AnimeSuki Forums

holyman282 · 2007-02-25, 14:44

Well basically i've been watching a few anime lately such as, Elfen Lied, Utawarumono, KGNE, this ugly and beautiful world ect and i realised that most anime these days never have a good ending.....

is it too cliche for a anime to just end happily these days, i mean it's not that hard...

Even Pita-Ten, which i watched and thought was a happy ending, then upon reading the manga, realised otherwise...

Why is anime these days leaning towards sad and bittersweet endings? Is this simply to make us think about life and the realities that things don't always end happily?

Zu Ra · 2007-02-25, 15:01

IMO they are making anime more realastic . Anime chracters are always larger than life so a little dose of reality is added with a bitter sweet ending . They dont live happily ever after which is nice in a way . When I watched the last ep of Elfen Lied what was going on in my head was will Lucy live or die . That was my main fascination with the ending .

Anime is a world of fantasy and fiction they are just merging fantasy with reality which is a nice thing makes the fantasy more belivable IMHO .

Moon Eclipse · 2007-02-25, 15:08

possible back lash from all the "happy ending" animes that came before them?

jedinat · 2007-02-25, 15:09

Because the creators are lazy and it's easy to manipulate the viewers emotions with tragedy.

Areguzanda · 2007-02-25, 16:10

I liked the ending of Elfen Lied
even though it never gave a clear vision of what happend.
did she die?
did she survive?

this is the kind of endings I have a problem with but still like.
because it's up to each individual person to use theire imagination to figure out what happend.
thats the good thing.
the thing I don't like is that you will never really know what happend even if you make you own vision of the end. So the end you thought of could be totally wrong, but then again it could be totally right.
the problem is, you will never know.
and i both Love and hate not knowing

Maxon · 2007-02-25, 18:25

Sometimes a happy ending isn't a viable option. Writers may have thought of a happy ending but couldn't find a way to get to the happy ending that made sense. However, any ending is better than no ending...

What grinds my gears are anime that end and nothing is actually decided or resolved.

Mirrinus · 2007-02-25, 18:26

Kanon 2006 said it best: It's the "Schrödinger's Cat" tactic. Is the cat alive or dead? You want to find out, but you can't until you open the box (or in our case, finish the show).

But you're right, I've been noticing this trend too. The most recent anime I finished was Hanbun no Tsuki ga Noboru Sora (OK, so I'm like a year late on that one...but still).

Mueti · 2007-02-25, 18:32

The thing is that none of those sad endings were depressing for me like I heard many others say. There was none among them that I didn't interpret positively but maybe that's just me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jedinat

Because the creators are lazy and it's easy to manipulate the viewers emotions with tragedy.

While certainly not universally appropriate I still think you got a point there. But I'm not one to mess with the writer's idea of how things had to work out, I'd never say "the story would've been better if this and that would've been different". The story is how it was supposed to be and ended how it was supposed to end and that's that.

Matrim · 2007-02-25, 18:54

Quote:

Because the creators are lazy and it's easy to manipulate the viewers emotions with tragedy.

But it's even easier for the writers to go with the flow and if need be, even pull some implausible happy end out of their collective ass, just for the sake of not disappointing most of the audience. Sure sometimes tragic elements are handled so poorly that they become annoying even for people like me who like it when not everything goes right for the characters, but the "laziest" or rather the path with the least resistance is obviously the happy ending. The ending has to fit the overall mood and theme of the series and to make sense plotwise. Why end a dark series with a happy end just for the sake of happy end? This is terribly annoying for me. And of course, it's just as emotionally manipulative to have a sudden twist and a happy resolution as to have a sudden scene in which something awfuls happens to the fans' favourite character.

jedinat · 2007-02-25, 19:10

It's just as easy to have a normal happy ending, yes. What I meant is I think it's much easier to come up with a "meaningful" or impressive tragic ending than a memorable happy one. How many sad endings have made you cry? How many happy ones?

Mueti · 2007-02-25, 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by jedinat

It's just as easy to have a normal happy ending, yes. What I meant is I think it's much easier to come up with a "meaningful" or impressive tragic ending than a memorable happy one. How many sad endings have made you cry? How many happy ones?

When I read this, instantly RahXephon came to my mind. I guess it's a rare exception though.

Matrim · 2007-02-25, 19:28

Quote:

How many sad endings have made you cry? How many happy ones?

None and none actually but I see your point. I don't agree though, if not done well, the happy ending is just as likely to not impress much than the tragic one. A scriptwriter can kill all the characters in the end and still fail to move many viewers. Tragic endings tend to get a bit overrated due to their relative rarity but it's also true that there are people who will detest any tragic ending even if it makes perfect sense in the context of the show.

jedinat · 2007-02-25, 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mueti

When I read this, instantly RahXephon came to my mind. I guess it's a rare exception though.

...are you thinking RahXephon had a happy ending? I remember it being incredibly bittersweet. I even skimmed through the movie version to see if it ended differently. Well, I deeply regretted doing that because it was way more sad.

The one really, really memorable happy ending for me was Full Moon wo Sagashite.

Zu Ra · 2007-02-25, 19:35

The chracters thats died in most animes mentioned died were in line with the plot . If you take Naruto, Kishimoto actually sits and thinks who to kill off next the quota has to be filled up . The ratings have to go up

The killings justified the plot at the end , not a delibarte case as some manga-kas do .

jedinat · 2007-02-25, 19:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matrim

I don't agree though, if not done well, the happy ending is just as likely to not impress much than the tragic one. A scriptwriter can kill all the characters in the end and still fail to move many viewers. Tragic endings tend to get a bit overrated due to their relative rarity but it's also true that there are people who will detest any tragic ending even if it makes perfect sense in the context of the show.

I don't agree with the sentence in bold. I don't think the extreme example in the next sentence supports the argument very well either.

As to the latter part of your post... Well it also seems to me there are people who will worship any show with any sort of cheesy soap opera tragedy and drama so it all balances out. For example I cannot see how KgNE would appeal to anyone for any reason other than the manipulative emotions it induces. (ed~ err... maybe we should just forget I typed this last paragraph, as it seems it might pull things off topic

)

Matrim · 2007-02-25, 20:16

Quote:

I don't agree with the sentence in bold.

Why? What makes tragic endings more likely to imress? Judging by your attitude to writers who use them, it cannot be that they have superior quality by default. And if you say that things balance out, it cannot be because of all the tragedy fanboys who love any ending, provided it's a sad one. So what is it? Maybe because only more serious shows have tragic endings, so the chances for memorable ending are bigger if we exclude all the comedy series?
The extreme example was a reaction against your extreme statement that it's so much easier to impress people with a sad resolution. If it was so, wouldn't killing off at least half of the cast in the last episode an almost sure road to success?

jedinat · 2007-02-25, 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matrim

Why? What makes tragic endings more likely to imress?

It's because people are stupid. Turn on the television and watch commercials for a few minutes. Or watch the news and actually listen to what the commentators are saying. People are stupid. And I'm too tired and apathetic to elaborate right now.

Matrim · 2007-02-25, 20:42

So people are stupid and tragic endings are more likely to impress, yet time and again we see forced happy endings which are there to increase the commercial success of the book/movie/anime/manga/whatever? That makes no sense.

jedinat · 2007-02-25, 20:57

Let me reword what you wrote a bit...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matrim

Time and again we see forced happy endings which are there to increase the commercial success of the book/movie/anime/manga/whatever, so tragic endings are more likely to impress.

Exactly.

Matrim · 2007-02-25, 21:39

They are more likely to impress only people tired of cliches who seem to be the minority. So the majority is more easily impressed by a happy ending. And I doubt that even most people in that minority are that tired by the happy ending cliche that they are so easily led to like a lot an ending whose main or only quality is the fact that it is tragic. Personally, I just want the ending to not feel forced and to fit with the rest, so while a tragic one would get points for originality, this alone won't impress me much.

2007-02-25, 14:44	Link #1
holyman282 Snape: "I hate Potter!" Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Australia	What's up With all the Sad and Bittersweet endings.. Well basically i've been watching a few anime lately such as, Elfen Lied, Utawarumono, KGNE, this ugly and beautiful world ect and i realised that most anime these days never have a good ending..... is it too cliche for a anime to just end happily these days, i mean it's not that hard... Even Pita-Ten, which i watched and thought was a happy ending, then upon reading the manga, realised otherwise... Why is anime these days leaning towards sad and bittersweet endings? Is this simply to make us think about life and the realities that things don't always end happily?

2007-02-25, 15:01	Link #2
Zu Ra ✖ ǝʇ ɯıqnɾl ☆ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Mortuary : D	IMO they are making anime more realastic . Anime chracters are always larger than life so a little dose of reality is added with a bitter sweet ending . They dont live happily ever after which is nice in a way . When I watched the last ep of Elfen Lied what was going on in my head was will Lucy live or die . That was my main fascination with the ending . Anime is a world of fantasy and fiction they are just merging fantasy with reality which is a nice thing makes the fantasy more belivable IMHO . __________________

2007-02-25, 16:10	Link #5
Areguzanda Ecchi! Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Oslo, Norway Age: 36	I liked the ending of Elfen Lied even though it never gave a clear vision of what happend. did she die? did she survive? this is the kind of endings I have a problem with but still like. because it's up to each individual person to use theire imagination to figure out what happend. thats the good thing. the thing I don't like is that you will never really know what happend even if you make you own vision of the end. So the end you thought of could be totally wrong, but then again it could be totally right. the problem is, you will never know. and i both Love and hate not knowing __________________

2007-02-25, 19:35	Link #14
Zu Ra ✖ ǝʇ ɯıqnɾl ☆ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Mortuary : D	The chracters thats died in most animes mentioned died were in line with the plot . If you take Naruto, Kishimoto actually sits and thinks who to kill off next the quota has to be filled up . The ratings have to go up The killings justified the plot at the end , not a delibarte case as some manga-kas do . __________________

2007-02-25, 20:42	Link #18
Matrim Naysayer?Fanboy?Wiseacre? Join Date: Dec 2005	So people are stupid and tragic endings are more likely to impress, yet time and again we see forced happy endings which are there to increase the commercial success of the book/movie/anime/manga/whatever? That makes no sense. __________________ 'The world we live in is always in darkness.' 'Yes, and that is why we seek light.'

2007-02-25, 15:08	Link #3
Moon Eclipse Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	possible back lash from all the "happy ending" animes that came before them?

2007-02-25, 15:09	Link #4
jedinat Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Age: 38	Because the creators are lazy and it's easy to manipulate the viewers emotions with tragedy.

2007-02-25, 18:25	Link #6
Maxon Demon Hunter Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Underground Age: 38	Sometimes a happy ending isn't a viable option. Writers may have thought of a happy ending but couldn't find a way to get to the happy ending that made sense. However, any ending is better than no ending... What grinds my gears are anime that end and nothing is actually decided or resolved.

2007-02-25, 18:26	Link #7
Mirrinus Bemused Scholar Join Date: Jan 2007 Age: 36	Kanon 2006 said it best: It's the "Schrödinger's Cat" tactic. Is the cat alive or dead? You want to find out, but you can't until you open the box (or in our case, finish the show). But you're right, I've been noticing this trend too. The most recent anime I finished was Hanbun no Tsuki ga Noboru Sora (OK, so I'm like a year late on that one...but still).

2007-02-25, 19:10	Link #10
jedinat Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Age: 38	It's just as easy to have a normal happy ending, yes. What I meant is I think it's much easier to come up with a "meaningful" or impressive tragic ending than a memorable happy one. How many sad endings have made you cry? How many happy ones?

2007-02-25, 21:39	Link #20
Matrim Naysayer?Fanboy?Wiseacre? Join Date: Dec 2005	They are more likely to impress only people tired of cliches who seem to be the minority. So the majority is more easily impressed by a happy ending. And I doubt that even most people in that minority are that tired by the happy ending cliche that they are so easily led to like a lot an ending whose main or only quality is the fact that it is tragic. Personally, I just want the ending to not feel forced and to fit with the rest, so while a tragic one would get points for originality, this alone won't impress me much. __________________ 'The world we live in is always in darkness.' 'Yes, and that is why we seek light.'