[Game] Umineko no Naku Koro ni Chiru - Ep. 6 Dawn of the golden witch

[ameskitty]

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

Poor Eva.

I like George a lot less now.

Ditto that. The George = yandere fanon appears to be at least partially true . Although to be fair it was the conversation with Sayo that actually triggered the drop in my respect for him.

And as for Jessica...it's a bit harder to outright lose respect. She was possessed by an effing demon. I'm not sure if she actually believes the stuff she said/did in that state (especially considering her behavior in the metaworld before and after that). Not to mention that she kind of had one of those "you're going way over my head, I've been in a relationship for 12 hours" expressions on her face the whole time she was talking with Kyrie.

Although if she did mean that stuff I agree - she really is kind of a moron .

[Kamar]

I dunno, I wouldn't say murder was an appropriate response, but I certainly wouldn't say Eva has a worthwhile viewpoint. George is an adult, Eva has no business at all making that kind of decision for him.

[Marion]

Originally Posted by the_rogue

Ditto that. The George = yandere fanon appears to be at least partially true . Although to be fair it was the conversation with Sayo that actually triggered the drop in my respect for him.

And as for Jessica...it's a bit harder to outright lose respect. She was possessed by an effing demon. I'm not sure if she actually believes the stuff she said/did in that state (especially considering her behavior in the metaworld before and after that). Not to mention that she kind of had one of those "you're going way over my head, I've been in a relationship for 12 hours" expressions on her face the whole time she was talking with Kyrie.

Although if she did mean that stuff I agree - she really is kind of a moron .

That is true - she did feel incredibly uneasy about attacking her to begin with. And Kyrie kinda did go a bit too much into detail I think But then again Kyrie said she knew Jessica had lied to her about going to get a book, but then again Kyrie was possibly manipulated into saying those things by Battler.

Also with George- Eva attacked him first. See if he made the first move then I would hate him more, but it was generally self-defense. I mean Eva wanted to put him back into her womb SO

[Tyabann]

Originally Posted by Kamar

I dunno, I wouldn't say murder was an appropriate response, but I certainly wouldn't say Eva has a worthwhile viewpoint. George is an adult, Eva has no business at all making that kind of decision for him.

He's still her son, and he also looks like an impulsive idiot from her perspective. Eva probably thinks he just wants Shannon for her body (and were it not for evidence to the contrary, I'd agree with her).

Originally Posted by Marion

Also with George- Eva attacked him first. See if he made the first move then I would hate him more, but it was generally self-defense. I mean Eva wanted to put him back into her womb SO

That's technically Evatrice, not Eva. But yeah, she's crazy and I suppose George had SOME business in kicking her in the chest.

Still, wasn't the trial supposed to be about killing someone or something like that? Notice how George went straight for his mother?

[ameskitty]

Originally Posted by Marion

Also with George- Eva attacked him first. See if he made the first move then I would hate him more, but it was generally self-defense. I mean Eva wanted to put him back into her womb SO

Haha true O_o. But yeah, you've still got all those things he was saying to Sayo, even if they were said in the past I guess :/.

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

Notice how George went straight for his mother?

That was the other thing that kind of irked me. Jessica chose randomly, and Kanon and Shannon kind of took the wimpy way out by mercy-killing and killing in defense .

[Kitsu]

Well I've never liked Jessica. She was always a bit bland to me. This episode didn't help that at all. Especially when she tells Kyrie that she has no love, only envy and "I heard you like burning with your jealously, so I put lava in your room so you can burn while you burn!"

I mean really Jessica. Kanon confessed to you roughly twelve hours before you attacked Kyrie and you're saying that she, a person who stood by Rudolf's side despite his womanizing behavior and just general jerkiness (seriously, intentionally making your girlfriends jealous - what purpose does this have) and waited twelve years to become his wife, has no love at all.

I mean just seriously Jessica, you cannot compare your affection/love for Kanon to Kyrie's entire relationship with Rudolf over a span of nearly two decades.

I'm normally not a person that believes that you can measure love with the time you are with a person or how many obstacles you withstand but I agree with you. How can Kyrie possible lack love (maybe for Battler but not for Rudolph) The whole scene seemed a bit fishy. Kyrie just goes and outright tells Jessica everything.
I'm really fond of that scene but I think her behaviour in the fight was rather arrogant. As if her love to Kanon was the only true love.... of course it was fitting for such a trial but still arrogant and naive.

But I think maybe that the time span of the 12 hours makes it. She finally got the thing she desired for and finally gets to be wih Kanon...and than not even 10 hours after that someone tries to take that away from her...of course she is ready to go as far as she did.
While i have to agree with this

Not to mention that she kind of had one of those "you're going way over my head, I've been in a relationship for 12 hours" expressions on her face the whole time she was talking with Kyrie.

[MeoTwister5]

I specifically didn't mention the parts where Eva-Beato goes on a "get into mah uterus" tirades because as a medical student that just makes me sick to my stomach.

But yes, George was pretty much backed into a corner at that point, and while I have reservations on whether or not he really should have killed his own mother, it's not as if he had a lot of options either. Assuming Eva-Beato was ever an accurate representation of Eva in the first place, she would have likely also killed her own son than let him "sully" the family name.

[immblueversion]

Originally Posted by MeoTwister5

I specifically didn't mention the parts where Eva-Beato goes on a "get into mah uterus" tirades because as a medical student that just makes me sick to my stomach.

That is exactly what makes her so cool.

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by ijriims

When people said Battler left six years ago, they meant in six years'time ago. So they were referring to 1980.

The 19 was the 19th year after 1980.

I did not say that 1986 was the sixth year Battler from when he had left the family.

Yeah, that's why I said there was some leeway for your statement to hold, since it was never said "19 years ago;" all we got is that 19 was related to the creation of the story, which is quite vague.

[ijriims]

Those scene, about George killing Eva, Jessica killing Kyrie, etc, were fantasy scenes made by meta-Battler and the truth was nobody got hurted or killed until Erika came.

These scenes showed their resolution (well, for Jessica, she was a lot less resolute than George) in keeping their relationship. They were willing to kill if got into that sort of pacts with Demons, but under normal time it doesn't mean they would just go to kill (No such Demons).

If there were no such a demon pact, George would probably talk with his parentS, but not just Eva. Jessica would never agree to murder a random person. Kanon would not kill Rosa and there would not be Shannon defending Kanon.

[MeoTwister5]

Today's update:

Kyrie Ushiromiya vs. Jessica(?) Ushiromiya

Spoiler for Ep6 summary:

- Kyrie goes out of the conference room and heads for the second floor. She's obviously tired from the discussion. She encounters Jessica.
- She asks Jessicawhy she's here. She says she came to get a book from her room. She's nervous and evasive. She and Kyrie make small talk.
- Side scene with Jessica saying sorry to Kyrie. Zepar and Furfur say the roulette of fate has chosen Kyrie as her opponent. Unlike George who knew he needed to go against his mother, Jessica chose to get a random opponent.
- With Kyrie turning her back to her, Jessica ponders attacking her now but doesn't. Kyrie asks what's wrong.
- Jessica is evasive. She ends up asking about love. Kyrie asks if it's the sort of unrequited love. Jessica says she has some sort of love trial ahead of her. She says she's forced to fight for it.
- Kyrie asks if she meant a love triangle. Jessica obviously can't explain very well her problem. She says she needs to establish that emotional connection. Kyrie asks her how far she's willing to go to get that love.
- Kyrie says you've already lost if you decline to fight for it. Narrator says something about how victory in love cannot be attained if you don't communicate it and fight for it.
- Kyrie asks if Jessica has given up on that love, and says her life will be full of regret if she doesn't make up her mind.
- Side scene to Ange, who says she didn't understand those things because she was six back then. She says she read her mothers diaries after she died, but didn't understand them. Featherine asks if they were about Kyrie's relationship with Rudolph. To her she thought back then that Kyrie and Rudolph were an ideal couple, and thus didn't understand why Battler chose to be apart.
- Kyrie recalls the stories of when Rudolph was a playboy who had girls in the palm of his hand. Rudolph was a womanizer who enjoyed the life. Apparently Kyrie attracted him with her intellect and wasn't just another girl in the harem.
- There is a lot of backstory on Rudolph about his university days too hard to translate. They became business partners at some point. Something about how from all the women he worked with, she was the best (?). She worked her way into his heart as other women watched.
- Back to Kyrie and Jessica, she's telling her the story of Rudolph's womanizing, how she was able to get close to him despite all the women throwing themselves at him by becoming his business partner. She worked her way slowly but surely into his heart by using her business and intellectual skills.
- She however at that time felt she was just a partner and couldn't "heal the hole in his heart" of sorts.
- She says he would eventually be taken by another woman. During those days he slept with a lot of women.
- Ange says that he got one pregnant at some point. She also got pregnant.
- Kyrie expresses her emotions about the other woman he got pregnant and how it ruined her plans. She says at that time she at least wanted to be recognized.
- She and the other woman would give birth on the same day, naturally hers wouldn't be recognized. The woman is Asumu. She refused to be defeated by Asumu.
- Featherine says however that Kyrie's child was delivered stillborn. Battler was born to Asumu. Ange says her mother's chance of being recognized was destroyed. Ange wondered why, despite being Asumu's child, Kyrie accepted Battler. Ange talks about her mothers diaries that described her feelings and intentions, especially the grudge she would develop against Asumu.
- Kyrie says she did have some regrets, but not anymore since Rudolph's hers now. She says that love requires two people who are willing to make it grow. She tells Jessica to remmeber that they will still need to work on their love to make it bear fruit. They have to nurture it and guard it.
- She says she was lucky because the hell she experienced ended after 18 years. Despite everything she went through, Rudolph is hers. She will not give him up.
- Kyrie goes so far as to say that enemies of Rudolph are her enemies too, and murder to keep them togther isn't out of the question, because it took 18 years to get her miracle.
- Jessica says Asumu's death was a miracle for Kyrie. Kyrie even suggests she would have killed Asumu if she had to, and this miracle prevented her from bloodying her own hands.
- Jessica is speechless at this story. She's also rationalizing her own trials to gain the love she wants, and how George did his by killing his own mother. As Kyrie advised, she needs to nurture the love she and Kanon share, even if it forces her to do very drastic things.
- Kyrie apologizes for taking her time. She says that given Jessica's apparent situation, a life fueled by jealousy and regret keeps one going as it did for her, for 18 years. There are also other women experiencing this now.
- Kyrie likens love to playing with fire. Everyone can do it, but the burns will leave scars behind. She apparently thought Jessica could take hearing this story because she notices the passion in her eyes.
- As she walks away after the story, she notices Jessica moving quick. Jessica's eyes are gray as she attacks Kyrie. She narrowly misses her head.
- Jessica (possessed) is surprised she didn't get her. Kyrie says she doesn't understand because she didn't live such a life. Kyrie had her guard up already noticing the change in Jessica's demeanor.
- Kyrie says she already knew Jessica was lying about coming to get a book. She had already assumed several things for Jessica's appearance, and this was one of them.
- Kyrie asks why she wants to kill her. Jessica says her story helped her make her decision. She attacks again.
- Kyrie evades as Jessica smashes a wall with tremendous force. Kyrie is impressed since she really is Krauss' daughter, who himself knows boxing.
- Jessica tells her not to resist. She attacks again and Kyrie barely evades, pushed back by the wind air pressure her attacks make.
- Jessica says her feelings are similar, for the future of the love she has is clouded. Kyrie is irate at her suggestion. Jessica's arms pulse red. Kyrie attacks but is repelled by the red barrier. Jessiva calls Ronove.
- Kyrie thinks she's dreaming or something (I'm not sure who actually thinks they're having a nightmare, I think it's Kyrie).
- Jessica slowly approaches Kyrie, walkign while the ground beneath her steams from the heat. Kyrie is freaking out.
- As Jessica attacks, a flash of gold appears and stabs Jessica's head. Leviathan (stake of jealousy) appears. Kyrie seems thankful.
- Jessica is bleeding but alive. Her hands are hotter than they were. Kyrie asks if she can be beaten. Leviathan thinks it's impossible. Furfur and Zepar appear in a side scene, saying she cannot be beaten as she is empowered by "love" (and I assume possessed by these 2).
- The barrier behind them is held by Ronove, and Leviathan says it might be impossible. Kyrie asks of running through the window is possible, but it is also blocked by Ronove.
- Jessica glows red again. Leviathan says the attack she did won't work anymore. Jessica tells them they're trapped. The two are able to escape into a room in the corridor. It is Kinzo's study.
- Leviathan says they'll just blow the door open. This is like a coffin.
- Kyrie tells Jessica she cannot enter this secret room. Jessica wonders how exactly is she prevented from coming in. She starts pounding the door.
- Kyrie holds the door with one finger. Suddenly everything goes slow motion. Jessica's blows are slowed down to the force of a knock.
- Kyrie calls her jealous and recalls how she told her the story of her 18 years of emotional hell. Jessica admits she is jealous. She starts getting angry and starts hitting the door even more.
- Jessicas hands are supposed to achieve a speed of 1225 kmph. A comparison starts between her two years of pining for Kanon and Kyrie's 18 year hell.
- Math time. 2x365=730. 730x24=17520. However due to Shannon's talk about her love, the value is reduced to an equation of 17520/[(7x3)/24]=312 jealousy points. In contrast, Kyrie has a total of 157680, which makes Jessica's value barely 0.2%, or about 2.5 kmph. Kyrie says Jessica's experience is nothing compared to hers.
- Kyrie says even with one finger Jessica cannot knock it down. Ronove appears by Jessica and says that by Beato's rules a human cannot commit murder successfully in a locked room. Only magic can break it, and only when Jessica understands it can she break the door.
- Kyrie says Jessica cannot keep this up for long because the other family members will start looking for her.
- Zepar and Furfur push her on. Kyrie says she can just use the internal phone loine to call, and says this is her checkmate.
- However, Jessica seems to have undertsood that magic is the only way to kill through a true locked room, and manages to launch a hit through the door. She hits Kyrie, who slumps down dead.
- She mocks Kyrie, saying if she loves jealousy that much she can fester in it in death for eternity. Ronove congratulates her. He goes inside to check on the body.
- Jessica's eyes return to normal. She probably realized she was possessed by Zepar and Furfur.
- In their metaworld, George congratulates Jessica. Beato1 seems to feel sorry for this entire affair. Jessica cries, freaks out and apologizes to Kanon. George seems to have some issues with Jessica's performance but Shannon thinks she performed well.
- Beato2 agrees with Shannon and is fascinated with the locked room method of murder. Zepar and Furfur declare the inital trials done. They ask who could be next in line. Yes Beato1 is part of this too. Shannon, Kanon and Beato raise their hands simultaneously. It is just after 12:10.

[immblueversion]

Originally Posted by MeoTwister5

Today's update:

Kyrie Ushiromiya vs. Jessica(?) Ushiromiya

Spoiler for Ep6 summary:

- However, Jessica seems to have undertsood that magic is the only way to kill through a true locked room, and manages to launch a hit through the door. She hits Kyrie, who slumps down dead.

Spoiler for Didn't Jessica...:

...light the room ablaze with hellfire from outside by spewing lava through the keyhole?

[FredericaBernkastel]

Battler looks so hawt in his cape >-<

[Marion]

- Jessica glows red again. Leviathan says the attack she did won't work anymore. Jessica tells them they're trapped. The two are able to escape into a room in the corridor. It is Kinzo's study.

It's Krauss's study actually. If you replay the scene you notice that the background is a far cry from the background used for Kinzo's room.

[MeoTwister5]

Originally Posted by immblueversion

Spoiler for Didn't Jessica...:

...light the room ablaze with hellfire from outside by spewing lava through the keyhole?

Not too sure actually. I assumed she did an attack that struck Kyrie in a manner similar to how the Siestas supposedy struck their victims through the keyhole.

Anhyway thanks time for corrections.

[immblueversion]

Originally Posted by MeoTwister5

I assumed she did an attack that struck Kyrie in a manner similar to how the Siestas supposedy struck their victims through the keyhole.

Well, the red tint and the sounds of something burning kind of tipped me off.

[MeoTwister5]

BTW sorry no summaries today. Got kinda burned out and one of my patients was an asshole, so I'm taking a break from Umineko... for today.

[Smeckledorf]

Spoiler for This whole game is off:

This game and some of the red truths in it seem to be off still. This may just be because of Erika's blatant interference in the game but the red truths seem to me to still cause a logic error. Let's go to the guestroom, the chain lock in maintained and Kannon was in there with Erika. Kannon cannot leave because it is impossible to create this closed room from the outside. My Japanese translation and memory aren't the greatest but I just cannot see how Kannon escaped. There might be a slight chance that the window was not mentioned and if so that is truly the lamest of lames. I will not go back through it until Witch-Hunt puts out an English translation but I dislike this game. The only part I like about this game is Bern seems to have a better plan to expose the truth now.
Battler is obviously in denial and this is not the truth. My opinion is the real reason Battler could not be dead in that room is then Battler could not be a culprit, thus proving Battler's whole theory wrong. I think Battler planned this game to end early just so no one would die. Battler's sin from 6 years ago is a cause for the deaths on this island. This is not to say it is the only cause, there is a limit of only one culprit, or that the culprit has to be Battler. I am starting to think another person will turn up on the island by the logic that furniture does not count as a full person. Even if this proves to be wrong, there is something off about Kannon. I think he has a twin on the island that shares his same life. Thus, this person is Kannon and could still technically count as one person. This might explain Kannon's overall rule following attitude thus to not contradict the actions of the other. This twin thing does not still explain the closed room to me, though. I am pretty good at thinking up circumstances that fit in with the red truth but this is pretty solid.

[~Pyro~]

One thing that confuses me is if...

Spoiler for Erika:

If Erika doesn't exist in this games, does that erase all the red truths produced by her? Because if she wasn't there, then the tape wasn't there. If there was no tape, then that could allow battler to escape if he was in that room. The whole sixth game seems to be thrown into question if Erika never was there...

[Squirrellord]

This is probably really late, and I skipped about 5 pages, so if someone already said it, sorry:

Spoiler for Erika:

Even if they accept Erika on the island, there's only 17 people... because Erika's true form is a dead floating body, as shown in her tips. So even if she washes on shore on Rokkenjima she won't have any effect.