Madan no Ou to Vanadis [Light Novel]

[akim36]

chapter 13 is updated

[setsuna86]

Originally Posted by akim36

chapter 13 is updated

Chapter 1, you mean. Well, I'm the one who first made an error though.

[DragonOsman]

Yeah. I also mentioned in my previous post. It's the one right before Akim's.

I really don't like how Valentina lied about whether or not she knew from the beginning that Ganelon was a Demon. I mean, yeah, I do understand that she needs to keep it in line with the story she told at the aforementioned Vanadis meeting where she said she doesn't know anything about Demons, but even that itself was a really big lie already and I don't like it.

And I asked in my previous post about this:

Originally Posted by Volume 13, Chapter 1

Though the five people who were here had abundant experience, even so there was not even one among them that thought that Greast captured Elen for his own desire.

I'd gotten confused about who was the only one who considered the possibility - whether it was Augre or Mashas. I looked at it again and got my answer. It was Augre.

[sparhawk1610]

Thanks Setsuna, you are the best!

[setsuna86]

Originally Posted by DragonOsman

Yeah. I also mentioned in my previous post. It's the one right before Akim's.

I really don't like how Valentina lied about whether or not she knew from the beginning that Ganelon was a Demon. I mean, yeah, I do understand that she needs to keep it in line with the story she told at the aforementioned Vanadis meeting where she said she doesn't know anything about Demons, but even that itself was a really big lie already and I don't like it.

You're right. Amd there's alsa a discrepancy in what she said. At the Vanadis meeting, she said that she doesn't know anything about Demons, but at this meeting, she clearly said that "Dragonic Tools can sense Demons".
If she had never heard about Demons and their existences, how can she explain what she said there? The fact that she knows about Dragonic Tools sensing Demons already means that she knew the existences of Demons, right?

[DragonOsman]

Yes, now that you mention it, there's also that discrepancy in what she said. The other Vanadis who were there at the meeting should also get suspicious with just this unless the author decides to give them PIS (plot-induced stupidity) for some reason.

[Chingaruna517]

If my indication are correct, I believe it have to do with how was Osterode became a flourish as a city before the series beginning. According to what I read so far, Tina had to go Brune in order to seek Ganelon and collaborating with him, all in a purpose to improve Osterode's condition, despite her Viralt sensed something monstrous about Ganelon. Maybe that is why Tina offered Ganelon a shelter simply because he helped Osterode's economic growth? Seems like Liza is not the only War-Maiden that made a deal with a demon.

What truly pisses me off is when Tina decides to leave Brune while refuse to help saving her fellow War-Maiden, even when Lim and even the three old men beg her to at least stay in Brune to save Elen. Some comrade she is...

[Marx-93]

Osterode has the advantage of being a river city though, which is a huge boon to any city in an ancient or medieval period. The Russians (which are mostly Slavs), for example, decided to put their capital at St. Petersburg instead of Moscow for a time simply because the former was a port, despite that it was several hundreds of km to the north. I don't think a literal pact with a demon would be needed, it should be enough with an old-fashioned trade treaty an care to make it prosper (and considering how the coastal cities to the south of Brune are depicted as thriving I believe the author knows this).

Frankly, I think that almost all Vanadis already suspect Tina, but they lack proof. And simply attacking her would likely be playing into her hands (considering how politically savy she is), so the Vanadis can't do anything until a clear connection is done.

Oh, and thanks for the translation, Setsuna!

[DragonOsman]

Yeah, thanks for the translation, Setsuna!

All of the Vanadis aside from Fine know how shady she is, yes. But with her trust issues, you'd think she'd be more reluctant to go along with her plans. What's she doing? It couldn't be that she's just doing it to go against Elen because of their feud, could it?

Man, I really wish their problems would be sorted out soon and that they'll reconcile, no matter how difficult it may be.

I know that Tina made a trade treaty with Ganelon to make Osterode prosper and that she still carried on even while knowing that he was a Demon, and that the Demon factor probably didn't matter as long as Osterode could prosper. It's not like she made a magical deal with him, it was just trading deal. But aside from that, she's the type of person who would be willing to go to any lengths necessary to make Osterode prosper. She doesn't seem to care how low she has to sink for it. Kind of reminds me of Sinbad and Kouen from Magi the Labyrinth of Magic, with how they were willing to go to any lengths for the sake of their respective countries (of which they were kings). Tina is like that, except she's doing it just for her own dukedom rather than the whole country since she's the governor of a single territory (though, as a Vanadis, she's also supposed to have a duty to Zhcted itself as one of the seven people with authority second only to that of the crown, which she unfortunately seems to be neglecting unless it's convenient for in certain situations).

But yeah, Marx, I understand what you're saying. But I don't think Tina herself cares if Osterode becomes the capital or not unless I'm missing or forgetting something. She does want to become Queen of Zhcted, but she could also rule from Silesia after she becomes queen.

I really want to know why she's acting the way she is in Volume 15 even though she should know about the King of the Magic Bullet legend. Does she think she can defy the Black Bow and the goddess whose will the King embodies? Either way, I hope she'll fall back in line eventually, along with Fine, and that all seven Vanadis together will move to place Tigre on the throne as the King of the Magic Bullet. It's just that, right now, he's also thinking of becoming King of Brune by marrying Regin. These two are going interfere with one another unless the two countries unite as one. And then we need a resolution for the harem for a True Harem ending in as believable a way as possible by the end of Volume 17. I'm scared of it being too rushed.

[Ramero]

Originally Posted by Marx-93

Osterode has the advantage of being a river city though, which is a huge boon to any city in an ancient or medieval period. The Russians (which are mostly Slavs), for example, decided to put their capital at St. Petersburg instead of Moscow for a time simply because the former was a port, despite that it was several hundreds of km to the north. I don't think a literal pact with a demon would be needed, it should be enough with an old-fashioned trade treaty an care to make it prosper (and considering how the coastal cities to the south of Brune are depicted as thriving I believe the author knows this).

Frankly, I think that almost all Vanadis already suspect Tina, but they lack proof. And simply attacking her would likely be playing into her hands (considering how politically savy she is), so the Vanadis can't do anything until a clear connection is done.

Oh, and thanks for the translation, Setsuna!

Even so, the problem is the willing of the merchants itself and the resources that can be offered there and possibly tradeways of connections. No merchants want to go that far especially those who has hard time to preserve the natural resources. Some natural resources such as vegetables, meat and other edible foods that naturally can be established at further southern will be rotten once reach Osterode. Even Osterode got river system, doesn't mean Tina can utilize it since Zhcted's Navy are only avaiable at Lebus and Legnica which makes Osterode completely vulnerable against river pirates and bandits.

The only Vanadis that was able to foil her plan indirectly are Sasha but now she is already dead because of her disease. Tina view Sasha as one of the most threatful Vanadis which can be seen where Tigre was diverted to Lippner to meet with her Captain, Matvey instead of keeping him to go to Prepus Port where Tina was waiting for Tigre there.

Tina was not be able to move freely because of Sasha that she was more brilliant than Tina to keep her in check. Even she was sick, she was be able to monitor all Vanadis without a hitch.

For the current story, i would like to see if Tigre was able to make Alsace a new Capital while Silesia and Nice can be a good place as a Province Capital because Alsace is the central of the Kingdom in case Zhcted and Brune are united into one Kingdom.

[Marx-93]

Originally Posted by Ramero

Even so, the problem is the willing of the merchants itself and the resources that can be offered there and possibly tradeways of connections. No merchants want to go that far especially those who has hard time to preserve the natural resources. Some natural resources such as vegetables, meat and other edible foods that naturally can be established at further southern will be rotten once reach Osterode. Even Osterode got river system, doesn't mean Tina can utilize it since Zhcted's Navy are only avaiable at Lebus and Legnica which makes Osterode completely vulnerable against river pirates and bandits.

The only Vanadis that was able to foil her plan indirectly are Sasha but now she is already dead because of her disease. Tina view Sasha as one of the most threatful Vanadis which can be seen where Tigre was diverted to Lippner to meet with her Captain, Matvey instead of keeping him to go to Prepus Port where Tina was waiting for Tigre there.

Tina was not be able to move freely because of Sasha that she was more brilliant than Tina to keep her in check. Even she was sick, she was be able to monitor all Vanadis without a hitch.

Okay, I didn't want to drag the topic more, but more than half of that is simply not true. Osterode has a navy, it is a plot point because Tina uses it to transport her soldier to Brune, and even uses the excuse of "the river is frozen" when she doesn't want to send soldiers.

And merchants go where the money goes. The fact that the route to reach Osterode means few of those commodities will reach only makes the price go higher. Now, if Osterode was a poor region, then nothing more will happen, but we're talking about putting a court there, which is precisely the only people rich enough to pay for carrying them. This are the basics of the economy, in work for at least 3.000 years. It has worked for St. Petersburg and hundreds of other cities. It is the entire point of the trade of exotic fruits: most will rot away, there are very few, price goes through the roof, a merchant makes an express travel only for the fruit, makes a killing due to it.

So now, everyone else, feel free to ignore this. I don't want to restart the argument again, but I had to at least correct that.

[Chingaruna517]

I think so too, moving on......

So here is the recap of the chapter 1 of series so far, (Many thanks to Setsuna86, the wait is finally worth it....)

1. Elen is captured by the enemy forces due to the poisoned river waters and enemy weapons and worst is she imprisoned by the Magical Chains.
2. Greast harasses Elen lewdly and vowing to make Elen as his "object" by robbing her virginity. Heaven forbid me to see what will he going to do next hadn't Tigre and someone come to the rescue in the later chapters (we will be waiting for it....)
3. Nice meanwhile still recovering from the uprising aftermath and Mashas has to tell Regin and other Brune aristocrats the bad news, especially the Moonlight Knights' defeat by the returning Greast.
4. This igniting everyone's panic after hearing Greast's return but Badouin manages to silent everyone. So, under Regin's degree, the Moonlight Knights are allowed to recuperate in Nice while declaring Greast as the enemy of Brune and have Badouin to dispatch messengers to investigate his and his associate's motive.
5. Five people (Mashas, Lim, Hughes, Tina and Badouin) enter the provided Guest Room and discuss about the current events. They talk about Greast's cunning that captured Elen, Tigre's disappearance to save Elen, and of course Ganelon as the demon. What really bothers me the most is Tina decides to return to Zhcted as she claimed that she in Brune sole in repelling Sachstein Army and her job is done. Even after Lim and the elder ministers begs her to stay, Tina still thinking about leaving anyway. Again, some comrade she is.....
6. Badouin and Mashas talk about Tigre to be king in order to stabilize Brune. Mashas of course have to decline in honor to Urs and his late wife. Then, as expected, incoming invading Muozinel Army, more trouble for Brune.

[AP24]

So Tigre and Titta really did it. From what I can tell:

Spoiler for Tigre and Titta bed scene:

They kissed just after Titta asked Tigre if she could come to his room tonight. Then during the scene in the bedroom it was shown that they were both completely naked in bed and kissed many times. At the end when they were hugging each other, Titta felt her thigh touching something and told Tigre that she was still fine (to do it again obviously ). Tigre then immediately kissed Titta with force and the scene ended there.

[Elberet]

Holy shit... Well done, Titta!

[Ratedhook522]

Whoa whoa whoa wait a second now, which volume does this occur in??? And if that's the case then I see Tigre taking on multiple wives including Elen and Titta.

[holybell84]

Originally Posted by AP24

So Tigre and Titta really did it. From what I can tell:

Spoiler for Tigre and Titta bed scene:

They kissed just after Titta asked Tigre if she could come to his room tonight. Then during the scene in the bedroom it was shown that they were both completely naked in bed and kissed many times. At the end when they were hugging each other, Titta felt her thigh touching something and told Tigre that she was still fine (to do it again obviously ). Tigre then immediately kissed Titta with force and the scene ended there.

I didn't think the omission of the main detail and some glorification will make things so erotic....

Spoiler for Spoiler:

The scene in the bedroom started with both of them sleeping naked. Tigre woke up due to sensing a presence in the room, which turns out to be Tir Na Fa who went on to possess Titta

After some talk between Tigre and TNF about the demons' plan, about other gods, Tir Na Fa then left, leaving Titta to collapse into Tigre's arm. She replied to Tigre that she is fine and after some hug and kisses, Titta request they go back to sleep (I seriously doubt Tigre will still be in the mood to continue on especially when he is quite upset when Titta got possessed again

The Tigre X Titta part was spoiled some pages back lol

[AP24]

Originally Posted by holybell84

Spoiler for Spoiler:

The scene in the bedroom started with both of them sleeping naked. Tigre woke up due to sensing a presence in the room, which turns out to be Tir Na Fa who went on to possess Titta

After some talk between Tigre and TNF about the demons' plan, about other gods, Tir Na Fa then left, leaving Titta to collapse into Tigre's arm. She replied to Tigre that she is fine and after some hug and kisses, Titta request they go back to sleep (I seriously doubt Tigre will still be in the mood to continue on especially when he is quite upset when Titta got possessed again

Spoiler for additional detail:

Actually, Tigre was the one suggested they should go back to sleep and then they lied down hugging each other. Titta then felt her thigh touching something and said to Tigre, "As for me, uhm, I'm still fine...". Tigre then immediately kissed Titta with force and the scene ended there. So it was obvious they were planning on going for another round.

[holybell84]

Originally Posted by AP24

Spoiler for additional detail:

Actually, Tigre was the one suggested they should go back to sleep and then they lied down hugging each other. Titta then felt her thigh touching something and said to Tigre, "As for me, uhm, I'm still fine...". Tigre then immediately kissed Titta with force and the scene ended there. So it was obvious they were planning on going for another round.

Spoiler for Spoiler:

Yeah my mistake on the suggestion to go back to sleep part.

Without TNF it really sounds like something out of NetaChara.

[DragonOsman]

Originally Posted by Ratedhook522

Whoa whoa whoa wait a second now, which volume does this occur in??? And if that's the case then I see Tigre taking on multiple wives including Elen and Titta.

It's from Volume 15. And of course, if this is really a True Harem, he'll be keeping all seven Vanadis plus Lim, Titta and Regin. But of course, the current troubles between Elen and Fine have to be sorted out first, not to mention the Brune vs. Asvarre conflicts and the Zhcted civil war involving the Vanadis and also Valentina's plans which Ruslan is also helping her in after she cured him (all of which is apparently happening starting from Volume 15). Tigre and Elen are expanding their forces to fight in both Brune and Zhcted. So all of this has to be sorted out before everything can be wrapped up, hopefully into a nice little bow where the harem and romance plot-points are also sorted out nicely. But unless the author decides to extend the series, he has to do it all by the end of Volume 17 (because he was originally planning on ending it there, and IIRC, if I understood right, he also said he might extend if he sees he has to - which I hope he did say and will do).

And Valentina and Fine also have to fall for him first, too, before a True Harem ending can really happen. He also saw Valentina naked and groped her, which is the flag in this series for a girl being added to his harem. Next is Fine. Then they have to fall for him. For Regin and Liza, it was partial, but they both love him already so they're technically in the harem (he only wiped their bodies after they'd bathed, so he did see them naked but he didn't grope them - not as far as I know).

Originally Posted by Chingaruna517

I think so too, moving on......

So here is the recap of the chapter 1 of series so far, (Many thanks to Setsuna86, the wait is finally worth it....)
Elen is captured by the enemy forces due to the poisoned river waters and enemy weapons and worst is she imprisoned by the Magical Chains.
Greast harasses Elen lewdly and vowing to make Elen as his "object" by robbing her virginity. Heaven forbid me to see what will he going to do next hadn't Tigre and someone come to the rescue in the later chapters (we will be waiting for it....)
Nice meanwhile still recovering from the uprising aftermath and Mashas has to tell Regin and other Brune aristocrats the bad news, especially the Moonlight Knights' defeat by the returning Greast.
This igniting everyone's panic after hearing Greast's return but Badouin manages to silent everyone. So, under Regin's degree, the Moonlight Knights are allowed to recuperate in Nice while declaring Greast as the enemy of Brune and have Badouin to dispatch messengers to investigate his and his associate's motive.
Five people (Mashas, Lim, Hughes, Tina and Badouin) enter the provided Guest Room and discuss about the current events. They talk about Greast's cunning that captured Elen, Tigre's disappearance to save Elen, and of course Ganelon as the demon. What really bothers me the most is Tina decides to return to Zhcted as she claimed that she in Brune sole in repelling Sachstein Army and her job is done. Even after Lim and the elder ministers begs her to stay, Tina still thinking about leaving anyway. Again, some comrade she is.....
Badouin and Mashas talk about Tigre to be king in order to stabilize Brune. Mashas of course have to decline in honor to Urs and his late wife. Then, as expected, incoming invading Muozinel Army, more trouble for Brune.

I agree completely. And on the part of Tina at the meeting, she also lied about whether or not she knew that Ganelon was a Demon when they first met. In truth, Ezendeis had already warned her, meaning that she all along since then that Ganelon is a Demon. She lied for the sake of being consistent with the lie she spoke at the meeting between the Vanadis and Tigre when after Sasha's death when Fine still hadn't been chosen as a Vanadis yet, where she said she didn't know anything about Demons. Though I guess that, like Setsuna pointed out, she forgot that if she lied about knowing about the Demons, she has to continue pretending to not know about Demons at all even now to really keep the lie up. Though I guess the other Vanadis who know that the Viralt can warn a Vanadis about Demons probably didn't buy it anyway (or at least I hope not).

Also, the main reason Mashas is against Tigre marrying Regin to become of Brune is the fact that he knows about Tigre's feelings for Elen, though a good part of it is also as you said, probably. The narration mentions him wondering whether Badouin is pushing for Tigre marrying Regin now because he noticed it. He must've wanted to hurry and have Tigre married to Regin so that he doesn't get the chance to marry Elen before that. Clever little cat, he is (I say that because his appearance is like that of a cat and the narration always makes a point of it; in this chapter he's even called a cunning cat ).

But yeah, I'll bring in the quote just in case so that everyone can see it here and make their own judgment. Mashas does say he wants Tigre to marry someone he loves. That's the main reason he's against making him marry Regin just to make him King of Brune: he knows that Tigre loves Elen. If he does marry Regin, it'll only be a political marriage to make Tigre King. He already rejected Regin's confession that she made as a woman and told her to wait for a year for his reply to her confession and proposal that she made as Brune's Queen who wants him to be King.

The quote is kind of long, so I'll put it in a spoiler tag:

Spoiler for Madan Volume 13 Chapter 1, evidence for what I said above:

“But, I intended to take more time for that. I wanted to have him serve in the royal palace and steadily pile up achievements other than in the battlefield, have him act as the mediator of the young nobles, increase little by little the time he would spend together with Her Highness and thus gradually disseminate their relationship.”
“……There are many things I want to say, but I’ll put them aside for the time being. In that case, why don’t you do as such? Why the hurry?”
Mashas asked with an expression still lingering with surprise. Badouin wrinkled his brows and further puffed out his round cheeks in displeasure. He took one of the maps spread out on the table. It was the one depicting the neighboring countries.
“He was given a glorious title as a warrior by Muozinel, he was highly evaluated to the point of having the opportunity to talk one-on-one with the Zhcted King, he repelled the large army of Sachstein, negotiated on equal footing with Duke Tallard Graham, who is regarded as Asvarre’s next King, and gains him as an ally……”
While tapping the various countries on the map with a finger, Badouin made an astonished face. The one that he deemed especially dangerous was the Asvarre Kingdom. Their conduct had no integrity, but as a result, only Asvarre stood almost unscathed in this war.
“It is no longer only achievements in the battlefield. Earl Vorn’s existence will become important even in the relationships with various countries in the future. Moreover, he is young and single. The possibility of Zhcted or Asvarre bringing up talk of engagement in the future is great.”
“Well, that may be so……”
Mashas made a dejected face. He remembered about how previously various nobles of the country proposed marriage interviews to Tigre and were going to send their daughters or nieces as maid apprentices.
“I do not say that it will absolutely happen. But, it would be late to take countermeasures after such talks were to be brought up. What is especially scary is the case where a trouble will occur in the future diplomacy were we to decline. ──Now then”
While stroking the tip of his erectly stretched moustache, Badouin made a solemn face.
“Her Highness Regin’s reign is also two years. It is already a good time for her to think about marriage, right? The marriage of royalty should give priority to political maneuvers, but there is nothing to criticize about the current Earl Vorn on that point. Above all, Her Highness likes him.”
“Even if Her Highness does……”
After saying up to there, Mashas thought of something and knitted his brows. Why did Badouin suddenly start talking about something like this? That he had been thinking about it since before was probably not a lie, but would it not be fine talking about it after the battle against Greast ended?
—Has he noticed that Tigre yearns for Eleonora-dono?
Currently, Tigre was acting alone in order to rescue Elen. It was not out of responsibility as the Moonlight Knight Army’s supreme commander. It was as one young man strongly yearning for one young woman.
Both Tigre and Elen had their respective positions and there was first no way that they could be wedded, but even so Badouin would like to take measures for the sake of Regin.
“Even if Her Highness likes Tigre, he’s the lord of Alsace and doesn’t come from a prestigious family. Even if he has brilliant war achievements and is highly evaluated by other countries, won’t it be difficult? Above all, he can use neither sword nor spear even now and only excels at archery.”
“Aside from if it was until last year, our country in its present state cannot afford the luxury of choosing ‘an innocuous person with good pedigree and lineage’ as King. Be strong in war and be able to compete with various even in the field of diplomacy. That is what is demanded from a King. Those, who found it a problem that Earl Vorn can use neither sword nor spear and suspected that he is Zhcted’s puppet, will behave themselves with the fact that he suppressed the revolt and protected Her Highness. If it is now, there will be few objections. And also, do you know about the title of Knight of the Moonlight that he was given by the late King Faron?”
Faron was Regin’s father and Brune’s previous King. To the unexpected question, Mashas made a puzzled face and shook his head.
“I’ve heard that, while it happened quite a long time, it isn’t even sure that a person who was given that title has existed, but…… is there some special meaning to it?”
“Nearly 100 years ago, there was only one person who has been honored with that title. The person married the King’s daughter and became the next King.”
Mashas had his mouth wide-open. The shock temporarily rendered the old Earl speechless.
“T-Then, won’t it be better even if more were known about it……?”
Though he somehow pulled himself together and threw a question, the old Prime Minister indifferently answered without being agitated.
“Do you think that a person, who is able to marry the King’s daughter, has just been given that title alone? I heard that that person was also won many other titles and was called with various nicknames.”
“Do you intend to choose a suitable time, spread that and shout that Tigre and Her Highness being wedded is the will of His Majesty Faron?”
Badouin did not returned words. His expression filled with determination was above all his reply.
Mashas made a sullen face and strongly stroked his gray beard as if tearing it off.
Tigre would undoubtedly make a good King.
He has an intention which would make him a good ruler and also the magnanimity of lending an ear to the voices of people. Regin, Badouin and Mashas just had to compensate for the abilities he lacked.
In addition, if Tigre became King, the position of Mashas, whom he deeply trusted, would become firm and the Rodant House would greatly prosper. Though Mashas was not that interested in power and influence, he naturally had the wish of wanting to make the Rodant House and the land of Aude that he governed prosper.
It was not only Mashas. Augre, the people of Alsace and all those, who had accompanied Tigre in the battles until now, would be given his favor.
But, Mashas shook his head with a wry smile.
“Badouin. I understand your thought. Sorry, but I can’t lend you my help.”
“Could I hear the reason?”
To the Prime Minister’s words, the old Earl nodded with a smile on his whole face.
“His father is a man who had the daughter of a gardener without relative as a wife. I think that it was a choice not like a noble, but the persons themselves seemed to be happy. As a person, who was a friend of such a fellow, I want Tigre to be wedded to someone he loves.”

[Chingaruna517]

Originally Posted by DragonOsman

And Valentina and Fine also have to fall for him first, too, before a True Harem ending can really happen. He also saw Valentina naked and groped her, which is the flag in this series for a girl being added to his harem. Next is Fine. Then they have to fall for him. For Regin and Liza, it was partial, but they both love him already so they're technically in the harem (he only wiped their bodies after they'd bathed, so he did see them naked but he didn't grope them - not as far as I know).

If you meet one woman who likely start a civil dissident under her would-be-reign while the other is more interested in battle than negotiate, this could be a bigger challenge even for the only male Vanadis Mediator. The solutions for that isn't fare-fetched though as we will going to see how would it going to end without curtain fall of the series, the only question is how will Tigre able to pacify the situation beforehand. Here is how I think,

Spoiler for Tigre's solution to pacify Valentina and Figneria from ruining Zhcted:

1. There is no doubt Tina is an ambitious women who halt at nothing to fulfill her dream (as Queen of Zhcted), with her message to Elen in Nice Royal Palace seemly solidify that attribute. Now keep in mind that Tina is interested towards Tigre after hearing the events during Brune Civil War at that time, mostly because of his relationship with the first three Vanadises, but those only as her own test to see if Tigre and his own ability make a worth for her and her only, not Elen nor especially Sofy. Even as an ally, some of Tina's tactics are considered to be both inhumane and shady to the point that prompt Elen, Mila and even Badouin to fell extremely uncomfortable (if you ask Sofy anything about Tina's shady things, she might reply the same answer). Keep in mind that the one thing does interest Tina towards Tigre though is the Black Bow's power that generate the Charged Arrow Shot via absorption through her Viralt that nearly injured Ganelon. Can the descend of Tir Na Fal reform the Void Vanadis?
2. Meanwhile we have Fine, a longtime mercenary who thrived her entire life via fighting and survival. Although she did meet and befriended with other mercenaries such as the Silver Gale, the friendship only lasted as her contracted mission when she killed Vissarion, the leader of the Silver Gale whose death not only forced the once renowned mercenary group, but also generated a brewing hatred from Elen . Hypothetically, if things would have been different if Fine showed up during the Sun Festival in time and met Tigre and the Vanadis,then anything can be talked over with. That aside, am I the only who see Fine's overrated concern towards Elen and Lim that she forgot that they are accompanied by someone else? Such as Tigre? Yes, in Showdown Arc, Fine wishes to see the man who Elen fought for in Brune and yet she failed to realized that he is the same person who able to yield Elen from doing something she regret. Wonder if the battlefield against Tigre will allowed her to see the Black Bow's prowess, as well prompts Fine to see the phenomenal for the first time?

By the way, further note about anything about Tir Na Fal's descend into Zhcted that finally quell the dissident, there will be a potential risk to have Ganelon as he is aiming to absorb the Goddess of Death for his own purposes, especially with Durandal in his hand. That begs to question if the weapon itself is immune to the power of the gods?