[Anime-only] Naruto Shippuden Episode 214 Discussion

[MidnightViper88]

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

But just hitting home more and more how completely gone Sasuke is becoming. Is willing to and really is planning to kill just about everyone he used to know. Plus is living under some delusion that no one else in Konoha was unhappy other than him. Kind of pointless to compare personal tragedies, but in the end he wasn't the only one that suffered. Just the one that decided to focus his entire life on revenge and not trying to find some kind of happiness.

That's because of all of the side professions a ninja can take up, "therapist" is not one of them...

Originally Posted by HayashiTakara

Naruto is the most flashback heavy series I've ever seen... Surely the director can come up with better ways to stretch out an episode other than flashbacks... Prolonging the fight between Sasuke and Kakashi would've been a welcome filler over flashbacks.

Except for the fact that Sasuke already pulled enough out of his own ass in order to put out a fully-formed Susanoo and show off to Kakashi how axe crazy he's become, when he really should be dropping dead after exhausting his chakra resources during his fight against Danzo...Anything more than what had happened, and the suspension of disbelief would be left to the gallows due to overkill (For justification on the argument against absolute canon-based filler overkill, see Naruto Shippuden episode 167 )...

[Essenar]

Sasuke is such a selfish whiny little brat. "Don't get close to me or I'm gonna cut you! I hate you!"


I really wish someone would just kill him at this point. He's such a broken character with such a shallow "I hate the world" plot. Why do people even talk to him anymore? He's about as unpredictable as a bad guy in a Final Fight game. He's just gonna run at you and try to kill you.

[HiddenMessage]

Originally Posted by Essenar

Sasuke is such a selfish whiny little brat. "Don't get close to me or I'm gonna cut you! I hate you!"


I really wish someone would just kill him at this point. He's such a broken character with such a shallow "I hate the world" plot. Why do people even talk to him anymore? He's about as unpredictable as a bad guy in a Final Fight game. He's just gonna run at you and try to kill you.

Pretty sure most of the characters that appeared in this episode had the intention to kill him. If naruto didn't feel like it before, he will now.

[Arjento]

For me...this is the episode that Sasuke has finally crossed over.

There's no way back.

[Suika-Esper]

Originally Posted by MidnightViper88

That's because of all of the side professions a ninja can take up, "the rapist" is not one of them...

In Sasuke's case, there might be an exception. He is trying to revive his clan afterall.

But yeah, he should be about ready to drop dead at this point. Fighting the Kages AND Danzo? And now Kakashi?

Spoiler for size:

[octaviahawk]

well, defiantly a step up from the last two weeks. Oh the drama. And I didn't mind the flashbacks as much...since there was more substance to this week's episode. Of course, that could just be because my standards have been lowered after the torture of the last two weeks :-P

[Ushio the Omega]

Originally Posted by HayashiTakara

Too much filler flashbacks for my tastes, but better than last week. So decent overall.

Again Sakura has proven how useless she is

This epsiode covered 2 chapters perfectly and yes Sakura's flashback this episode happend in the manga as well.

Originally Posted by MidnightViper88

Well, I actually appreciated the episode...Not much actually happened, but it was still fun to watch...

At this point, it's pretty clear that Sasuke can outclass Kakashi, but I was surprised at how much Sasuke has changed from one fight to another...It looks like Sasuke can now form Susanoo on the same level as Itachi, but really? That has to drain a lot of chakra...I thought just at the end of Danzo's fight he expended all of his chakra, but now he can somehow muster enough to put out a fully-formed Susanoo? I guess that raged lack of thinking is what's preventing Sasuke from having anything nice, because he's going blind now...Well, I guess he could pluck Itachi's eyes, but they're probably rotting now...Unless Itachi's head is kept in a jar, a-la Futurama...Or not...

It's nice to see Kakashi use Mangekyo Sharingan and Kamui without passing out at the end of things too...It can be often overlooked the fact that up until this point, Sasuke wasn't aware of Kakashi's Mangekyo Sharingan...It's a shame Kakashi's trying so hard to be optimistic with a Sasuke turnover, that I'm sure Kamui might be effective at messing Sasuke's day up, more so when Sasuke had the disadvantage of only being able to see red X's...

Poor Sakura; She has the right idea, but she hasn't the resolve...

Poor Karin, too; "Stop looking so sad, you're crying on my face!"

The end of the episode was marred with a flashback, but at the very least, it's a retold scene with different dialogue and new animation efforts...For once, I didn't mind the flashback, because it wasn't a total replay of the same old Part I scene we've seen since forever now (Though I still mind my justification for flashbacks from the last episode's discussion thread)...

Speaking of animation, I really loved how smooth everything looked, both the aesthetic detailing and the consistency of animation fluidity...Starting with the first scuffle between Sasuke and Kakashi, I knew this was going to be a good-looking episode...But even with everything covered in flesh lacquer, the anime team still makes Sasuke look like a damned rapist; I guess it's the only way to show how far off the deep end he's gone...

After beating Danzo Sasuke bit Karin which restored his chakra. The flashback happened in the manga so had to happen and Kakashi's arguments suck.

Kakashi - So Konoha orchastrated the massacre of your entire family it doesn't justify this anger you have to let it go. WTF

Originally Posted by Maxtro

Ugh! Why did the episode have a long-ass flashback at the end? It totally ruined the pacing

For the love of god, throw in a filler fight between Kakashi and Sasuke. Have them do taijutsu and ninjutsu to each other for 10 minutes then Sasuke pulls out his Susan'o. I don't care if it's not in the manga, it would have been awesome and infinitely better than flashbacks.

Man, I really want to watch a Naruto kai. Give Naruto the same treatment Dragonball Z got. I wouldn't mind watching it all over again from the beginning but with all the fillers, flashbacks and long stares cut out.

Flashback happend in the manga so give it a rest.

Originally Posted by Casshern

At this point Sasuke has the same "main character privileges" as Naruto i.e he can be completely out of energy but he'll still manage to pull some more out if the plot demands. This was the best opportunity anyone could have to take out Sasuke and they still failed. What that says is basically, Sasuke is for Naruto to take care of.

Er do you actually watch this series as after the chakra blade dual with Danzo, Sasuke bit Karin which you know HEALED HIM and restored his chakra.

Originally Posted by HayashiTakara

Believe it!

lol... I couldn't help myself...

Naruto is the most flashback heavy series I've ever seen... Surely the director can come up with better ways to stretch out an episode other than flashbacks... Prolonging the fight between Sasuke and Kakashi would've been a welcome filler over flashbacks.

This epsiode covered 2 chapters perfectly and yes Sakura's flashback this episode happend in the manga as well.

[kitten320]

Ah damn! Just come on! We saw this flashback 2 weeks ago already! Do they have any difference? Because I didn't bother to watch them.

And for those who want a filler Kakshi/Sasuke fight, here you go! A very good fan made animation:

[Frenchie]

Originally Posted by Maxtro

Ugh! Why did the episode have a long-ass flashback at the end? It totally ruined the pacing

For the love of god, throw in a filler fight between Kakashi and Sasuke. Have them do taijutsu and ninjutsu to each other for 10 minutes then Sasuke pulls out his Susan'o. I don't care if it's not in the manga, it would have been awesome and infinitely better than flashbacks.

Man, I really want to watch a Naruto kai. Give Naruto the same treatment Dragonball Z got. I wouldn't mind watching it all over again from the beginning but with all the fillers, flashbacks and long stares cut out.

It's so funny that you'd ask for a Dragonball Kai to get rid of all fillers when you've just asked for a filler fight between Kakashi vs Sasuke to pad out the encounter.

lols.

[LadyKikyo91]

Originally Posted by Arjento

For me...this is the episode that Sasuke has finally crossed over.

There's no way back.

Don't be so sure this is shounen after. If its Shounen there's a way. Sasuke should be completely evil right about now I will admit. Tragic. I liked him in part one and at the beginning of part two. Now he's a brat and an insane brat at that.

[Fran~]

Remember Raikage words to Naruto about Sasuke, that he will be hunting not only by him (Raikage) but as a international terrorist he will be hunted by every ninja. Sasuke told directly to Sakura and Kakashi that he will destroy Konoha... and Naruto saw him almost killing Sakura.

This is different from your standard Shounen, Team 7 can hold feelings for him, but they have feelings for Konoha and their friends too... and Sasuke is threatening them.

[Maxtro]

Originally Posted by kitten320

Ah damn! Just come on! We saw this flashback 2 weeks ago already! Do they have any difference? Because I didn't bother to watch them.

And for those who want a filler Kakshi/Sasuke fight, here you go! A very good fan made animation:

OMG, thank you! That was miles better than today's episode.

Heck with the dialog rerecorded into Japanese, it could be edited into the actual episode.

Originally Posted by Frenchie

It's so funny that you'd ask for a Dragonball Kai to get rid of all fillers when you've just asked for a filler fight between Kakashi vs Sasuke to pad out the encounter.

lols.

There is a huge difference between a filler fight that can be completely amazing, and a filler arcs and non-stop flashbacks.

[Frenchie]

Originally Posted by Maxtro

There is a huge difference between a filler fight that can be completely amazing, and a filler arcs and non-stop flashbacks.

No, not really. Whether filler is amazing or not, it's filler.

[yogotah]

Originally Posted by Arjento

For me...this is the episode that Sasuke has finally crossed over.

There's no way back.

Sad but true. Only the miraculous would convert him back to being "sane", but theres no way in hell that he's ever going to be friends or associate himself with the leaf.

Sasuke has always been my favorite character. I started watching the show because of his fights, and I've stuck with him through the b.s he has done but I really was surprised how easy it becomes to him to kill off his current/former camarades. I totally understand sasuke's logic, and his anger is justified but the way he handles it is a bit overboard.

and he's clearly being manipulated by mardara, who I hate, so that's a nail in the coffin

[MidnightViper88]

Originally Posted by Suika-Esper

In Sasuke's case, there might be an exception. He is trying to revive his clan afterall.

OH, I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE, SEAN CONNERY!

Originally Posted by Ushio the Omega

After beating Danzo Sasuke bit Karin which restored his chakra. The flashback happened in the manga so had to happen and Kakashi's arguments suck.

Kakashi - So Konoha orchastrated the massacre of your entire family it doesn't justify this anger you have to let it go. WTF

Yeah, OK...Sasuke started at 100%, nearly burned out his eyes on Susanoo and held a marathon against Danzo, pulling him down to only enough power to manipulate Chidori and use the Mangekyo Sharingan for a finishing kill or two...So I'm supposed to believe that biting Karin for 5 seconds would allow him to muster just a little more strength for a more formed Susanoo against Kakashi for a longer duration than what would be expected? If anything was restored, it was Sasuke's arrogance, since he's going blind now after overclocking his eyes just to prove a point...A lot of wasted effort based on just the ego...

Kakashi's arguments are idealistic in that Sasuke could still change, and they only suck in that they're a desperate attempt to persuade Sasuke against revenge...You can say what you will about the higher-ups in Konoha that knew about the Uchiha massacre; If what Madara is saying to be true, then it goes against the very thing Itachi was trying to keep Sasuke away from...Itachi cared about Konoha, didn't want any harm to be brought to Sasuke, and hoped the Uchiha's clan would be brought back in his pride; Instead, Sasuke has now painted a target on his head with a dose of disgrace, and is willing to kill anyone and everyone that gets in his way or has affiliation to Konoha, even those not directly involved in any remote way with the Uchiha massacre...

Sasuke is an ass that acts like no one could understand from a logical viewpoint the wrongs that happened in Itachi's lifetime, that no one but the Uchiha have ever remotely came to the same amount of emotional pain and suffering Sasuke has went through...I would dare anyone to argue in favor of Sasuke at this point...

At the same time, Madara is an ass too, for feeling it's necessary that the Uchiha be doomed to the same fate as the older son of the Sage of Six Paths had originally started, continuing on with Sasuke and with Naruto as the lineage liason for the Sage's younger son and the Senju...Instead of breaking the mold and trying to change things, Madara's still stuck on a feud that must be many generations old...Madara twisted Sasuke to another path of revenge after revenge against Itachi was already achieved, in a way kind of making Sasuke a tool of Madara's, but not completely, since it's a fact that Sasuke has a personal mindset differing from that of Madara's own goals...

I don't know where you're going with the flashback comment, though...

[BigGimp77]

As someone who doesn't read the manga, I'm preparing myself to be disappointed.

Finally Naruto and Sasuke meet, but I imagine there will be little to no fight. I can picture it now...

Naruto "It's time to settle this Sasuke....."
Then Madara ninja teleports Sasuke out of there.

They are obviously not going to have Naruto vs Sasuke without both men being 100% physically.

[HasuMasu]

hhmm, nice, guess naruto used up his nature energy to run faster, datz owrigh

anyway, would've been better if sasuke tried to kill sakura with a chidori then naruto came in and busted a rasengan in his ass, but i guess i'll just have to wait, you never know

[Casshern]

Originally Posted by MidnightViper88

...I would dare anyone to argue in favor of Sasuke at this point...

Sasuke is taking an eye for an eye. There are no innocents in his view, just as there were no innocents when Itachi killed every helpless elderly and baby Uchiha. It doesn't really matter what Itachi wanted at this point. Itachi himself filled Sasuke with hatred, now the rest of the world has to deal with it. Whenever Sasuke started to feel at peace in team 7, Itachi would torture him with tsukiyomi and feed him with more hatred. It's because Itachi couldn't let it go that Sasuke abandoned Konoha, brought Itachi's death, encountered Madara and turned against konoha. Everything Sasuke is doing was within Itachi's expectations, hence the implanted amaterasu in Sasuke's eye and the gift he gave Naruto.

Btw, both Sakura and Kakashi went there with the intention to kill Sasuke. Neither of them is innocent. Also, Sasuke hasn't actually taken any action against Konoha yet. He took out Oro who was an enemy of Konoha, Itachi was on the verge of dying and granted Sasuke his revenge while he still could, and he also took out Danzo who had betrayed the council. As far as konoha should be concerned, Sasuke is nothing more than a rogue ninja. You didn't see konoha going out of their way to take out Orochimaru, even after he leveled konoha to the ground, yet Sakura feels that Sauke should die for what he's done. What has he done again? Reject her?


Well these forums have seen this discussion over and over again with every possible argument being iterated several times and in the end everyone leaves with the same opinion they came with.

[Kakashi]

Yeah, in this episode Sasuke's insanity was taken too far. I think this step was unecessary. As we saw from the flashbacks, Sasuke always had a speck of morality, even if his actions were misguided...even while he was with Orochimaru. Not anymore! The reasons for his hatred is not well explained at all, it was just a plot device to make obvious the Naruto/Sasuke dichotomy that Kishi is going for, at the price of Sasuke becoming completely mindless and dislikable.

As for the episode, it was exactly the same as in the manga except for the flashbacks and one or two things in the fight which make it better. I was looking foward to this fight but it turned out not to be much of a fight and an opportunity for Naruto to come and save the day. I actually like the encounter, it's a shame more wasn't done with the opportunity.

[Vindi89]

Originally Posted by Casshern

Sasuke is taking an eye for an eye.

Btw, both Sakura and Kakashi went there with the intention to kill Sasuke. Neither of them is innocent. Also, Sasuke hasn't actually taken any action against Konoha yet. He took out Oro who was an enemy of Konoha, Itachi was on the verge of dying and granted Sasuke his revenge while he still could, and he also took out Danzo who had betrayed the council. As far as konoha should be concerned, Sasuke is nothing more than a rogue ninja. You didn't see konoha going out of their way to take out Orochimaru, even after he leveled konoha to the ground, yet Sakura feels that Sauke should die for what he's done. What has he done again? Reject her?

So... Konoha knows Sasuke has turned against them...the international community knows Sasuke is an ally of Akatsuki (who want to take over the world) and hell even you know it (hence your bold statement ending with "yet") but Konoha is suppose to sit around and wait for him to attack them outright before they decide to do something? The only reason he never got to Konoha was because Pain beat him to it.

Anyways, Sakura was the only one who went there with the intention to kill Sasuke. Kakashi came to save her and Naruto to save the both of them. And... just because the main characters weren't involved in looking for Orochimaru doesn't mean Konoha didn't have ninjas out looking for him. We only saw the main characters involvement in that search during part 2.

And finally... I have no clue how you can say Sasuke is only taking an eye for an eye. He's the biggest hypocrite ever working with/ accepting help from the guy that helped Itachi kill the Uchiha clan. Also..what did Karin ever do for Sasuke except help him... was she part of his revenge plan too? What about the rest of his team that he abandoned?