Find out where you fit in the Fansubbing Political Spectrum (2011 Edition)

[SilverSyko]

L-R: 3
P-C: 1

The L-R sounds about right, but I thought my P-C would be higher.

[brocko]

L-R = 4
P-C = -1

Spoiler for calculations:

1. No
2. No
3. No
4. No
5. Yes +1 C
6. Yes +1 L
7. No
8. No
9. No
10. No
11. Yes +1 C
12. No
13. No
14. Yes +1 C
15. Yes +1 P
16. No
17. No
18. No
19. No
20. Yes +1 P
21. Yes +1 L
22. Yes +2 L

3C ; 2P ; 4L

L-R = 4-0 = 4
P-C = 2-3 = -1

[karice67]

L-R = -1
P-C = -2

L-R seems about right (I'm trying and slowly getting to the stage where I have fansubs/raws only for series I actually own, usually R2 DVDs), but P-C is debatable - I really thought I'd be more neutral...

[SeijiSensei]

L-R = 2
P-C = 0

I did have trouble with some of the questions. In many cases my answer would have been "it depends."

3. I usually wait for legal streams if they are late, but not always. I watched a couple of subbed episodes of [C] but stopped to await the entire series being available. I'll watch Funi's version now. On the other hand, I can't bring myself to watch the version of Kemono no Sou-ja Erin on Crunchyroll since their translator couldn't even decide which gender to use in some instances. Even I could tell that the fansubs are superior in this case.

5. I have little ability to discriminate among fansubbing groups. These days they're often all using the same rips, so it comes down to accuracy of translation, which I'm unable to evaluate. I trust some groups more than others (e.g., Live-eviL), and some translators like you, Quarkboy, more than others. I also suspect that speed-subbers may not be as careful as groups that take longer, but I really have no basis for this belief. Most of the series I watch (e.g., Hyouge Mono, Showa Monogatari) have only one or two groups anyway so I don't have much choice, and speed is not really relevant when we're getting at best an episode per month. Still I chose "yes" for my answer since I generally prefer quality over speed.

13. Are we talking about ripping R2 DVDs/Blu-rays or R1 versions? The latter I think is entirely unethical; the former not so much. Why should it matter if I have a 720p fansubbed version of Dennou Coil from an HDTV telecast or from an R2 BD? I can't buy an R1 release, so for me the question is moot.

18. I suspect this is all about 4Kids, so it's pretty much old hat. Take the case of Dance of the Vampire Bund. Funi uses the censored TV release for its stream, but the uncensored version for the DVD/BD release. I don't have a problem with censorship of streams since there's essentially no way of limiting access to the material, despite the request for me to state my age. (I presume they ask this only to comply with the CIPA, though I doubt many children are trying to watch Dance from a school or library computer!) Censoring a DVD release is another matter entirely. Since I'm paying for the show, I expect it to be intact.

20. Groups ripping from Crunchyroll have no legitimacy for me, so I don't really care how long it takes them. I think they "have no excuse" period. Is that a no?

21. Just speculation since no one here has any basis for an opinion on this subject. I'd guess fansubbing played hardly any role in Naruto's popularity, especially in comparison to Turner's decision to carry it on CN. I'm pretty sure I've watched no more than a handful of Naruto episodes at most, so I'm not really well-qualified on this subject.

22. Why are we singling out Funimation here? They're actually one of the cheaper distributors these days compared to Sentai or NISA.

In general, I rely on fansubbers to provide access to materials not available in R1. In many cases those series will never be available here. I have continued to watch fansubbed versions of some licensed shows like Hikaru no Go, since the fansub translator provided useful information about the play of the game that isn't included in Viz's subs. In that case, I let my computer "watch" all 75 episodes of Hikaru on Viz/Hulu so they'd get the advertising revenues while I watched the fansubs.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

22. Why are we singling out Funimation here? They're actually one of the cheaper distributors these days compared to Sentai or NISA.

I figured Funi was chosen here since, as you said, they're the cheapest. If the cheapest is too expensive for someone, then it's likely the more expensive companies would also be too expensive.

[Marcus H.]

L1 p4 r2 c2
l-r = -1 p-c = 2

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by Quarkboy

I proposed a simple quiz 5 years ago and got some really interesting results here:
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=29118

Let's do it again (with the quiz slightly updated) and see if we can quantify any shift in people's opinions as a whole!

Take this simple quiz, and then open the spoiler tags below to see where YOU fit in the fansubbing political spectrum! Like a myers briggs test, except cooler.

Answer yes or no to whether each statement applies to you:

1. I often download dvd or blu-ray-rips after I watch the versions that aired on TV for archiving or because they're uncensored.
2. I often stream anime on pirate streaming sites instead of downloading.
3. When a show is licensed for streaming, but the official streams in my territory are a week later than the airing, I wait for the official stream before I watch.
4. When a show is licensed for streaming, I only watch it if it's available legally in my country and on the official streaming site.
5. I prefer to wait for the best quality fansub group to release than to just take the first available.
6. I archive fansubs to DVD/Bluray/HDDs, and keep them indefinitely.
7. If a series is licensed, I'll delete/destroy any copies of fansubs I have of it.
8. I often download hollywood movie rips.
9. When a japanese company makes a public statement about how fansubs are hurting the industry, I feel angry or insulted.
10. I will download the first release of a show, no matter which group it is.
11. I will make sure that if more than one group completes a series, that I have all of a single groups' releases.
12. Fansubbing licensed anime is wrong and should not happen, no matter what.
13. DVD/Bluray ripping is wrong and should not be done.
14. The most important part of anime fansubbing is the community of fans.
15. The most important part of anime fansubbing is the anime itself.
16. A new, super popular show which causes the an influx of new fans would be bad for the community.
17. Anime shows are not as good as they used to be.
18. I would prefer a show be licensed by any legal company in my territory, even if they censor it, than remain unlicensed.
19. Big fansub groups with lots and lots of projects are better than small, one show groups.
20. Ripping groups like Horriblesubs have no excuse when they take more than a day to release rips from Crunchyroll.
21. If Naruto had not been fansubbed, it would have done much more poorly on Cartoon Network.
22. Funimation charges too much for DVDs and/or Blu-rays.

Spoiler for DO NOT READ UNTIL AFTER ANSWERING THE ABOVE QUESTIONS:

For every question you answered "Yes" to, add the following numbers for each of 4 categories, L,R,C,P If you answered "no", do nothing.

1. +1 L
2. +2 P
3. +2 R
4. +1 R
5. +1 C
6. +1 L
7. +2 R
8. +2 L
9. +1 L
10. +2 P
11. +1 C
12. +2 R
13. +1 R
14. +1 C
15. +1 P
16. +2 C
17. +1 C
18. +2 C
19. +2 P
20. +1 P
21. +1 L
22. +2 L

Now calculate these two numbers, L-R and P-C. These are your scores. The ranges are from -8 to 8.

The higher the L-R, the less you care about the legal issues involved with fansubbing. Very positive L-R indicates you care little about the legality of your actions (in reguard to fansubbing), and don't think it matters or don't care about the effects of dvd-rippers. Very negative numbers indicate that you believe fansubs are only a temporary substitute for a proper DVD release, and are a privilage, not a right, that are allowed us by the japanese companies.

The higher the P-C, the more progressive attitude you have toward fansubbing and the methods/goals it has. Very positive P-C indicates that you think bittorrent is great, and that the most important thing about fansubbing is getting the largest number of downloads and the fastest releases. Very negative numbers indicate that you'd probably prefer if digisubbing had never been invented, and that people still traded anime on VHSs that are shown in people's basements.

Please note that these usage of "Progressive, Conservative, Left, Right" have NOTHING to do with their normal usage in political discourse, and I am totally making up their meaning to apply to fansubbing. Feel free to invent your own terminology if you don't like mine

Just some comment on your survey. I think it will be better if you change the format into "Agree" and "disagree". Otherwise some questions are a little bit confusing

For example: 20. Ripping groups like Horriblesubs have no excuse when they take more than a day to release rips from Crunchyroll. Is this "No, they have no excuse" or "No, i don't agree with this"?

Mine is like +2 toward L and +2 toward P. But i thought that i am extreme left on the issue

[james0246]

L-R = -3: Not very surprising. I firmly support the DVD/Blu-Ray industry…even if the prices can get a bit high at times (FYI – Different regions have different prices, so that should be taken into account when discussing this survey).

P-C = -2: A little surprising. I definitely don’t think that we should ever have to go back to the days of the VHS subs (I was around in those days...not fun), but I do agree that the quality of the fansub and the quality of the anime take precedent over the fan community.

[bhl88]

Spoiler for Hope it's correct:

1. Yes (I archive shows) +1 L
2. No (I download cause it takes lots of time)
3. Yes (but there's really not so much point in waiting... US gets their shows fast) + 2 R
4. No (I download if it's not available legally).
5. Do not want. (I grab anything that comes out... as long as the quality is passable)
6. Yes. +1 L
7. No (because I need to wait for the Blu-Ray to come)
8. No (I only watch Hollywood stuff on TV and on theater and as for anime... I download it/buy it/stream it).
9. Yes (they are obviously not listening.....) +1 L
10. Yes (as long as the subs don't have a Chinese-like quality and as long as it is passable). +2 P
11. No (I only need one).
12. No (For Americanized anime... it's fine).
13. Yes +1 R
14. Yes (everyone is important). +1 C
15. Yes +1 P
16. Yes (I admit, I have mixed feelings about it...) +2 C
17. No (there are still gems).
18. No (I don't want 4kids censoring... anything is fine though).
19. Yes (I'd take 5 shows than 1). +2 P
20. Yes (they have definitely no excuse). +1 P
21. Yes (I feel it so). +1 L
22. No (just watch it on a legal network).

4-3 = 1
3-3 = 0

So I'm a moderate... huh.

[Zeroryoko1974]

Spoiler for answers:

1. I often download dvd or blu-ray-rips after I watch the versions that aired on TV for archiving or because they're uncensored. No
2. I often stream anime on pirate streaming sites instead of downloading. No, I only stream licensed stuff
3. When a show is licensed for streaming, but the official streams in my territory are a week later than the airing, I wait for the official stream before I watch. Depends on how much I like the show.
4. When a show is licensed for streaming, I only watch it if it's available legally in my country and on the official streaming site. No, if it is on TAN, I will usually download it
5. I prefer to wait for the best quality fansub group to release than to just take the first available. Usually just take the first one if it is going to be more then a day
6. I archive fansubs to DVD/Bluray/HDDs, and keep them indefinitely. yes
7. If a series is licensed, I'll delete/destroy any copies of fansubs I have of it. sometimes
8. I often download hollywood movie rips. no
9. When a japanese company makes a public statement about how fansubs are hurting the industry, I feel angry or insulted. No
10. I will download the first release of a show, no matter which group it is. not always
11. I will make sure that if more than one group completes a series, that I have all of a single groups' releases. no
12. Fansubbing licensed anime is wrong and should not happen, no matter what. yes, on dvd releases only
13. DVD/Bluray ripping is wrong and should not be done. Yes, but I do it anyway
14. The most important part of anime fansubbing is the community of fans. No
15. The most important part of anime fansubbing is the anime itself. Yes
16. A new, super popular show which causes the an influx of new fans would be bad for the community. No
17. Anime shows are not as good as they used to be. yes
18. I would prefer a show be licensed by any legal company in my territory, even if they censor it, than remain unlicensed. No
19. Big fansub groups with lots and lots of projects are better than small, one show groups. No
20. Ripping groups like Horriblesubs have no excuse when they take more than a day to release rips from Crunchyroll. Yes
21. If Naruto had not been fansubbed, it would have done much more poorly on Cartoon Network. Yes
22. Funimation charges too much for DVDs and/or Blu-rays. Yes, but I am cheap

L-R +1
P-C +2

[Random32]

L-R: 6
About right. I think I have the record of the most criminal person so far. No R's and all but 2 L's, namely about the DVD pricing. In Japan an entire series is in the hundreds, people should be very happy about the low price of stuff on the other side of the Pacific.

I consider torrents a competitor to legal stuff. I choose the best product. Quite honestly, the best product is nearly always the torrent. No restrictions, no annoying anti-piracy messages that I can't skip, better looking subs, already a video file so no hassle with ripping, etc. Right now I only buy the Japanese DVD's when I feel the creators of a series really deserves my money, I don't think I have bought a licensed DVD in a very long time. Legal options simply cannot compete quality-wise with torrents. All they have is legality, and a lot of forward movement of society comes from breaking laws.

P-C: 0
I don't think this score is correct. I love BitTorrent. I just also happen to like good translations and reliability which hurt my P-C score.

[Decagon]

L: 2
R: 0
C: 4
P: 1
L-R=2
P-C=-3

Spoiler for answers:

Yes
No
No
No
Yes
Yes
No
No
No
No
Yes
No
No
No
Yes
Yes
No
No
No
No
No
No

I get more raws nowadays, and have imported R2's for a few series in addition to normal purchases of licensed series. All this money exchange happened after I started working, however. Maybe a corollary for people who have watched thousands of hours of anime is that they become less reliant on subs and may go for livestreams or raws?

[Gamer_2k4]

L - R: 5
P - C: 6

I didn't have any points for R or C. This is probably due to the fact that I only started watching anime about three years ago (excluding Yu-gi-oh and Pokemon, which I saw a decade ago), and I simply don't think most media, anime included, is worth my money. Consequently, I couldn't care less about "anime community tradition" or the legality of piracy.

[synaesthetic]

L-R: 3
P-C: 1

Haters gonna hate.

I am currently so at odds with "content gatekeepers" no matter where they are that my actions in regards to what I pay for and what I don't seems very random, but it is not. Right now, the only thing I really pay for is games from Steam.

Why? Because Valve is the only content-distribution company NOT FUCKING US OVER. So I'm happy to give them money, and I'm not giving anyone else money--I haven't gone to the theater in ages, and I don't rent or buy most new movies that often. Nor do I buy much in the way of music anymore, either... I simply listen to what I already have, or make use of Pandora or last.fm.

Funi's DVD prices aren't bad, to be honest. They're a whole lot better than they used to be, but my issue is that DVD is an obsolete format. My fansubs are in higher resolution; why should I feel overly arsed to pay for something that's worse than what I already have, and what I received for free?

Blurays are a different story, though. I've actually bought a few of those, but they ARE often too expensive. The other BD problem with anime is crappy upsamples... that really makes me rage.

Edit: Hey OP, you should tell your bosses they should put out an Android app to stream CR to smartphones. I'd totally pay for a subscription then.

[DonQuigleone]

Originally Posted by synaesthetic

L-R: 3
P-C: 1

Haters gonna hate.

I am currently so at odds with "content gatekeepers" no matter where they are that my actions in regards to what I pay for and what I don't seems very random, but it is not. Right now, the only thing I really pay for is games from Steam.

Why? Because Valve is the only content-distribution company NOT FUCKING US OVER. So I'm happy to give them money, and I'm not giving anyone else money--I haven't gone to the theater in ages, and I don't rent or buy most new movies that often. Nor do I buy much in the way of music anymore, either... I simply listen to what I already have, or make use of Pandora or last.fm.

Eh, I'm not such a huge fan of Steam. They mess with a lot of the games that come out on it. A lot of the more niche titles have messed up patching. I prefer Gamers Gate, which is less intrusive. Though some titles are only available on steam...

[Sorrow-K]

L-R: 1
P-C: -4

This is probably about right. I don't have a strong opinion on the legality because I tend to believe that serving the fans' best interests should be the highest priority of all anime distribution, legal or not. But I am extremely finicky about what I do with fansubs after the show is finished. I'm a compulsive archiver, but I prefer having a physical product if DVDs are available, so I don't see the point in DVD/BD-rips.

[gsilver]

L 2
R 5
C 2
P 2

L-R = -3
C-P = 0

Yeah, sounds about right. I believe in buying *everything* that I like (including unsubbed R2 DVD/Blu-rays of shows that I particularly like), but at the same time, I'm *done* blind-buying. Licensed or not, I don't care when downloading, but if I like it, I buy it.

Though in cases where the fansubbed product is better than the legit one, I'll buy the legit one and watch the fansub... some weird kind of wanting to support the R1 industry. I'm watching Blu-Ray rips of Card Captor Sakura, leaving my R1 DVDs on the shelf. It does burn when the fansubs are better quality, though. Doremi's HD TV rips of Heartcatch easily look better than my DVDs, though my Blu-Rays of Madoka look a lot better than my fansubs.

Originally Posted by synaesthetic

Edit: Hey OP, you should tell your bosses they should put out an Android app to stream CR to smartphones. I'd totally pay for a subscription then.

There is one available. I don't know which one you have, but I've got one on my Droid 2. It's free, too (though I'm a subscriber for access to new shows).

[ahelo]

L-R 6
P-C 4

Yeah that's about right I guess. I could care less about legality since those damn DVDs are too expensive.

[Quarkboy]

Originally Posted by synaesthetic

Edit: Hey OP, you should tell your bosses they should put out an Android app to stream CR to smartphones. I'd totally pay for a subscription then.

First, Crunchyroll is one of my clients, not my boss.

And second:

http://www.crunchyroll.com/devices?src=carousel

CR has apps for iphone, ipad, android 2.1 phones and tablets with streaming over 3G and wi-fi (3G only for members).

sooo, I guess you'll be paying for a subscription now, right?

[Random32]

Tell your client they need to ditch Flash. At least provide the option of HTML5 video or even Silverlight. Flash needs to die.

Originally Posted by ahelo

L-R 6
P-C 4

Yeah that's about right I guess. I could care less about legality since those damn DVDs are too expensive.

Don't move to Japan then. What gets you a full series in the US might get you 3 episodes on the other side of the Pacific lol.