(L) Dungeon ni Deai o Motomeru no wa Machigatte Iru Darou ka (LN)

[XFire]

Originally Posted by DragonKing0117

I know that. If GAR was about just ability, then we'd have GARku alon with a bunch of other Super GARyans. So which scene was this from, Volume 6?

Volume 2. You can find the RAW chapter up at the usual places.

Originally Posted by Tyrhunger

Whats GAR?

Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary

A term used towards male characters and individuals who are so overwhelmingly manly that your own masculinity is absolutely *buried*, leaving you naught but a whimpering, swooning girl-child before them.

[Lhklan]

Err, by that definition, Bell isn't that Gar since he's rather unimpressive at times.

Archer OTOH, this guy have the balls to insult Gilgamesh while being weakened from not having enough prana.

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Lhklan

Err, by that definition, Bell isn't that Gar since he's rather unimpressive at times.

Archer OTOH, this guy have the balls to insult Gilgamesh while being weakened from not having enough prana.

Go read the scene I described again.

[Lhklan]

Originally Posted by XFire

Go read the scene I described again.

Go read my post again. I said "at times" and "Not that Gar", meaning that he's still Gar other times.

Sides, I'm more impressed with the fight with the Minotaur.

[bearzerger]

Bell may have his moments of badassery but he really isn't truly GAR. He inspires the shoutacon instincts in every woman he meets. Shoutacon bait and GAR are mutually exclusive.

[Reaper Phoenix]

Originally Posted by GodTurtleOm

Honestly, at this point I wonder if the bonuses from leveling up are more complex than a simple +500. The whole thing about any new Level 2 having better stats than the the strongest Level 1 (excluding Bell) could be explained with that if it wasn't for the Magic stat. The Magic stat does not need to be in the 500+ range to level up, unlike the rest of the basic stats. Welf's Magic was 70(I) before they made the Vol 5 dungeon trip, and Tiona doesn't have Magic at all even at Level 5. In the case of an across the board +500 on level up, without any actual Magic usage, a Level 4's completely undeveloped newly gained Magic could be about the same as a strong Magic based Level 2 adventurer. I'm not sure whether I like that idea or not, but it definitely contrasts with the earlier statement. Bell himself noted that his Magic was more powerful after reaching Level 2, so it was definitely affected, I just don't know to what degree.

Another thing, can we be sure that 1 point in a stat for a Level 5 Adventurer means the same thing as 1 point for a Level 1 Adventurer? The way that the difference in power and ability is sometimes presented between the different levels of Adventurers makes me wonder if get greater benefit from each Stat point gained while at a higher level.

One last thing, wasn't Hermes and Hestia discussion about Bell's stats on pages 328 and 329 of Volume 6 about how high they got after the fight with the Minotaur, but before the display reset at Level 2? I can't read it myself, but I got the impression that all of Bell's Lvl 1 stats were in the SS range, with the exception of Agility, which was even higher. So his actual stats were even higher than the numbers we got in Volume 3.

Could the bonuses from leveling up be percentage of the stats? For example something like +50%

[Tyrhunger]

A % bonus would fit better.

[Hiyono]

Originally Posted by Tyrhunger

Whats GAR?

Be glad you don't know. Knowing things like that is pretty much the opposite of a badge of honor.

[Kunagisa]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

sure they can, Just ask Zeus

I know you are kidding , but just in case people want to know the citation, it's pg. 304 of Oratoria 03. All deities get neutered in this story!

Originally Posted by GodTurtleOm

In the case of an across the board +500 on level up, without any actual Magic usage, a Level 4's completely undeveloped newly gained Magic could be about the same as a strong Magic based Level 2 adventurer. I'm not sure whether I like that idea or not, but it definitely contrasts with the earlier statement. Bell himself noted that his Magic was more powerful after reaching Level 2, so it was definitely affected, I just don't know to what degree.

I think magic being 0 is balanced. Magic is supposed to be rare and powerful.

If a Level 6 discovered magic for the first time, it should be weaker than others who have been training for it for a long time. Looking at total exp at Level 5: Tiona = 3335, Ais 3668. Tiona's overall non-magic stat is far superior to Ais. If a Level 5 learning magic for the first time is the same as a another Level 5 magic user who has discovered magic since low level (namely elves), then I think everyone would fork over ridiculous amount of money to just grab grimoires, which is totally within Loki's Familia's price range as shown in Oratoria 02.

Also, the +500 would be invisible and added to the total pool without ever showing on your back, so technically you still leveled with 0 on magic throughout.

Originally Posted by GodTurtleOm

Another thing, can we be sure that 1 point in a stat for a Level 5 Adventurer means the same thing as 1 point for a Level 1 Adventurer? The way that the difference in power and ability is sometimes presented between the different levels of Adventurers makes me wonder if get greater benefit from each Stat point gained while at a higher level.

So far there's been only 2 exp distinction, personally I don't think there's a reason to think you get "better" exp at higher level. Despite that they're harder to come by, just having that higher power means you have access to rarer items is already enough incentive for people to keep leveling. Keep in mind we're focused on extremely small group in this world, most adventurers can make a living just being Level 1 and killing kobolds.

Originally Posted by GodTurtleOm

One last thing, wasn't Hermes and Hestia discussion about Bell's stats on pages 328 and 329 of Volume 6 about how high they got after the fight with the Minotaur, but before the display reset at Level 2? I can't read it myself, but I got the impression that all of Bell's Lvl 1 stats were in the SS range, with the exception of Agility, which was even higher. So his actual stats were even higher than the numbers we got in Volume 3.

Uguu ... you are right. I admit I missed this and you're totally correct, which means volume 6's stat is probably not his end either ... sigh. I can always settle for (cop out) Hyacinthus being a pompous idiot leveled asap so he only hit 700~800s instead of 900 before leveling .

Originally Posted by Reaper Phoenix

Could the bonuses from leveling up be percentage of the stats? For example something like +50%

Originally Posted by Tyrhunger

A % bonus would fit better.

% bonus would make him even more overpowered, which yeah would make sense but also mean that the leveling gap isn't that big anymore. Imagine a newly ranked up Level 2 leveling with average 500s versus a Level 1 averaging 750 having similar performance.

This theory's good too (would explain high level people not giving a crap about magic if they don't have it already), just that Oratoria 03 make leveling such a ridiculous huge deal that I feel a flat bonus across the board would make it more beneficial for people to just level asap rather than grinding to A's. Cause mfw killing monsters that can wipe out the whole legion by yourself only gives you +1 point.

Maybe we can settle for a middle ground so it's both a flat bonus and a percentage , I can't help but think Omori's being intentionally vague about the whole thing.

---

Also, I don't know if anyone read this
http://animeslovenija.tumblr.com/pos...jpegs-together
Would post in anime thread but has spoilers so linking here. This is someone piecing together that free guidebook thing handed out for free during the last comiket, and includes the first interview for the animated series.

• Apparently Omori was most worried about how Status would be shown with visual media. We "kinda" saw it in the manga, but he seems to be satisfied with how the director (Yamagawa) handled it.
• Omori is most looking forward to the Mino fight, to which Yamagawa said he has a JC veteran animator working on it.
• Character design wise, Ais is the hardest to draw and has the most number of retakes.
• Yamagawa thinks that character growth sets this novel apart from the other ones and he would like to focus on that.

I heard DAL II was a disaster with this series composer, maybe it'll work out fine here? But I think a lot of people lost faith in the anime already though Yasuda face's fine and all, but sometimes I like animators put their own style in character design (even if Ais end up looking kinda funky but at least now I know why ww).

[GodTurtleOm]

Originally Posted by Kunagisa

I think magic being 0 is balanced. Magic is supposed to be rare and powerful.

If a Level 6 discovered magic for the first time, it should be weaker than others who have been training for it for a long time. Looking at total exp at Level 5: Tiona = 3335, Ais 3668. Tiona's overall non-magic stat is far superior to Ais. If a Level 5 learning magic for the first time is the same as a another Level 5 magic user who has discovered magic since low level (namely elves), then I think everyone would fork over ridiculous amount of money to just grab grimoires, which is totally within Loki's Familia's price range as shown in Oratoria 02.

I definitely agree that a Level 5 Adventurer (A) that has only recently developed Magic should be weaker than another Level 5 Adventurer (B) that developed Magic at an earlier Level. The only thing I'm unsure about is whether A should be stronger or weaker in Magic than a higher-tier Level 2 Adventurer (C) that had Magic since the beginning.

Originally Posted by Kunagisa

Also, the +500 would be invisible and added to the total pool without ever showing on your back, so technically you still leveled with 0 on magic throughout.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by Kunagisa

So far there's been only 2 exp distinction, personally I don't think there's a reason to think you get "better" exp at higher level. Despite that they're harder to come by, just having that higher power means you have access to rarer items is already enough incentive for people to keep leveling. Keep in mind we're focused on extremely small group in this world, most adventurers can make a living just being Level 1 and killing kobolds.

I know that 50%+ are Level 1s, I hope we get a bit more of a breakdown for the rest at some point, beyond there being only 1 known Level 7.

Originally Posted by Kunagisa

Uguu ... you are right. I admit I missed this and you're totally correct, which means volume 6's stat is probably not his end either ... sigh. I can always settle for (cop out) Hyacinthus being a pompous idiot leveled asap so he only hit 700~800s instead of 900 before leveling .

I can't take credit for it, it was a jcafe user that pointed it out first and made me look through the raw to find the scene. Which I can't actually read.

Originally Posted by Kunagisa

% bonus would make him even more overpowered, which yeah would make sense but also mean that the leveling gap isn't that big anymore. Imagine a newly ranked up Level 2 leveling with average 500s versus a Level 1 averaging 750 having similar performance.

This theory's good too (would explain high level people not giving a crap about magic if they don't have it already), just that Oratoria 03 make leveling such a ridiculous huge deal that I feel a flat bonus across the board would make it more beneficial for people to just level asap rather than grinding to A's. Cause mfw killing monsters that can wipe out the whole legion by yourself only gives you +1 point.

Yeah, it would have to be a 100% bonus to the displayed values to reconcile that "No Level 1 having better Status than a fresh Level 2." And in that case it seems difficult for Bell to have reached Hyacinthus's speed, but still very much possible.
Bell's Agility (Lv 2)=1300(guess)*2+1300=3900
H's Agility (Lv 3)= 2500-5000 I'll guess 3800 (800*2+800*2+600)
The main problem with this simplistic approach is that even without including Bell, there would be massive variation in abilities between higher Level Adventurers down the line. A Fresh Lvl 4 Adventurer who had only leveled upon reaching 900s (900*6=5400) would be far more powerful than a Lvl 5 who was somehow able to level immediately upon reaching the 500s (500*8=4000). This doesn't mesh well with how insurmountable differences in Level are usually represented in Danmachi. If this is somehow how it works, Bell as a Level 3 would be more powerful than most Level 4s.

Originally Posted by Kunagisa

Maybe we can settle for a middle ground so it's both a flat bonus and a percentage , I can't help but think Omori's being intentionally vague about the whole thing.

That's the most likely answer, once he sets something down, he's stuck with it unless he wants to retcon, and retcons are for amateurs. Bell will always be as powerful as the author needs him to be, and that's easier to do if the math behind his abilities is kept vague.

[neowind]

volume 6 sounds really interesting XD

I wish someone had drawings from the novel Xp

[Miraluka]

Originally Posted by Kunagisa

I heard DAL II was a disaster with this series composer, maybe it'll work out fine here? But I think a lot of people lost faith in the anime already though Yasuda face's fine and all, but sometimes I like animators put their own style in character design (even if Ais end up looking kinda funky but at least now I know why ww).

That depends, the TV version's issue fans had was the animation, not the adaptation because we knew there were scenes cut on purpose as to fit the TV slot time, thus the BD had those cuts added and the pacing was much, much better and. The animation issue fixed.

[SoloPanda]

What is this and has it already been uploaded here?

Originally Posted by neowind

volume 6 sounds really interesting XD

I wish someone had drawings from the novel Xp

there should be a few around on google and such somewhere. Hmm wait volume 6 images are on this thread, not sure how many pages back though. That's a nice Stephanie Brown batgirl btw

[Hiyono]

Ad for v7, dated for April of this year.

[neowind]

Originally Posted by SoloPanda

What is this and has it already been uploaded here?







there should be a few around on google and such somewhere. Hmm wait volume 6 images are on this thread, not sure how many pages back though. That's a nice Stephanie Brown batgirl btw

hahaha, thanks XD, I will slowing start to go back and see what I can find. Now that it's coming out in full on licensed English.I'll start looking into that.. hmm or i should read the Japanese ones..So i can some how spark an interest back into studying,,,

Thanks ! Beside Cass she is one of my all time favorite Batgirls. XD Stephanie Brown..! it's a clip from the final batgirl issue before the New 52 relaunch
thank you.

Originally Posted by Nandesuto

Ad for v7, dated for April of this year.

ohh...it seem Volume 7.. something big is going to happen =O

[bakato]

Originally Posted by neowind

hahaha, thanks XD, I will slowing start to go back and see what I can find. Now that it's coming out in full on licensed English.I'll start looking into that.. hmm or i should read the japanese ones..So i can some how spark an interest back into studying,,,

Thanks ! Beside Cass she is one of my all time favorite Batgirls. XD Stephanie Brown..! it's a clip from the final batgirl issue before the New 52 relaunch
thank you.



ohh...it seem Volume 7.. something big is going to happen =O

Maybe Freya will finally make a move on Bell.

[Miraluka]

Shit will hit Hestia.

I just noticed there was a raw for chapter 25, those guys from Lili's familia are already planning on set her up in the dungeon.

[The One Above God]

Just read the raw of chap 28...Bell really looked badass during that scene with Lili

[ndiezel]

I thought of one theory. What if level up give extra points only for people that don't overpowered themself? For example it give adventurers necessary points, so their stats become 1000? Great difference between levels may be because of 999 for each stat as a wall that can't be overcome (1000 - 999 = 1, but still there was no example of guy with 999). I based it on the fact that Bell didn't sensed new powers after level up and it was stated, that he updated his status after defeating minotaur and before ritual. What do you think?

[GodTurtleOm]

No, that would just make it harder for Bell to reach Hyacinthus's speed (a Level 3) in Volume 6, judging from Kunagisa's post, Bell is actually a little bit faster than him. Plus, in Volume 4, Bell said he did feel more powerful after achieving Level 2 when he was actually in combat. He just didn't notice anything immediately after the Level Up, since he was just walking around the city as normal.