2011-11-29, 23:58 | Link #2241 | ||||||
#1 Ranka Fan!!
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: USA
Age: 32
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Looking between the changes in Ranka's past for both series and movies, the series version of herself didn't learn much about herself until later, leading her around a "who am I" and "why am I here" until E23. Yes, we can all agree that falling for Grace's mind control was stupid, but because of the trauma of remembering such an event, Grace manages to take over her mind. Realize that in such a state, Ranka was helpless, and so E24 and 25 is not her fault directly but rather Grace took advantage of her just like she'd once done to Sheryl. That much was obvious by Ranka's blank eyes (which, in anime, usually state the person is unconscious/dead/soulless).. But when you look at how her past has changed between the two formats, you can easily see that her series' self lacked that resolve and bravery that her movie self found. I personally do not see Ranka's resolutions as "badly timed" because she reflects every normal teenager with "bad decisions" and "wrong time." Had she gone out and done something stupid like gotten pregnant, I'd see that as a "bad decision." It doesn't change how I feel about the character because she seems like the most 3D character out of the whole lot: a normal teenager girl. Yes, she acts childish, but I've been to high school for four years (recently) and I can tell you a lot of girls nowadays are acting like her: childish, conceited, and selfish. Kawamori hit the nail on the head with a good character that most modern teens could relate to. And, about the "growing up" piece; were we ever shown her growing up to distinguish this as a conversation to start? No. There is no proof that - as she grew up - she was not stunted by her trauma or lack of knowledge of who she is. Realize that Ozma had to have told Ranka something for her to already know he's not her real brother. So she had to have known something. Plus, how did she come to remember Aimo? You see where logic falls into questioning about the things we have no proof of? Quote:
Now, wouldn't a person raised by encouragement and freedom be more independent than a person raised by lack of encouragement and sheltered? Logically speaking, yes they would have problems growing as a person. That person would become too attached to their significant other who'd raised them and wouldn't be able to step away from the curb let alone live by themselves. We gotta remember that Catherine also states that Ozma kept putting Ranka first over her. When Ozma took Ranka into his home, she was five or so. So you have to ask, why - after at least two or three years - couldn't he make room for Catherine? Because he was being overprotective. It got so bad to the point where Catherine said "if you can't at least put me as a priority on your list, I'm leaving." Ozma was a pilot, a brother, and a lover; but because he put his other two duties above his own romance life, he lost Catherine. This just goes to show that Ranka's growth is most likely harmed by Ozma's excessive care to her over the years, making her clingy. And I think that could be proved by E3 when Ozma returns injured. Quote:
It is a flaw in herself, sadly. A very small one that could change had events played out a little differently. Had the first movie been the prequel to the series and the series picked up from there, I'm sure we would've seen different growth from her because she learned more about herself and was more confident that she could do something to help, unlike her series self who was constantly going "who am I" and "why am I here" whilst others constantly protected her. She had no idea that her songs were affecting the Vajra nor did she know how to stop them. The only proof we had that she realized anything was E14 and E16. And both times, she easily started questioning why it was her they were after. Realize that in the movie, this was immediately resolved with one flashback and she went "they're after me, then I must do something." And she did. Not best planned out, but her idea was "I am the sacrifice." Like I said above, her moods relate to modern teens nowadays. I realize that a lot of you are old time Macross fans and don't like characters like these, but if you ever walk into a high school again and look at girls around you, 90% of them are gonna act childish, spoiled, and timid, even spoiled. Hell, just take the cheerleaders into account too. Her moods aren't actually flaws but reflects of personalities of real living teens. Like I said: Kawamori gave us a 3D character with her. I never said she's a "fragile princess." I don't wanna even go back to the topic of Cinderella here. I was stating a fact that between amnesia, trauma, and being sheltered most of her life, Ranka's growth was stunted by the people around her, even if that wasn't their intention. Sometimes we can be so heartless as to put our own ideals above our child's. In Ozma's case, he did this. Don't think I'm bashing Ozma, I just think that some of what he did in her childhood (sheltering her from reality) really harmed her growing as an independent person. Quote:
In the movie, however, we have those necessary flashbacks in M1; thus is why she's such an amazing character by M2. So looking at that, her growth in the movies just shows that she had problems in the series due to her past. Quote:
Ranka made some good choices in the series, some that helped her grow. Though some were so small that they seemed insignificant, she still showed she wanted to grow. Some good examples are: in E4 and 5, she chose to sing, in E10, she chose to do the kiss scene, in E12, she chose to go to Galia 4 even knowing the risks and also sang before a bunch of rebels who could've killed her, in E16 and 17, she chose to go out onto the battlefield and assist the pilots in stopping the Vajra, in E21, she chose to leave Frontier upon realizing she was the cause of the attacks. She wanted to help Frontier however she could. But she also wanted to learn about herself. And sadly, a lot of the episodes showed no proof that she ever understood her past until E23. Then she realized "it really was me who drew them." But because of the trauma of remembering such an event, Grace manages to take over her mind. Realize that in such a state, Ranka was helpless, and so E24 and 25 is not her fault directly but rather Grace took advantage of her just like she'd once done to Sheryl. That much was obvious by Ranka's blank eyes (which, in anime, usually state the person is unconscious/dead/soulless). Quote:
In the series verse, Ozma was overprotective of Ranka even after she became an idol. He actually wanted her to back out in E16 (or was that 17) but she persisted. Even when she made her debut, Ozma didn't want to give her up, even scared the shit out of Elmo. In the movie verse, after Ranka becomes serious about singing, Ozma backs off. And I mean that literally. So, in the movie verse, Ranka's growth was mostly caused by the correct memories and lack of an overprotective Ozma. The only scene in which could be considered over-protectiveness (and he even showed some to Alto too) would be when he told them both to stay away from Sheryl (because she is a spy, at that time). It is easy to tell that Ozma was the cause of Ranka's lack of growth in the series. Ranka, in the movies, made a much better entrance as a teenager or adult rather than her series self, which goes to show that without the "sheltering," she was able to mature more. So that leaves the question: is it truly Ranka's fault that she has problems growing in maturity? Another topic: I've been dying to know this one: what made old and current fans alike like Ranka? Doesn't have to be from the beginning and it doesn't have to be specifically about the movies (though I'd aim more towards the series cause I already know what a lot of people think of her movie self). Just tell me what you guys liked about Ranka in general even if you chose to pick Sheryl in the end. What made you like her in the beginning?
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2011-11-30, 01:05 | Link #2242 | |
Senior Member
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Even now, probably due to my initial misunderstanding, I don't see Alto ever being romantically involved with Ranka in the series. However, movie-Ranka is an entirely different story. The movies really established a clear-cut triangle, requiring Alto to make a choice. Even though he ended up choosing Sheryl over Ranka, it seemed that Ranka really had a chance to win Alto's heart. Overall, I enjoyed both movies more than the series, mostly because the movies managed to polish the rough edges of the series. I'm thankful for having watched the series before watching Itsuwari no Utahime, because I was able to appreciate (and to a lesser degree, understand) the differences. |
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2011-11-30, 01:15 | Link #2243 | |
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
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Certainly, she was a more appreciable character than her TV counterpart, though I never saw the possibility. - Tak
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2011-11-30, 01:33 | Link #2244 |
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Join Date: Jan 2009
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Well reading your post I remembered something in the movie that I overlooked at first. THE big difference between movie Ranka and series Ranka.
Series Ranka only had one confirmed friend and probably had talked to michael and luca trough her or Ozma, but they were more like acquaintances. Movie Ranka was friends with Michael, Luca, Klan and Alto (and later Sheryl and one could argue that she will befriend Nana again); this makes a great difference since friends also help build confidence, something that helps one to grow up, Ranka in the movie had a memory that held her responsible of the situation and friends that helped to boost her confidence in herself (I'm pretty sure that series Ranka would have crashed even if the revelation happened as soon as in the movies). This is what makes the great difference between them, lack of friends surely caused a great deal of Ranka's selfishness since she really didn't need to care for others before. Of course being selfish also helped with her spoiledness and childishness and VOILA series Ranka is born! I think this is a WAY better explanation to Ranka's Childishness in the series than her amnesia. Someone else agrees? Well the closest thing I have near me to a Ranka fan is another friend of mine that liked her despite my very vocal hate for her (she just recently watched the series). And well in her case it was a no brainer she likes cute stuff and Ranka was cute, end of history. (she also liked a whole lot of the cast including Sheryl.) I asked her if she didn't have a problem with Ranka's decisions or action but I guess the experience does change from a week by week viewing than from a marathoned one.
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2011-11-30, 03:17 | Link #2245 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Age: 33
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I actually have/had two friends that were like Movie Ranka and Series Ranka, minus the amnesia part and I must say my friend that was like series Ranka was very clingy to me. >3< |
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2011-11-30, 14:02 | Link #2249 |
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
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This may be helpful:
http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/dissociative-amnesia Take it as what you will. I honestly don't know what LMK is trying to pull answering the question, she is hardly a qualified individual to even remotely tackle the topic. - Tak
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Last edited by Tak; 2011-11-30 at 14:20. |
2011-11-30, 16:19 | Link #2252 |
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Join Date: Jan 2009
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My point was, that there was no way that was the cause, and already got a real answer to that, or at least one that makes more sense. I didn't realize that I was condemning Ranka by calling her childish, after all that was part of her characterization in the series at least.
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2011-11-30, 19:20 | Link #2257 | |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
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But we could cut this by simply saying that you don't agree with this general concensus that I agree with and end it for good. fact noun 1.something that actually exists; reality; truth. 2.something known to exist or to have happened. 3.a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true. 4.something said to be true or supposed to have happened. By this definition Ranka being Childish is indeed a fact.
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2011-11-30, 19:25 | Link #2258 |
さっく♥ゆうきゃん♥ほそやん
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: in the land down under...
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I think even the creators would say that they were portraying her as being rather 'childish' early in the series. E.g. episode 5.
But I personally think she grows up a fair bit during the series, unlike most of the fans on this board - or so it would seem.
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2011-11-30, 21:52 | Link #2260 |
Senior Member
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What exactly is the argument here? Stating that Ranka acts childish isn't meant as an insult - atleast not in the context of this discussion, so there's no reason to start an all-new debate on whether or not she was childish. The original issue is whether or not Ranka's amnesia had any effect on her maturity. Tak gave a very concise answer, which Teelatsuki accepted. Issue resolved; time to move on.
I agree with Karice that Ranka did indeed mature by the end of the series; she was pretty much forced to by events beyond her control. At least both movies help "correct" (for lack of a better term) Ranka's monumental naivety immaturity and portray her as a normal teenage girl. |
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