Ichigo and Rukia? or Ichigo and Orihime?

[Amirali]

Originally Posted by Elegant Destruction

Naruto is a typical 'boys manga' you can't really say the same for Bleach.

Elle, please don't say that. I took up Bleach as a boyish, geeky expression of simplistic violence and cool action. It loses the macho when someone points out that it actually has a decent story and good characterizations .

Originally Posted by Elegant Destruction

i do like ORIHIME as a character.

Originally Posted by Elegant Destruction

I truly believe she has a crush, in her usual sweet, innocent, and somewhat creepy way, but just a crush.

Why is unrequited love so creepy ? I have sympathy for Orihime because she's going through the most painful teenage experience.......having an important person who hardly knows her. Just as Rukia transformed Ichigo's life (as has been discussed at great length), he changed Orihime's. Saved her life multiple times, put her beloved brother to rest, triggered her powers, gave her lonely life some direction. It's only natural that she would fall for him (doesn't hurt that he's handsome). It's not like she's stalking some random stranger just because he's cute ..........now that might be creepy.

Originally Posted by Chiibi

Yeah, a crush is like how you feel about the cute person sitting behind you in sixth grade. Love is all about sacrifice and dedication and positive influence.

That actually supports my point. She's sacrificed enough risking her life and freedom that she deserves to be taken seriously (as wondermike pointed out earlier). What more can she dedicate besides that? Most 6th-graders may say they're willing to die for their squeeze........I rather doubt any would go through with it. As for positive influence, like I said above, Ichigo has made a tremendous impact on her life. Admittedly, she hasn't been an earth-shattering influence on him...........but if she's willing to die for her feelings......I won't trivialize them as being fake or a mere crush.


What further earns my respect is the mature way she's handled her unreturned feelings. Instead of resenting Rukia, she's trained with her and risked her life trying to save her (in SS arc). Her healing powers have helped save Ichigo and co time after time. Really, what more could one expect of Orihime? That she should kill herself so that she's out of the way? Or stop trying to fight alongside Ichigo and co, basically admitting that she can't get stronger?

Personally, even though I'm not an Ichi-Ori fan.........I'd respect her less if she changed her feelings so easily. He should be important in her heart for what he's done for her.........and I'm sure that she has the strength to move on, if and when Ichigo declares his feelings for Rukia publicly. Time and hunks like Grimm and Ulqi will heal any wounds of the heart she might suffer.

P.S: That rant wasn't meant for you Elle; I know you're an Orihime fan. Just that I wanted to get that off my chest for a while now. No offence meant.

[MalikIshtal]

When we were first introduced to Orihime I never liked her. She was the typical big titted sow with the IQ of watery ejaculate. For the most part she proved this true with her massive crushing and wet dreaming over her "Kurosaki-kun" to the point of borderline obessessing combined with her mostly pants on head retarded dialogue.

Nothing was particularly likable about the big bosomed mangafication of Mother Teresa because she was a boring character with no depth or dimension. A virtuous flower child who was pure and nice to a fault is not exactly going to make me like a character, not exactly asking for sassy bad ass chick but at least spice her up a bit D:

Her "twue luv" for "Kurosaki-kun" was best described as a cross between Shinobu's fawning over "Keitaro-Sempai" in Love Hina and Hinata Hyuga's crushing over "Naruto kun" and while at times it was cute for the most part it was boring and typical of shy girl "no speaka" to guy she "wuvs". Even after she professes her love to a vegetative Ichigo she hasn't exactly proved that her ZOMG LURV is geniune honest to goodness love. When you have to be reassured by Nel of all people that your precious "Kurosaki-kun" is still the same even when in Vaizard mode it makes me question the depth and sincerity of her profession of true love. Yes I understand she was scared of seeing this side of Ichigo but she needed a good kick in the arse to realize that her idealistic image of Ichigo that she fell in love with isn't exactly true

Despite her faults I am satisifed that the writer is trying to make Orihime a stronger and likable character. She is at least less one dimensional then before and has become more bold and assertive. Does that mean I expect to see Orihime and Ichigo begin to squirt babies by the truck load? No, it is definately far from that point, Orihime has a lot of growth as a person and with Ichigo before I consider her a viable contender for Ichigo's affection

Rukia isn't much closer to Ichigo's affection either, sure she cares for him and they had a lot of scenes that can be seen as declarations of love or good friend looking out for Ichigo, depending on where you stand with it, but there hasn't been one single scene that the 9 year old loli bait just blurts out "I like/love/want Ichigo" or implied by someone that has spoken with her and vice versa. It is not rare to see the more popular pairing in a series to be dumb down to brother/sister relationship in favor of the Mary Sue character of the story winning the heart of the protagonist. Its a real shame and not fair but what is in life?

So in short just wait and see what the writer decides to do with Orihime and Rukia as far as their own personal growth and development with Ichigo is concerned

[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by MalikIshtal

Even after she professes her love to a vegetative Ichigo she hasn't exactly proved that her ZOMG LURV is geniune honest to goodness love. When you have to be reassured by Nel of all people that your precious "Kurosaki-kun" is still the same even when in Vaizard mode it makes me question the depth and sincerity of her profession of true love. Yes I understand she was scared of seeing this side of Ichigo but she needed a good kick in the arse to realize that her idealistic image of Ichigo that she fell in love with isn't exactly true.

I see your point on this but to be fair, that was Orihime's first time seeing Ichigo fight with the mask on, while Nel had seen the mask come out twice before and knew the affects weren't permanent. Caring about someone isn't about blindly admiring them no matter what (i.e. Hinamori's "love" for Aizen). You can be horrified at what someone has become and still love them.

I actually saw Orihime's doubt there in a positive light. Someone who cared less about Ichigo may have been happy seeing the mask just realizing it gave Ichigo more power to fight Grimmjow (and therefore increase their chances of being rescued) rather than consider the negative affects the mask might have on Ichigo.

But other than that I agreed with most of your post. Pretty good.

[Amirali]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

I actually saw Orihime's doubt there in a positive light. Someone who cared less about Ichigo may have been happy seeing the mask just realizing it gave Ichigo more power to fight Grimmjow (and therefore increase their chances of being rescued) rather than consider the negative affects the mask might have on Ichigo.

Agreed. Considering that Ichigo himself was scared by his hollow side for a long time, I don't think it's wrong that Orihime would be worried by it also. Recall, she saw when he was fighting Yammi that his reiatsu was rough and darkened, and then she saw him suddenly unable to fight (because of hollow influence). So she knows at least vaguely that his powers have been troubled. Even now, like Hichigo said, if Ichi ever slips up.........he'll take over again. I think it's only natural that Orihime should be concerned for him.

[sorbet]

I think this is gonna be spoilers...and I'm arguing against IchiOri here.

Spoiler for well, spoiler:

Er...what? Why poeple still bringing up 'Orihime was scare for Ichigo' here? Orihme was scared of Ichigo. And while I don't think it was wrong of her to be scare of him (I actuallu laughed because so much for 5 lifetimes love). But it was her selfishness for whining about how Kurosaki Kun didn't seem like he was there to save her that killed IchiOri during GJ's fight.

There is nothing possitive about that doubt. It actually showed how disconnect they are. For someone who claimed to love Ichigo so much, for someone who claimed to came to HM to protect; her thoughts bet to differ. She was all about 'I wanted Kurosaki Kun to save me, to be here for me.' And right after the fight, Orihime was only glad that he came back to normal. What was that? So this mean the next time Ichigo uses that mask she will get scared again? And that is alright for a so-called couple?

To be honest, I don't see IchiOri happen anymore. I did think ch 283 was a great chapter for IchiOri. But Kubo mocked Orihime's 'don't get hurt' speech by having Ichigo got stabbed right away. It's not something you do for a 'canon' pairing.

Beside....Ichigo cared for Nel more than Orihime. All Ichigo and Orihime interactions are 'heal him and then he went off to fight or tell her to heal someone else.' It's pretty boring and not adding any development.

[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by sorbet

I think this is gonna be spoilers...and I'm arguing against IchiOri here.

Spoiler for well, spoiler:

Er...what? Why poeple still bringing up 'Orihime was scare for Ichigo' here? Orihme was scared of Ichigo. And while I don't think it was wrong of her to be scare of him (I actuallu laughed because so much for 5 lifetimes love). But it was her selfishness for whining about how Kurosaki Kun didn't seem like he was there to save her that killed IchiOri during GJ's fight.

There is nothing possitive about that doubt. It actually showed how disconnect they are. For someone who claimed to love Ichigo so much, for someone who claimed to came to HM to protect; her thoughts bet to differ. She was all about 'I wanted Kurosaki Kun to save me, to be here for me.' And right after the fight, Orihime was only glad that he came back to normal. What was that? So this mean the next time Ichigo uses that mask she will get scared again? And that is alright for a so-called couple?

To be honest, I don't see IchiOri happen anymore. I did think ch 283 was a great chapter for IchiOri. But Kubo mocked Orihime's 'don't get hurt' speech by having Ichigo got stabbed right away. It's not something you do for a 'canon' pairing.

Beside....Ichigo cared for Nel more than Orihime. All Ichigo and Orihime interactions are 'heal him and then he went off to fight or tell her to heal someone else.' It's pretty boring and not adding any development.

Spoiler:

We're trying to point out the difference between love and blind admiration. Always cheering on someone and never questioning them isn't love, that's being a fool. That's what Hinamori does with Aizen, veiling herself to the truth of who he really is.

Like amirali said, Orihime wasn't just afraid of Ichigo just because he was wearing a spooky mask. His reiatsu when he uses the mask is like that of a hollow, Orihime can feel it. Why wouldn't she be scared for/of him? Ichigo for a long time was frightened of his hollow.

BTW, Orihime was a large part of the reason Ichigo won the fight with GJ. Ichigo was giving in even with the mask on until Orihime started to cheer for him. Then the fight shifted in his favor. That speaks a lot to how much she means to him, since Nel was cheering him the entire fight, but it was Orihime was the one who gave him the boost he needed to win.

[MalikIshtal]

Spoiler for ::

Like I said before I'm glad this tension was shown with the Viazard Ichigo confrontation because it adds much needed depth to Orihime's character. It's not like Rukia who already acknowledged Ichigo's inner hollow and instilled the much needed courage into Ichigo so he can confront it.

Rukia is already at the point of acceptance since she is confident that Ichigo will be ok. Orihime on the other hand is FAR from Rukia like how far I am from finding a pretty single woman.

Orihime had this picture perfect image of Ichigo as painfully shown throughout the series. It's the whole bloody foundation of her love for the orange haired strawberry. For that to be shaken, shows how much she needs to grow as a character and how her innocent "wuv" for Ichigo needs to deepen and mature if she ever hopes to have a shot for Ichigo's heart.

[Nu Gundam]

Originally Posted by MalikIshtal

When we were first introduced to Orihime I never liked her. She was the typical big titted sow with the IQ of watery ejaculate.

Ranked 3rd in her Class.

Orihime had this picture perfect image of Ichigo as painfully shown throughout the series. It's the whole bloody foundation of her love for the orange haired strawberry.

I don't quite get this, when you say "Perfect image" do you mean she.... I don't even know what to suggest.....!


Orihme was scared of Ichigo.

Why poeple still bringing up 'Orihime was scare for Ichigo' here? Orihme was scared of Ichigo.

I'm going to sound like a dick here, but, uh, How do you know that?

It's not something you do for a 'canon' pairing.

I hate making posts like this, but you don't know that. There hasn't been any real examples of 'love' (Mutual, Proper, Getting married kinda thing) That you can use as a precedent. As a result, you have nothing to compare it to. Maybe Kubo Tite would rather have the love unfold that way? Who knows!

[Zu Ra]

There is something called Book smarts and Street Smarts . IQ is not taken over power of reproduction of matter . Japanese education system gives more emphasis on reproduction of matter . Even autistic people are known to posses book smarts

Kim Peek has a photographic or eidetic memory and developmental disabilities, possibly resulting from congenital brain abnormalities. He was the inspiration for the character of Raymond Babbit, played by Dustin Hoffman, in the movie Rain Man.

And why we say she is far from being intelligent , well she has acted nothing but intelligent in the whole manga . if we start calling Inoue intelligent it would seriously be insulting to characters like Ishida

[Nu Gundam]

Originally Posted by Geta Boshi

There is something called Book smarts and Street Smarts . IQ is not taken over power of reproduction of matter . Japanese education system gives more emphasis on reproduction of matter . Even autistic people are known to posses book smarts

Yeah, but "Street Smarts" are irrelevent when talking about IQ, which is directly correlated with "Book Smarts"

[MalikIshtal]

Sorry about the double post internet was acting rather stupid around that time.

The IQ bit referred to when we were first introduced to her, at this point we were uninformed of her book smarts. In my statement I clearly referred to her first introduction and my first impression of her.

I later pointed out my satisfaction on her growth and development so she doesn't look like she was hit in the head with a bat made out of frozen stupid.

Also what I meant is that orihime has this whole image of what she percieves Ichigo to be, the silent but good hearted scowling face tough manly orange haired man. She never could have fathomed in her little fantasy world a vicious or dark side within Ichigo, this side of Ichigo was such a 180 from her image of Ichigo that she even wondered if that was Ichigo right in front of her.

[Nu Gundam]

Originally Posted by MalikIshtal

Sorry about the double post internet was acting rather stupid around that time.

The IQ bit referred to when we were first introduced to her, at this point we were uninformed of her book smarts. In my statement I clearly referred to her first introduction and my first impression of her.

And shortly thereafter, we are informed of her underlying intelligence.

Also what I meant is that orihime has this whole image of what she percieves Ichigo to be, the silent but good hearted scowling face tough manly orange haired man. She never could have fathomed in her little fantasy world a vicious or dark side within Ichigo, this side of Ichigo was such a 180 from her image of Ichigo that she even wondered if that was Ichigo right in front of her.

You have a point.....sort of.....but, where do you get this from? I don't remember this being stated anywhere.....

[MalikIshtal]

Spoiler for ::

Chapter 282 pages 16 and 17 Orihime states
"Kurosaki-kun! Is that...really...you?"

Chapter 283 page 7 she futher continues by saying

"When I think back to those eyes...it feels like Ichigo has turned into a stranger"

From those lines you can see whatever image she had of "Kurosaki-kun" from that point was marred because this person right in front of her, fighting and nearly dying for her mind you, is not the person she percieved Ichigo to be at all.

This proves to be significant because it is the first time ever that her image...her vision...of who Ichigo is, was challenged. It was shaken the very moment she laid eyes on Vaizard Ichigo.

Once these battles are over how she copes with this side of Ichigo and her interactions with him from then on will most likely be the make or break of whether she got what it takes to be his significant other or not

[Nu Gundam]

Originally Posted by MalikIshtal

Spoiler for ::

Chapter 282 pages 16 and 17 Orihime states
"Kurosaki-kun! Is that...really...you?"

Chapter 283 page 7 she futher continues by saying

"When I think back to those eyes...it feels like Ichigo has turned into a stranger"

From those lines you can see whatever image she had of "Kurosaki-kun" from that point was marred because this person right in front of her, fighting and nearly dying for her mind you, is not the person she percieved Ichigo to be at all.

This proves to be significant because it is the first time ever that her image...her vision...of who Ichigo is, was challenged. It was shaken the very moment she laid eyes on Vaizard Ichigo.

Once these battles are over how she copes with this side of Ichigo and her interactions with him from then on will most likely be the make or break of whether she got what it takes to be his significant other or not

Ahhh, I see. Thanks.

[Marsala]

Originally Posted by MalikIshtal

Spoiler for ::

Chapter 282 pages 16 and 17 Orihime states
"Kurosaki-kun! Is that...really...you?"

Chapter 283 page 7 she futher continues by saying

"When I think back to those eyes...it feels like Ichigo has turned into a stranger"

From those lines you can see whatever image she had of "Kurosaki-kun" from that point was marred because this person right in front of her, fighting and nearly dying for her mind you, is not the person she percieved Ichigo to be at all.

This proves to be significant because it is the first time ever that her image...her vision...of who Ichigo is, was challenged. It was shaken the very moment she laid eyes on Vaizard Ichigo.

Once these battles are over how she copes with this side of Ichigo and her interactions with him from then on will most likely be the make or break of whether she got what it takes to be his significant other or not

Spoiler:

We've already seen a bit of that. In 286, Orihime thought, "Thank goodness... he's still the same Kurosaki-kun..." even though Ichigo was always the same throughout the battle. She still doesn't get him. This was contrasted with Nel who was only thankful that Ichigo hadn't died.

A bit later on, in 292 (I think), Orihime was hurt when Ichigo ignored her to stare at Nel and then jealous when she hugged him.

[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by MalikIshtal

Spoiler for ::

Like I said before I'm glad this tension was shown with the Viazard Ichigo confrontation because it adds much needed depth to Orihime's character. It's not like Rukia who already acknowledged Ichigo's inner hollow and instilled the much needed courage into Ichigo so he can confront it.

Rukia is already at the point of acceptance since she is confident that Ichigo will be ok. Orihime on the other hand is FAR from Rukia like how far I am from finding a pretty single woman.

Orihime had this picture perfect image of Ichigo as painfully shown throughout the series. It's the whole bloody foundation of her love for the orange haired strawberry. For that to be shaken, shows how much she needs to grow as a character and how her innocent "wuv" for Ichigo needs to deepen and mature if she ever hopes to have a shot for Ichigo's heart. I don't see how moment of doubt automatically invalidates OrihimeXIchigo, it was a natural reaction towards someone you care about.

Spoiler:

Yes, except you are neglecting one very important point: Rukia is a 150 year-old shinigami while Orihime is a 15-year old school girl. Rukia has been trained most of her life to deal with hollows. She has already dealt with a loved one being possessed by a hollow (the Kaien situation) she is in a much better position to react to Ichigo's situation than Orihime, who has practically no experience with this at all. Though we saw that when her brother became a hollow, she still sympathized with him despite what he had become.

Rukia's acceptance came from a overall better understanding of the situation, not a greater love of Ichigo. Even considering that, Orihime quickly accepted Ichigo's hollow side. She still continues to support him the same as she always has. I don't see how a moment of doubt invalidates the possibility of IchigoXOrihime. It's a natural reaction towards someone you care about.

[VaLerie-xX]

Well i dun really no, i think Ichigo would end up with Orihime
and Rukia would end up with Renji

[MalikIshtal]

Spoiler for :

Well didn't mean to imply that Rukia has a greater love for Ichigo, was leaning more towards what you pointed out that she has a better understanding of the situation because of her obviously superior maturity.

Thats the thing though, it shows that now. It would be a shame though to build up all that tension and conflict just to be completely resolved by some prompting by Nel. Honestly that wouldn't do those scenes justice. There is still so much more that can result from this that can ultimately be to Orihime's benefit. Her character is in dire need of development and growth.

[Kakashi]

I wonder how much Kubo enjoys thinking this stuff up at night. I agree with the above. Hopefully Orihimes character will unfold now.

[MalikIshtal]

Also incase anyone is wondering if I am pro IchiOri or pro IchiRuki. I am neither, I am pro good story telling, and if either pairing is well written and convincing then I am satisfied regardless of who Ichigo ends up with if anyone at all