Gundam Seed/Seed Destiny General Discussion Thread

[Aquaman OS]

Difference is Star Trek shows are in the same universe, but are usually later on, and featuring a different cast, although old characters might occasionally pop up for a guest appearance. DS9 was the only rare exception where two major TNG regulars were also major regulars on DS9.

Unicorn is something similar, since the majority of the cast are new characters and older characters only made a rare guest appearance (Bright I think was only in 2 of the 7 OVAs and in a minor role at that). But not MSG to Zeta where many MSG return in regular roles, and especially not Seed to Destiny where practically the entire survining former cast return in a major capacity that rivals or even overshadows new characters.

[Skye629]

Originally Posted by zeroexia

I was being sarcastic. Trailblazer's ending was really weird. The Alien Flower and Metal Setsuna and Alien Quanta was quite off-setting. Everything was pretty stupid imho with the aliens.

But that's 00 and not CE.

Off topic but the ending (what you mentioned) made sense. Well at least in Japan, the flower was a cultural thing (some sort of peace symbol) so we westerners had no idea what it meant. ELS Setsuna made sense, he is more or less the diplomat of the universe with the Quanta so they prolonged his life by ELSing him. Upgrading the Quanta came naturally with that



On the subject of Destiny's sequel:

I dont think its possible to do a sequel with the way they ended it. I would like something like the Rebuild of Evangelion though, a set of movies which retell the story (Using plots along the lines of the SRW games)

[Gundamx]

Originally Posted by Aquaman OS

Problem is if they have a 3rd destructive war it means Durandal was right and Kira and Lacus were wrong, and I doubt the staff would do that after Destiny.

I think aliens was the next step, but 00 beat them to it.

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

This would make sense, since GSD was intended to be CE's version of Zeta.

Much like how Scirocco screwed over Kamille (in the original TV version), Durandal being proven right may mean that Durandal screwed over Kira and Lacus.

My interpretation is that Durandal forced them to fight again, when all they wanted to do is live in peace.

Kira already know that there will be another war he even prepared for it.

Basically he said he would rather to have world with war but free will than
peaceful world of machines.
(control DNA)

[Rising Dragon]

The problem is that Destiny already gutted one side of the conflict and Durandal eliminated the other half. You have Lacus in control of ZAFT, and unlike Zala and Durandal she won't go to war immediately, especially with an enforcer like Kira on her side, and the EA's already lost its leadership and LOGOS is out of the picture, leaving it open for better leadership. Not to mention ORB and such.

They'd need to create a new villain, likely on EA's side of things (again), and there's only so many ways you can do the same war before viewers get sick of it.

[brightman]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

The problem is that Destiny already gutted one side of the conflict and Durandal eliminated the other half. You have Lacus in control of ZAFT, and unlike Zala and Durandal she won't go to war immediately, especially with an enforcer like Kira on her side, and the EA's already lost its leadership and LOGOS is out of the picture, leaving it open for better leadership. Not to mention ORB and such.

They'd need to create a new villain, likely on EA's side of things (again), and there's only so many ways you can do the same war before viewers get sick of it.

Or maybe they finally make Lacus and Kira the real bad guys and have a new protag go and defeat them. Like how GSD was supposed to be.

Spoiler:

I can dream

[zeroexia]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

Yes, I'm not that good with English phrases.

I still count ZZ as a direct sequel to Zeta coz it's still has Bright and his Argama crew and also Haman Karn. Those two are prominent in Zeta. Plus, even though he's not the MC anymore, the story in ZZ still directly involve Camille (at least in the early eps). Remember the scene where Judau being touched by the mentally-broken-down Camille and experienced the Newtype sensation? I think that's Tomino's way of "passing the torch" of Gundam MC from Camille to Judau (thus, a direct sequel).

As for Unicorn: Bright is still there along with Char's clone who still has the real one's memory of the climactic event in CCA. You can even add Mineva, Kai, Beltorchika and that Argama's doctor from the previous series who appeared and had minor roles.

That is so unlike Star Trek TNG & Voyager.

Like I said, Stargazer happened after SEED in terms of timeline. But just like my comparison before, Stargazer is not a direct sequel to SEED, just like Voyager is not a direct sequel to TNG.

And I think I'll stop talking about Star Trek now since this is not the place and you said it yourself that you're not a Trekkie (have you watched the entirety of TNG & Voyager?). So, yeah.

Yea, I didn't watch everything. So I'll defer to your judgement.

[zeroexia]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

The problem is that Destiny already gutted one side of the conflict and Durandal eliminated the other half. You have Lacus in control of ZAFT, and unlike Zala and Durandal she won't go to war immediately, especially with an enforcer like Kira on her side, and the EA's already lost its leadership and LOGOS is out of the picture, leaving it open for better leadership. Not to mention ORB and such.

They'd need to create a new villain, likely on EA's side of things (again), and there's only so many ways you can do the same war before viewers get sick of it.

Well I'm sure there are other factions in the CE universe. There's a lot of material in Astray.

Mars built its own Gundam for example. There may even be other colonies in the solar system. CE has a lot of potential actually. It's just poorly utilized.

I think it would be best to have a CE sequel without Kira, Athrun or Shinn with a new protagonist and the three having cameos. Like ZZ in UC.

Then they could have CE's version of CCA for them.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by zeroexia

Well I'm sure there are other factions in the CE universe. There's a lot of material in Astray.

Mars built its own Gundam for example. There may even be other colonies in the solar system. CE has a lot of potential actually. It's just poorly utilized.

I think it would be best to have a CE sequel without Kira, Athrun or Shinn with a new protagonist and the three having cameos. Like ZZ in UC.

Then they could have CE's version of CCA for them.

The only remaining large faction would be the Mars Colony... who pretty much just want to be left alone, having left the Earth Sphere to get away from their wars. All other factions are too small or factions-within-factions. None of them can really cause a full-scale war unless they triggered it to happen between ZAFT and EA... which, again, been done to death.

[zeroexia]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

The only remaining large faction would be the Mars Colony... who pretty much just want to be left alone, having left the Earth Sphere to get away from their wars. All other factions are too small or factions-within-factions. None of them can really cause a full-scale war unless they triggered it to happen between ZAFT and EA... which, again, been done to death.

I'm pretty sure they can just create a new faction if they wanted to. Look at UC and the endless Zeons.

I mean if there isn't stuff, you can just make it up. It's not like everything in CE has been explained anyway.

Maybe have a third faction that wants to destroy both ZAFT and Earth and everybody has to team up to beat the third faction. Idk, but I'm sure people can be imaginative. It is fiction after all.

Besides UC is basically EF vs Zeon or a variant of it, so it's been there from the beginning.

[Washu-Chan]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

The problem is that Destiny already gutted one side of the conflict and Durandal eliminated the other half. You have Lacus in control of ZAFT, and unlike Zala and Durandal she won't go to war immediately, especially with an enforcer like Kira on her side, and the EA's already lost its leadership and LOGOS is out of the picture, leaving it open for better leadership. Not to mention ORB and such.

They'd need to create a new villain, likely on EA's side of things (again), and there's only so many ways you can do the same war before viewers get sick of it.

Or, why not make the conflict a civil war between the TSA, the Patrick Zala loyalists, and those who believed in Durandal's ideals?

At this point, the EA aren't a credible threat.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by zeroexia

I'm pretty sure they can just create a new faction if they wanted to. Look at UC and the endless Zeons.

I mean if there isn't stuff, you can just make it up. It's not like everything in CE has been explained anyway.

Maybe have a third faction that wants to destroy both ZAFT and Earth and everybody has to team up to beat the third faction. Idk, but I'm sure people can be imaginative. It is fiction after all.

Besides UC is basically EF vs Zeon or a variant of it, so it's been there from the beginning.

Which only brings up the previous problem: how many times can you do the same conflict over before it gets stale? ZAFT and the EA's war is primarily based on race: Naturals vs. Coordinators. Zeon and Earth's wars were primarily spacenoids/Newtypes vs. Earthlings/Oldtypes. It was done to death too.

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

Or, why not make the conflict a civil war between the TSA, the Patrick Zala loyalists, and those who believed in Durandal's ideals?

At this point, the EA aren't a credible threat.

Admittedly, this would be an interesting idea. Moreso than the usual war we get in SEED, at least.

[Znozzy]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Which only brings up the previous problem: how many times can you do the same conflict over before it gets stale? ZAFT and the EA's war is primarily based on race: Naturals vs. Coordinators. Zeon and Earth's wars were primarily spacenoids/Newtypes vs. Earthlings/Oldtypes. It was done to death too.



Admittedly, this would be an interesting idea. Moreso than the usual war we get in SEED, at least.

Honestly, the Lacus vs Durandal/Patrick loyalists was already done in SEED and Destiny. I'd like Astray to be animated as a Ova. I honestly can't stand more Kira/Lacus divinity and flawless victories. The less of those two we see, the better.

They could do a movie about Athrun and Shinn being a londo-bell esque force with Kira and Lacus as minor characters, but dear god, we do not need another Destiny ending. Shiho/Yzak/Dearka/Mwu could do some cameo's aswell.

Attack of the Space whales, anyone?

[monster]

Those who support Zala's idea would be more interested in hurting the Naturals than fighting their own kind and those who support Durandal's ideas could still spread their idea without fighting.

At this point, a more likely source of conflict would be Eurasia, especially after both the JOSH-A incident in SEED and the Berlin incident in Destiny.

One possibility is to have western Eurasia fight for independence from the rest of Eurasia. Another possibility is to have a conflict between Eurasia Federation and Atlantic Federation.

And if they want to include Kira, they can have ZAFT interfere in either conflict and send in limited troops, which may include Kira and/or any other known ZAFT soldiers.

Of course, there are also other nations in the EA and who knows what problems they are having.

Either way, it doesn't have to be a conflict of a global scale, as in SEED/Destiny.

[monster]

Does anybody know if they took a scene from a video game right around when the Impulse and the Destroy had their first showdown?

[StratoSpear]

Originally Posted by monster

Does anybody know if they took a scene from a video game right around when the Impulse and the Destroy had their first showdown?

I noticed that too.

But I forgot where it was from. I KNOW it was from somewhere but definitely not in the anime run...

[Aquaman OS]

I believe that was from the 2 minute ish commercial for the Impulse Master Grade.

[monster]

Yes, that may have been it, thanks.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by monster

How about Reginald Barclay and Deanna Troi? And you have Miles and Keiko O'Brien and Worf in DS9, along with Q (both DS9 and VOY) and Tom Riker and Lwaxana Troi. So I think those count as direct sequels as well. TNG simply had multiple sequels following different characters, including the movies.

I already said that I‘m not gonna do this (since this is not a thread for UC Gundams nor Star Trek), but I don’t wanna be accused of ignoring a counter-argument. So, I’ll keep this as brief as I can:

Spoiler for a bit long :

All you said above are in-universe cameos (Even the people who made Voyager consider them as mere cameos) and cameos don’t necessarily means direct sequel. A direct sequel needs more than that. It’s either one of the main characters from previous series must retain his/her status in the new show, or you can throw all the previous MCs away but the story still has to be directly connected/continues/addresses the specific “big problem(s)” faced by the previous MCs. Voyager didn’t do that after TNG, but ZZ did after Zeta.

As for Unicorn, if you read my previous post, I only acknowledged ZZ as a direct sequel to Zeta, while Unicorn, in essence, is a brand new story though still tied to all the problems faced by the MCs in the previous UC outings (especially CCA). Still, I did mention some elements in Unicorn that surpass Voyager in terms of being a direct sequel to the previous series. First, Bright is still a prominent character in it and actually drives the main plot of Unicorn at some points. Second, the main antagonist of Unicorn is basically the same as CCA only in a different body. Last but not least, the major events in CCA (Char dropping Axis & Amuro’s Psychommu system pulling the said Axis and saved the earth) have some direct effects both technically (the further development of Psychommu system applied to Unicorn & Banshee) and psychologically (the characters in Unicorn still refer to what Char & Amuro did in CCA in many occasions).

And please don’t say DS9 being a direct sequel of TNG. Why? Because many people (including Trekkies and those involved in DS9’s production) consider it a spin-off. Hell, even the TV Stations that broadcast it said it’s a Star Trek spin-off and promoting it as such .

Wow, it’s already become a wall of text before I realized it . Mind you that I can elaborate more, but I’ll stop now. So, monster, if you still have some questions regarding this matter, please do it somewhere else (I think there’s a general Gundam thread somewhere in this forum) and I'll answer them, but maybe a bit later on.

[monster]

Well, technically, a sequel is also a spinoff as it is a derivative work based on an existing work, but it doesn't really matter. Your point still stands, and I think it is the general consensus, that a remaster will not necessarily lead to a sequel/spinoff TV series for Destiny.

[Aquaman OS]

I doubt a sequel series was ever in the cards.

The question is if it will lead the finale film or if that will forever remain in limbo.