you?" or less literally "Is Hachijo the real you, or is that Featherin?"

That's like asking Hanyū if the real her is Oyashiro, or Hanyū. It works beautifully.

[immblueversion]

It is my understanding that this episode sheds some light on Rosa's husband and Maria's father.

Does anyone care to elaborate and/or confirm?

[chronotrig]

Originally Posted by Rias

I just hope that he's able to wrap it up without having the story too forced at the end. Higurashi revealed several points that resulted in weird characters behaviour as a wrap up.

I'm interested what he's going to do with stating ep1-2 = bottle message ep3-6 = made by ms.18.

I've wondered that myself. Maybe it's just all message bottles exist, but only the first two are ever found in Ange's kakera. After all, considering the way it drifted, it's almost a miracle that even the second one was found. Hachijou needed some way to show these other stories to Ange, so she wrote them out herself.

By the way, if it turns out that the real Hachijou is actually Featherin, then it may be that she is the only truly supernatural influence on the real world. Sounds like another monster I know^^

[Rias]

Originally Posted by immblueversion

It is my understanding that this episode sheds some light on Rosa's husband and Maria's father.

Does anyone care to elaborate and/or confirm?

Rosa's husband borrowed a large sum, had Rosa co-sign, and disappeared. Rosa is left with a huge debt.

[Rias]

Originally Posted by chronotrig

By the way, if it turns out that the real Hachijou is actually Featherin, then it may be that she is the only truly supernatural influence on the real world. Sounds like another monster I know^^

If it's that monster indeed, it would explain why Bernkastel doesn't get along with Featherine. One of the inheritance from that monster's weird behavior in Higurashi

[immblueversion]

Originally Posted by Rias

I just hope that he's able to wrap it up without having the story too forced at the end. Higurashi revealed several points that resulted in weird characters behaviour as a wrap up.

I'm interested what he's going to do with stating ep1-2 = bottle message ep3-6 = made by ms.18.

Well, the revelations in Higurashi were more straightforward.

Umineko will be gradual in the revelations of secrets, so we may see different developments.

Then again, we hardly know anything about the next game until it's released, so we have no real material to use as a basis for such worries. We don't even know if EP7 actually will be the last episode.

They may both be "When They Cry", but Higurashi is Higurashi, and Umineko is Umineko. The time will come when answers will be revealed, so let us be patient.

[immblueversion]

Originally Posted by Rias

Rosa's husband borrowed a large sum, had Rosa co-sign, and disappeared. Rosa is left with a huge debt.

A sum of what, her company's shares or something?

[NarkNarks]

Originally Posted by Rias

Rosa's husband borrowed a large sum, had Rosa co-sign, and disappeared. Rosa is left with a huge debt.

Well thats helps explain Rosa's abandoment complex, i've wondered for a while what the situation surrounding his leaving was. The combination of abandoment and being screwed over financially would leave quite the wound. It adds a bit more character to Rosa than simply being mental, which I approve of.

[momobunny]

So she really was married? I wasn't sure, the line about nobody wanting to be with a divorcee in EP4 should've tipped me off but I wasn't sure if it was 100% reliable since the man is only referred to as Maria's father and not Rosa's ex-husband or anything like that.
I guess she either kept her last name so that she could still have a chance to be in the Ushiromiya line for inheritance or she changed it back after getting divorced?

What a scum bag, Rosa doesn't seem to have the best luck in terms of... ummm... well anything really (kinda like Natsuhi). owo;