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View Poll Results: Chuunibyou Demo Koi ga Shitai! - Episode 11 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 33 | 33.33% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 31 | 31.31% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 20 | 20.20% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 9 | 9.09% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 0 | 0% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 0 | 0% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 2 | 2.02% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 1 | 1.01% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 1 | 1.01% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 2 | 2.02% | |
Voters: 99. You may not vote on this poll |
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2012-12-15, 06:29 | Link #121 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
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Deko x Shinka OTP FOR THE WIN!
People will be surprise how many crazy people have healthy, productive and good lifes. It´s not like been ´´normal´´ is responsable when the ´´anormal´´ people can have the samethings, Look how many actor, directors, artist, etc, and refuse the reality and have better live than us. It´s not something easy but even a good job is not something easy
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2012-12-15, 09:18 | Link #122 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
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I think a lot of people aren't really getting the point, if they think Rikka dropping her chuunibyou is altogether a good thing.
Look, Rikka isn't just being crazy with her chuunibyou behavior. It's become part of who she is, her identity. She's an unusual and eccentric girl, but she's not crazy. She's also still a young teenager, her personality will change and evolve over time as she grows up. It's not right to expect her to "snap out of it" over night. Her now acting "normal" isn't a good thing at all, because she's not being herself - she is surpressing her own personality in order to conform, in order to be what other people - specifically, her family - want her to be. She threw away all the stuff in her room not because that was a logical thing to do, but because her mother wanted her to. She visits her fathers grave, not because she herself wants to, but because "it would make mom happy". I don't want to go on a rant about Rikka's mother, but honestly, what kind of parent demands their child completetly shed their own identity and personality and become a robot? By the way: I recommend watching the ED again and paying close attention to the lyrics. They suddenly make a whole lot more sense after this episode.
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Last edited by Goggen; 2012-12-15 at 09:21. Reason: Probably shouldn't be mentioning fansub groups of a licensed show. |
2012-12-15, 09:40 | Link #123 | |||||||||||||
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Also, plenty of episodes in the first half of this anime were largely comedic. So saying that this series took a "severe turn" towards realistic "since the start" is massive over-exaggeration. This series became somewhat more realistic about half-way through the show (at the earliest), but has maintained some unrealistic elements all the way through. Quote:
I could make a similar defense of Koi to Senkyo to Chocolate, but it would be harder to do without getting specific in a spoiler-esque way, so I'll skip it here. Quote:
This anime does not present clubs in any more serious a fashion than Hyouka or Koi to Senkyo to Chocolate do. So I don't think there's any legitimate basis to treat student clubs in this anime any different than you would in those two shows (and countless more beside). What about the club in Kokoro Connect, by the way? You can't tell me that Kokoro Connect doesn't deal with some serious life issues, because it does. But KC's student club is totally nonsensical, truly nothing more than a place for a group of five friends to meet in an organized fashion and socialize together. Quote:
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In any event, perhaps "rehabilitate" would be the better word for me to use here. Quote:
Rikka has gone from one extreme to the other. She needs to find a happy balance between the two, imo. Quote:
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That sort of dressing up is ultimately harmless, insofar as the reality behind it isn't lost sight of. Quote:
But "chuunibyou" isn't just delusions. For most people, it's role-playing (like it was for Yuuta and Mori Summer). Yuuta wasn't delusional when he was Dark Flame Master, he was just having fun. This is why I'm saying Rikka shouldn't have to turn off her chuunibyou persona forever. She clearly enjoyed much of it as simple fun (this is seen by how she frequently called one aspect or another of it "cool"). Quote:
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Suppose Rikka and Yuuta have a very successful relationship and end up married one day. Suppose on their 5th wedding anniversary they talk and reminisce about their first meetings with each other. Chuunibyou will inevitably come up. It is a core part of their romance narrative. If Rikka has forever denied herself chuunibyou, and looks back on it as something entirely negative, then that means she can't cherish how her and Yuuta came together like she ought to be able to. She'll feel shame and lingering hurts when thinking back on what brought her and her husband together. That's an awful place to be, so I think it's highly beneficial for chuunibyou itself to become rehabilitated in Rikka's mind. And I think the only way that happens is if Rikka can divorce her chuunibyou from the death of her father. That admittedly might not be easy, but I think it can be done, and I think the way to do it lies directly through Yuuta, actually. Past chuunibyou shouldn't just be a source of shame for Rikka. There's too many important friendships and romances now tied into it in Rikka's mind. These relationships are with people that Rikka needs in her life, so those relationships should be rooted in something that Rikka doesn't look upon with shame. Quote:
It doesn't have to be this way. And it shouldn't be. Quote:
All of these things would be considered "for kids" at one time. Times have changed, Klash. It's no longer that strange for an adult to embrace his or her "inner chuunibyou" from time to time. I'm honestly amazed this has to be stated on an anime message board where a large number of the members (including you and I) are over the age of 20. Finally - We all agree that Rikka needs to move on from her father's passing. So why you and some others keep bringing that up as though I disagree with that is bizarre to me. We agree on that. Where we disagree is that I think some of Rikka's chuunibyou was rooted in simply enjoying it and finding it "cool". That much can be preserved. And while I see what you mean by "changing filament", Rikka needs an off switch regardless. She can't be in chuunibyou mode all the time, no matter what the core motivation behind it is. Even if Rikka's chuunibyou is rehabilitated, she'll still need to know how to switch back and forth between "chuunibyou" and "normal" (much like how Yuuta can now do that).
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Last edited by Triple_R; 2012-12-15 at 09:55. |
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2012-12-15, 11:26 | Link #124 | |||||||
Also a Lolicon
Join Date: Apr 2010
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How many people happily reminisce about that time when life hurt so bad they lost themselves in beer everynight? Quote:
Sure the end result is similar, but Rikka's motives for her chuunibyou behavior are a lot worse. Quote:
Example: I went to Wreck-It Ralph with a bunch of friends, and all the parents looked at us with "stay away from my kids you fucking pedos" expressions. Example2: This is actually closer to Chuu2. LARPing, especially the fighting each other with swords and stuff type, is still regarded as weird, and LARPers are generally considered acceptable targets to make fun of. |
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2012-12-15, 12:46 | Link #125 |
Marauder Shields
Join Date: Sep 2012
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It's obvious for me that Rikka used her chuunibyou as a way to run from reality. Alcoholics and drug addict people do that too. They have two things in common with Rikka.
1- Running away from reality. 2- The addiction/delusion is controlling their lifes so much that they will have problems. Rikkas currently behavior is comparable to the situation when you take the Alcohol/drugs away from the junkis. They can't run away from reality anymore and are forced to face reality. Manny of them can't handle that and get extremely mad or just depressed (Rikka). And again. As long Rikka accepts reality and doesn't run away from it, and as long she clearly knows that her "delusions" are nothing more for her than just playing and she can stop with that anytime, than there is no problam if she has fun from time to time. It's the same with alcohol. As long you know what you are doing, and only drink from time to time and only for fun and not to run away from reality, there is no problem with it. But the moment you use it to run away from reality, it becomes a huge problem. And unlike Rikka, Yuuta and Shinka were never running away from reality and clearly know when it was time to turn their "delusions" off. So what I think we wil see in the next eisode is that Rikka accepts reality completely. She won't use her chuunibyou to run away from it anymore and will realize that she doesn't need to completely stop with having fun. Somthink like that. |
2012-12-15, 12:51 | Link #126 | |||||||||||||||
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The key is having a good support structure in place (or creating one) that better enables a person to move on. Rikka never had that before, but she gained that through Yuuta and through her club (which is another reason why I view Rikka's club in a more positive light than you, Klash, and Random32 seem to). Now, speaking of what she gained through Yuuta... Quote:
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Also... why the hell would anybody equate her peers with her elders? Isn't that a contradiction in terms? Quote:
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Case in point: Superman is obviously not realistic. I doubt any real world science will show you that going from living under a red son to living under a yellow sun will turn you into a god among men. However, Superman is a serious character. His stories generally aren't made to make you laugh. Like any fictional world, Chuunibyou's gets to determine what's normal within it. Those determinations limits the degree to which we can apply strict realism to the fictional world. They don't mean we can't take it seriously through. Long story short, "serious" does not necessarily equal "realistic". If you want an anime example of this, just look at Shin Sekai Yori. That show is starkly serious, almost unrelenting so. Yet it has obvious fantasy elements to it. Quote:
I honestly doubt that. Not to mention the incredible irony of an anime show conveying such a message. It's like a line of heavily marketed and merchandised "Capitalism Sucks!" T-Shirts making quite a bit of capital for the owners and makers of the line. Quote:
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You guys really ought to quit the absurd alcoholism and heroine analogies. They just make you look like your desperately grasping at straws to me. Why is it so hard to think that Rikka should re-embrace some chuunibyou? In a rehabilitated format? Quote:
That's no worse than somebody finding Superman's S-symbol or Iron Man's costume or Sephiroth's theme music "cool". Quote:
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No, my friend, this is pop culture now. Some people think it's strange, sure, but millions upon millions of people embrace it. Just keep your present company in mind, and it's all good. I will say that at my place of work, men in their 20s and 30s commonly talk about comic books and video games. I daresay that a man in his 20s/30s that doesn't play video games at all is the exception, and not the rule, today. As for LARPers, many view them as weird, sure. Does that stop them from functioning in society? I'm sure many LARPers are in decent jobs and/or have good stable families.
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2012-12-15, 13:53 | Link #127 | |
Irregular Hunter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Age: 37
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Much to my chagrin, we still know too little about her mother. First I assumed she just abandoned her children, then in the light of last episode it seems like she did try her best to stay with them, but Rikka's rejection of her was too strong that she thought it's better to put some distance. I think that's a fair decision. Maybe not the best, but it doesn't seem to me like she is a bad parent. I really wish for the last episode to put some lights on this topic. I don't have much to add to the great discussion about how good or bad dropping her chuunibyou altogether is, but here's why I think that's a necessary bitter pill for the current Rikka, at least in the short term: Her chuunibyou is like the blood vessel to the tumor that is the issue of dealing with her father's death. It is unavoidable that some of the vessels in the normal tissue has to be cut off. It's ok to let the good part grows back later, but right now this measure is necessary. Last edited by Hyper; 2012-12-15 at 13:55. Reason: Change some wording |
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2012-12-15, 17:31 | Link #128 |
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Even though I've wrote a lot on the chuunibyou debate, I will admit that I feel like I haven't quite hit on the full, core essence for why I feel and think the way that I do on it.
Then I saw papermario13689's avatar, and it hit me like a ton of moe. I want that Rikka back. I want that lively, energetic, fun-loving, "sparkle in her eyes" Rikka. And I think it's very clear that certain aspects of chuunibyou bring this out of Rikka like nothing else can. I want Rikka to smile again.
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2012-12-15, 17:33 | Link #129 | |||||||||||||||||
Also a Lolicon
Join Date: Apr 2010
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So why not a nice table? Rikka's
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Let's say someone nukes my hometown. I can't accept reality, and run around acting like the event never happened, and that all my emails back to my family are not being replied to because of a vast government conspiracy, and am dedicated to seeing my family again. That is exactly what Rikka is doing. Making up a reality where her father is still alive, then proceeding to reject the one around her in favor of it. It's not hurting my physical body like drugs would, but it's still very very bad. Quote:
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The problem is when the people that look down on it so greatly outnumber those who don't. Then "keeping present company in mind" means "don't do it at any place where it isn't you and your best buds alone." Quote:
I'm saying that boldly associating yourself with LARPing will probably get you a lot more weird looks than friends. Maybe LARPing isn't weird enough for you for my example. So how about this one, lolicon. Would you suggest that I should openly tell people irl, "I like looking at cartoons of underage girls as it turns me on a lot." |
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2012-12-15, 20:02 | Link #131 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2010
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I'll reply to this specifically, because I think there's a lot of confusion about this point. Rikka is not delusional, nor was she ever. I mean, yeah, she was "delusional" in a joke-y sense of the word, but she didn't really believe her own delusions. She was aware that her make-believe was just that - though she would obviously never admit it, as that would break character. Sure she got caugth up in her own fantasies to an annoying degree, but it was still just make-believe. So yes, Rikka was pretending. And if that wasn't clear before from those moments where she briefly breaks character or "cheats" in her chuunibyou rants by filling in parts of her sentences with "blah blah blah" when she couldn't think of anything cool on the fly, for instance, it should certainly be clear after this episode. If she was truly delusional, she wouldn't have been able to just switch it off like that.
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2012-12-15, 20:10 | Link #132 | |||||||||||||||||||||
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I'm not forgetting her. However, do we know precisely how much Dekomori knew about Rikka's personal background?
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You can dress up as a Starfleet Officer, and playact as one, without seriously thinking that Scotty is about to beam you up. Quote:
The following are now mainstream for adult viewers: 1) A movie about a man who dresses up like a bat to fight against a psychotic serial killing clown. 2) Movies based on a 80s children's cartoon series and popular toy line. Big giant robots in disguise! 3) A movie about superpowered people in colorful costumes fighting against a trickster god. Gamma radiation. Super Soldier Serum. The whole nine yards. I don't know about you, but that sounds like "Chuuni-style" entertainment to me. Quote:
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2012-12-15, 23:06 | Link #133 | ||
Irregular Hunter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Age: 37
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Now that scenario takes a lot of assumptions, so I wouldn't argue that's the case. My point is we know too little to put any blame on her mother. Also, while it's true that those around her certainly deserve some of the blames, I personally think the zombie Rikka is the result of she doing it to herself mostly. Still, I recognize that is a subjective take on my part. Quote:
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2012-12-15, 23:34 | Link #134 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California
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2012-12-16, 00:13 | Link #135 | |
Irregular Hunter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Age: 37
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Last edited by Hyper; 2012-12-16 at 00:48. Reason: Took out the spoiler part since it's not important |
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2012-12-16, 01:26 | Link #136 |
18782+18782=37564
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: InterWebs
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Spoiler for Umineko comparison:
It may become an escape mechanism, but so can many other things. Without even looking at the most notorious examples of alcoholism and drugs, there's: gaming, reading, watching, etc. So many 'fun' things can become an escape mechanism if done out of proportion. I'd say so is the case of chuunibyou. It isn't an inherently 'bad' thing. And such, I can't say I condone to throwing all of Rikka's chunibyou out of the window. And deep down, a part of Yuuta also thinks so, but he is now deeply conscious about how 'irresponsible' for him to say that to Rikka. OTOH, Rikka also knows she shouldn't cold turkey her habits, but she needs Yuuta to confirm to that (as Sanae alluded). And so we arrive at the current ぎこちない situation, the hooks they try to tie keeps missing each other. I think there is only one way the narrative could go from here (because there is only one that keeps recurring throughout different series I could think of that leads to a somewhat happy ending). To quote Keima, "I can already see the ending!"
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2012-12-16, 03:24 | Link #137 | |
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Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California
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Others have already pointed out that Rikka's imaginations doesn't interfere with her regular school life. Nor have there been any hints or clues that points to past incidents where her behavior has gotten her into serious trouble.
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2012-12-16, 09:19 | Link #138 |
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Elestia makes some excellent points here.
I think that chuunibyou has become such a large part of Rikka's life that it has become inextricably mingled with Rikka's personal sense of self. Liking this play-acting, liking these "magical" items, liking this colorful Okabe Rintarou-esque terminology and mannerisms, that is part of who Rikka is, like it or not. Completely divorcing her from that is naturally turning her into a shell of her former self, because so much of what made her her has now been removed despite her genuine fondness for it. And yeah, we're not talking about an one year fad, we're talking about something she's been since a very young age and has embraced for several years. It would be like if somebody told my 14-year old self that I had to stop reading comic books, stop dreaming about super hero adventures I used to come up with, and stop all of that sort of "geek" stuff. It would have left me a shell of my former self too, with life seeming much more dreary.
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2012-12-16, 14:00 | Link #139 | ||
Irregular Hunter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Age: 37
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I agree with you that her interaction, especially in the first half of the series, show that she is just having fun. But it's different when it directly involve her father. She comes out to me as "clinging" to her imagination rather than playing with it in some situations, which is dangerous IMO. Problem is, the "situations" included anything involving her family. And she cannot avoid her family, especially now that she'll live with her mother. My opinion is that chuuni-Rikka is fine. It is what defined her character, both in-universe and as an anime character. However, right now she is using it to avoid accepting her father's death and it is pushing her toward being truly delusional. She can has her fantasy back when she dealt with that issue. And consider everything, I agree with almost everyone here that it is practically guaranteed that she will have it back next episode. What I'm looking forward to see is "how". |
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2012-12-16, 15:01 | Link #140 |
Mmmm....
Join Date: Sep 2006
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In next week's episode, Yuuta goes around department stores telling all the little children queuing at Santa's Grotto that Santa isn't real.
From the toned down colour palette at the start of the episode to pretty much all Rikka's appearances you can see that she's been knocked back and lost her joie de vivre. In a way she's in the situation Yuuta was in at the start, packing everything up and trying to be "normal", but this time it's not really of her own volition, she's just trying very hard. |
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chuunibyou, drama |
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