Mahouka LN - Yotsuba Inheritance Arc (Volume 16) Discussion / Poll

[Echizen777]

Originally Posted by Iramohs

That's his innate magic and it was also a surprise attack. Once Tatsuya was aware he was fighting he handled him easily.

Tatsuya can sense magic activations so even though it was a surprise attack he should have been able to dispel it if he had been fast enough, he definitely ssensed it, it was even mentioned that he had been unable to keep up earlier.

[Iramohs]

Let's me confirm sth from the talk between Tat and Misugu'

Do the memory of Tat before 6 y.o. (before the AMCA experiment) still reside within him or being wiped? thx

He has the memories but the emotions have been separated from them, just like Maya's memories before Dahan.

[caminhas]

Originally Posted by Iramohs

He has the memories but the emotions have been separated from them, just like Maya's memories before Dahan.

i think it has been mentioned that he lost his memories from before 6 years old, no?

[Kadia]

^ No as Iramohs said he remember with the effect of memory rearrangement.

Spoiler for Tat's memory:

However, the combat training was still continued. It was quite excessive for your growing
period, until it was determined that your training prevented the growth of your body”
“I also remembered the rest from that period”
Actually, he also had the memory in store before the artificial maigican experiment, but
Tatsuya was unable to realized himself. The memory before that experiment seemed like
watching movie-like experiences

After reading the v16, i got the feeling that TatxMiyuki will eventually bring Yotsuba to the bright side and change the direction of the clan with that ESCAPE project of his.
Yotsuba has been being condemned publicly due to its shrouded existence and its nature of the clan for black opt and assassination. Nonetheless can we really blame them from their atrocity when the government was the one who gave an order? (i do believe that their mentioned sponsor is a high ranking officer in the cabinet) There is always someone taking that kind of jobs for the sake of country, it just happen to be Yotsuba. Other clans just reap the benefit from it by presenting itself cleanly in the public eyes whereas in actuality they also do the underhanded jobs as well.

I think i can understand Maya's feelings and feel sympathy toward her. After experiencing such tragedy losing also her families in the process, what she wished were trying to assure the safety of the clans and prevent the history repeating itself. I think it's natural that she kept harboring such twisted logic about the revenge to the world. In a sense i believe she wish that Tat can achieve her goal by prevention instead of destroying.

With that said, i do not get it why some of u guys dislike Yotsuba(put aside pathetic branch head for the moment) and wishes it to be destroyed and painted Maya as antagonist. In my eyes, Maya is a heroine. She hasn't done anything to harm Tatsuya so far from the story point of view. Inhumane treatments toward Tat? I don't think if Tat had been raised normally with his emotional intact, he would have survive in the future. He also might end up just a test subject somewhere. There is a need why Tat was forged that way, it actually benefited him and made him who he is today.

Let's me ask again why u dislike Maya?

[millie10468]

Originally Posted by Kadia

Let's me ask again why u dislike Maya?

This is my speculation of course: Before v14 to 16, the people who disliked her probably did because she seemed like she was setting up to be the antagonist to Tatsuya. Probably stemming from v8 when she tried to get him to quit school and be confined at home It wasn't till the scene in v14 or 15 when she talks to Saeki about Tatsuya like he was a family member that people realized there was more to her feelings about Tatsuya.

Currently, though, some people might dislike Maya because of all she's done tying Tatsuya to Miyuki even more and officially. Quite simply, it's a shipping thing. I'm not even talking primarily about the people here who possibly dislike Maya but from my browsing a lot of different forums, I get the idea that if Maya had arranged a marriage between Tatsuya and other girls other than Miyuki, the members of that ship would be praising Maya while the other ships would be cursing her. Of course, they wouldn't say they disliked her because she didn't enable their ships; they'd say something along the lines of "She's not giving Tatsuya a choice . She's taken away his free will in order to bind him to Miyuki and the clan", conveniently forgetting that (as someone else in this thread has already said) there's nothing stopping Tatsuya from grabbing his sister and getting the hell out of dodge if he wanted to. If he believed being tied to the Yotsuba via marriage with Miyuki was the worst thing for Miyuki and him, he'd never go along with Maya.

[Kadia]

^just curious who do u ship then. From your "my ship will never sink", i guess u do not ship Miyuki?

Yeah.. i got the gist about shipping war. But that quote "She's not giving Tatsuya a choice . She's taken away his free will in order to bind him to Miyuki and the clan", irritated me the most. Even if Maya had let him live his life freely, he would have been exploited by others (i.e. military) and as i said his shackles both spartan training and inhumane AMCA exp are a must have for Tat to survive without risking his emotional run wild.

For binding Tat to the clan by arranging marriage with Miyuki, IMO it's a win-win situation. Tat gains access to Yotsuba's assets and power to achieve his dream whereas Yotsuba receives his protection as a leverage. Also, Maya wasn't the one to implant that "one remaining emotion" but Miya and Miya did it with Tat's best interest(otherwise as Maya said Miya had a choice to remove all emotions but she chose not to). Hence, i really can't see these tragic sisters in the bad way. I do really wish Maya will survive till the end of the series.

I'm sorry for discuss about this topic late as i just had a time to finish reading v16. This may irritate some one

[millie10468]

Originally Posted by Kadia

^just curious who do u ship then. From your "my ship will never sink", i guess u do not ship Miyuki?

Shh, confirming your ship out loud sometimes prevents your opinions from being taken as objective. I'll pm you just to be on the safe side

[Kadia]

555 please do, my ship never had a chance to sail from the beginning coz i like Shizuku.

[Aciald]

Here's the thing. You guys are so caught up in shipping Tatsuya and Miyuki that you are trying to make the story fit your little shipping fantasy. Tatsuya can annihilate the entire clan Maya included and Miyuki will still stay with Tatsuya. In fact Miyuki even says so. Miyuki pointedly reminds Tatsuya of their conversation in the first 9sc about taking down Maya and the Yotsuba and reaffirms that she will back Tatsuya whatever he does.

Never once does Tatsuya say he has in anyway changed his mind about the Yotsuba or Maya. The only thing Tatsuya affirms is that he will stay with Miyuki. Maya wants Tatsuya to be part of the Yotsuba. We don't yet know what Tatsuya wants to do. He may go along with the situation or he may tell the Yotsuba to go to hell. All we know for sure is he will stay with Miyuki either way.

[millie10468]

Originally Posted by Aciald

Here's the thing. You guys are so caught up in shipping Tatsuya and Miyuki that you are trying to make the story fit your little shipping fantasy. Tatsuya can annihilate the entire clan Maya included and Miyuki will still stay with Tatsuya. In fact Miyuki even says so. Miyuki pointedly reminds Tatsuya of their conversation in the first 9sc about taking down Maya and the Yotsuba and reaffirms that she will back Tatsuya whatever he does.

Never once does Tatsuya say he has in anyway changed his mind about the Yotsuba or Maya. The only thing Tatsuya affirms is that he will stay with Miyuki. Maya wants Tatsuya to be part of the Yotsuba. We don't yet know what Tatsuya wants to do. He may go along with the situation or he may tell the Yotsuba to go to hell. All we know for sure is he will stay with Miyuki either way.

I'm assuming I'm included in the "You guys are so caught up in shipping Tatsuya and Miyuki that you are trying to make the story fit your little shipping fantasy" so, first of all, I ask you: please identify where in my post I wrote that I'm a Tatsuya and Miyuki shipper?

Also, maybe you didn't actually read what was written because I'm pretty sure neither Kadia nor I ever said Tatsuya has changed his mind about the Yotsuba or Maya. Kadia asked why some people disliked Maya and I speculated that it had to do with shipping. Truly, regardless of shipping, it's been confirmed (as in there are quotes to back it up) that Tatsuya sees the benefits in staying as Maya's son and is therefore going along with her plans. In other words, we do know what Tatsuya wants to do. At least for now. He had the chance to tell Maya to go to hell. He didn't. At least for now. Don't make it sound like he didn't already make a decision in v16. Sure, he can change his mind later on and go against the Yotsuba but for now, yes he's sticking with the Yotsuba.

I don't think it can be helped that the facts make it seem like Tatsuya and Miyuki shippers are making the story fit their shipping. Of course, the only way it would come across that way is if you were looking at those facts through shipping glasses. Objectively, Tatsuya has no reason to not play along with Maya, seeing how it benefits both him and Miyuki.

[Kadia]

Nope.. i have never prejudice about Tat shipping, i just pointed out and asked kindly that why some of u guys hate Yotsuba and Maya very much.
In fact, i'm fine with matching Tat with any girl so long as not matching Miyuki with that Rupture guy.

[Aciald]

Originally Posted by Kadia

Nope.. i have never prejudice about Tat shipping, i just pointed out and asked kindly that why some of u guys hate Yotsuba and Maya very much.
In fact, i'm fine with matching Tat with any girl so long as not matching Miyuki with that Rupture guy.

Sure, aside from the blackmail, torture, murder and other fun family activities whats not to like.

[Kadia]

Sarcasm much didn't u? i never said those illegitimate acts were acceptable. Please reread my previous post before answering will u?

Kadia
Member

Join Date: Oct 2014

^ No as Iramohs said he remember with the effect of memory rearrangement.

Spoiler for Tat's memory:



After reading the v16, i got the feeling that TatxMiyuki will eventually bring Yotsuba to the bright side and change the direction of the clan with that ESCAPE project of his.
Yotsuba has been being condemned publicly due to its shrouded existence and its nature of the clan for black opt and assassination. Nonetheless can we really blame them from their atrocity when the government was the one who gave an order? (i do believe that their mentioned sponsor is a high ranking officer in the cabinet) There is always someone taking that kind of jobs for the sake of country, it just happen to be Yotsuba. Other clans just reap the benefit from it by presenting itself cleanly in the public eyes whereas in actuality they also do the underhanded jobs as well.

I think i can understand Maya's feelings and feel sympathy toward her. After experiencing such tragedy losing also her families in the process, what she wished were trying to assure the safety of the clans and prevent the history repeating itself. I think it's natural that she kept harboring such twisted logic about the revenge to the world. In a sense i believe she wish that Tat can achieve her goal by prevention instead of destroying.

With that said, i do not get it why some of u guys dislike Yotsuba(put aside pathetic branch head for the moment) and wishes it to be destroyed and painted Maya as antagonist. In my eyes, Maya is a heroine. She hasn't done anything to harm Tatsuya so far from the story point of view. Inhumane treatments toward Tat? I don't think if Tat had been raised normally with his emotional intact, he would have survive in the future. He also might end up just a test subject somewhere. There is a need why Tat was forged that way, it actually benefited him and made him who he is today.

Let's me ask again why u dislike Maya?

[Aciald]

Originally Posted by Kadia

Sarcasm much didn't u? i never said those illegitimate acts were acceptable. Please reread my previous post before answering will u?

You are kidding right? They tortured and abused Tatsuya from the day he could walk. Unless you think forcing a toddler to fight and kill animals is noble and uplifting? Also how is the whole murder, torture, blackmail bit not relevant to how we view the Yotsuba and Maya.

[Kadia]

Pls reread another of my previous post

Kadia
Member

Join Date: Oct 2014

^just curious who do u ship then. From your "my ship will never sink", i guess u do not ship Miyuki?

Yeah.. i got the gist about shipping war. But that quote "She's not giving Tatsuya a choice . She's taken away his free will in order to bind him to Miyuki and the clan", irritated me the most. Even if Maya had let him live his life freely, he would have been exploited by others (i.e. military) and as i said his shackles both spartan training and inhumane AMCA exp are a must have for Tat to survive without risking his emotional run wild.

For binding Tat to the clan by arranging marriage with Miyuki, IMO it's a win-win situation. Tat gains access to Yotsuba's assets and power to achieve his dream whereas Yotsuba receives his protection as a leverage. Also, Maya wasn't the one to implant that "one remaining emotion" but Miya and Miya did it with Tat's best interest(otherwise as Maya said Miya had a choice to remove all emotions but she chose not to). Hence, i really can't see these tragic sisters in the bad way. I do really wish Maya will survive till the end of the series.

I'm sorry for discuss about this topic late as i just had a time to finish reading v16. This may irritate some one

And about the irrelevance of atrocity acts, i already stated my opinion as "There is always someone taking that kind of jobs for the sake of country, it just happen to be Yotsuba. Other clans just reap the benefit from it by presenting itself cleanly in the public eyes whereas in actuality they also do the underhanded jobs as well" in my previous post.

and yes i'm not kidding Maya is likable comparing to hypocrite Retsu and black stabber Koichi, IMO that is

[Aciald]

Originally Posted by Kadia

Pls reread another of my previous post



And about the irrelevance of atrocity acts, i already stated my opinion as "There is always someone taking that kind of jobs for the sake of country, it just happen to be Yotsuba. Other clans just reap the benefit from it by presenting itself cleanly in the public eyes whereas in actuality they also do the underhanded jobs as well" in my previous post

You are the one who asked why people could dislike Maya and the Yotsuba. You may excuse every evil thing they do but that doesn't mean others have to. We will have to agree to disagree as I don't find murder, child abuse etc to be 'irrelevant'.

[Kadia]

Fair enough and i never asked others to align themselves with my opinion and from the beginning i have never offended u in anyway.

But u were the one who derailed the topic and being sarcastic? thx

[Aciald]

Originally Posted by Kadia

Fair enough and i never asked others to align themselves with my opinion and from the beginning i have never offended u in anyway.

But u were the one who derailed the topic and being sarcastic? thx

Ummm... you asked how people could not like Maya or the Yotsuba and I gave you reasons how is that derailing anything? Millie proposed that people don't like the Yotsuba or Maya because of shipping and I thought that was wrong. There are tons of reasons to think that Maya and the Yotsuba should be wiped out. Thats why i pointed out it's perfectly in keeping with the story for Tatsuya to wipe out the clan and still remain with Miyuki.

Sorry if sarcasm offends you but all i did is answer the question you asked.

[Kadia]

I was so put off when u said "You guys are so caught up in shipping Tatsuya and Miyuki that you are trying to make the story fit your little shipping fantasy" and in your first post u havn't stated the reasons y u don't like Maya and Yotsuba. U merely stated Tat's and Miyuki's stance toward Maya and Yotsuba which i think the same.

Nevermind mate, i got your point let's pacify coz i'm so hyped about vol 17 now. Thx for your arguments though

Here's the thing. You guys are so caught up in shipping Tatsuya and Miyuki that you are trying to make the story fit your little shipping fantasy. Tatsuya can annihilate the entire clan Maya included and Miyuki will still stay with Tatsuya. In fact Miyuki even says so. Miyuki pointedly reminds Tatsuya of their conversation in the first 9sc about taking down Maya and the Yotsuba and reaffirms that she will back Tatsuya whatever he does.

Never once does Tatsuya say he has in anyway changed his mind about the Yotsuba or Maya. The only thing Tatsuya affirms is that he will stay with Miyuki. Maya wants Tatsuya to be part of the Yotsuba. We don't yet know what Tatsuya wants to do. He may go along with the situation or he may tell the Yotsuba to go to hell. All we know for sure is he will stay with Miyuki either way.

[AksaraKishou]

Originally Posted by Kadia

Nope.. i have never prejudice about Tat shipping, i just pointed out and asked kindly that why some of u guys hate Yotsuba and Maya very much.
In fact, i'm fine with matching Tat with any girl so long as not matching Miyuki with that Rupture guy.

Another person who doesn't like that shipping!!! I should make a fb group just for us xd