(L+CR) Goblin Slayer

[Tenzen12]

I would throw that back at you. It's not like he lives in actual RPG where level equal overal strenght. GS is jack of all trades master of none killing goblins only. Other silver ranked adventurers have much more experience with fighting other humans and are often more specialised on straightforward combat than Orcbolg.

Take away his guerrila warfare and he lost half of his combat profficiency.

[Haak]

Would be nice if we got some sort of explanation on how the government in this country/world fits in all this because that's the biggest elephant in the room for me. It just strikes me as weird how these threats are decentralised in strange way (the Government/army leaves these threats to local guilds - some of those adventurers were expecting quests fighting dragons?!?!) and at the same time centralised in an even weirder way (locals and villagers seemingly have no local constables/sentries/defenders to deal with small scale threats and have to ask a guild).

I don't think this is an intentional mystery, because if it is I'd wonder why it has to be mystery at all. I'm not reading any hints in the story that it's meant to be either. I guess I could bother myself to read one of the novel explanations/spoilers that are probably littered somewhere in this thread, or just fanwank it (though that doesn't stop it from being an elephant in the room). I read some of the manga way back but I barely remember any of the details.

My best guess is that the guild is a government agency itself because that would make the most sense to me. I really don't have a clue though.

Or I guess I could just stick to my Doylist inclinations and just settle with the fact that maybe I'm not supposed to think too deeply about it because that's just the way it is in an RPG and that's that. Which is annoying as hell because the whole point of a Low Fantasy is that it's supposed to be more down to earth and grittier. It's the same problem I had with Grimgar (as much as I liked that show). If both Grimgar and Goblin Slayer had just a bit more imagination and creativity to their settings, these stories could've been so much more.

And for the record, I still liked the second episode in spite of everything. It actually did well to characterise the silver bastard. And I liked the dark irony of the Priest Girl's reservations about using a spell originally designed to protect allies, to brutally trapping her enemies so that they suffocate or burn to death.

[Jord]

Spoiler for Nerf:

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Don't underestimate the other guys too much. They earned their silver plates. Though I do wonder how experience would play. The other guys have some experience fighting people (bandits), but GS probably has more experience fighting intelligent critters (goblins).

Goblins aren't necessarily dumber than bandits. We have seen them laying traps right from the get go. Notably traps that fooled someone much smarter than your average bandit.

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

I would throw that back at you. It's not like he lives in actual RPG where level equal overal strenght. GS is jack of all trades master of none killing goblins only. Other silver ranked adventurers have much more experience with fighting other humans and are often more specialised on straightforward combat than Orcbolg.

Take away his guerrila warfare and he lost half of his combat profficiency.

You assume the humans they are fighting are actually smarter than goblin shamans, which bandits in this world doesn't seem to be.
They are definitely not half as smart as the wizard girl and the priestess the goblin's fooled with traps based on light.

The traps that shaman laid seem simple, but are actually more elaborate than it appears.
For a trap like that to be successful you need to have an understanding of your preys abilities and factors affecting their awareness.

It's definitely not the first thing one would think of when hearing the words trap and cave. What you'd look out for as a human are tripwires like GS laid.

And let's not forget that the only reason the Shaman was killed is GS' experience telling him that his strike wasn't enough to kill it. - Every other adventurer would have been outsmarted there.

Originally Posted by Jord

Spoiler for Nerf:

So that's where Maya got her buff from (Phoenix wright)

[kanoguti]

Originally Posted by Jord

Spoiler for Nerf:

big shame. I hope they don't tone down stuff later on, especially the high priestess.


What do you guys think about the goblins = stereotype discussion?

[Twi]

Originally Posted by kanoguti

What do you guys think about the goblins = stereotype discussion?

It started out stupid and it remains stupid. The Goblins in Grimgar have a better case than the ones in this setting specifically because of plot reasons.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

You assume the humans they are fighting are actually smarter than goblin shamans, which bandits in this world doesn't seem to be.
They are definitely not half as smart as the wizard girl and the priestess the goblin's fooled with traps based on light.

The traps that shaman laid seem simple, but are actually more elaborate than it appears.
For a trap like that to be successful you need to have an understanding of your preys abilities and factors affecting their awareness.

It's definitely not the first thing one would think of when hearing the words trap and cave. What you'd look out for as a human are tripwires like GS laid.

And let's not forget that the only reason the Shaman was killed is GS' experience telling him that his strike wasn't enough to kill it. - Every other adventurer would have been outsmarted there.

I didn't work under assumption they are smarter, but that they fight different way. But you are wrong anyway. Yes Shamans are smarter then regular goblins, which means they are smarter then 10 years old children, so in their case it will be probably like 12 years old children instead. Traps aren't example of their high inteligence, it's just proof they are not complete idiots and that's something that Orcbolg repeat often, so you have word of specialist on that.

Anyway as I said fight one on one is different then guerrilla war and GS is specialist on later not former. Which is more important then speculation who is smarter

PS: lol on thinking human never play dead (and that Silver ranked adventurers never experienced someone do so), even animals and bugs can do that, it's one of most basic survival techniques.

[Applehell]

I agree that guild structure/system is pretty inefficient if the goblins are suppose to be as much as a big threat as the show portrays them to be. You also considering that everything goblins are doing also happening on top of bandit raids, potential labor shortages, crop destruction by pests and animals. Even if the guild hears a request out of pity it will take an adventurer several days to arrival and deal with the problem and it might be too late by then so outlying villages are kind of screwed. It's wonder how produces enough to feed themselves let alone pay taxes.

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Oh, and in the manga, the Archer immediately remarked on an inconsistency: the Bard told her where to find GS, even though he sang about how GS wandered all the time. (In fact, he has no magic sword and has lived in the same place for five years).

Huh, interesting, then mistaken identity will be the excuse for GS and elf to meet, but the events that happen then is will cause her to stick with him. GS himself might have met the person in the story and been taught by him.

[Top Sergeant]

One of the chief reason that I am really enjoying this show is that our hero is not the Prince, he's not anyone special at all: he's a hard-bitten veteran, like a long service sergeant, no bravado, no flash, just get the job done as best you can. And like a sergeant we've seen him training Priestess: passing on his knowledge to her to help her fight better and to survive. I think that's why this is not like Berserk for me. This is a new take on fantasy and I'm enjoying it.

[orion]

Originally Posted by Top Sergeant

One of the chief reason that I am really enjoying this show is that our hero is not the Prince, he's not anyone special at all: he's a hard-bitten veteran, like a long service sergeant, no bravado, no flash, just get the job done as best you can. And like a sergeant we've seen him training Priestess: passing on his knowledge to her to help her fight better and to survive. I think that's why this is not like Berserk for me. This is a new take on fantasy and I'm enjoying it.

Well...songs are being sung about him and what appears to be an elf is looking for him. He has a harem of 3 girls so far and this is only episode 2. GS is special.

[Applehell]

It might not be him though.

[Keila]

Originally Posted by orion

Well...songs are being sung about him and what appears to be an elf is looking for him. He has a harem of 3 girls so far and this is only episode 2. GS is special.

I don't think it's fair to count what are (effectively) his colleagues/boss/child-hood friend(neighbour) as being part of a harem, especially since all interactions with them thus far are effectively work-related.

[bakato]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Don't underestimate the other guys too much. They earned their silver plates. Though I do wonder how experience would play. The other guys have some experience fighting people (bandits), but GS probably has more experience fighting intelligent critters (goblins).

The tactics and ingenuity GS displayed was acquired through his crusade against goblins who developed theirs as a result of their lack of natural abilities. The other silver-ranked adventurers earned their ranks with their specs fighting bigger prey who do not utilize tatics like goblins do. So GS might lose in specs, but not in making the best out of what he's got.

Originally Posted by Haak

Would be nice if we got some sort of explanation on how the government in this country/world fits in all this because that's the biggest elephant in the room for me. It just strikes me as weird how these threats are decentralised in strange way (the Government/army leaves these threats to local guilds - some of those adventurers were expecting quests fighting dragons?!?!) and at the same time centralised in an even weirder way (locals and villagers seemingly have no local constables/sentries/defenders to deal with small scale threats and have to ask a guild).

I don't think this is an intentional mystery, because if it is I'd wonder why it has to be mystery at all. I'm not reading any hints in the story that it's meant to be either. I guess I could bother myself to read one of the novel explanations/spoilers that are probably littered somewhere in this thread, or just fanwank it (though that doesn't stop it from being an elephant in the room). I read some of the manga way back but I barely remember any of the details.

My best guess is that the guild is a government agency itself because that would make the most sense to me. I really don't have a clue though.

Or I guess I could just stick to my Doylist inclinations and just settle with the fact that maybe I'm not supposed to think too deeply about it because that's just the way it is in an RPG and that's that. Which is annoying as hell because the whole point of a Low Fantasy is that it's supposed to be more down to earth and grittier. It's the same problem I had with Grimgar (as much as I liked that show). If both Grimgar and Goblin Slayer had just a bit more imagination and creativity to their settings, these stories could've been so much more.

The guild is basically the same as it is in Overlord. It's an organization that acts purely as a middleman and broker for quest-givers and adventurers. It is not a government agency but it is acknowledged by the government because it's work is convenient for them. Adventurers deal with monsters who prove themselves problematic to people who can pay up while the military deals with national threats.

Originally Posted by Applehell

I agree that guild structure/system is pretty inefficient if the goblins are suppose to be as much as a big threat as the show portrays them to be. You also considering that everything goblins are doing also happening on top of bandit raids, potential labor shortages, crop destruction by pests and animals. Even if the guild hears a request out of pity it will take an adventurer several days to arrival and deal with the problem and it might be too late by then so outlying villages are kind of screwed. It's wonder how produces enough to feed themselves let alone pay taxes.

Huh, interesting, then mistaken identity will be the excuse for GS and elf to meet, but the events that happen then is will cause her to stick with him. GS himself might have met the person in the story and been taught by him.

Goblins aren't a big threat. All they need is women and food and they don't need to attack large population centers for those. They get what they need by preying on small villages that don't even exist on the map that are too poor to barely pay the guild's fee for quest-givers and easily pillaged. So what if a few non-existent villages are wiped out? Girls being raped? They died all the same like everyone else killed by monsters. So what's the difference? Goblins aren't a threat. The horrors they inflict with their malice is

The common belief that goblins are the weakest fodder of monsters is correct, but misunderstood. Compared to trolls and dragons, goblins are obviously lacking in natural abilities. However, we've seen them compensate for their lack of strengths by developing tactics like sleights of hand, poisoned weapons, superior numbers, and their enemies lack of experience. Goblins have mastered the art of killing those stronger than themselves. We saw their skill in full effect in their own nest.

As for why the strengths of goblins aren't well known, zeando tackled this nicely.

Originally Posted by zeando

The lack of available informations around, also coming from the surviving victims, is indeed puzzling.
What are the groups of people involved and what do they know?

1) Adventurers with experience
They survived a goblin quest:
1.a) without problems = "goblins are small fries" --> (if they come to know from others "noobs are wiped", laughs at noobs)
1.b) with casualties = (first hand source of "one party of noobs was wiped") --> "goblins can be dangerous" (the priestess)(must be an uncommon case, surviving a failed party)
(though, how did she know about the full picture about other parties? how did she know "noobs are regularly wiped" ?)
From the priestess tale, other survivors from wiped parties abandon the idea of being an adventurer and go back to where they came from without much fuss, maybe being wiped by goblins is in itself something shameful to let know.

2) Adventurers without experience
They have only hearsay, in most cases = "goblins are small fries" (the whole rookie group)

3) Dead adventurers
Tell no tales. Few of them should have people waiting for them to come back. Few know of them having died.
It makes also wonder how much available are resurrection spells, probably rare or very expensive.

4) Raped adventurers
They know and would probably say = (first hand source of "one party of noobs was wiped") --> "goblins are dangerous"
4.a) But they don't want to talk about it.
4.b) They don't have a place to go back, nor people who would care much about their story.
4.c) Their personal story doesn't travel far.

5) Adventurers Guild workers
Knows who accepts a quest and knows who comes back = (first hand source of "noobs are wiped regularly")

6) Villagers getting attacked by goblins
They may not know about noob party death ratio, unless the adventurers came from their own village, even in that case they would know about single deaths and not have the full picture.
6.a) They chase the goblins away = "goblins are small fries" --> (may become adventurers with the same views)
6.b) They can't prevent stealing and abducting = "goblins are dangerous, need adventurers" --> (probably too weak to generate adventurers)

7) Goblin Slayer
Have done lots of goblin quests and saw many noob parties getting wiped = (first hand source of "noobs are wiped regularly")
The priestess could have heard it from him, it seemed too soon for her to have known from experience by following him in other quests.


To sum it up, "noobs are wiped not so rarely" is a reality, but not very known outside of the adventurers circles.
The first hand sources for "noobs are wiped" are the guild girl and goblin slayer. Everyone else comes to know about it from hearsay, and apparently the amount of hearsay saying "goblins are small fries" is the vast majority, so the information of "noobs are wiped" may be underplayed or ignored.
"Goblins are small fries" being the most common hearsay may be the result of the input from successful adventurers and successful villagers (adventurers who died are often forgotten, the survivors from wiped parties must be rare), and from a self feeding bias.
Guild girl tried to warn the party, but without success. Goblin slayer could have tried to tell others too, but so far we only saw the priestess to take that to heart. (assuming she learned it from him)

"Rehabilitation center" may not be what we mean for it, could just be a village needing cheap labor, or an abbey. Wait, she actually said "join a temple". No rehabilitation centers.
There could be no real "rehabilitation" going on at all.

Not all goblins quests will involve goblin nests this well-organized like we've seen. Sometimes it's just a case of homeless goblins attacking a village. They have no lair or leader so adventurers can take them out easily. In the case they don't, then dead adventurers tell no tales. Even if you rescue any female prisoners, they won't be too keen to share their experiences so it's just another tale of the nasty things goblins do to girls.

[Twi]

The Bard is singing about him because they're on the frontier and Goblins are a problem, so he's considered a folk-hero. In the manga the bard explained he embellished a little but most of the details are accurate.

[Liddo-kun]

Originally Posted by orion

Well...songs are being sung about him and what appears to be an elf is looking for him. He has a harem of 3 girls so far and this is only episode 2. GS is special.

Is guild receptionist already added to that harem? She seems to respect GS a lot.

[Twi]

You could tell she respects him from she told him to take pride in his rank.

On a side note, if anyone wants more details about GS backstory of what happened right after the attack (as in how he lived through it and what happened to Cow Girl's parents) without spoilers for what happens in the current story, check out the first chapter of Goblin Slayer Side Story Year One.

[orion]

Originally Posted by Keila

I don't think it's fair to count what are (effectively) his colleagues/boss/child-hood friend(neighbour) as being part of a harem, especially since all interactions with them thus far are effectively work-related.

Well...Priestess is worried more about his well-being and the interaction in the Guild building wasn't all work.

Childhood friends are called that because it's implied that the people involved are expected to be dating. Cowgirl also worries a lot about GS and is the sole reason he is still living where he is. Her father would have kicked him out prob a long time ago if not for his daughter.

Guild Girl's expression brightens up as soon as GS enters a room. That is a sign that the girl has a thing for him.

This means that a harem is forming imo.

[~Yami~]

just watched episode 2

so far, the adaptation is so faithful to the manga
I hope they keep it this way

They don't show the graphic animation at what happened at Goblin Slayer's village... lucky! I might turn insane

about the harem, so far it is only hinted but it won't be explored at all
it's the same thing with government stuff, kingdom view, etc.. Goblin Slayer is a guy who stayed true to his goal.. he doesn't want to be involved with anything
and Priestess would inherit that view as well.. they would avoid things that didn't involve Goblin

on contrary on what people think, there are lots of girls that fond of Goblin Slayer.. including that wizard in the guild
Probably because he is the guy who slayed the enemies of young women

Mili in the opening song is great... can't believe that I followed Momocashew since 2010 without knowing that she would become this famous

[moridin84]

It is sort of vague but I don't think the guild is a government "agency", it is more of an open market placement.

Also, It is a medieval RPG like setting so you don't find the modern socialism that people are talking about. It wouldn't really be much of a dark fantasy setting if a centralised goverment was providing education, training and social welfare.

I do know that the reward for goblin quests come from the villages, not from the country itself. It was shown in the episode even.

[Nachtwandler]

I wonder, if they plan to include that gory part with fem party that they skipped this episode as some sort of BD-special or will it be skipped for good.