U.S. Politics Thread (2017 going forward)

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

My actions did nothing for either party. Nor did I care who Sanders said one should vote for, as I'm not a Democrat, nor am I a Republican. I live in California, where Democrats rule during election night (and did by over 2 to 1). I would not vote for Clinton, period. I also would not support Trump. Therefore I choose what I considered to be a better choice, and a valid choice as a legal write-in vote within the State of California.

I chose a third way. And I stand by that. That 120 million or so people didn't do what was right, and say "the hell with your parties", is not my fault, as I'd been voicing the opinion that both Trump and Clinton were bad choices for a while.

With all due respect, I find it rather fatalistic. And again, I point to sure California always votes a certain way, but it still requires people to show up. Snowball effect and all.

But this is why we are screwed. You seem to be an upstanding person, but if you're willing to allow (in your own words) Hitler to be elected over Hillary, then I can't imagine what less upstanding people would do.

Unlike anyone else around here, I won't judge you either supporting either end. But if you want my recommendation, I'd vote for a paper bag if it wasn't Trump and it had the best chance of winning

-Me, to people on Election Day

Also, I just was reminded of something. Is California always doomed to vote Democrat? I'm sure we had a Republican for governor not too long ago....

[Galaxian]

This isn't foreboding at all...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...vows-overturn/

[VORTIA]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

How did you come to that conclusion?

Why should the electoral system change to suit the voting pattern of the voters?

Because the government exists to serve the people, not the other way around, that's why. Unfortunately, nothing short of a revolution in this country will change that, because the only two viable parties benefit from it remaining this way. One of the best things to come from Trump's election is Democrats new-found appreciation for the 2nd Amendment!

[Dauerlutscher]

Arkansas passes law allowing rapists to sue victims who want an abortion

A pregnant woman's husband will have the power to stop her from having an abortion, even in cases of spousal rape, under a new law introduced in the US state of Arkansas.

D&E procedures are the safest way for women to end their pregnancies after 14 weeks of gestation, according to the American Medical Association.

But the medical procedure will now become a felony in the southern state, punishable by a $10,000 fine or six years in prison.

This is despite 683 of Arkansas's 3,771 abortions being D&E in 2015, according to the state's health department.

A clause in the legislation also states the husband of a woman seeking an abortion, if he is presumed to be the baby's father, can file a civil lawsuit against the physician for monetary damages or "injunctive relief" ― a court order that would prevent the doctor from going ahead with the procedure.

[Archon_Wing]

Why are we banning Muslims again?

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Why are we banning Muslims again?

Because fear of terrorism iirc.

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Sheba

Because fear of terrorism iirc.

Also thought it was because over there all those countries, they didn't have a high respect for personal rights. Oh and treating women as second-class/property. Like damages because of an unborn child. Maybe those values were too far apart from us.

Or maybe not and we do have more in common with islamofascists then we thought...

[Dauerlutscher]

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...67311054974976

[VORTIA]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Also thought it was because over there all those countries, they didn't have a high respect for personal rights. Oh and treating women as second-class/property. Like damages because of an unborn child. Maybe those values were too far apart from us.

Or maybe not and we do have more in common with islamofascists then we thought...

If that was really the issue, we'd be sanctioning Saudi Arabia, where women can't drive & lashing & beheading are very much in fashion. With the incredibly disappointing exception of Iraq, the temporary travel ban mostly targets countries that the US doesn't diplomatically recognize or are unstable &/or engaged
In civil wars. I think the US is very much within its right to improve vetting of visitors from those countries, but more than anything this is a political stunt for Trump's voters. Including Iraq, when they're one of our primary allies in the fight against ISIS, is a complete slap in the face. A better organized roll-out would also have prevented the unnecessary harassment of green-card holders and dual citizens. Americans have been hollering for an "outsider" for decades. This is what happens when people with no experience in government try to hit the ground running.......

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by VORTIA

If that was really the issue, we'd be sanctioning Saudi Arabia, where women can't drive & lashing & beheading are very much in fashion. With the incredibly disappointing exception of Iraq, the temporary travel ban mostly targets countries that the US doesn't diplomatically recognize or are unstable &/or engaged
In civil wars. I think the US is very much within its right to improve vetting of visitors from those countries, but more than anything this is a political stunt for Trump's voters. Including Iraq, when they're one of our primary allies in the fight against ISIS, is a complete slap in the face. A better organized roll-out would also have prevented the unnecessary harassment of green-card holders and dual citizens. Americans have been hollering for an "outsider" for decades. This is what happens when people with no experience in government try to hit the ground running.......

Well, none of this matters when you have a president that throws a temper tantrum towards a judge for doing their job. And yea, that selective thing is quite blatant when we know the country most terrorists come from is not blocked...

Must have mistaken president for something else.

It's really dumb because there are so many ways to do it, and this is definitely not one of them.

[VORTIA]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Well, none of this matters when you have a president that throws a temper tantrum towards a judge for doing their job.

To be fair, he throws a temper tantrum about literally everything, the American people knew he throws a tantrum about literally everything, and we still elected him president, so I guess we get what we deserve. Laughs all around on anyone who believed he'd become "presidential" though!

[Key Board]

At one point, I thought that maybe Donald Trump prefers to be at Trump Tower and wants to be impeached

..but now I realized that's Trump being Trump

I do hope he doesn't get so angry, he uses the literal nuclear option one day, though

[Magin]

Unfortunately, I was younger than 10 at the time, so I don't know which side controlled Congress when Bill Clinton was president. I bring this up because it seems to me that the only reason why Trump hasn't been impeached yet is because his own party is looking at this like a babysitting job- let Trump rant and rave and then occasionally pacify him to make sure all media attention is on him, while the "adults" (the Republican party) then go and do their own thing that never gets reported. Because as long as they have Trump inb office, he gets to be their massive diversion to this behind-the-scenes shit that's going to screw us

[Jaden]

Well, Trump is probably going to win this legal battle.

From https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1182

“Whenever the President finds that the entry of any aliens or of any class of aliens into the United States would be detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by proclamation, and for such period as he shall deem necessary, suspend the entry of all aliens or any class of aliens as immigrants or nonimmigrants, or impose on the entry of aliens any restrictions he may deem to be appropriate."

So yeah, president can put out all the bans he likes, unless you can successfully make the case that this part of the law is unconstitutional and thus invalid. A judge should probably know all that, so it's no wonder Trump is calling him out.

[Key Board]

That only applies for those seeking visa?
Not ones that already have it?

And the process is reversed.
You have provide a solid case first. ( communicable diseases /criminal record / physical and mental disorders.
terrorist and or espionage threat )
Trumphouse just went on and REVOKED Visas

[Galaxian]

Originally Posted by Jaden

Well, Trump is probably going to win this legal battle.

From https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1182



So yeah, president can put out all the bans he likes, unless you can successfully make the case that this part of the law is unconstitutional and thus invalid. A judge should probably know all that, so it's no wonder Trump is calling him out.

That's why they're not challenging the ban itself, but the criteria that Trump is using for it.

Officially, the ban is against specific territories, but there have been no attacks or acts of terrorism originated from any of the seven countries.

In reality, it is a ban again a people who follow a specific religion, which is against the constitution.

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Also thought it was because over there all those countries, they didn't have a high respect for personal rights. Oh and treating women as second-class/property. Like damages because of an unborn child. Maybe those values were too far apart from us.

Or maybe not and we do have more in common with islamofascists then we thought...

Turd/GoP hates Muslims, but love Muslims Laws that keep women in the dark ages. Turd wants to grab pussy, rape women, and get away with it like many men in in those countries...

VORTIA asked, "what is it that has convinced modern leftists that name-calling is the only effective means of convincing voters to support their agenda?".
I gave up all hope to try to convince people who just don't want to listen to facts and believe in nonsense like alternative fatcs.
I will call a racist a racist- because he is one. If these people or delicate snowflakes and can't handle that, so be it.
But this hypocristy when a racist hates being called what he is and starts whining, this gets extremely on my nerves.
It's like these people have absolutely no understanding of history.
It's extremely annoing.
So trying to convice thoes people is like talking with a wall.

I'm pretty tolerant and live with the credo to treat others in such a way, how I would like to be also treated. Which means i treat them with respect and accept human rights. We all are equall, we are human beings. But my tolerance ends when people try to undermine the rights of others.

When someone likes to call me a sjw in the stupid believe that it will somehow insult me or hurt my feelings, ha can do it. I don't mind at all. Because being social, helping people, feeling emphaty and fighting for justice are things I'm proud of. Sure, i'm not perfect and I have my faults too and sometimmes i can be pretty stubborn and my temper gets the better of me, but I'm working on it.

[Reckoner]

Originally Posted by VORTIA

I honestly don't care. Insurance costs so much for me and my wife we'd be better off saving our money to pay out of pocket. We can't afford to see a doctor, can't afford medicine, and we still have to pay thousands of dollars to the insurance companies. Sorry for those who are getting taken care of, but I just don't care and can't afford to keep paying all this money for nothing! Single payer would have been okay. I felt stabbed in the back by the Democrats when they sold us out to the insurance lobby with the ACA. I'm pretty much fine with anything that gets rid of it at this point.

The Democrats did not sell you out to ACA, they went for the only practical solution left to them available because Joe Lieberman was the 60th vote necessary.

It's interesting that you haven't answered my question about what state you live in, but whatever. You seem to believe you're better off rolling the dice without insurance. Good luck with that, I really hope you are not an unlucky individual here. What is clear to me though is that you don't really believe in universal health coverage, and aren't ready to do what is necessary to make the law better for yourself and others.

The ACA has done a whole lot of good already, and while not EVERYONE is better off necessarily, most of the faults of the law are due to Republicans. So what do people like you do? Allow those same Republicans to get back into office.

This is why there's no reasoning with people like you. It's absolutely preposterous that you say Hillary and Trump are equivalent. It's downright shameful that people who should know better think this way, and it's why people have nothing but insults for you. There is no reasoning with someone who puts their head in the ground.

[Ithekro]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Why are we banning Muslims again?

Because we are at war with some of them.

[VORTIA]

Originally Posted by Reckoner

It's interesting that you haven't answered my question about what state you live in, but whatever.

If it's enough for you, it's blue.

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

VORTIA asked, "what is it that has convinced modern leftists that name-calling is the only effective means of convincing voters to support their agenda?".
I gave up all hope to try to convince people who just don't want to listen to facts and believe in nonsense like alternative fatcs.
I will call a racist a racist- because he is one. If these people or delicate snowflakes and can't handle that, so be it.

This is why there's no reasoning with people like you. It's absolutely preposterous that you say Hillary and Trump are equivalent. It's downright shameful that people who should know better think this way, and it's why people have nothing but insults for you. There is no reasoning with someone who puts their head in the ground.

Wow, guys, thanks for proving my premise without answering my question. Here I am, a moderate Republican anti-Trumper, asking you to convince me why I should come over and vote Democrat, not even looking for a high bar to entry, and you've just called me racist and ignorant. I hope you realize how much this encourages people to abandon the Democrat party at the ballot box.