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GendoAizenPig · 2018-01-02, 06:42

How about you learn to read? It's literally right there in my last post.

"I don't have an issue with them not going to Elca. I have an issue with them not getting any panel time or mention at all."

Also none of them knew what Elca was even like beforehand, so why would they know that males couldn't go there? It also seems like Satellizer is the only one that took over a body. Notice how none of the others have wounds at all while she does. They're also all wearing their Genetics uniforms. So yeh....

If you're going to show hostility at least read the post you're responding to. I don't understand responding like that when all I'm doing is criticizing a chapter of a manga I've been reading for a long time.

DragonOsman · 2018-01-02, 07:03

Why did you talk like you expected the Limiters to go to Elca? I know you also said you have an issue with them getting any mention or panel time at all, but I also noticed you saying that you expected to go to Elca with their respective Pandora. And what can the Limiters or Pandora without physical bodies?

GendoAizenPig · 2018-01-02, 07:07

I mentioned it being strange that the limiters weren't included at all leading up to their Pandora partners going to another world. I would've liked it to be addressed that they couldn't go if that was the case, but it wasn't. Also like I said Cassie, Roxxane, Rana, and Charles don't seem to have taken over a body at all. They look like they somehow transferred their entire bodies to Elca, similar to Kazuya. So why wouldn't the limiters be able to do the same? I mean you can't even use the argument that only transcended Pandora could do it because Cassie and Charles were able to.

Alhazad2003 · 2018-01-04, 02:46

That's... hard to say. But if Kazuya's Freezing was useless against the Elukan Goddesses, then anyone else's will be less than useless. Ergo, there's no point in the Limiters going if they can't help their partners. Looks like it's gonna be a slugfest between Team 13 and Darth Gengo and his goddesses, with the fate of Eluka and Earth at stake. Can't wait for the grand finale.

GendoAizenPig · 2018-01-04, 04:21

We as readers would know that the limiters would be outmatched, but the characters aren't omnipotent. What would they do if Kazuya was incapacitated and they had to fight Elca Gengo? He'd just freeze them all and that would be game over. I bet those limiters would be useful then. I'm not saying that the limiters would be any help at all, but I am saying that the Pandora not bringing their partners makes no sense. By all accounts Cassie and Charles should've also been left behind if that was the case. They haven't even transcended yet.

This series put so much stock in the limiter/pandora partnership in the earlier arcs of the story. Satellizer and Kazuya's partnership was the backbone of the first arc. They fought Louis and Holly in the Siblings arc and solidified their relationship. Andre and Elizabeth had major moments in the E-Pandora arc culminating with their fight with Charles focusing on it specifically. It tapered off in the Transcendence arc, but they were still present. Same goes for the Busters arc.

They had limiters during every other arc in the story, but for whatever reason the author chose to forgo including them in the most important fight. It's nonsensical. You've also got to remember that the limiters are part of the Platoon 13 too. So are the Valkyries. We've never seen Platoon 13 do anything as a unit. This would've been a perfect time for that.

On another note, were Satellizer, Roxanne, and Ticy ever given those legendary stigmata? If this is indeed the final battle I guess that can be included in the dropped plotlines pile. Unless they got them off screen or I just straight up don't remember.

Edit - Apparently the Legendary Stigmata being made for Satellizer and co. were used to heal the Legendary Pandora. So it was addressed, but it may as well have been dropped all together.

ChuckE · 2018-01-04, 07:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by GendoAizenPig

This series put so much stock in the limiter/pandora partnership in the earlier arcs of the story. Satellizer and Kazuya's partnership was the backbone of the first arc. They fought Louis and Holly in the Siblings arc and solidified their relationship. Andre and Elizabeth had major moments in the E-Pandora arc culminating with their fight with Charles focusing on it specifically. It tapered off in the Transcendence arc, but they were still present. Same goes for the Busters arc.

But who cares about limiters?

Kadmos1 · 2018-01-04, 23:31

OK, so does anyone else wish for Kazuya and Satellizer to finally get intimate or married by series' end? Seriously, Satellizer is 1 of the hottest anime/manga blondes I have seen.

Tachibana · 2018-01-04, 23:37

I seriously doubt we've seen the true potential of Kazuya's Freezing. However, this is a better time than any to witness it.

Alhazad2003 · 2018-01-05, 00:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tachibana

I seriously doubt we've seen the true potential of Kazuya's Freezing. However, this is a better time than any to witness it.

Mm, what makes you so sure? Considering what he demonstrated in the last Clash, and just recently in the last Round, I fail to see why he needs to get more powerful. Kazuya doesn't want to be a god, he simply wants to protect his friends. So if you're expecting yet another power up for him, I can't see it happening. I mean if he resolves the whole Nova conflict himself, then what's the point of the Pandoras? An all-powerful MC doesn't appeal to me, though I know many will disagree on this. But I guess, we can only wait and see what happens in the next chapter.

Tachibana · 2018-01-05, 03:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alhazad2003

Mm, what makes you so sure? Considering what he demonstrated in the last Clash, and just recently in the last Round, I fail to see why he needs to get more powerful. Kazuya doesn't want to be a god, he simply wants to protect his friends. So if you're expecting yet another power up for him, I can't see it happening. I mean if he resolves the whole Nova conflict himself, then what's the point of the Pandoras? An all-powerful MC doesn't appeal to me, though I know many will disagree on this. But I guess, we can only wait and see what happens in the next chapter.

Remember, Kazuya's power is still very new. He's only begun to realize it's potential but has yet to display to true depth of his power. Besides he's also lacking in soul energy. I had estimated he had around at least around 10,000 to 100,000 soul energy count. He may be able to execute a powerful Freezing in his present condition but with more soul energy, it will be even stronger. I'm not saying he should become all-powerful. Though it's obvious he's capable of more. I'm not convinced that he isn't.

GendoAizenPig · 2018-01-05, 03:59

@Kadmos1 - I would hope anyone who doesn't want this would've moved on by now. They were about to "do the deed" in the Busters Arc so it's not even a question of if anymore, but when.

@Tachibana - I really think his "chess-master" ability was the epitome of what he was supposed to become. I wouldn't mind seeing something else from him though as long as it's not too ridiculous. I don't see anything that'll change him from just being support happening though.

It'll be funny if all of them get wrecked after this cool entrance. Though that might remind too many of the Busters arc.

Alhazad2003 · 2018-01-05, 18:20

@GendoAizenPig

Indeed, though considering they're going up against goddesses, I can see the opening stages of the battle going very badly for them. How they're gonna turn it around, remains to be seen.

And I wouldn't worry about West Genetics, not with the invading fleet being attacked by Novas. So the school's not in as much danger as the heroes in Eluka right now, where I'm certain the final battle is taking place.

GendoAizenPig · 2018-01-05, 21:16

@Alhazad2003

I could see some of the Pandora that went to save Kazuya ending up dead. This series did kill off Chiffon, who was pretty important at the time, after all. It'd be nice in my opinion to do so from a storytelling perspective. These are the final bosses (allegedly) of the manga so I think they should kill some of the good guys. A flawless victory would be very disappointing.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Chevalier Fleet is saved by Genetics and they team up with them against the Nova. That or they're completely annihilated by the Nova and Genetics doesn't end up having to fight them at all. It's really hard to say.

I do wonder if we'll be seeing Julia, Holly, and Sawatari in this final battle somewhere. Julia and Holly not being invited to Platoon 13 or the party seemed strange to me ever since it happened and Sawatari was spared for some reason.

***relentlessflame*** · 2018-01-06, 20:14

I removed some off-topic posts. This thread is indeed to discuss the whole manga, not only the most recent chapters, so any discussion is allowed so long as it's within the rules and on-topic.

GendoAizenPig · 2018-01-07, 22:24

So 214 finally got translated and it had some pretty interesting tidbits in it. I'll spoiler tag it for now.

Spoiler:

DragonOsman · 2018-01-08, 08:45

Just read the chapter myself.

Spoiler for reply to above:

Tachibana · 2018-01-08, 16:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonOsman

Just read the chapter myself.

Spoiler for reply to above:

Spoiler for Reply:

Culaio · 2018-01-09, 11:56

Am I only one who is wondering about important fact related satellizer possesing other satellizer: how exactly she is going to fight ? I mean people from other dimension arent pandora, they dont have stigmata in their bodies(they have stigma looking thing in their weapons though) which should mean that satellizer cant use pandora abilities in other satellizer body.

DragonOsman · 2018-01-09, 14:44

Yeah, how will she fight? I also want to see that.

@Tachibana:

Spoiler for reply:

GendoAizenPig · 2018-01-09, 15:07

@Culaio

She might end up just doing what she normally does. The body she took over could simply be a proxy. It'll definitely be interesting if not though.

@DragonOsman

Spoiler:

I just had a random thought. This entire arc is framed in a way that makes it seem like the Nova won't even be a problem after the stuff in Elca is resolved. If that is indeed the case, the Pandora probably won't even be needed anymore. Gengo's plan won't even be necessary either, which is probably for the best. Happy Ending seems more plausible than it did before this arc started.

2018-01-02, 07:03	Link #4382
DragonOsman Dragon King Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Al Khobar, Saudi Arabia Age: 34	Why did you talk like you expected the Limiters to go to Elca? I know you also said you have an issue with them getting any mention or panel time at all, but I also noticed you saying that you expected to go to Elca with their respective Pandora. And what can the Limiters or Pandora without physical bodies? __________________

2018-01-04, 04:21	Link #4385
GendoAizenPig Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: United States	We as readers would know that the limiters would be outmatched, but the characters aren't omnipotent. What would they do if Kazuya was incapacitated and they had to fight Elca Gengo? He'd just freeze them all and that would be game over. I bet those limiters would be useful then. I'm not saying that the limiters would be any help at all, but I am saying that the Pandora not bringing their partners makes no sense. By all accounts Cassie and Charles should've also been left behind if that was the case. They haven't even transcended yet. This series put so much stock in the limiter/pandora partnership in the earlier arcs of the story. Satellizer and Kazuya's partnership was the backbone of the first arc. They fought Louis and Holly in the Siblings arc and solidified their relationship. Andre and Elizabeth had major moments in the E-Pandora arc culminating with their fight with Charles focusing on it specifically. It tapered off in the Transcendence arc, but they were still present. Same goes for the Busters arc. They had limiters during every other arc in the story, but for whatever reason the author chose to forgo including them in the most important fight. It's nonsensical. You've also got to remember that the limiters are part of the Platoon 13 too. So are the Valkyries. We've never seen Platoon 13 do anything as a unit. This would've been a perfect time for that. On another note, were Satellizer, Roxanne, and Ticy ever given those legendary stigmata? If this is indeed the final battle I guess that can be included in the dropped plotlines pile. Unless they got them off screen or I just straight up don't remember. Edit - Apparently the Legendary Stigmata being made for Satellizer and co. were used to heal the Legendary Pandora. So it was addressed, but it may as well have been dropped all together. Last edited by GendoAizenPig; 2018-01-04 at 05:09.

2018-01-04, 23:31	Link #4387
Kadmos1 ≠epic failure Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Glendale, AZ Age: 37	OK, so does anyone else wish for Kazuya and Satellizer to finally get intimate or married by series' end? Seriously, Satellizer is 1 of the hottest anime/manga blondes I have seen. __________________ ≠epic fail

2018-01-04, 23:37	Link #4388
Tachibana タチバナ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Noctis Labyrinthus Age: 33	I seriously doubt we've seen the true potential of Kazuya's Freezing. However, this is a better time than any to witness it. __________________

2018-01-06, 20:14	Link #4394
*relentlessflame* 　 Administrator Join Date: Dec 2003 Age: 41	I removed some off-topic posts. This thread is indeed to discuss the whole manga, not only the most recent chapters, so any discussion is allowed so long as it's within the rules and on-topic. __________________ [...]

2018-01-02, 06:42	Link #4381
GendoAizenPig Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: United States	How about you learn to read? It's literally right there in my last post. "I don't have an issue with them not going to Elca. I have an issue with them not getting any panel time or mention at all." Also none of them knew what Elca was even like beforehand, so why would they know that males couldn't go there? It also seems like Satellizer is the only one that took over a body. Notice how none of the others have wounds at all while she does. They're also all wearing their Genetics uniforms. So yeh.... If you're going to show hostility at least read the post you're responding to. I don't understand responding like that when all I'm doing is criticizing a chapter of a manga I've been reading for a long time.

2018-01-02, 07:07	Link #4383
GendoAizenPig Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: United States	I mentioned it being strange that the limiters weren't included at all leading up to their Pandora partners going to another world. I would've liked it to be addressed that they couldn't go if that was the case, but it wasn't. Also like I said Cassie, Roxxane, Rana, and Charles don't seem to have taken over a body at all. They look like they somehow transferred their entire bodies to Elca, similar to Kazuya. So why wouldn't the limiters be able to do the same? I mean you can't even use the argument that only transcended Pandora could do it because Cassie and Charles were able to.

2018-01-04, 02:46	Link #4384
Alhazad2003 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011	That's... hard to say. But if Kazuya's Freezing was useless against the Elukan Goddesses, then anyone else's will be less than useless. Ergo, there's no point in the Limiters going if they can't help their partners. Looks like it's gonna be a slugfest between Team 13 and Darth Gengo and his goddesses, with the fate of Eluka and Earth at stake. Can't wait for the grand finale.

2018-01-05, 03:59	Link #4391
GendoAizenPig Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: United States	@Kadmos1 - I would hope anyone who doesn't want this would've moved on by now. They were about to "do the deed" in the Busters Arc so it's not even a question of if anymore, but when. @Tachibana - I really think his "chess-master" ability was the epitome of what he was supposed to become. I wouldn't mind seeing something else from him though as long as it's not too ridiculous. I don't see anything that'll change him from just being support happening though. It'll be funny if all of them get wrecked after this cool entrance. Though that might remind too many of the Busters arc.

2018-01-05, 18:20	Link #4392
Alhazad2003 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011	@GendoAizenPig Indeed, though considering they're going up against goddesses, I can see the opening stages of the battle going very badly for them. How they're gonna turn it around, remains to be seen. And I wouldn't worry about West Genetics, not with the invading fleet being attacked by Novas. So the school's not in as much danger as the heroes in Eluka right now, where I'm certain the final battle is taking place.

2018-01-05, 21:16	Link #4393
GendoAizenPig Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: United States	@Alhazad2003 I could see some of the Pandora that went to save Kazuya ending up dead. This series did kill off Chiffon, who was pretty important at the time, after all. It'd be nice in my opinion to do so from a storytelling perspective. These are the final bosses (allegedly) of the manga so I think they should kill some of the good guys. A flawless victory would be very disappointing. I wouldn't be surprised if the Chevalier Fleet is saved by Genetics and they team up with them against the Nova. That or they're completely annihilated by the Nova and Genetics doesn't end up having to fight them at all. It's really hard to say. I do wonder if we'll be seeing Julia, Holly, and Sawatari in this final battle somewhere. Julia and Holly not being invited to Platoon 13 or the party seemed strange to me ever since it happened and Sawatari was spared for some reason.

2018-01-07, 22:24	Link #4395
GendoAizenPig Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: United States	So 214 finally got translated and it had some pretty interesting tidbits in it. I'll spoiler tag it for now. Spoiler: I guess Arcadia won't be coming to help after all. She is just there to maintain a link to the other world. It also looks like the Legendary Pandora might end up dying from maintaining a link to Elca. They made it sound like it would possibly kill them just sending one more person over. They sent over quite a bit in 215. At the very least, they're most likely out of the fight. At least that gives other characters the chance to shine.

2018-01-08, 08:45	Link #4396
DragonOsman Dragon King Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Al Khobar, Saudi Arabia Age: 34	Just read the chapter myself. Spoiler for reply to above: They only said that it might kill them if they sent someone over. They probably found they could send more than one before running out Soul Energy. __________________

2018-01-09, 11:56	Link #4398
Culaio Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009	Am I only one who is wondering about important fact related satellizer possesing other satellizer: how exactly she is going to fight ? I mean people from other dimension arent pandora, they dont have stigmata in their bodies(they have stigma looking thing in their weapons though) which should mean that satellizer cant use pandora abilities in other satellizer body.

2018-01-09, 14:44	Link #4399
DragonOsman Dragon King Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Al Khobar, Saudi Arabia Age: 34	Yeah, how will she fight? I also want to see that. @Tachibana: Spoiler for reply: Yeah, that's what I'm saying too. I thought Gendo was saying that it doesn't make sense how they were still able to send more people after Satellizer even though they were saying that even sending in one person might make them use up all of their remaining Soul Energy. __________________

2018-01-09, 15:07	Link #4400
GendoAizenPig Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: United States	@Culaio She might end up just doing what she normally does. The body she took over could simply be a proxy. It'll definitely be interesting if not though. @DragonOsman Spoiler: You do have to admit though it was a weird storytelling decision to even have the legendary Pandora say that though. They acted like they were at the brink of overusing their soul energy and were struggling to come up with a solution that wouldn't kill them. So not only did they end up sending way more people over, but they also presumably are still maintaining the link. Only thing I could come up with is that maybe Elizabeth and Arnette (Who was shown to have a lot if I'm remembering correcting) gave them some of their soul energy. Heck maybe all of them did. If not I got nothing. What I got from what was said is that running out of soul energy = death and no more link to the other world. I just had a random thought. This entire arc is framed in a way that makes it seem like the Nova won't even be a problem after the stuff in Elca is resolved. If that is indeed the case, the Pandora probably won't even be needed anymore. Gengo's plan won't even be necessary either, which is probably for the best. Happy Ending seems more plausible than it did before this arc started. Last edited by GendoAizenPig; 2018-01-09 at 15:48.