Claymore Chapter 121

[Claymore!]

Originally Posted by Demon6666

an eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind. - gandhi

BUT REVENGE IS THE MAIN PLOT OF CLAYMORE!


But seriously the this story is about revenge. However, I do like your quote from Gandi, it is true. Revenge is Not always a good thing.

[Nixl]

I just read the translation, it is not that bad. Furthermore, at least it was not battle talk like we had in the Slasher's arc or Deneve's wedge analogy. It truth, I thought it was Cassandra just trying to be snarky and finally put the joke on Roxanne. Most importantly, it seemed to work. I like knowing that Cassandra's technique carried over in her form, but I still think Roxanne is holding something back. My vote is till that she synchronizes and absorbs her prey.

Hysteria's dialogue kind of made the chapter for me with, "hey wait for me, please." Just feels like the most obnoxious and vain AO to date.

[Shiek927]

Originally Posted by Nixl

I just read the translation, it is not that bad. Furthermore, at least it was not battle talk like we had in the Slasher's arc or Deneve's wedge analogy. It truth, I thought it was Cassandra just trying to be snarky and finally put the joke on Roxanne. Most importantly, it seemed to work. I like knowing that Cassandra's technique carried over in her form, but I still think Roxanne is holding something back. My vote is till that she synchronizes and absorbs her prey.

Hysteria's dialogue kind of made the chapter for me with, "hey wait for me, please." Just feels like the most obnoxious and vain AO to date.

In other words, the dialog actually matched them all very well; you're right in that it wasn't generic battle-talk, but basically just more aspects of their personality, but amplified -- Hysteria as vain as ever (come to think of it, she far far surpasses Galatea in that regard), and Cassandra now suddenly the tough guy....Yuma I imagine, if she ever awakened, would act very similar to how Cassie is right now.

Roxanne really is the only person I feel who hasn't 'changed' much in this regard after the awakening, which strangely doesn't surprise me; probably because she was already as malevolent as can be.

[TheRussianMeatClob]

Originally Posted by Shiek927

In other words, the dialog actually matched them all very well; you're right in that it wasn't generic battle-talk, but basically just more aspects of their personality, but amplified -- Hysteria as vain as ever (come to think of it, she far far surpasses Galatea in that regard), and Cassandra for once trying to be the tough guy....Yuma I imagine, if she ever awakened, would act very similar to how Cassie is right now.

Roxanne really is the only person I feel who hasn't 'changed' in this regard much after the awakening, which strangely doesn't surprise me.

Indeed we all learned something about Hysteria this chapter and thats that manners are more important than arms.

[Nixl]

Originally Posted by Shiek927

the tough guy....Yuma .

But Yuma is already the tough guy of the universe hehe

That does make me think...an awakened Yuma...


Edit: I know what Yuma will be, but I am going to need photoshop for this one...but I am too sleepy. I'll post the monstrosity tomorrow. Just. You. Wait.

[lordshadowisle]

Does anyone want to estimate/mass-wild-guess the odds of success here?

I think we can discard the idea of defeating all 3 abyssal ones; I think that even killing Hysteria is implausible, unless someone awakens.

Assuming Cassandra and Roxanne continue their fight, then there's only Hysteria to care about. It is certainly possible to escape from an abyssal one; the ghosts did it previously with Riful. However, without implying anything about the relative power of Hysteria and Riful, I think that escaping from Hysteria is going to be far more difficult, simply due to her specialization in speed. If everyone scatters in different directions, then most will survive, but the bait won't.

I'm wondering though.... how does Hysteria attack, um, without useful appendages? Bite or trample her foes?

[Friday]

Originally Posted by lordshadowisle

Does anyone want to estimate/mass-wild-guess the odds of success here?

I think we can discard the idea of defeating all 3 abyssal ones; I think that even killing Hysteria is implausible, unless someone awakens.

Assuming Cassandra and Roxanne continue their fight, then there's only Hysteria to care about. It is certainly possible to escape from an abyssal one; the ghosts did it previously with Riful. However, without implying anything about the relative power of Hysteria and Riful, I think that escaping from Hysteria is going to be far more difficult, simply due to her specialization in speed. If everyone scatters in different directions, then most will survive, but the bait won't.

I'm wondering though.... how does Hysteria attack, um, without useful appendages? Bite or trample her foes?

look for me on pge17

as for Hysteria attack method.......good question!!!!!!

[gxy1069]

Originally Posted by lordshadowisle

Does anyone want to estimate/mass-wild-guess the odds of success here?

I think we can discard the idea of defeating all 3 abyssal ones; I think that even killing Hysteria is implausible, unless someone awakens.

Assuming Cassandra and Roxanne continue their fight, then there's only Hysteria to care about. It is certainly possible to escape from an abyssal one; the ghosts did it previously with Riful. However, without implying anything about the relative power of Hysteria and Riful, I think that escaping from Hysteria is going to be far more difficult, simply due to her specialization in speed. If everyone scatters in different directions, then most will survive, but the bait won't.

I'm wondering though.... how does Hysteria attack, um, without useful appendages? Bite or trample her foes?

i wouldn't be too sure that the claymores have absolutely no chance against hysteria; sure, they shouldn't have a chance of killing hysteria outright without any casualties, but i would imagine it to be a pyrrhic victory for the claymores rather than a "everyone runs" scenario...

oh and i certainly hope someone else will awaken

[MalakTawus]

@ATM

Why not?
Sorry Malak, but I kinda disagree with you (yet again :P). Clare learned it from Jean whom almost fully awakened and totally changed her physical features. You are kinda right, but it was maybe Jean and not Clare who was the first claymore in history to have ever accomplished that (I don’t know if she was the first in history to do so, but at least she is the first claymore I saw doing it). But if Clare kinda copied it from Jean, why can’t others do it as well? Specially the claymores that saw Clare’s transformation at Pieta. It seems that the biggest requirement is to have very strong willpower (Jean had plenty of that) and maybe that’s what Miria and the other claymores lack at the moment and that’s the reason they can’t control or even produce a meaningful physical mutation; or maybe the author is just being kinda lazy and wants to save himself the trouble of having to design their partial awakened forms.

I don't agree.Jean has NEVER showed any sign of partial awakening,never.
You base your speculation on something that simply isn't true,Jean did a full awakening,not a partial.
All she did was being able to keep her body completely immobile thanx to her great will power (and only for a very brief time),but in the end that's more similar to what Hilde or Ophelia (more or less) did.
What Claire did against Rigardo is something that no one has ever done in Claymore,and this is a fact.
On the contrary what happened to Jean actually strenghten my opinion not yours,infact even a warrior with an incredible "humanity" and determination like Jean wasn't able to do a partial awakening so it's actually even more probable that only Claire can do something like that.
Jean gave Claire inspiration to control her awakened arm but that's completely different to say that Jean can also do it, giving an idea and actually doing it its not the same.

Not to mention that considering that the QS technique is already considered a techinique that only a monster could do......the QotB mode is surely something beyond impossible for a normal warrior.

Also another thing that supports my point is that the ghosts stopped Miria at the end of the chapter as if they knew that she was fully awakening, so they already know that a partial awakening is impossible for them,if not they would surely try to do it considering that their opponents are crazy strong......

[Friday]

Originally Posted by theevilanimal

Enemies are: Cassandra, Roxanne, Hysteria
Warriors who are present and active: Miria, Deneve, Helen, Cynthia, Yuma, Tabitha, Dietrich, Anastacia, Nike, Phina, Keira, twin1, twin2
Warriors who are present and dismembered: Audrey, Rachel, Nina

That makes 16 warriors
If Galatea's troup decide to join in, that would make 19 warriors.
+Raftela=20

For now, Cassandra is occupied with Roxanne, so 19 warriors against a handicapped Hysteria.

Out of these 20 warriors, we have Miata who is no1 material according to the org's standards and Miria who is very close to that title.

Galatea is also a high ranking warrior, along with Deneve and Helen.

Cynthia, Yuma and Tabitha are also forces that mustn't be neglected.

lets just stick to the arrival of the 8 only no one else

Originally Posted by White Silver King

So I'm thinking, while Cassandra and Roxanne duke it out, Deneve will order the weaker warriors (Dietrich, Anastasia, and Nike) to start getting the warriors and trainees out of there and Cynthia and Yuma to heal the injured (Audrey, Nina, and Rachel) while she, Helen, Miria, and the trainees take on Hysteria. They'll gain the upper hand and just when they seem to win, Hysteria will rip off her lower shell and sacrifice her extra attack power for even more extraordinary speed. Then, I'm guessing, either Clare or Galatea and Miata (I'd prefer the latter) swoop in and save the day and/or help the other escape. Me like...

my version.....

all 8 will fight as 1 against Hysteria, but they might have pep talk with the twins along with Keira & Phina and tell them what role to play.
As for healing the injured....no time for that, there wounds are fresh so it can be done later.
Galatea and Miata showing up....I say no they still be guarding in Rabona
and Clare & Priscilla wait and see.

[Shiek927]

Originally Posted by lordshadowisle

Does anyone want to estimate/mass-wild-guess the odds of success here?

I think we can discard the idea of defeating all 3 abyssal ones; I think that even killing Hysteria is implausible, unless someone awakens.

Assuming Cassandra and Roxanne continue their fight, then there's only Hysteria to care about. It is certainly possible to escape from an abyssal one; the ghosts did it previously with Riful. However, without implying anything about the relative power of Hysteria and Riful, I think that escaping from Hysteria is going to be far more difficult, simply due to her specialization in speed. If everyone scatters in different directions, then most will survive, but the bait won't.

I'm wondering though.... how does Hysteria attack, um, without useful appendages? Bite or trample her foes?

You're right here -- Quality is what matters here, not quantity...not to mention we are dealing with three abyssal ones....

This whole situation is beyond chaotic -- the only plausible way the Ghosts/Warriors could "win" in this situation is simply letting the Abyssals weaken eachother and then moving in to finish them off...or simply letting them kill eachother and escaping, which is the more ideal choice in my opinion.

Escaping, survival, should be their goal here - not trying to be heroes and killing off Abyssals; their are still trainees in the building after all, and a bunch of warriors unconscious and on the ground...helping them and getting them out should be their number 1 priority.

If I truly see the Ghosts manage to kill off one of the Abyssals.....I don't even know what to say about that except their had better be a perfect explanation, because it will probably just promote the Nixl's idea that the power-levels are broken.

I also want to say that this is a good chance to see the true potential of the ZAOs....in other words, to see if one of them truly is stronger then an AO -- unless all three happen to fit this, which I doubt considering Dae's lack of knowledge surrounding both Teresa and Priscilla, It wouldn't surprise me if we saw one of them vastly stronger then the others...if so, then they at least succeeded with one of them.

Personally though, I don't think this is the case...it's not like it's merely one level or the other, and time will tell how strong these three are (like Nixl said -- Priscilla was put up on top when she first awoke way back when...since then, Yagi has been steadily filling up the gaps and we're getting closer and closer; with these three, it's a question of how close).

They could simply be "normal" Abyssals, which is what I think....and apparently what Dr.Deneve thinks because that's what she called them -- however, that's probably because their is no better term to call them, regardless of their strength. However, facing Raciella, if any of the Ghosts compare any one or more of the ZAOS to it, then the Org really did succeed...if not, then they didn't; barring Luciella, the Ghosts have faced the Abyssals, Raciella, and Priscilla....in this case, Dr.Deneve can actually give a reasonable understandable estimate of where the ZAOs are.

[Ryus]

Originally Posted by lordshadowisle

I'm wondering though.... how does Hysteria attack, um, without useful appendages? Bite or trample her foes?

My guess would be as she flies past them she attacks them with all those blades and insect legs on her backside. Similar to how she used her elegant move in human form to attack Miria's back on there first exchange. So some sort of straffing run... Maybe she could even just grab someone with a hawk like grap to a small animal (via impalining thier guts with her legs due to her lack of tallons) then swooping back up in the air as high as possible before dropping them from a height not even Dietrich could survive (this assumes she learns that she can push things off her blades or just let the wind force do it for her). Or once she gets the sword out of her mouth just bite them in half from there.

She appears a bit fraggle to me to be the type to tackle often... dont get me wrong I think she could do it but she does seem resistant to blades so that attack method would be risky to her.

[gxy1069]

@shiek927

the claymores can try to escape, but i don't think hysteria is gonna let them walk without a fight. also, it would be pretty anti-climatic if everyone decides to flee right after they arrive...though i understand why they would want to, given the circumstances.

[Ryus]

Originally Posted by gxy1069

@shiek927

the claymores can try to escape, but i don't think hysteria is gonna let them walk without a fight. also, it would be pretty anti-climatic if everyone decides to flee right after they arrive...though i understand why they would want to, given the circumstances.

You're right, they wont flee until every last warrior and trainee (and once they realize he's there Raki) is safe and out of harms way. After that, if Priscilla has shown up by then... maybe they will flee or at least those too injured to fight any more will flee and the rest will try to manipulte the battle like Dietrich did between the AFs and the Hellcats.

Maybe they'll even buy time for Clare to bring back Teresa or protect the process while the ZAOs fight Priscilla... though I remain skeptical on this since it seems far to predictable. Even though if Teresa was brought back she'd be done so "awakened" but with Clare being partualy awakened and having Raphaela's memlries means she might be able to make Teresa partualy awakened too instead. Thus I dont see something like this being impossible either, though still predictable... to say the least.

[Shiek927]

Originally Posted by gxy1069

@shiek927

the claymores can try to escape, but i don't think hysteria is gonna let them walk without a fight. also, it would be pretty anti-climatic if everyone decides to flee right after they arrive...though i understand why they would want to, given the circumstances.

Who cares if it's anti-climatic or not? Again, they aren't trying to be heroes; it's one thing if the ZAOs impede them, but these are Abyssals we're talking about...

It's like Miria purely leaving Pieta with all the Claymores...it's one thing if she couldn't, for whatever reason, but to stay and fight for the hell of it? She and all the warriors could have left and none of them would have died.

They are going to fight them though, I don't think you'll have to worry -- as predictable as it is, I can't imagine Helen and Deneve not deliberately fighting as they did against Isley...they are suicidal, what can you say.

The only thing that really gets me is the same fear I've been saying: is that I don't want any of the ZAOs to die....that would be anti-climatic and would be a serious blow for me.

[SpiritOfGray]

Random thought. Dae is doing all of this just to see his supposed greatest creation, Priscilla. I wonder what he's going to think if he ends up seeing Clare. A warrior who was considered horrible, that rose in the ranks. It's an even better story than Roxanne who started out in the 30s, yet she was up there in his favorites.

[Asimati]

So personal opinions of the chapter and initial impressions. A transfer chapter mostly, nothing particullary unexpected.

"Her soul for the future" sounds really like Miria will awake at some point.
The skin falling off like that is fairly creepy.
Raftela collapsing might from her yoki still being connected to Roxanne when she awoke.
Nice speech Audrey, but it might work better without the tone of "run away and live happily for the next week or so until the ZAO comes and eat you".
Roxanne's form, didn't like the bionic skeleton angel style at first, but it has grown on me a bit. The old AO forms were generally less creepy though. Might be a more sympathetic -> prettier form perhaps?
Several random claymore deaths stated though, so some confirmation that claymores can still die.
Is Cassandra still chewing on Roxanne in the first picture? Nice shit talking towards Roxanne there and it worked.
These ZAO:s makes significant collateral damage.
The matrix, even if I wonder where the blade came from. It's a thrusting motion, while the blade wings are cutting.
Hysteria. Agreeing on kill by mirror. Insect legs for speed and upper body for "beauty", so there's still a theme there. Legs seems to double as retractable projetiles if I red the leg through the left claymore correct. The claymore blade is either going to be weak spot or body form limiter.
Miria going for awakening at that point isn't so surprising, she's out of options.
I do like Deneave's entrance comments there, the good old "stay alive so I can beat you" style. I'm guessing that Helen is going for if you're supposed to die, die with a smile here. After overcoming the initial fear, she should go back to her normal attitude.

I don't think Hysteria is at full power yet due to the blade, even if the Ghosts+extra might be able to win a very bloody victory vs Hysteria at full strength. A fresh Miria would've helped a lot.
It does feel like full evacuation should be started to be planned though and they might got enough numbers for that atm. Going for hoping to be able to take Hysteria down and then hope that the Roxanne vs Cassandra fight goes to the death (the claymores don't know why they fight) and finish off the survivor sounds like the last option at this point.

[MalakTawus]

Shiek,even if they want to escape,they simply can't.
The ghost can't escape 'cause they are the only ones that can buy a little bit of time for all the others to escape.Simple as that.
The problem is that Histy won't stay there looking at them running away,lol.

Also, if the ghosts go full power they won't be that easy to kill 'cause even if it's true that there is a big gap between an awakened n.2 and an abyssal,it's still a fact that the ghosts didn't simply defeat an awakened n.2 (Agatha),they completely destroyed her like she was nothing (ok,Claire was also there but from that fight it doesn't seems that without her things would have gone differently....) and with their yoki completely sealed.
So i don't think that it's so strange for the ghosts going full power to be able to hold their ground against an abyssal.....if not defeating her,at least buying some time for the others.
Of course if the 3 ZAOs are even stronger than normal abyssals.......

[Shiek927]

I think I'm giving you the wrong impression Malak - I can understand that the Abyssals, Hysteria anyway, is not going to simply let the warriors pack up and leave...undoubtedly they will, at the very least, have to distract them in an effort to allow the other warriors to escape. What I'm trying to say though, is that "Escape" should be their first priority, not fighting with the Abyssals.

One thing is fighting them to give the others time to flee; it's another to fight them "just because".

[Elandyll]

Imo given the following conditions, the Ghosts -might- have a chance to win. #1 is probably the most important of all.

1) If Roxane and Cassandra keep being busy with each other and ensuring mutual self destruction (leaving one survivor, badly damaged and having had to spend a large deal of Yoki, ripe for the kill.)

2) If The ghosts all do partial awakenings and decide to finally show us what their training for 7 years did to their special "Yoki based" abilities

3) If the ghost and available warriors work with the same kind of team coordination we saw vs Agatha

4) If Yagi allows for meaningful deaths, because frankly, I don't see the Ghosts winning against even 1 AO without a single casualty and serious injuries among survivors. Plus, Clare isn't there and Miria must be getting to her limits fast now.