(L) Mushoku Tensei -Isekai Ittara Honki Dasu- [WN]

[Darknemo2000]

I was saying Gandalf as an example. Frodo is MC but lets say Gandalf was MC and then you would jump to useless Frodo as MC. This would be a downgrade. And thats how it feels if you go from Rudi to Akihito. This is setting up to novel popularity drop unless you somehow increase significantly in how interesting plot is or how good characters surrounding MC are. i dont think he can improve that it that much so if Akihito becomes MC I can see the readership for this series start to drop.

No one likes from having more falling to having less. We cant start from blank page. We already have Rudi. Akihito will always get compared to Rudi and will always fail to match him. And I think novels popularity will also take a hit with that as well, unless again the supporting cast is much more interesting now and can carry the story on their own with a weak MC dragging behind.

[yulinard]

Originally Posted by Darknemo2000

I was saying Gandalf as an example. Frodo is MC but lets say Gandalf was MC and then you would jump to useless Frodo as MC. This would be a downgrade. And thats how it feels if you go from Rudi to Akihito. This is setting up to novel popularity drop unless you somehow increase significantly in how interesting plot is or how good characters surrounding MC are. i dont think he can improve that it that much so if Akihito becomes MC I can see the readership for this series start to drop.

No one likes from having more falling to having less. We cant start from blank page. We already have Rudi. Akihito will always get compared to Rudi and will always fail to match him. And I think novels popularity will also take a hit with that as well, unless again the supporting cast is much more interesting now and can carry the story on their own with a weak MC dragging behind.

I think it doesnt mater if it was a difrent story. Like I said before Rudeus story is in MT. Akihito story is another. There's previous story about Dragon Kingdom.

And I dont think the novel popularity will drop. MT alone already seinen, not shounen power fantasy. The author already said over and over that it will be a difrent story, and weak MC, looking at sucess of LoTR, i dont think it will matter.

Or you can always go back to other power fantasy novel. There are many of them.

[Darknemo2000]

Originally Posted by yulinard

I think it doesnt mater if it was a difrent story. Like I said before Rudeus story is in MT. Akihito story is another. There's previous story about Dragon Kingdom.

And I dont think the novel popularity will drop. MT alone already seinen, not shounen power fantasy. The author already said over and over that it will be a difrent story, and weak MC, looking at sucess of LoTR, i dont think it will matter.

Or you can always go back to other power fantasy novel. There are many of them.

Lots sucess was because of supporting cast and the world set up. MC was a failure. Frodo never could carry the story as his own. Sam was far better developed than Frodo. LOTR strength was its supporting cast and plot.

Does this story has it? World maybe. Supporting cast? Have no idea. Some of Rudi story-line characters were strong and well made (Roxy, Eris) some wear weak (Sylphy, Luke), but MC was strong and real good and could carry the plot by himself.

Now a new MC doesnt seem like he will be capable of doing it. He will be useless MC in most cases differently from Rudy, so the author will have to step-up his game as far as supporting cast goes. He really needs to create a good supporting characters around MC like in LOTR, because now relying on MC to carry the story is out of the question.

[yulinard]

Originally Posted by Darknemo2000

Lots sucess was because of supporting cast and the world set up. MC was a failure. Frodo never could carry the story as his own. Sam was far better developed than Frodo. LOTR strength was its supporting cast and plot.

Does this story has it? World maybe. Supporting cast? Have no idea. Some of Rudi story-line characters were strong and well made (Roxy, Eris) some wear weak (Sylphy, Luke), but MC was strong and real good and could carry the plot by himself.

Now a new MC doesnt seem like he will be capable of doing it. He will be useless MC in most cases differently from Rudy, so the author will have to step-up his game as far as supporting cast goes. He really needs to create a good supporting characters around MC like in LOTR, because now relying on MC to carry the story is out of the question.

First let me repeat again about my opinion. The new story will be more LoTR like, while MT is not.

The author already showed us who are those supporting characters. There are total 7 support character, all already mentioned. A total of 8 with MC.

Akihito as MC
Orsted
Lara Greyrat
Ars grand daughter
Luicelia
Nanahoshi
"Miko"
Another Japanese, posibly Akihito friend and Lara husband.

Regarding the new MC can take the story or not? Mostlikely he can because dealing with Hitogami, you need to be invisible to him not just being OP. Orsted fail 200+ times because he was alone, cursed and hated despite being the most OP of the story.

So there you go. In LoTR style: Akihito = Frodo, Orsted = Gandalf. Lara = Legolas. Luicelia = Gimli. Ars grand daughter = Boromir. Nanahoshi, Miko and lara husband/boyfriend = the extra Hobbits.

[Wargumm1i]

Is there a sequel? or are people just deluding themselves.

[Xellos-_^]

the author already said MT is prequel the real story will be Akihito and company against hito.

[Rageth]

Since when was it said Akito can't be seen by Hitogami? He could see Nanahoshi just fine, so why not Akito?

Just because "he's never seen him before?" Same thing applied to Rudeus until he came intoo existence. Akito wasn't recognized, because he didn't exist yet.

Originally Posted by yulinard

Another Japanese, posibly Akihito friend and Lara husband.

?? What?
What fanfiction is this from? Or did the author actually say anything about Lara getting married to him?

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by Rageth

Since when was it said Akito can't be seen by Hitogami? He could see Nanahoshi just fine, so why not Akito?

Hito can't see her.

[Rageth]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Hito can't see her.

Since when? He never said he couldn't.
In fact, Rudy being able to successfully make it to Bageritt continent was thanks to Nanahoshi's existence, which was supposedly within Hitogami's prediction.

Is there anywhere that says he can't see her? Or are you just guessing?

[yulinard]

Originally Posted by Rageth

Since when? He never said he couldn't.
In fact, Rudy being able to successfully make it to Bageritt continent was thanks to Nanahoshi's existence, which was supposedly within Hitogami's prediction.

Is there anywhere that says he can't see her? Or are you just guessing?

Orsted already said that Hitogami cant see people who deffy that world's law. Nanahoshi never get single visit from Hitogami although she was very close with Orsted.

Originally Posted by Rageth

?? What?
What fanfiction is this from? Or did the author actually say anything about Lara getting married to him?

Spoiler for ? Person ?:

When she did, the man beside her started talking with her.
Perhaps he was asking what she was doing.
She answered something to him and then that man turned this way with a surprised face.
He also had an Oriental face.
People with faces like that were few in this world.
Perhaps he’s Japanese?
He might be in his 20s....doesn’t feel like he’s in his 30s.

He faced this way and quickly bowed.
His actions seemed Japanese, so he’s Japanese after all.
Possibly.

Please note that the author also wrote this 2 paraghraphs beefore so they cant be the same person

Spoiler for Akihito:

The one who was talking was....a boy.
Probably 17~18 years old.
With short hair, a good-looking guy with a sportsmanlike face.
That’s definitely the face of a Riajuu.1
He looked Oriental.
Still, that’s a nice smiling face he’s got there. I wonder if Orsted’s curse was ineffective on him.

[Amuris]

Originally Posted by Darknemo2000

Now a new MC doesnt seem like he will be capable of doing it. He will be useless MC in most cases differently from Rudy, so the author will have to step-up his game as far as supporting cast goes. He really needs to create a good supporting characters around MC like in LOTR, because now relying on MC to carry the story is out of the question.

Alot of your argument comes from the assumption that Rudy was a powerful MC. He wasn't though, he was a MC that HAD power. His defining trait wasn't that he was strong. Just like how most of the fights mostly served to show off the connections and bonds that Rudy built throughout the story, the development of his magic was actually just to show the diligence and humility he had learned with Roxy. It was just to show that he never stopped trying to improve his abilities or assumed that they were complete/perfect as well as the result of that mentality. It was never important that Rudy was strong in and of itself.

[kazzuya]

Rudy never consider himself as strong and when he did someone would appear and beat him senseless. when he was young it was paul. and then Orsted when in his travel. and when finished adventuring it was Badigadi. and many more characters in the course.of the story

[ththth13]

Originally Posted by Rageth

Since when? He never said he couldn't.
In fact, Rudy being able to successfully make it to Bageritt continent was thanks to Nanahoshi's existence, which was supposedly within Hitogami's prediction.

Is there anywhere that says he can't see her? Or are you just guessing?

Actually, that probably was not Hitogami's prediction. He wants to get rid of Rudy and his wives, not help them. If Rudy had went there without Nanahoshi, it would have taken years. He would have been too late, while Sylphy would have been alone and easy to get rid of. It would have been a bad end, but Nanahoshi changed it.

[yulinard]

Originally Posted by ththth13

Actually, that probably was not Hitogami's prediction. He wants to get rid of Rudy and his wives, not help them. If Rudy had went there without Nanahoshi, it would have taken years. He would have been too late, while Sylphy would have been alone and easy to get rid of. It would have been a bad end, but Nanahoshi changed it.

Hitogami get alot of misscalculation because Nanahoshi. First most she talk japanese with Rudy in front of Sylphy, which make her super jealous and re think that her possition of childhood friend in danger. Second Nanahoshi introduce teleportation circle to Rudy. Third introducing Rudeus to Pergius. I wonder how Derek managed to meet Pergius but in this time line he is long dead, replaced by Nanahoshi.

[Rageth]

Originally Posted by yulinard

Orsted already said that Hitogami cant see people who deffy that world's law. Nanahoshi never get single visit from Hitogami although she was very close with Orsted.

Being close to Orsted is most likely the reason. And then there's the fact that she wouldn't have listened to a word Hitogami said anyways, because of Orsted.
If the logic is the coming from another world makes you immune to Hitogami, then 90% of the story would not exist, because Rudy was still

Originally Posted by yulinard

Spoiler for ? Person ?:

When she did, the man beside her started talking with her.
Perhaps he was asking what she was doing.
She answered something to him and then that man turned this way with a surprised face.
He also had an Oriental face.
People with faces like that were few in this world.
Perhaps he’s Japanese?
He might be in his 20s....doesn’t feel like he’s in his 30s.

He faced this way and quickly bowed.
His actions seemed Japanese, so he’s Japanese after all.
Possibly.

Please note that the author also wrote this 2 paraghraphs beefore so they cant be the same person

Spoiler for Akihito:

The one who was talking was....a boy.
Probably 17~18 years old.
With short hair, a good-looking guy with a sportsmanlike face.
That’s definitely the face of a Riajuu.1
He looked Oriental.
Still, that’s a nice smiling face he’s got there. I wonder if Orsted’s curse was ineffective on him.

Yes, I read that part.
Question: Where the does it say they were Lara's husband? Or were you talking about someone else entirely?

————

Originally Posted by ththth13

Actually, that probably was not Hitogami's prediction. He wants to get rid of Rudy and his wives, not help them. If Rudy had went there without Nanahoshi, it would have taken years. He would have been too late, while Sylphy would have been alone and easy to get rid of. It would have been a bad end, but Nanahoshi changed it.

Originally Posted by yulinard

Hitogami get alot of misscalculation because Nanahoshi. First most she talk japanese with Rudy in front of Sylphy, which make her super jealous and re think that her possition of childhood friend in danger. Second Nanahoshi introduce teleportation circle to Rudy. Third introducing Rudeus to Pergius. I wonder how Derek managed to meet Pergius but in this time line he is long dead, replaced by Nanahoshi.

Nanahoshi never broke any of his predictions though? Hitogami said that Rudy and Roxy were destined to meet and have a child no matter what. Thus it was in Hitogami's interest to kill Roxy and her child while she was pregnant. So setting up a scenario where he can kill her was best. Roxy would have survived anyways, if Rudy didn't get there, by some stroke of luck.
Her existence also doesn't stop Sylphy from going after Rudeus; it actually encourages her to go after him, before she loses him. He wanted to get them together, and then kill them off afterwards. There's no other reason for Hitogami to send Rudy to the magic school otherwise. The fact that he sent him there is proof that he wanted to get him together with Sylphy, likely to set up the future events.

Everything from Oldeus timeline shows just how his plan went; not only did he manage to kill Roxy, he also got rid of Ariel, through Sylphy and Luke. Meeting with Pergius was meaningless, because without Derek, she couldn't get his approval, because she normally wouldn't have come up with an adequate answer, without Rudy specifically reminding her of him..


Nanahoshi in no way hindered or circumvented Hitogami's plots; you could even say she helped a little in pushing them forward.

[yulinard]

Originally Posted by Rageth

Being close to Orsted is most likely the reason. And then there's the fact that she wouldn't have listened to a word Hitogami said anyways, because of Orsted.
If the logic is the coming from another world makes you immune to Hitogami, then 90% of the story would not exist, because Rudy was still

Rudy is close to Orsted but when his braclet is cut off he meet Hitogami instantly. Nanahoshi never have such braclet, she do have a communication ring but it was loaned for some time.

Originally Posted by Rageth

Yes, I read that part.
Question: Where the does it say they were Lara's husband? Or were you talking about someone else entirely?

Just my speculation since he ask Lara for aproval. probably will be explained in Lara short sory.

Originally Posted by Rageth

Nanahoshi never broke any of his predictions though? Hitogami said that Rudy and Roxy were destined to meet and have a child no matter what. Thus it was in Hitogami's interest to kill Roxy and her child while she was pregnant. So setting up a scenario where he can kill her was best. Roxy would have survived anyways, if Rudy didn't get there, by some stroke of luck.

I wonder why Hitogami try so hard to convince Rudy to mary the cat princess rather than rescuing his mother. The author already said Hitogami lie about Roxy rescued by other adventurer.

Originally Posted by Rageth

Her existence also doesn't stop Sylphy from going after Rudeus; it actually encourages her to go after him, before she loses him. He wanted to get them together, and then kill them off afterwards. There's no other reason for Hitogami to send Rudy to the magic school otherwise. The fact that he sent him there is proof that he wanted to get him together with Sylphy, likely to set up the future events.

Like I said Rudy marry her instead the cat princess. She became more agressive because she think that "childhood friend" status is in danger.

Originally Posted by Rageth

Everything from Oldeus timeline shows just how his plan went; not only did he manage to kill Roxy, he also got rid of Ariel, through Sylphy and Luke. Meeting with Pergius was meaningless, because without Derek, she couldn't get his approval, because she normally wouldn't have come up with an adequate answer, without Rudy specifically reminding her of him..


Nanahoshi in no way hindered or circumvented Hitogami's plots; you could even say she helped a little in pushing them forward.

If Rudy stay and take cat princess as his second wive as Hitogami sugested, Roxy die.

Ariel will die because her entire effort sabotaged by Luke, not because she dont have Pergius aproval.

[Rageth]

But there's no reason for Hitogami to contact Nanahoshi from the start? She was an acquaintance to Orsted, so manipulating her would be difficult. Talking to her at all gave no merit.

Even at Hitogami's suggestion, Rudy was already planning to leave for Roxy, and Nanahoshi only gave him a faster route.
Hitogami already saw that Rudy and Roxy would end up together. He said so himself; no matter what he planned, every path led to the two together and with a child. So rather than trying to keep them away, it's better for him to push the two together already, so when she gets pregnant, he can expose her to the magic stone disease.

He knew Rudy wouldn't have gone for any of the princesses; hell, he knew Rudies would go try to save Zenith—literally no other reason for him to have Gisu send that message.

He set that up, so that Rudy would trust Hitogami when it finally came time for his "favor".

Ultimately, there's nothing that suggests or proves that Nanahoshi can't be seen by Hitogami. However we have proof that her existence never broke any of his plans, so her existence was likely taken into account.

[yulinard]

Originally Posted by Rageth

But there's no reason for Hitogami to contact Nanahoshi from the start? She was an acquaintance to Orsted, so manipulating her would be difficult. Talking to her at all gave no merit.

Or like Orsted said he simply cant see her. You mentioned earlier that Rudy is anomally. He is not. he was born in that world, can use magic and have no other super power like Lilya.

Originally Posted by Rageth

Even at Hitogami's suggestion, Rudy was already planning to leave for Roxy, and Nanahoshi only gave him a faster route.
Hitogami already saw that Rudy and Roxy would end up together. He said so himself; no matter what he planned, every path led to the two together and with a child. So rather than trying to keep them away, it's better for him to push the two together already, so when she gets pregnant, he can expose her to the magic stone disease.

Nope he was encouraged by his surrounding to help his mother. This show us the limit of Hitogami power. He was limited up to giving people sugestion.

If he stay with cat princess, Roxy will die, Without Nanahoshi Roxy will die.

Originally Posted by Rageth

He knew Rudy wouldn't have gone for any of the princesses; hell, he knew Rudies would go try to save Zenith—literally no other reason for him to have Gisu send that message.

No, that show us the limit of his power.

Originally Posted by Rageth

He set that up, so that Rudy would trust Hitogami when it finally came time for his "favor".

Rudi almost die in that Labyrinth. Roxy too.

Originally Posted by Rageth

Ultimately, there's nothing that suggests or proves that Nanahoshi can't be seen by Hitogami. However we have proof that her existence never broke any of his plans, so her existence was likely taken into account.

The one who said that was Orsted. Hitogami realy dont have any plan, since unlike Orsted he does not loop. He improvise every time and use anything available to him.

[Rageth]

Originally Posted by yulinard

Or like Orsted said he simply cant see her. You mentioned earlier that Rudy is anomally. He is not. he was born in that world, can use magic and have no other super power like Lilya.

Neither does Nanahoshi have any power. Her soul should be the same as Rudy's, having come from the same world. Only her body was odd.

Originally Posted by yulinard

Nope he was encouraged by his surrounding to help his mother. This show us the limit of Hitogami power. He was limited up to giving people sugestion.

If he stay with cat princess, Roxy will die, Without Nanahoshi Roxy will die.
——
No, that show us the limit of his power.

Now you're making things up. Hitogami has already demonstrated his power to see the future. Are you seriously now trying to say that everyone around Rudy is immune to Hitogami's powers too?
Are you now going to tell me that Hitogami wasn't lying to Luke when he said Rudy was after Ariel, but "the limit to his power" didn't account for Rudy not wanting to cheat on Sylphy or some shit?

You already said Hitogami can lie; why can he only lie about what you said he did?

Originally Posted by yulinard

Rudi almost die in that Labyrinth. Roxy too.

Yes, and?

Originally Posted by yulinard

The one who said that was Orsted. Hitogami realy dont have any plan, since unlike Orsted he does not loop. He improvise every time and use anything available to him.

But he can see possible futures. This has been the plot since the beginning. He creates plans for setting things up down the line, but Orsted interferes, and that's when he has to improvise.

Or will you now deny that he can see the future too?
If he can't see it, then why would he be scared of Rudy and Roxy having a child?

[Hokoga]

rageth, yulinard can't you both just agree to disagree?

Spoiler:

Originally Posted by rageth

yes he can

Originally Posted by yulinard

no he can't

Originally Posted by rageth

yes he can

Originally Posted by yulinard

no he can't

Originally Posted by rageth

YES! he can

Originally Posted by yulinard

NO! he can't

Originally Posted by rageth

YES HE CAN!!

Originally Posted by yulinard

NO HE CAN'T!!

__________________________________

Originally Posted by yulinard

yes she is

Originally Posted by rageth

no she isn't

Originally Posted by yulinard

yes she is

Originally Posted by rageth

no she isn't

Originally Posted by yulinard

YES! she is

Originally Posted by rageth

NO! she isn't

Originally Posted by yulinard

YES SHE IS!!

Originally Posted by rageth

NO SHE ISN'T!!

__________________________________

Originally Posted by rageth

Nu uh!

Originally Posted by yulinard

Ya huh!

Originally Posted by rageth

Nu uh!!

Originally Posted by yulinard"

Ya huh!!

Originally Posted by rageth

Nu uh!!!

Originally Posted by yulinard

Ya huh!!!

Originally Posted by rageth

Nu uh!!!!

Originally Posted by yulinard

Ya huh!!!!

__________________________________

Originally Posted by Hokoga

Oh really now?