Tokyo's Youth Ordinance Bill

[aeriolewinters]

Why is it that people say that moe will die? I don't get it. It's the really 'bad' oppai anime or anything close with that manner that will get hit worst. Moe? No it wouldn't. K-ON! and its understudies are more likely the wholesome anime that conservatives would want. Nothing wrong with the Moe character designs, it's the content that has to be regulated. I'm pretty confident that things like K-ON!! would work better in such a manner, remember... moe is just the look, never the content. Also the regulation has something to do with content, not character design. Being clumsy isn't illegal people. so the clumsy moe character is still available.

Before anyone misread me for saying a while ago that I am condoning anime for being too moe, and fanservice-filled. I am saying that these two things are completely separatable. You can have moe without fanservice, you just have to place the right things for the character.

Another thing: It's how the characters will interact that will change, not how they look like in terms of facial features...I believe that anime will have to adapt its content, not its look to cope up.

[Dahak86]

Originally Posted by aeriolewinters

Why is it that people say that moe will die? I don't get it. It's the really 'bad' oppai anime or anything close with that manner that will get hit worst.

yeah, I wonder what will happen to the supposed 'bad' oppai anime... which aren't that bad, imho.
are they just gonna slap an R-18 mark on them?
or, they will get censored to death during broadcast-run? ... well, this is already happening for the most.

[aeriolewinters]

@Dahak: quote marks are there for a reason... 'bad' means that it's bad in the conservative's pov.

they will get censored to death during broadcast-run? ... well, this is already happening for the most.

Canned will be the logical next step.
But nonetheless, I'd be darned if this doesn't end up as Tokyo being encircled by Nearby towns which now have mini-akihabara(s). The short-term effect would probably be what many say, but if push comes to shove, I'm sure that something will give.

[technomo12]

something will give alright but im betting on the the people who wants freedome of speech

then again like what aeriolewinters said

there will be some kind of new tactics not involving to much fanservice (then again some anime only has fanservice even thoguh it has no story line it was good)

[technomo12]

ok sorry for double psot but this seems to be such an....i dunno weird for me

If a publisher releases something that Tokyo deems to be harmful to minors more than 6 times within a 12 month period, then the self-regulatory body that the publisher belongs to will be told to do something about this offending publisher. If the publisher offends once more within 6 months after that process, the Governor will have the right to humiliate the publisher in a public forum, and when that happens, you can expect retailers and distributor to avoid carrying that publisher’s line of works.

i mean what kind of a public forum? is it realy public? is ISHIHARA HIMSELF GOING TO BE THERE??

because in this public forum the attendees can be filtered to meet the requirments of an "ANTI OTAKU" people

or rather im sure only people who will say yes to ishiharas law can be invited and other pro otaku or other people who is agaisnt the law can notenter since tahts how i think ishihara will work

also humiliate?? im sure when that happens the publishing company will show ALL the freaking rape and violent stuff left on the TV that MINORS can watch because heck it is on TV

[Akito Kinomoto]

Originally Posted by Yui Is My Wife

The trouble is, Ishihara's definition of "Adult Material" seems to not be limited to just sex, but also:

Cussing (Goodbye Vegeta)
Punching People (Goodbye Goku)
Associating with criminals (Farewell Straw Hat Pirates)
Unlawful public extreme sports (Air Gear, we hardly knew ye)
Practice of dark arts (Negi old chap, Harem-Potter was nice while it lasted)

Need I go on?

Originally Posted by Vexx

He is cynically protecting *his* style of authorship (novels) against the transfer of general interest to anime/manga by demonizing the latter.

Originally Posted by aeriolewinters

As for one solution though: it's a bit of a stretch though; what if anime were to be sourced from novels because of this development. and a significant number of authors convert their works.

I think Yui, Vexx, and aeriole, inadvertently or not, found the solution to this problem: turn DBZ, One Piece, Air Gear, and Negima! into (light) novels. Perhaps light novels don't sell as much as picture books or motion pictures, but I would imagine that even the average anime fan is more inclined to read a book with Holo on the front cover than the main character of random law drama X. Brilliance I tell ya. Huhuhu~

[SinsI]

Originally Posted by Akito_Kinomoto

I think Yui, Vexx, and aeriole, inadvertently or not, found the solution to this problem: turn DBZ, One Piece, Air Gear, and Negima! into (light) novels. Perhaps light novels don't sell as much as picture books or motion pictures, but I would imagine that even the average anime fan is more inclined to read a book with Holo on the front cover than the main character of random law drama X. Brilliance I tell ya. Huhuhu~

And it promotes a question - how do we differentiate anime with film inserts and films with some 3D/animated scenes, and light novels with illustrations from manga with lots of text.

[Roloko vi Britannia]

I dont know if anyone posted this or not so I'll just leave this here.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/inte...-protest-event

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by aeriolewinters

Why is it that people say that moe will die? I don't get it. ...

Because the ones who say that have few clues at all about what "moe" means. The term has been explained hundreds of times in this forum but there's a determined crowd who refuse to grasp the concept because they use it to label anything they don't like (and what they often don't like is anything outside of testosterone-filled shouting action shounen). Ikki Tousen is at much higher risk from this bill than, for example, K-On! and I think few of these folks would label Ikki Tousen "moe". There's also a fair number of people who have "moe" erroneously mapped onto "sexy".

Magical girl series might trip up a bit on this though with lengthy transformation sequences.... (though honestly I wouldn't miss those too much. after the first few times they're just time filler).

[solomon]

Frankly, I am not into moe or hardcore fanservice stuff....

Still, it's a bad bill. It's the Action for Children's Television deal on steroids and is just there to score points with.......wait..........WHO is this made to score points with? Do the average Japanese even really CARE about this crap right now with the recession going? I mean outside of Sazae-san, Chibi Maruko chan, Ghibli movies and some shonen adaptions, I was under the impression that most Japanese don't care about anime at all.

[Vexx]

All my research basically points to a personal vendetta Ishihara has against the industry. He hates it and he builds support by the usual witch hunting tactics known the world over: demonize, scapegoat, and build power. He feeds hate for it into nationalistic sentiments about the Good Old Days when Things Were Better. More personally, he'd rather people bought his rape-murder-underage novels. Don't get me wrong, those books are apparently quite good reading (one was adapted to a live-action movie and a short series) -- but they'd be excoriated by his own law if adapted to anime/manga.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by solomon

Frankly, I am not into moe or hardcore fanservice stuff....

First they came for the lolicons, and I did not speak up because I was not a lolicon.
Then they came for the seifuku fetishists, and I did not speak up because I did not have a seifuku fetish.
Then they came for the yaoi fangirls, and I did not speak up because I was not a yaoi fangirl.
Then they came for me, and there was nobody left to speak up.

Yes, I know I'm trivialising a great quote (and coming perilously close to fulfilling Godwin's Law), but I stand by the principle: unless there's some overriding harm involved, like with child porn or hate speech, freedom of expression isn't something we can be selective about.

Personally I could happily do without a lot of the trash this law may target. But it's still a frightening weapon in the hands of a bigot like Ishihara, and IMO it needs to be resisted as such.

[Zetsubo]

Based on what I see of Japanese consensus follow the mass society.

This bill will stick and get worse.

I can see house wives and neighborhood associations nodding their head in approval.

I bet they hope pressuring otaku will help their birth rate increase

I know that Anime and Otaku are pretty much seen as undesirable members of society.

"Sick people" like the "Hikimori" and just as bad as Burakumin

So... im not sure it will ever be repealed in Tokyo.

The most anime/manga fans can hope for is that this bill does not spread to the other prefectures.


The way I see it Japan has an AGING society, the old folks are slowly out numbering the young. This is going to only get worse.

Originally Posted by Simon

Personally I could happily do without a lot of the trash this law may target. But it's still a frightening weapon in the hands of a bigot like Ishihara, and IMO it needs to be resisted as such.

ISHIHARA-san will only get stronger and stronger as there are more bitter old men in Japanese society and not enough young free minded ones to counter balance them.

Simple put, the young are becoming a minority with less power as time goes on.

As long as their are old men with power who are free to do as they please, yearning for the good old days, then things like this will happen in 日本

[Tyabann]

All those old people you're so scared of will be dead in ten years...

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

All those old people you're so scared of will be dead in ten years...

No they won't.

Hopefully the "new elderly" won't be as conservative as Ishihara (and he seems to be extreme even for his generation), but if I was a Japanese kid I wouldn't feel optimistic about my voice carrying much weight in politics.

[Tyabann]

Originally Posted by Simon

Hopefully the "new elderly" won't be as conservative as Ishihara (and he seems to be extreme even for his generation), but if I was a Japanese kid I wouldn't feel optimistic about my voice carrying much weight in politics.

The people who are old now are the people who were young in the 30s and 40s... the people who will be old in the future will be the people who were young in the 50s and 60s, and they're probably going to be a lot different than the war generation.

[Guardian Enzo]

A shot across Ishihara's bow:

I wonder if those 10 largest mainstream publishers would consider holding an "Osaka Anime Fair" or some such, preferably on the same weekend as the crippled TAF. You won't get as big a hall as Tokyo Big Sight, but you could have a good-sized event.

[orion]

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

A shot across Ishihara's bow:

For something that occured 55 years ago for which he received a Time magazine interview as a best selling author in his 20's, it comes off mostly as pathetic to me. I doubt that anyone would hold their head in shame for a positive Time magazine interview.

Truly shows how out of touch with reality those protestors are.

[aeriolewinters]

I wonder if those 10 largest mainstream publishers would consider holding an "Osaka Anime Fair" or some such, preferably on the same weekend as the crippled TAF. You won't get as big a hall as Tokyo Big Sight, but you could have a good-sized event.

inb4 someone big makes one bigger than tokyo big.

[Equidistant]

Originally Posted by orion

For something that occured 55 years ago for which he received a Time magazine interview as a best selling author in his 20's, it comes off mostly as pathetic to me. I doubt that anyone would hold their head in shame for a positive Time magazine interview.

Truly shows how out of touch with reality those protestors are.

Isn't it simply because this bill is seen as a direct attack on anime and manga? It's not about the content of Ishihara's novels, but rather if you were to adapt his novels into manga format they'd fall under the restrictions of the bill. If they can demonstrate how works of art can live on in novels, and yet be basically reduced to being sold as porn if those novels were adapted to an anime or manga, it at least sends a message. Of course I'd say at this point no of this is going to really matter much in regards to tge bill.