Aldnoah.Zero - Anime Spoilers & Speculation

[karice67]

Originally Posted by Slaine

Kar, you come off as the type who needs things explicitly stated.

That's a huge misinterpretation of the kind of person I am.

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I'm glad that, at least, you have backed away from the claim that "Asseylum definitely has no idea about the darker side of things" and "she has zero knowledge..." to "she has an incomplete awareness of her empire." In fact, I fully agree with the latter. And I'd say that she's been slowly learning more about what her empire is like, no? Now if she survives, that also means there's room for further development.


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Originally Posted by Slaine

This makes the fact that the emperor responded to Slaine's warning so odd. If she knew there were rebels than he had to know as well. Not giving Slaine any consideration must mean he is extremely sick in the head, racist, gullible or all of the above.

Well, I wrote this to someone in PM, so might as well use that to respond.

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Originally Posted by Slaine

And no, that line you quoted wasn't what I read. I can't find it so forget it.

Ok, I'll assume that it hasn't been said then. But if you ever find it, please share it. I'd like to see if I can verify it.

Originally Posted by Slaine

As for the quality of Aldnoah? It's ok, it is one of the more interesting anime in recent years and being fun is more important than being well crafted at a technical level. That said, very few anime/manga titles leave me thinking they deserve a spot among the best western works.

Western works as in film or TV? Because when I look at current Western TV, the only thing I really enjoy is the odd British series, like Sherlock. Ah, Game of Thrones is fun too. Anime is a subset of Japanese TV, so I seriously do not expect more than about 1 or 2 series a year to be something worth remembering. And I haven't found any this year either. But I honestly think that some of the criticisms I keep reading around here (especially those that keep bashing the creators) aren't as legitimate as some of you seem to think they are.

[DevilHighDxD]

I think we should get the mod to created a debate thread for us, looking back few pages it nothing but us going at each other to stand by our view which isn't the purpose of this thread.

[Lhklan]

And on that note, let's get back to speculation.

Anyway, anybody think that the Earth Federation's top brass are planning something? I mean, we haven't seen actual case where someone in high command got affected, and 15 years of researching the Deucalion and they only show a battleship? I don't buy it.

Especially the latter. Hell, the fact that the battleship got up and running smoothly just by having the Princess activated it is suspicious. I mean, if they don't know how Aldnoah work, how the hell would they even link it to the rest of the systems? I think that they know the battleship actually worked, but Orlaine's death rendered it completely useless, thus why it was left in that cave.

[Arya]

Mmm, glad to see that the forum is lively as always

Just a thought or two about the surviving odds of our darlings (meant both ironically and seriously depends on your side ).
From awhile I was thinking that considering a particular circle the first season had, IF Asseylum is alive so it will be Inaho, or either they will be both dead. The circle I'm talking about is:

Slaine being saved by Asseylum ---> Asseylum being saved by Inaho ---> Inaho being killed by Slaine

So if Asseylum survives it will be thanks to Slaine. So it will ignite the next reversed circle:

Asseylum be saved by Slaine <---Inaho be saved by Asseylum <--- guess what?

That would also fits with my view of the S1 ending intended for Inaho and Asseylum as Justice being done, though heavens fall (they supposedly died). S1 end.

So, since Slaine is supposed to reform Mars I can easily see the ending of S2 as Justice being done by Slaine this time, though heavens fall (he will die). S2 end.

That, if Inaho won't say otherwise (about killing Slaine). (that could be very likely, considering his character, closing the circle in the right way this time, aka saving Slaine instead of killing him).


As for Slaine feelings at the end of S1, I'll stick with my view, that is the one that sees Slaine's path as the "reversed" one of Rayet's.
To make it short:
- A teenager that started as martian terran on Earth that has as stepping-stone the kill attempt of her usurper, ending up siding with the terrains, piloting a mecha.
- A teenager that started as terran martian on Mars that has as stepping-stone the kill attempt of his usurper, ending up siding with the martians, piloting a mecha.

So to understand his feelings it could help looking at Rayet's feelings back then when she strangled Asseylum.

[Ultraviolet X]

Originally Posted by Lhklan

Anyway, anybody think that the Earth Federation's top brass are planning something? I mean, we haven't seen actual case where someone in high command got affected, and 15 years of researching the Deucalion and they only show a battleship? I don't buy it.

Honestly doubt there really "planning something," or at least holding something back that can be used. I mean, the Terrains got cornered to the point that the base in Russia was the final refuge, wouldn't they have used all there options before that point?

Originally Posted by Lhklan

Especially the latter. Hell, the fact that the battleship got up and running smoothly just by having the Princess activated it is suspicious. I mean, if they don't know how Aldnoah work, how the hell would they even link it to the rest of the systems? I think that they know the battleship actually worked, but Orlaine's death rendered it completely useless, thus why it was left in that cave.

yea, I found this one weird as well. I agree, I think they had made some progress into researching Aldnoah tech, but they had to scrap it because they lost the means to activate the thing. Which raises an interesting point. They have a landing castle, Deucalion, and a Kat now, albeit in bad condition, but all with Aldnoah drives, and if they capture Saazbaum, someone who can turn it on. I wonder if they'll make something of it?

[Slaine]

Originally Posted by karice67

I'm glad that, at least, you have backed away from the claim that "Asseylum definitely has no idea about the darker side of things" and "she has zero knowledge..." to "she has an incomplete awareness of her empire." In fact, I fully agree with the latter.

Nothing is a fact, even this statement. So if it makes things better, I'm not actually implying absolutism with those words. I just considered the above interpretation, with all we know, as more likely and most likely, unless shown otherwise, is about as close as we get to truth. PM me if there is anything left to say~

As for tv shows, you should give True Detective a watch. I thought it was pretty amazing.

guess what?

Asseylum kills Asseylum?

[karice67]

Originally Posted by Slaine

Nothing is a fact, even this statement. So if it makes things better, I'm not actually implying absolutism with those words. I just considered the above interpretation, with all we know, as more likely and most likely, unless shown otherwise, is about as close as we get to truth. PM me if there is anything left to say~

Sure, but the evidence available makes that statement of 'she has incomplete information' the best conclusion, to me.

And no, I have nothing else to say. I think I've made my point.

Apologies for the long OTs, everyone - I think I just got tired of seeing the same 'opinions-stated-as-fact' time and time again in the only A/Z thread I'm subscribed to. I'll try to remember to report those OT (or baiting) posts next time.

[Slaine]

There is nothing to apologize for because it wasn't even really OT, especially considering the end result.

Now, another issue:

How does Slaine becoming a knight work with the Emperor thinking he is a traitor. Will he even know?

[Syaokura]

I just want to say, thank you so much for translating that bit, Karice! The Slaine fangirl in me feels vindicated when I saw this part: but if you watch the second cour, you’ll realise that it wasn’t jealousy, but something else. And I rolled my eyes at every dummy who states that he's super jealous like it's a fact. Okay, I can kinda see why they think that, but meh.

Originally Posted by karice67

And I'd say that she's been slowly learning more about what her empire is like, no? Now if she survives, that also means there's room for further development.

I'm honestly torn. On one hand, I wouldn't mind it if Asseylum stays dead because the whole "She's dead, j/k she's alive!" is becoming such a gag that it has overstayed its welcome. On the other hand, if I had to choose between Inaho or Asseylum to live through the second cour, it'd be the latter. I actually like Asseylum and this is coming from someone who doesn't care for the pacifist princess trope; I find them boring as shit. I'd be totally fine if she gets more development and obtain a more active role in the plot.

ETA: Also @ karice67: do you know if you'll be translating the rest of this talk show repo post? If anyone else can, that'd be fantastic as well.

[Slaine]

Between the two, I'd want Asseylum to live. She's developed a bit more and after Inaho enlightened her about war, she might take it upon herself to reflect on why this happened and consider her civilizations current state of affairs more deeply. Which could lead to her actually becoming a capable leader. I wouldn't mind seeing that and might be able to excuse the excessive near death experiences... maybe, I hate when people keep bringing characters back from the brink.

The most important info out of that bit is the comment about Slaine not being Jealous(Which was obviously just shipper rage talking lol) and that the bit from the OP where Asseylum is firing a gun is a metaphor for a decision that will be important in season 2.

There is also the bit about not being able to confirm Cruh's status because bitches be crazy.

And new character Harklight is voiced by http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/ency...le.php?id=2177.

Until somebody does it all, you basically ain't missing much.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Slaine

Asseylum kills Asseylum?

If only.

Originally Posted by Syaokura

I just want to say, thank you so much for translating that bit, Karice! The Slaine fangirl in me feels vindicated when I saw this part: but if you watch the second cour, you’ll realise that it wasn’t jealousy, but something else. And I rolled my eyes at every dummy who states that he's super jealous like it's a fact. Okay, I can kinda see why they think that, but meh.

It was crystal clear it wasn't envy or jealousy. Inaho pulled a gun on him and had his finger in the trigger (he wasn't trying to kill himself, he was trying to kill Slaine, IMO, who was an enemy soldier. Yes, I found his reaction understandable, just like Slaine's in episode 7 but it was his loss this time. It comes to full circle). Was he going to expect to be shot down? I thought it was obvious that the episode built him (in a rather awkward way) to choose Vers by finally pulling the trigger on a Earth soldier in a decisive manner when he couldn't bring himself to do this in the past, including in the same episode when he aims but hesitates to shoot.

I suspected his shots in episode 7 were half-heartened, that's why Inaho wasn't harmed (like with Calm in episode 3) because Slaine still didn't consider him an enemy and he had the absolute advantage there. In episode 12, he considered him his enemy and the episode had him built up "Earth is your enemy".

Originally Posted by Arya

From awhile I was thinking that considering a particular circle the first season had, IF Asseylum is alive so it will be Inaho, or either they will be both dead. The circle I'm talking about is:

Slaine being saved by Asseylum ---> Asseylum being saved by Inaho ---> Inaho being killed by Slaine

So if Asseylum survives it will be thanks to Slaine. So it will ignite the next reversed circle:

Asseylum be saved by Slaine <---Inaho be saved by Asseylum <--- guess what?

None of that happened in that order. IMO, Episode 12 is just a reverse role of episode 7 where Slaine takes Inaho's role as the obstacle when Inaho tries to reach to Asseylum just like Slaine did once and he gets shot down instead of Slaine. They swatted places. The first season doesn't start with Asseylum saving Slaine as basis either to match your idea. If anything, it'll have Inaho (if he's alive) senselessly chasing Asseylum location while she's aiding Slaine and learning the gist of Mars side better (if she's alive and awake) and missing her until the last episode or so. This might all lead to Slaine and Inaho will clarify their misunderstanding too, IMO, because that's how their bad blood began: because they failed to communicate rather than a legitimate reason.

[Arya]

Originally Posted by Thess

None of that happened in that order.

What are you talking about? That's the right chronological order. Why should we consider any other order?

Originally Posted by Thess

IMO, Episode 12 is just a reverse role of episode 7 where Slaine takes Inaho's role as the obstacle when Inaho tries to reach to Asseylum just like Slaine did once and he gets shot down instead of Slaine. They swatted places. The first season doesn't start with Asseylum saving Slaine as basis either to match your idea. If anything, it'll have Inaho (if he's alive) senselessly chasing Asseylum location while she's aiding Slaine and learning the gist of Mars side better (if she's alive and awake) and missing her until the last episode or so. This might all lead to Slaine and Inaho will clarify their misunderstanding too, IMO, because that's how their bad blood began: because they failed to communicate rather than a legitimate reason.

Yep, I can agree with that, it's just that one thread doesn't exclude the other. They are not mutual exclusive.
It doesn't matter when we saw Asseylum saving Slaine, it matters when it happened. In fact if she hadn't saved him he wouldn't have told her about Earth and she wouldn't have decided to go there, letting Saaz attempting to kill her, and so on.
That is the starting point of all.

About the ending I can see that happens, but in a set up in which Inaho ( obviously if he's alive) will be led to kill him for some reason (he will be the one "in the dark" about the princess this time as Slaine was in S1) but will instead stop himself doing that. That's more or less the gist we will have IMO. That's because the circle I'm talking about has to be ended on a good note and not as it ended in the first season. The implied message would be obvious in relation to another possible circle, the one related to war and the clear risk to be perpetuated by terrains in the future. Inaho will "forgive" Slaine as Asseylum forgave Rayet (to go back to my parallelism between Rayet and Slaine). As a meta-key to end the war.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Arya

What are you talking about? That's the right chronological order. Why should we consider any other order?

Because it doesn't happen in the show. Episode 1 didn't start with Asseylum saving Slaine. It just exists so Inaho could have a parallel scene. More properly, IMO, would be saying Inaho will be the new Slaine, while Slaine would be the one watching the princess now.

You're also forgetting that this scene is a shot out to episode 7, so Inaho already nearly had Slaine killed and he already had this position of power.

Originally Posted by Arya

It doesn't matter when we saw Asseylum saving Slaine, it matters when it happened. In fact if she hadn't saved him he wouldn't have told her about Earth and she wouldn't have decided to go there, letting Saaz attempting to kill her, and so on.

If Slaine saves her, it would be by the end of the first half, because he took her with him. So his last action would be saving Asseylum.

Originally Posted by Arya

About the ending I can see that happens, but in a set up in which Inaho ( obviously if he's alive) will be led to kill him for some reason (he will be the one "in the dark" about the princess this time as Slaine was in S1) but will instead stop himself doing that. That's more or less the gist we will have IMO. That's because the circle I'm talking about has to be ended on a good note and not as it ended in the first season. The implied message would be obvious in relation to another possible circle, the one related to war and the clear risk to be perpetuated by terrains in the future. Inaho will "forgive" Slaine as Asseylum forgave Rayet (to go back to my parallelism between Rayet and Slaine). As a meta-key to end the war.

Ehh, IMO Inaho doesn't have to forgive Slaine: Slaine's entitled to self defense and to consider an enemy soldier an enemy soldier in the middle of a war (so is Inaho, by the way). Inaho was an enemy who wanted to kill Slaine in a war: Inaho needs to stop seeing him as an enemy, not to forgive him. In case of Rayet, she harmed someone who wasn't really a soldier, in a calm situation because she was envious. Slaine's not envious, he's not jealous, he had his reasons: Inaho would have done the same in his shoes, only that Inaho, IMO, wouldn't hesitate so much for many episodes to get this done. Trying to compare their circumstances is off because Inaho was Slaine's self declared enemy while Asseylum was trying to be Rayet's friend. IMO, what Inaho and Slaine have to do is communicate and realize they need to stop the war together after the inevitable fighting each other for noble reasons but different methods. Inaho doesn't need to forgive him, because this is irrelevant.

Also Inaho show he's a guy who can hold grudges (episode 3) over Slaine who is the opposite of this. That's why it's good Slaine just shot him rather than doing something like killing Yuki on self defense, because he wouldn't forgive the latter.

[Lhklan]

Originally Posted by Thess

I suspected his shots in episode 7 were half-heartened, that's why Inaho wasn't harmed (like with Calm in episode 3) because Slaine still didn't consider him an enemy and he had the absolute advantage there. In episode 12, he considered him his enemy and the episode had him built up "Earth is your enemy".

I don't think so. Slaine already thought that Inaho was using the Princess, so I can't see him firing half-heartedly in that scenario.

None of that happened in that order. IMO, Episode 12 is just a reverse role of episode 7 where Slaine takes Inaho's role as the obstacle when Inaho tries to reach to Asseylum just like Slaine did once and he gets shot down instead of Slaine. They swatted places. The first season doesn't start with Asseylum saving Slaine as basis either to match your idea. If anything, it'll have Inaho (if he's alive) senselessly chasing Asseylum location while she's aiding Slaine and learning the gist of Mars side better (if she's alive and awake) and missing her until the last episode or so. This might all lead to Slaine and Inaho will clarify their misunderstanding too, IMO, because that's how their bad blood began: because they failed to communicate rather than a legitimate reason.

I don't think so. Inaho's too logical for that. If the princess is in front of him, then he will try to chase her. But if not, he will focus on the war instead.

If anything, I think it would be their goal that got a parallel: SS1 Slaine wanted to protect the princess but couldn't while Inaho did till the end, while SS2 Inaho - if he survives - wants to end the war but couldn't and Slaine would do things that would make that goal possible but the end couldn't do it alone needing help from Earth side.

Ehh, IMO Inaho doesn't have to forgive Slaine: Slaine's entitled to self defense and to consider an enemy soldier an enemy soldier in the middle of a war (so is Inaho, by the way). Inaho was an enemy who wanted to kill Slaine in a war: Inaho needs to stop seeing him as an enemy, not to forgive him. In case of Rayet, she harmed someone who wasn't really a soldier, in a calm situation because she was envious. Slaine's not envious, he's not jealous, he had his reasons: Inaho would have done the same in his shoes, only that Inaho, IMO, wouldn't hesitate so much for many episodes to get this done. Trying to compare their circumstances is off because Inaho was Slaine's self declared enemy while Asseylum was trying to be Rayet's friend. IMO, what Inaho and Slaine have to do is communicate and realize they need to stop the war together after the inevitable fighting each other for noble reasons but different methods. Inaho doesn't need to forgive him, because this is irrelevant.

I'm perfectly fine with the two of them working toward the same goals but not being buddy buddy, but as long as it shows that BOTH of them have flaws, both of their ways have their cons and pros and NOT just one.

Asseylum could probably be the bridge for that. Well, assuming she's alive.

Also Inaho show he's a guy who can hold grudges (episode 3) over Slaine who is the opposite of this. That's why it's good Slaine just shot him rather than doing something like killing Yuki on self defense, because he wouldn't forgive the latter.

Uh, Slaine can hold grudges if he doesn't heard the guy's motivation, he's just a lot more emotional about it. (Ep 4 Trillam)

[Slaine]

I feel like my interpretation of Slaine matches up really well with Thess.

I do think that Slaine's shots in episode seven were warning shots or half-hearted though. I doubt that he could have possibly missed at that sort of range had he meant to kill. That whole scene juxtaposed Slaine's uncertain position versus Inaho's rather certain assessment of whether or not they were enemies. It almost felt like Slaine knew in his heart they couldn't connect but was railing against the fact that he was now isolated IMO.

I do disagree on one more thing. I don't think episode seven was a misunderstanding. I think Inaho felt that Slaine wasn't an ally of the assassins but understood that Slaine would pose a problem to the resistance. Inaho does use the princess(With her consent, mind you) but he does nevertheless make use of her and I think he understood that Slaine would pose a problem. I think he had assessed Slaine as an enemy the moment that became clear to him.

[Ultraviolet X]

Originally Posted by Slaine

I do disagree on one more thing. I don't think episode seven was a misunderstanding. I think Inaho felt that Slaine wasn't an ally of the assassins but understood that Slaine would pose a problem to the resistance. Inaho does use the princess(With her consent, mind you) but he does nevertheless make use of her and I think he understood that Slaine would pose a problem. I think he had assessed Slaine as an enemy the moment that became clear to him.

Even when Seylum first revealed herself to him, Inaho has been interested in getting the Princess to communicate with her grandfather to stop the war. Yes, he's technically "using" her to stop the war even if all he's doing in that regard is supporting her, so how would allying with a Martian shares the goals in both protecting the Princess and wanting peace be a hindrance to that? And there's the point that he tried to communicate with Slaine before he shot him down. Why bother if he simply doesn't want any Martian near her? Why not just shoot him down immediately?

[karice67]

I'm another one who argues it's a misunderstanding.

But that's not what this thread is for discussing.

If you guys still want to discuss this, can you please take it back to the episode 7 thread?

[Slaine]

To ascertain his intentions. Inaho is the type to prioritize survival and logic over emotions. He has no qualms with placing her in danger if he deems it necessary.

This is just my interpretation but Inaho's speech to Rayet doesn't jive too well with how he reacted to Slaine and he seemed to understand that Slaine wasn't really an enemy to Asseylum given his dialogue with her later on. So why would he be Inaho's enemy? Only thing I can think of that makes sense to me is that he realized that Slaine would pose an issue to him doing what was necessary to survive should the situation ever present itself.

Edit: Kar, it ties into the above speculation on what might happen between characters in season two based on events of season one. If you can't discuss different interpretations then lol. if you wanna be so strict about the thread to keep it solely speculation then the posts are going to be pretty bare. Seems like an unnecessary concern. I'm not going to bother jumping between two threads discussing an interrelated topic so I'll just stop posting about it.

[Lhklan]

Originally Posted by Slaine

To ascertain his intentions. Inaho is the type to prioritize survival and logic over emotions. He has no qualms with placing her in danger if he deems it necessary.

I'll argue that whenever it comes to the Princess, Inaho tends to be a little more emotional and impulsive. Case in point: Ep 4, with Vlad - willingly walks out and jump in a Kat AFTER he overheard her planning to to go out herself. Or ep 12, while taking on Saazbaum - who got an impressive Kat - alone while telling Inko to go with Seylum and Yuki. Twice.

This is just my interpretation but Inaho's speech to Rayet doesn't jive too well with how he reacted to Slaine and he seemed to understand that Slaine wasn't really an enemy to Asseylum given his dialogue with her later on. So why would he be Inaho's enemy? Only thing I can think of that makes sense to me is that he realized that Slaine would pose an issue to him doing what was necessary to survive should the situation ever present itself.

Well, Slaine not answering and shooting Inaho for one?

Or Rayet actually got the chance to explain her actions while Slaine didn't?

Take a pick.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Lhklan

I don't think so. Slaine already thought that Inaho was using the Princess, so I can't see him firing half-heartedly in that scenario.

Slaine wasn't sure Inaho wasn't his enemy, that's why he asked after he opened fire, he wouldn't have asked this if he wanted him dead . It was Inaho who was sure of it. Slaine didn't have what it took to shoot down and kill Terrans until the last scene of episode 12, thanks to that shoehorned scene with the Martian guy.

Originally Posted by Lhklan

I don't think so. Inaho's too logical for that. If the princess is in front of him, then he will try to chase her. But if not, he will focus on the war instead.

He's in love. Love isn't logical.

Originally Posted by Lhklan

If anything, I think it would be their goal that got a parallel: SS1 Slaine wanted to protect the princess but couldn't while Inaho did till the end, while SS2 Inaho - if he survives - wants to end the war but couldn't and Slaine would do things that would make that goal possible but the end couldn't do it alone needing help from Earth side.

Inaho's entire character development is to grow attached to Asseylum, who he had said he was using her as pawn to end the conflict (something he made clear to Asseylum and himself) only to realize she did matter when he thought she died. Inaho denying her importance until the last episode it's meaningful, so I think he'll have other priorities if he survives.

Originally Posted by Lhklan

Asseylum could probably be the bridge for that. Well, assuming she's alive.

This is exactly why I would prefer if she died. It's just lazy writing.

Originally Posted by Lhklan

Uh, Slaine can hold grudges if he doesn't heard the guy's motivation, he's just a lot more emotional about it. (Ep 4 Trillam)

He shot Trillam in the heat of the moment and looked aghast afterwards and during it. Inaho meticulously planned to take revenge on Trillam. It wasn't a "heat of the moment" thing. Slaine after he calms down (he tends to do things by impulse) doesn't take revenge on anything. He didn't hate Terrans for killing Asseylium in episode 2 nor he tried to end Saazbaum in episode 12 when he had his moment of blind rage passing. Slaine's flaw is more of his inability to restrain his emotions when he's provoked: he's impulsive. Inaho represses them, but that makes them bottle up and fester which also has negative consequences.

Originally Posted by karice67

I'm another one who argues it's a misunderstanding.

But that's not what this thread is for discussing.

If you guys still want to discuss this, can you please take it back to the episode 7 thread?

The misunderstanding is still running and it's unresolved. We can speculate when and how it's resolved, right?